Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

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JackSkeptic
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#481

Post by JackSkeptic »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Pitchguest wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:The age is inconsequential when the perp admits that they knew it was wrong but did it anyway.

In any case, I'm still not sold on Ogvorbis' "recovered memories" story. Seems like bullshit. But I am sold on a bunch of vicious fuckers giving him hugs and babysitting gigs.
Right. It's more likely the whole story is bullshit, but that kind of makes the reaction they had to his confession even more distressing.
I don't get this. We* have so much dry ammunition. Why spend time on this tragic story?

* I have no illusions of being counted as a part of this community.
Underline mine. Unlike some places there is no clique or posting requirement to contribute here, as many 'guest' posts will testify to. I was welcome in this dump from day one nearly a year ago. All you need is a thick skin and reluctance to take offense or hold grudges.

Walter Ego
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#482

Post by Walter Ego »

Tribble wrote: With no evidence at all, Michael Shermer was accused of rape and pilloried by that community and anyone who said anything about 'hearsay' and 'evidence' was attacked and/or driven out. Oggie self-admits to actually raping three girls, without coercion, and he's forgive, 'pounce hugged, accepted and gets offers of babysitting.
Admittedly I haven't been paying much attention to the never ending soap opera in online atheist community for the last few months so could some kind soul tell me who Oggie is?

And while I'm waiting for an answer, please enjoy another vintage photo from the vault. That's three year-old me playing with my dad's model train set on Christmas morning. (I got a lump of coal and some socks and underwear that year.)
xmas54.jpg
(328.78 KiB) Downloaded 202 times

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#483

Post by Dick Strawkins »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Southern wrote:Phisioproffe should be back posting his horrible risotto-with-avocado recipes, instead of trying to be the embodiment of Justice Over Internet. Jesus Fucking Christ, the guy is an idiot.
In context, my post following the above may give the impression of being a half-assed-irony-response. It wasn't, and I hope you accept that. I really want to know if Bora has written anything worth reading.
Bora, before he really got into meta-scienceblogging, was a researcher into circadian rhythms, and often used to write about the latest research on that topic. I can remember a few decent articles on the subject he authored in those days (I don't have the energy to search them out now but they might be available in some old archived version of his scienceblog site.)

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#484

Post by murtzuphlus »

JackSkeptic wrote: Underline mine. Unlike some places there is no clique or posting requirement to contribute here, as many 'guest' posts will testify to. I was welcome in this dump from day one nearly a year ago. All you need is a thick skin and reluctance to take offense or hold grudges.
Thanks for that. I sort of knew that; it was more an (unhelpful) attempt of not sounding presumptious. Cheers!

free thoughtpolice
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#485

Post by free thoughtpolice »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:The age is inconsequential when the perp admits that they knew it was wrong but did it anyway.

In any case, I'm still not sold on Ogvorbis' "recovered memories" story. Seems like bullshit. But I am sold on a bunch of vicious fuckers giving him hugs and babysitting gigs.
Agreed on the "recovered memories" story, but that's not the issue is it? And I am pretty sure (aka I have no citation) that kids as young as 7 years old know the difference between right and wrong. Do you want to throw them in prison as well?
Assuming Ogvorbis hasn't committed more crimes than he admits to I don't think he should have been jailed.
On the other hand, if he did what he said he did, it was wrong don't you agree?
A 12 year old that is sexually involved with much younger children and knowingly violating the position of trust is not a victim in that case, yet almost all the commenters on Pharyngula have painted him as a victim because of his earlier experiences and not responsible for his later actions.
When people prop themselves up as judges of social virtue as the Pharyngulites have yet display obvious hypocrisy like they do, they certainly deserve to get called out on it.

Old_ones
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#486

Post by Old_ones »

Walter Ego wrote:
Tribble wrote: With no evidence at all, Michael Shermer was accused of rape and pilloried by that community and anyone who said anything about 'hearsay' and 'evidence' was attacked and/or driven out. Oggie self-admits to actually raping three girls, without coercion, and he's forgive, 'pounce hugged, accepted and gets offers of babysitting.
Admittedly I haven't been paying much attention to the never ending soap opera in online atheist community for the last few months so could some kind soul tell me who Oggie is?

And while I'm waiting for an answer, please enjoy another vintage photo from the vault. That's three year-old me playing with my dad's model train set on Christmas morning. (I got a lump of coal and some socks and underwear that year.)
xmas54.jpg
"Oggie" is short for Ogvorbis. He is a regular commenter at Pharyngula.

Really?
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#487

Post by Really? »

free thoughtpolice wrote:
murtzuphlus wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:The age is inconsequential when the perp admits that they knew it was wrong but did it anyway.

