Bleeding from the Bunghole

[mikelf]

In PZ's declaration of vegetarianism thread, someone has appeared asserting that vegetarian lifestyle actually leads to more sentient life death than meat prep. Sure to make a few heads explode, if true. I have to say, vegetarian PZ doesn't really compute. Here's a guy who used to brag about draining dogs of blood as experimental animals just to piss off PETA. And now he's found religion. He's sure a surprise a minute.

I realize that I am responding a bit late here, but I wanted to make sure that no one else had made this same point. And, frankly, it took for-fucking-ever to wade through the Timmy and Jimmy Show (Extended Remix.)

So, I can't have been the only one who noticed that PZ's new found commitment to becoming a vegetarian comes shortly after Watson mentions *her* vegetarianism at 2:43 of her Secular Thanksgiving video?

[youtube]3DlB2bCMMEHLo[/youtube]

[welch]

you know, life would be so much simpler if honkies stopped talking about "hispanics" the way we talk about "asians" or "africans". They take a term that is, at best a highly non-specific way to group multiple cultures across the globe, and then start acting as though they're all the same.

9 times out of ten, they mean "Mexican" or "Mexican-American". If you grow up around people who are nominally hispanic, but not mexican, it can get very confusing. Even the food. The first time some well-meaning but ignorant person took me to lunch at some Mexican chain in North Dakota, and said "this must be like what you'd eat at home", I almost choked due to laughing. It took me a while to explain that just like "Cuba" and "Mexico" are different places, "Cuban food" and "Mexican food" are different things.

i couldn't get too mad, they really did mean well, and given how much of a shock NFD was compared to Miami, I really did appreciate the gesture. But ye gods.

There were other things. People who expected me to know what the fuck "esse" meant. That was pretty rare to hear in Miami, at least when I was growing up. Shit like that. After a while, I just got used to it, because it starts to turn into a "boiling the ocean" issue. (that one confused the fuck out of me for a while, because really, never heard it, and if you don't know what it means, the misunderstandings are HILARIOUS)

Most of the time, people that conflate "mexican" with "Hispanic" do not mean harm. They are ignorant, are trying to be nice and I just correct the information in a nonchalant way. Some of my coworkers asked me if I ate a lot of tacos and I told them that Rican food was more about rice, beans, plantains, yuca and pork. They truly didn't know and I have brought some 'Rican food to work potlucks. They really enjoyed it.
I get pissed off when fuckers like the Jezebel writer decide to write against something they consider racist and end up being more racist than a malicious racist motherfucker. I thought SJWs were educated to "shut up and listen" or something.

It's funny how SJWs are the exemplars of that which they claim to be fighting.

[welch]

Oh, so here's the bio on our official gatekeeper of hispanic culture (I do be:

"Born in England, Ms. Crosley was raised by her military family in Northern California. She attended University of California, Davis and studied abroad at University of Warwick in the U.K, where she began her craft as an intern at MTV News UK, PRIDE and NME in London.

Upon returning to the U.S. Ms. Crosley graduated and moved to New York to pursue a career in journalism."

<eyeroll>

I'm pretty sure (based on that bio), that some people have called her "not black enough"...

Guarantee it.

[mikelf]

Screwed up the video link. Here:

[Tony Parsehole]

SallyStrange has been busy promoting #dearcisfeminism on Twitter. She just retweeted this:

Wait, what?!?

:doh:

What? Didn't they teach you lot about the transgender wars of the 19th century? Don't you know anything about the heroic defense of Rorke's Drift, in which a meagre 150 British soldiers held off an attack from 4000 gender-fluid Zulu warriors armed to the teeth with spears, rifles and condescending Hashtags? Or how those warriors would charge the British lines again and again, braving bullets and bayonets only for each wave to be repelled by the Brit's stubborn refusal to accept that gender is non-binary?
This is actual footage of the battle:
[youtube]x1FuHGn3O04[/youtube]

[welch]

It is possible, but HIGHLY unlikely. Very few people are going to grow their own cotton, gin it, weave it, etc. The number of times I've had some vegan tit lecture me about my leather coat whilst head to toe in petroleum byproducts is a number too high to bother counting anymore.