In any case, I'm still not sold on Ogvorbis' "recovered memories" story. Seems like bullshit. But I am sold on a bunch of vicious fuckers giving him hugs and babysitting gigs.
Agreed on the "recovered memories" story, but that's not the issue is it? And I am pretty sure (aka I have no citation) that kids as young as 7 years old know the difference between right and wrong. Do you want to throw them in prison as well?
Assuming Ogvorbis hasn't committed more crimes than he admits to I don't think he should have been jailed.
On the other hand, if he did what he said he did, it was wrong don't you agree?
A 12 year old that is sexually involved with much younger children and knowingly violating the position of trust is not a victim in that case, yet almost all the commenters on Pharyngula have painted him as a victim because of his earlier experiences and not responsible for his later actions.
When people prop themselves up as judges of social virtue as the Pharyngulites have yet display obvious hypocrisy like they do, they certainly deserve to get called out on it.
We can debate whether or not Little Oggie should have gone to jail for rape. I think most of us are a little sympathetic for Little Oggie; sure, if we believe Adult Oggie, he went through a terrible experience and may have had some of his ideas warped because of it.

But this is why we have a criminal justice system. Even if Little Oggie never went to jail for rape, if the authorities knew about the incidents, then the girls could have received the counseling they needed and may still need. As it stands, Oggie doesn't seem to have addressed his psychological problems. He says he still has that "monster" whispering in his ear. He may be a victim, but he has created victims who haven't received what they need to get well.

Oh, but let's all get mad because someone is Storifying SJW tweets.

Tony Parsehole
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#488

Post by Tony Parsehole »

If a 12 year old raped my 6 year old daughter I'd want him jailed. Right after I snapped his cock off.

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#489

Post by murtzuphlus »

free thoughtpolice wrote: Assuming Ogvorbis hasn't committed more crimes than he admits to I don't think he should have been jailed.
On the other hand, if he did what he said he did, it was wrong don't you agree?
A 12 year old that is sexually involved with much younger children and knowingly violating the position of trust is not a victim in that case, yet almost all the commenters on Pharyngula have painted him as a victim because of his earlier experiences and not responsible for his later actions.
When people prop themselves up as judges of social virtue as the Pharyngulites have yet display obvious hypocrisy like they do, they certainly deserve to get called out on it.
Yes, it is very wrong. Horrible.

Besides his age my point is that the thread in question is about people being open about the abuse they have been subject to, and several victims (including the one referred to in the OP) had strong reactions regarding Obvorbis' "confession". I just don't don't think we should go there. Ever.

Tribble
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#490

Post by Tribble »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Pitchguest wrote:The fact that he was twelve at the time is inconsequential. At the time, he wasn't forced into it like he was when he was younger. He did it voluntarily and with purpose.

Juxtapose their reaction to Bora and their reaction to Ogvorbis, and then consider the severity of the two cases. Which one is more fucked up?
We have to agree to disagree about the age being inconsequential. On the Bora-thing we in complete agreement.
You're old enough, at 12, to know not to rape. I knew not to rape. I knew not to murder. I knew not to assault people. I knew not to steal. I knew not to play in traffic. I knew to look both ways before crossing the street. In fact, there's a whole list of things I knew not to do from the mundane to the felonious.

So I find excusing this because someone was 12 and, I guess, lived so far away from society that he was a wolf-child and didn't know it was wrong... Oh, wait, he did indicate he knew it was wrong and did it anyway... At 12.

So much for my buying into any of the Oggie excuse making...

Tribble
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#491

Post by Tribble »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:The age is inconsequential when the perp admits that they knew it was wrong but did it anyway.

In any case, I'm still not sold on Ogvorbis' "recovered memories" story. Seems like bullshit. But I am sold on a bunch of vicious fuckers giving him hugs and babysitting gigs.
It is bullshit as the whole recovered memories thing was discredited decades ago and only quacks and clowns believe it. Yet that's his cornerstone -- recovered memories. So, no I don't believe it. But for argumentative purposes, I act as if his testimony is 'true' until he recants.

Lsuoma
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#492

Post by Lsuoma »

Dick Strawkins wrote:(I don't have the energy to search them out now but they might be available in some old archived version of his scienceblog site.)
Is this the REAL Strawkins speaking? I think not!!!

Tony Parsehole
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#493

Post by Tony Parsehole »

Lsuoma wrote:
Dick Strawkins wrote:(I don't have the energy to search them out now but they might be available in some old archived version of his scienceblog site.)
Is this the REAL Strawkins speaking? I think not!!!
And to think I made a Streetfighter 2 style picture for him:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7322/1145 ... e74a_o.png
Strawkins. I am dissapoint.

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#494

Post by murtzuphlus »

Tribble wrote: You're old enough, at 12, to know not to rape. I knew not to rape. I knew not to murder. I knew not to assault people. I knew not to steal. I knew not to play in traffic. I knew to look both ways before crossing the street. In fact, there's a whole list of things I knew not to do from the mundane to the felonious.

So I find excusing this because someone was 12 and, I guess, lived so far away from society that he was a wolf-child and didn't know it was wrong... Oh, wait, he did indicate he knew it was wrong and did it anyway... At 12.

So much for my buying into any of the Oggie excuse making...
So what? I mean, was it wrong? Sure, very wrong. But what do you think is the reasonable punishment for a 12 year old fucking a 7 year old? Sorry for being crude.

Tony Parsehole
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#495

Post by Tony Parsehole »

If anybody wants to watch a nice, happy family film don't watch The Magdalene Sisters. It's on now and, fuck me, it's grim.

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#496

Post by murtzuphlus »

Tony Parsehole wrote:If anybody wants to watch a nice, happy family film don't watch The Magdalene Sisters. It's on now and, fuck me, it's grim.
That's from Ireland with the orphan girls "looked after" by the Catholic clergy, right?

Tony Parsehole
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#497

Post by Tony Parsehole »

murtzuphlus wrote:
So what? I mean, was it wrong? Sure, very wrong. But what do you think is the reasonable punishment for a 12 year old fucking a 7 year old? Sorry for being crude.
Jail. And here in the UK he'd get it.

Tony Parsehole
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#498

Post by Tony Parsehole »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:If anybody wants to watch a nice, happy family film don't watch The Magdalene Sisters. It's on now and, fuck me, it's grim.
That's from Ireland with the orphan girls "looked after" by the Catholic clergy, right?
Yeah. Our lass put it on. I kind of wish she hadn't.

Really?
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#499

Post by Really? »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Tribble wrote: You're old enough, at 12, to know not to rape. I knew not to rape. I knew not to murder. I knew not to assault people. I knew not to steal. I knew not to play in traffic. I knew to look both ways before crossing the street. In fact, there's a whole list of things I knew not to do from the mundane to the felonious.

So I find excusing this because someone was 12 and, I guess, lived so far away from society that he was a wolf-child and didn't know it was wrong... Oh, wait, he did indicate he knew it was wrong and did it anyway... At 12.

So much for my buying into any of the Oggie excuse making...
So what? I mean, was it wrong? Sure, very wrong. But what do you think is the reasonable punishment for a 12 year old fucking a 7 year old? Sorry for being crude.
Let's ask the police what they thought when they found out about Oggie raping--oh, they never found out.

What about the psychiatrists assigned to the victi--oh, they never found out.

Compare this to the Sandusky case. (Yes, this makes Peezus Joe Paterno in some way.) Sandusky may have been victimized himself. Okay, fine. If Sandusky had confessed he had these thoughts early in life, we'd have sympathy. If he had come forward and begged forgiveness and treatment after raping one eight-year-old...it's a lot harder, but we'd give him a tiny bit of mercy. Instead, Sandusky went decades raping little boys with no consequence, personal or professional.

The FTB crazies have offered him pounce hugs and babysitting jobs based upon his confession alone. If Adult Oggie would come forward and do his best to actually atone for his crimes, then fine. I can see offering some mercy. Instead, Adult Oggie's victims (if they do exist) have never received justice. The SJW demands a person lose his (only his) livelihood when he merely says something that contradicts their dogma. They demand absolutely nothing from Oggie other than his confession. This is not proportional punishment.

Tribble
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#500

Post by Tribble »

Tony Parsehole wrote:If a 12 year old raped my 6 year old daughter I'd want him jailed. Right after I snapped his cock off.
+1

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#501

Post by murtzuphlus »

Tribble wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:If a 12 year old raped my 6 year old daughter I'd want him jailed. Right after I snapped his cock off.
+1
I suspect I would feel the same. No discussion there. But is it rational thinking? Probably not.

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#502

Post by Dick Strawkins »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Tribble wrote: You're old enough, at 12, to know not to rape. I knew not to rape. I knew not to murder. I knew not to assault people. I knew not to steal. I knew not to play in traffic. I knew to look both ways before crossing the street. In fact, there's a whole list of things I knew not to do from the mundane to the felonious.

So I find excusing this because someone was 12 and, I guess, lived so far away from society that he was a wolf-child and didn't know it was wrong... Oh, wait, he did indicate he knew it was wrong and did it anyway... At 12.

So much for my buying into any of the Oggie excuse making...
So what? I mean, was it wrong? Sure, very wrong. But what do you think is the reasonable punishment for a 12 year old fucking a 7 year old? Sorry for being crude.
I don't remember anyone suggesting a particular punishment for Ogvorbis. When the subject of his age at the time was raised I can recall people saying that he should be treated as less culpable than an adult would have been.
The reason his situation keeps getting raised is due to the SJW refrain of "think of the survivors" in rape accusation scenarios.
We can even ignore Ogvorbis in terms of punishment completely and still be faced with the necessity that we must "think of the survivors".