No! No! No! Bad! Wrong! Bad Welch!

Why does Cotton Kill?

Why does Cotton Kill?

Have you ever wondered why people say Cotton Kills? Do you understand exactly why? Here’s an in-depth explanation as well as a list of other fabrics that you should avoid when shopping for hiking clothes.

Clothing keeps you warm by trapping warm air near your skin. When cotton gets wet, it ceases to insulate you because all of the air pockets in the fabric fill up with water. When you hike, you perspire, and any cotton clothing touching your skin will absorb your sweat like a sponge.

If the air is colder than your body temperature , you’ll feel cold because your cotton clothing is saturated and no longer providing any insulation. This can lead to disorientation, hypothermia, and potentially death if you become too chilled. Remember, hypothermia can occur in temperatures well above freezing and become serious if you get wet and chilled.

Wicking and Layering

In addition, wet cotton does not wick water away from your skin. Wicking fabrics move water from wet areas to dry ones using a process called capilary action. For example, a wicking baselayer shirt made out of Patagonia Capilene will move moisture from the surface of your skin to the outer layers of your shirt leaving the part of the fabric touching your skin dry. This is why layering is such an effective clothing strategy for hiking, because wicking fabrics move water away from your skin and up through your layers one after another, enabling the fabric near your skin to trap insulating air and retain your body’s warmth.

Wool

Wool does not wick as well as synthetic garments and will absorb up to 36% of its weight in water. Unlike cotton, it does insulate when wet and is considered an acceptable fabric for hiking clothes.

Other Forms of Cotton

Avoid wearing garments that are labelled as corduroy, denim, flannel, or duck. These are all made with cotton. In addition, steer clear of cotton-polyester blends, for example 50/50. They’ll still kill you, although it may take a little longer.

Other Fabrics to Avoid

Modal, rayon, viscose, tencel and lyocell are all manufactured fabrics made from cellulose fiber. They absorb water even faster than cotton and lose all of their insulation value when wet. You should also be very careful with clothing made from Bamboo, which is often advertised as being a green product having characteristics comparable to wool. Many bamboo fabrics are actually just a type of rayon and share all of its pitfalls.

Silk is also very absorbent and loses its insulation value when wet.

Vegans can't use silk anyway, animal product. And yes, I am aware of thermal issues with various kinds of fabric. One does not work outside in -40 for years without acquiring that knowledge.

I wasn't saying cotton is some kind of wonder fabric. It's simply the low-hanging fruit for making clothes from source that isn't an animal product of some form.

[Mykeru]

Directive from The SlymePit Ad Hoc Committee on Why You Suck:

Vegans, we have determined that you will not wear any and all animal products such as leather, silk and wool. In addition, you will refrain from wearing synthetic and/or petroleum-based products. You are also forbidden from wearing cotton, for your own good and because of historical associations with racism.

Therefore, have fun cavorting about in your hemp jock-straps and mukluks, you dick-bags.

[ERV]

So, I can't have been the only one who noticed that PZ's new found commitment to becoming a vegetarian comes shortly after Watson mentions *her* vegetarianism at 2:43 of her Secular Thanksgiving video?

Not to mention his new BFF Poppy.

[Mykeru]

Vegans can't use silk anyway, animal product. And yes, I am aware of thermal issues with various kinds of fabric. One does not work outside in -40 for years without acquiring that knowledge.

I wasn't saying cotton is some kind of wonder fabric. It's simply the low-hanging fruit for making clothes from source that isn't an animal product of some form.

Oh, I know. I just wanted to make it clear in proper SJW fashion what a crap human being you are and, therefore from logical necessity, how I shit chocolate truffles.