It was this line that was used to condemn Shermer, Kraus and others - even when no 'survivors' were forthcoming - or at least willing to publicly claim to be victims.

And yet in this particular case we are told to forget about it - to ignore the fact that those children were raped.
Of course to 'think of the survivors' here could not be done without rather severe consequences for Ogvorbis himself.
Presumably he is the only one who knows who the victims were and tracking them down at this point in time to offer counselling, for example, would necessarily involve Ogvorbis in some serious repercussions (most probably in terms of reputation rather than financial or criminal since it happened so long ago.)

I also recall that people here tended to think Ogvorbis was making it all up for sympathy - the incident was claimed to be a recovered memory that recently surfaced in his mind, and recovered memories are, in general, very unreliable as records of the past.

But the horde claimed to believe him.
Therefore, by their own standards they should 'think of the survivors'.
Where is the compassion shown by them for the raped children?
Where are the efforts to seek out the victims and attempt to provide closure or justice?

Tribble
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#503

Post by Tribble »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Tribble wrote: You're old enough, at 12, to know not to rape. I knew not to rape. I knew not to murder. I knew not to assault people. I knew not to steal. I knew not to play in traffic. I knew to look both ways before crossing the street. In fact, there's a whole list of things I knew not to do from the mundane to the felonious.

So I find excusing this because someone was 12 and, I guess, lived so far away from society that he was a wolf-child and didn't know it was wrong... Oh, wait, he did indicate he knew it was wrong and did it anyway... At 12.

So much for my buying into any of the Oggie excuse making...
So what? I mean, was it wrong? Sure, very wrong. But what do you think is the reasonable punishment for a 12 year old fucking a 7 year old? Sorry for being crude.
I believe in keeping people like that away from the rest of society. Not to be a vindictive ass, but because they're showing they're willing to victimize others and, therefore, have no place in a civil society. So, jail? Yes.

If, at some time, after he'd served his sentence and rehabilitated himself and MADE REASONABLE RESTITUTION TO HIS VICTIMS, I'd be perfectly content with him being productive member of society. I wouldn't 'pounce hug' him. I sure as hell wouldn't offer him babysitting jobs. But I'd be fine having him as a productive member of society, albeit I'd never trust him.

But that's not the Oggie case. The Oggie case is 'crying victim-hood' and basking in 'titular self-revulsion' it as a bunch of reprobates forgive him for raping three girls, yet will (with NO EVIDENCE) try to destroy the lives of others based on rumor and hearsay.

And, FWIW, I don't believe his bullshit story one bit. For me this is just an exercise in a classic 'in-group/out-group' hypocrisy. Shermer is pilloried on hearsay on a claim that didn't even pass the 'sniff test.' Oggie is given 'pounce hugs' for claiming to be a monster who voluntarily raped three girls and has NEVER attempted (at least he's made no claims to an attempt of which I'm aware) restitution.

James Caruthers
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#504

Post by James Caruthers »

Tony Parsehole wrote:If Chris Clarke, Russell Glasser and Martin Wagner were all hanging off the edge of a cliff whose face would you piss in first?
If you answer any name other than "Wagner," you are wrong. Never forget, Wagner was the "it is my moral responsibility to dox you if I have your dox and disagree with you politically about something" guy.

Dobby
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#505

Post by Dobby »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Tribble wrote: You're old enough, at 12, to know not to rape. I knew not to rape. I knew not to murder. I knew not to assault people. I knew not to steal. I knew not to play in traffic. I knew to look both ways before crossing the street. In fact, there's a whole list of things I knew not to do from the mundane to the felonious.

So I find excusing this because someone was 12 and, I guess, lived so far away from society that he was a wolf-child and didn't know it was wrong... Oh, wait, he did indicate he knew it was wrong and did it anyway... At 12.

So much for my buying into any of the Oggie excuse making...
So what? I mean, was it wrong? Sure, very wrong. But what do you think is the reasonable punishment for a 12 year old fucking a 7 year old? Sorry for being crude.
Although I agree with Tony's prescription, I think we can all agree that juvenile justice is a thorny issue. I see where you're coming from, but I wonder what is supposed to happen at, say age 16 or 18, that suddenly makes someone more culpable? Does is happen like magic on the eve of their birthday?

BTW what "civilized countries" were you referring to before where a 12-year-old would not have been punished from rape of three minors - all younger than six years old - that he was charged with caring for?

Bitterness aside, the context of this entire issue was the self-appointed Lords of Atheism declaring many of us "rape apologists" for simply not asking for Michael Shermer's head after a double-hearsay accusation was lodged against him. Then we see actual rape apology happen on Pharyngula and - what? - we should just walk on by?

AndrewV69
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#506

Post by AndrewV69 »

Tony Parsehole wrote:If anybody wants to watch a nice, happy family film don't watch The Magdalene Sisters. It's on now and, fuck me, it's grim.
Heh!

As I recall those nuns were worse than the ones I experienced in real life than the ones that are portrayed in the film.

True Story.

You want ignorant abusive and malicious? Nothing in my experience beats Irish nuns with power over little boys under seven years of age (the lot I am talking about ran a girls school and a prep school for little boys up to the age of 11).

Of course later on in life I figured out that these nuns came for impoverished backgrounds. The first time they wore shoes was when they were entrusted to the convent by their mother at age 13. They came from families that lived seven to ten in a two room stone cottage with a single toothbrush between all of them. They knew all about sex and incest because they all slept in the same room and in the same bed once the peat fire went out at night.

Whatever man. Fuck.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#507

Post by Gumby »

murtzuphlus wrote:Sorry for being crude.
Well, there's a Slymepit first.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#508

Post by murtzuphlus »

Dick Strawkins wrote: I don't remember anyone suggesting a particular punishment for Ogvorbis. When the subject of his age at the time was raised I can recall people saying that he should be treated as less culpable than an adult would have been.
The reason his situation keeps getting raised is due to the SJW refrain of "think of the survivors" in rape accusation scenarios.
We can even ignore Ogvorbis in terms of punishment completely and still be faced with the necessity that we must "think of the survivors".

It was this line that was used to condemn Shermer, Kraus and others - even when no 'survivors' were forthcoming - or at least willing to publicly claim to be victims.

And yet in this particular case we are told to forget about it - to ignore the fact that those children were raped.
Of course to 'think of the survivors' here could not be done without rather severe consequences for Ogvorbis himself.
Presumably he is the only one who knows who the victims were and tracking them down at this point in time to offer counselling, for example, would necessarily involve Ogvorbis in some serious repercussions (most probably in terms of reputation rather than financial or criminal since it happened so long ago.)

I also recall that people here tended to think Ogvorbis was making it all up for sympathy - the incident was claimed to be a recovered memory that recently surfaced in his mind, and recovered memories are, in general, very unreliable as records of the past.

But the horde claimed to believe him.
Therefore, by their own standards they should 'think of the survivors'.
Where is the compassion shown by them for the raped children?
Where are the efforts to seek out the victims and attempt to provide closure or justice?
I fully agree that punishment is not the issue. When arguing not to pursue this matter I am basing it partly on him being 12 but mostly on it being bad form. I see this in the same manner as someone yesterday posting a picture of PZ and his daughter (and subseqently deleting it). Why go there - even if we score a rethorical point?

free thoughtpolice
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#509

Post by free thoughtpolice »

A number of years ago a "young offender" moved into my general area from another community. He was 16 or 17 and had been abusing younger children for some time, IIRC since early puberty or before. Although he was not allowed to be identified publicly he had enough victims in his previous city he needed to move.
According to terms set out by the authorities, he wasn't supposed to have contact with younger children, but his mother violated those terms by moving into an apartment next to an elementary school and even allowed him to babysit younger children, one of which was the 6 year old granddaughter of someone I worked with.
A few months later, he raped the little girl and then stomped her to death.
I'm confident that Ogvorbis wasn't and isn't nearly in the same league as this particular monster, but I think this story should put a fine point on why someone as young as 12 that is committing sex abuse needs to have it treated seriously.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#510

Post by Tribble »

Dobby wrote:[

Bitterness aside, the context of this entire issue was the self-appointed Lords of Atheism declaring many of us "rape apologists" for simply not asking for Michael Shermer's head after a double-hearsay accusation was lodged against him. Then we see actual rape apology happen on Pharyngula and - what? - we should just walk on by?
Yeah, what ever happened to their battle cry: The Standard You Walk Past Is The Standard You Accept?

Had a lot of that shit thrown in our faces the past six months. Along with 'rape apologists' and other demonizing terms. And yet they're making apologies for rape.

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#511

Post by murtzuphlus »

Dobby wrote: BTW what "civilized countries" were you referring to before where a 12-year-old would not have been punished from rape of three minors - all younger than six years old - that he was charged with caring for?

Bitterness aside, the context of this entire issue was the self-appointed Lords of Atheism declaring many of us "rape apologists" for simply not asking for Michael Shermer's head after a double-hearsay accusation was lodged against him. Then we see actual rape apology happen on Pharyngula and - what? - we should just walk on by?
Fuck. Now I actually have to do some checking. I was labouring under the misapprehension that 16 was the "criminal age" in most jurisdictions. I wasn't here for the Shermer-affair, but his "cease and desist"-thing against PZ worked, didn't it?

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#512

Post by Tribble »

murtzuphlus wrote:
I fully agree that punishment is not the issue. When arguing not to pursue this matter I am basing it partly on him being 12 but mostly on it being bad form. I see this in the same manner as someone yesterday posting a picture of PZ and his daughter (and subseqently deleting it). Why go there - even if we score a rethorical point?
So, basically you're an apologist for rape apologists? That's getting getting pretty meta. If I could be assed-to-bother, I'd dig out my SJW Finger Pointing Attack Card and see which of these three categories you fit: 'worse than a rapist,' 'as bad as a rapist' or 'close to, but not quite as bad as a rapist.'

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#513

Post by Tribble »

Oh, in good news, today was my wife's last radiation treatment. It's not as harsh as chemo, but man does she have one serious sunburn from it and the whole right side of her rib cage is the color of a boiled lobster. She also doesn't have to do Chemo, but may do the estrogen suppression hormonal therapy.

So, things are moving along 'fine' all things considered and it'll be quite sometime before we know if it's 'beaten' or she's got to go back under the knife.

murtzuphlus
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#514

Post by murtzuphlus »

Tribble wrote: So, basically you're an apologist for rape apologists? That's getting getting pretty meta. If I could be assed-to-bother, I'd dig out my SJW Finger Pointing Attack Card and see which of these three categories you fit: 'worse than a rapist,' 'as bad as a rapist' or 'close to, but not quite as bad as a rapist.'
Can I have some of what you are smoking?

Dingus

Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#515

Post by Dingus »

James Caruthers wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:If Chris Clarke, Russell Glasser and Martin Wagner were all hanging off the edge of a cliff whose face would you piss in first?
If you answer any name other than "Wagner," you are wrong. Never forget, Wagner was the "it is my moral responsibility to dox you if I have your dox and disagree with you politically about something" guy.
Could you elaborate? are there links to that?

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#516

Post by Semi »

murtzuphlus wrote: Fuck. Now I actually have to do some checking. I was labouring under the misapprehension that 16 was the "criminal age" in most jurisdictions. I wasn't here for the Shermer-affair, but his "cease and desist"-thing against PZ worked, didn't it?
Does this look like the C&D worked?

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... a-grenade/

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#517

Post by Dick Strawkins »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Dobby wrote: BTW what "civilized countries" were you referring to before where a 12-year-old would not have been punished from rape of three minors - all younger than six years old - that he was charged with caring for?

Bitterness aside, the context of this entire issue was the self-appointed Lords of Atheism declaring many of us "rape apologists" for simply not asking for Michael Shermer's head after a double-hearsay accusation was lodged against him. Then we see actual rape apology happen on Pharyngula and - what? - we should just walk on by?
Fuck. Now I actually have to do some checking. I was labouring under the misapprehension that 16 was the "criminal age" in most jurisdictions. I wasn't here for the Shermer-affair, but his "cease and desist"-thing against PZ worked, didn't it?
No, it didn't work.
PZ would need to have deleted the original post, and he hasn't done that.
He hasn't written much else since then explicitly accusing Shermer of anything but he's left up the original post and occasionally drops unsubtle hints in other posts along the lines of suggesting that rapists ply their victims with alcohol in order to commit their crime (exactly what he has accused Shermer of doing.)

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#518

Post by murtzuphlus »

Dick Strawkins wrote: No, it didn't work.
PZ would need to have deleted the original post, and he hasn't done that.
He hasn't written much else since then explicitly accusing Shermer of anything but he's left up the original post and occasionally drops unsubtle hints in other posts along the lines of suggesting that rapists ply their victims with alcohol in order to commit their crime (exactly what he has accused Shermer of doing.)
I stand corrected.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#519

Post by Clarence »

Well, just enjoying the explication of the SJW's selective hypocrisy though I do feel a bit sorry for Bora.

Also noticing that even here nothing quite brings out the irrational like crimes involving sex.
Heck, half the people here can't wrap their heads around people that are biologically children (not adolescents) 'statuatory' raping each other.
And others keep conflating sex crimes with violence when , in fact, most rapes (and I'm not even counting SJW and/or feminist attempted redefinitions of that word) aren't particularly violent crimes.
Sex does not equal violence.
And lets not even get into the absolute and often draconian insanity of most of our sexual laws.

I'm not against sexual laws or age of consent laws (though I'd never set the age as high as 18 and I'd put a few other reforms in place) but it would be nice if we could be consistent about these things.
Right now , seeing a 15 or 16 year old young woman or young man's sexual parts (including breasts for the female) can get you years in prison (where you might be raped, and prison rape is often repeated), however it is perfectly legal to watch videos of them being stoned to death.

Anyway, I trust no one here has a problem seeing that feminist SJW's and many religious whackos have no qualms about trying to make sexual assault laws into their weapons?

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#520

Post by Skep tickle »

Tribble wrote:Oh, in good news, today was my wife's last radiation treatment. It's not as harsh as chemo, but man does she have one serious sunburn from it and the whole right side of her rib cage is the color of a boiled lobster. She also doesn't have to do Chemo, but may do the estrogen suppression hormonal therapy.

So, things are moving along 'fine' all things considered and it'll be quite sometime before we know if it's 'beaten' or she's got to go back under the knife.
Glad to hear she's finished radiation and won't need chemo. Most women do fine on the anti-estrogen therapy.

John Greg
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#521

Post by John Greg »

murtzuphlus said (http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... 12#p154012):
... his "cease and desist"-thing against PZ worked, didn't it?
No, it did not. PeeZus utterly ignored it.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#522

Post by murtzuphlus »

Clarence wrote:Well, just enjoying the explication of the SJW's selective hypocrisy though I do feel a bit sorry for Bora.

Also noticing that even here nothing quite brings out the irrational like crimes involving sex.
Heck, half the people here can't wrap their heads around people that are biologically children (not adolescents) 'statuatory' raping each other.
And others keep conflating sex crimes with violence when , in fact, most rapes (and I'm not even counting SJW and/or feminist attempted redefinitions of that word) aren't particularly violent crimes.
Sex does not equal violence.
And lets not even get into the absolute and often draconian insanity of most of our sexual laws.

I'm not against sexual laws or age of consent laws (though I'd never set the age as high as 18 and I'd put a few other reforms in place) but it would be nice if we could be consistent about these things.
Right now , seeing a 15 or 16 year old young woman or young man's sexual parts (including breasts for the female) can get you years in prison (where you might be raped, and prison rape is often repeated), however it is perfectly legal to watch videos of them being stoned to death.

Anyway, I trust no one here has a problem seeing that feminist SJW's and many religious whackos have no qualms about trying to make sexual assault laws into their weapons?
Makes me think of something I heard about U.S. censorship in movies (I am not there): If you cut off a tit you get a "R" rating. If you kiss a tit you get a "X" rating. Very strange...

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#523

Post by Lsuoma »

AndrewV69 wrote:with a single toothbrush between all of them.
"And what's your ambition, soldier?"
"To get the toothbrush before the other two, sir!"

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#524

Post by Clarence »

murtzuphlus wrote:Makes me think of something I heard about U.S. censorship in movies (I am not there): If you cut off a tit you get a "R" rating. If you kiss a tit you get a "X" rating. Very strange...
Yes. I live in the USA and have been a citizen my entire life. I can't verify that particular example, but I CAN verify that when it comes to rating movies or dealing with violence/sex issues on live TV (FCC cases) violence is treated MUCH more leniently than sex.

I don't see how a single small flash of one of Janet Jackson's boobs is going to harm any kid of any age -let alone an adult. But that small flash of boob got tremendous political and social attention -arguably more than many economically or politically more pressing issues ever have.
There are times I'm ashamed of this country and the 'culture' of this country and that incident was one of them. Our 'pop' culture and our legal institutions are very schizophrenic.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#525

Post by Clarence »

Not to say that I'm not occasionally ashamed of the US foreign policy or the fact that our last two Presidents have both violated the Constitution in such numerous ways that they both probably should have been impeached for treason, or the fact we don't have Universal Healthcare or lots of other stuff.

But our pop and legal cultures are arguably more out there for the average foreign person to see, and what they see doesn't strike me as very pretty, or heck, very sane.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#526

Post by murtzuphlus »

Tribble wrote:Oh, in good news, today was my wife's last radiation treatment. It's not as harsh as chemo, but man does she have one serious sunburn from it and the whole right side of her rib cage is the color of a boiled lobster. She also doesn't have to do Chemo, but may do the estrogen suppression hormonal therapy.

So, things are moving along 'fine' all things considered and it'll be quite sometime before we know if it's 'beaten' or she's got to go back under the knife.
Tribble,

Sorry I missed this. Considering my "not-so-polite" post earlier you probably couldn't care less, but best of luck to your wife.


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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#528

Post by Clarence »

ConcentratedH2O, OM wrote:Nice surprise at the end:

http://riotclitshave.tumblr.com/post/69 ... -helicoils
LOL! If I didn't have some Christian friends, I'd post that to my Facebook.
I don't hesitate to post stuff about religious people behaving badly or science (even evolution) in general, but in this particular case, sadly (cuz I find it true and funny) it might be more combative than I want to be.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#529

Post by ROBOKiTTY »

Tribble wrote:Oh, in good news, today was my wife's last radiation treatment. It's not as harsh as chemo, but man does she have one serious sunburn from it and the whole right side of her rib cage is the color of a boiled lobster. She also doesn't have to do Chemo, but may do the estrogen suppression hormonal therapy.

So, things are moving along 'fine' all things considered and it'll be quite sometime before we know if it's 'beaten' or she's got to go back under the knife.
I will pray to the Lord PeeZus for your wife. :pray:

Er, hold on, I'm a deity, so I'll bless her myself. :snooty:

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#530

Post by Tony Parsehole »

James Caruthers wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:If Chris Clarke, Russell Glasser and Martin Wagner were all hanging off the edge of a cliff whose face would you piss in first?
If you answer any name other than "Wagner," you are wrong. Never forget, Wagner was the "it is my moral responsibility to dox you if I have your dox and disagree with you politically about something" guy.
He's also responsible for illustrating and authoring this heinous shite:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/sca ... epcats.jpg

Just bear that in mind next time he calls somebody a "virgin neckbeard basement dweller" .....Which he does an awful lot.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#531

Post by Clarence »

I will say best of luck to Tribble's wife, as well.
Even though I don't know her from a hole-in-the-head, I have enjoyed Tribble's posts , and someone fighting for their life helps put most of this stuff in the proper context. :(

I hope she gets better and stays better.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#532

Post by Southern »

Lsuoma wrote:
Dick Strawkins wrote:(I don't have the energy to search them out now but they might be available in some old archived version of his scienceblog site.)
Is this the REAL Strawkins speaking? I think not!!!
Oh noes! Greta Christina hacked Strawkins! Somebody call the cops! The NSA! MYKERUUUUUUU!

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#533

Post by Clarence »

By the way, ROBOKITTY: My prediction for you is you will bow to the power of DOG!

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#534

Post by Tony Parsehole »

Tribble wrote:Oh, in good news, today was my wife's last radiation treatment. It's not as harsh as chemo, but man does she have one serious sunburn from it and the whole right side of her rib cage is the color of a boiled lobster. She also doesn't have to do Chemo, but may do the estrogen suppression hormonal therapy.

So, things are moving along 'fine' all things considered and it'll be quite sometime before we know if it's 'beaten' or she's got to go back under the knife.
Coolies man.

Clarence
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#535

Post by Clarence »

Tony Parsehole wrote:
James Caruthers wrote:
Tony Parsehole wrote:If Chris Clarke, Russell Glasser and Martin Wagner were all hanging off the edge of a cliff whose face would you piss in first?
If you answer any name other than "Wagner," you are wrong. Never forget, Wagner was the "it is my moral responsibility to dox you if I have your dox and disagree with you politically about something" guy.
He's also responsible for illustrating and authoring this heinous shite:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/sca ... epcats.jpg

Just bear that in mind next time he calls somebody a "virgin neckbeard basement dweller" .....Which he does an awful lot.
TP, you sick fuck, why don't you try a TRIGGER WARNING next time?
Now I have to bleach my brain!
At least you have the taste to realize how horrid that is.
Now excuse me while fap to it get a nice, stiff drink...

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#536

Post by Southern »

murtzuphlus wrote:
Southern wrote:Phisioproffe should be back posting his horrible risotto-with-avocado recipes, instead of trying to be the embodiment of Justice Over Internet. Jesus Fucking Christ, the guy is an idiot.
In context, my post following the above may give the impression of being a half-assed-irony-response. It wasn't, and I hope you accept that. I really want to know if Bora has written anything worth reading.
I demand you write an infinite amount of blog posts apologizing, while I tell you that your apologies aren't worth a shit. Now go and do it, Bora murtzuphlus!

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#537

Post by murtzuphlus »

If anyone bothers, it looks like I have to eat my words. The age of being criminally responsible is much less than 16 years old. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_cri ... onsibility

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#538

Post by Southern »

Clarence wrote:By the way, ROBOKITTY: My prediction for you is you will bow to the power of DOG!
Or maybe you will bow down to the power of Hepcats, eh?

My God. I want to exterminate ALL animal life so it cannot inspire any shit like that ever again.

Tony Parsehole
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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#539

Post by Tony Parsehole »

Clarence wrote:
TP, you sick fuck, why don't you try a TRIGGER WARNING next time?
Now I have to bleach my brain!
At least you have the taste to realize how horrid that is.
Now excuse me while fap to it get a nice, stiff drink...
Google "Hepcats" (Hepcats? have they all got hepatitis?) for more lolz. What a sad, piss-joweled wanker.

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Re: Mykeru, what a Cnut, eh? Discuss.

#540

Post by murtzuphlus »

Southern wrote:
murtzuphlus wrote:
Southern wrote:Phisioproffe should be back posting his horrible risotto-with-avocado recipes, instead of trying to be the embodiment of Justice Over Internet. Jesus Fucking Christ, the guy is an idiot.
In context, my post following the above may give the impression of being a half-assed-irony-response. It wasn't, and I hope you accept that. I really want to know if Bora has written anything worth reading.
I demand you write an infinite amount of blog posts apologizing, while I tell you that your apologies aren't worth a shit. Now go and do it, Bora murtzuphlus!
I don't think you realise that was a classic case of not-apologizing. And you don't really want an infinite amont of blog posts from me. I am pretty sure you are annoyed already.

Locked