I have a series of sleeping bags. I keep one of my not-so-great 15 degree bags and a rudimentary survival kit in my car so as not to end up like James Kim. I have a 3-piece modular sleeping bag with a Gore-Tex cover and just bough what is supposedly a -40 military surplus sleeping bag to go with my m1928 haversack kit which I can't wait to try out. And I tried overnighting in 18 degree with just an army blanket like dudes did in Bastogne and damn near froze my ass off. If you've ever seen a mannered and theatrical film like Battlefield, the sight of guys in snowy holes covered by a single blanket makes one's balls shrink. My great-Uncle at the Battle of the Bulge used to wake up next to guys who froze to death, so it's no joke.

My experience in the right clothes to wear, not just wicking layers, but alternating insulating with silky layers so the layers don't bind, has been essential in camping, hiking and especially biking, where I've put together, for example, a three-layer glove system (Merino wool liner, nylon, PVC gloves and an outer Gore-Tex shell) so as to laugh at the lightweights who think "too cold" is a phrase to be used in commuting by bike.

Which is all to say talking noble shit about how one is too moral to wear an Anorak made from animal skins is all well and good when you're a sheltered little hipster-glasses wearing metrosexual tit, but not when actual cold and wet is a part of one's daily experience.

So what the fuck do you wear in -40?

[Southern]

In PZ's declaration of vegetarianism thread, someone has appeared asserting that vegetarian lifestyle actually leads to more sentient life death than meat prep. Sure to make a few heads explode, if true. I have to say, vegetarian PZ doesn't really compute. Here's a guy who used to brag about draining dogs of blood as experimental animals just to piss off PETA. And now he's found religion. He's sure a surprise a minute.

I realize that I am responding a bit late here, but I wanted to make sure that no one else had made this same point. And, frankly, it took for-fucking-ever to wade through the Timmy and Jimmy Show (Extended Remix.)

So, I can't have been the only one who noticed that PZ's new found commitment to becoming a vegetarian comes shortly after Watson mentions *her* vegetarianism at 2:43 of her Secular Thanksgiving video?

If that's true, I imagine Trophy Wife will start shoving meat down his throat until he bleeds of his asshole.

[Mykeru]

What? Didn't they teach you lot about the transgender wars of the 19th century? Don't you know anything about the heroic defense of Rorke's Drift, in which a meagre 150 British soldiers held off an attack from 4000 gender-fluid Zulu warriors armed to the teeth with spears, rifles and condescending Hashtags? Or how those warriors would charge the British lines again and again, braving bullets and bayonets only for each wave to be repelled by the Brit's stubborn refusal to accept that gender is non-binary?

The British had superior training as evidenced by their precision drilling:

[youtube]P0dWo31hwpI[/youtube]

[BillHamp]

Oh, okay, I'm wrong, I guess you showed m--

Wait, you didn't show me anything. Like, oh, I dunno, shoes...clothes...nothing.

Just to have fun, let me give you some specs:

Let's say you are going to be out and about in the late fall in a temperate region at moderate altitude. Show me your kit, including shoes, undergarments, gloves and jacket that would be suitable in a cold, wet climate. They would have to be water-repellent (so no mink oil for you!) and have an R factor not necessarily as good as animal/synthetics, but enough to keep you from freezing. Additional difficultly factor: No cotton, which is referred to as "death cloth" due to it losing all heat retention when wet and being very difficult to dry and, also, racism.

As noble as your convictions may be, you don't get to die for them in this exercise. No synthetics, and none of that awful Inuit stuff made from the bodies of our animal brethren. Those bastards.

You don't get to bullshit, or talk in generalities. Please link to the products in question, which will then be evaluated on how much time search and rescue will have to find your lifeless corpse.

Listen. I said it was difficult, but not impossible. You are arguing a fallacy here by insisting first that vegans live in an inhospital climate and second that they follow only your rules for dress and sustinence. I'm not a vegan. My point was that you are arguing a fallacy. If you want to do that, fine, but don't attack me over points I didn't make.

No philosophy is perfect, including yours, mine, and that subscribed to by most vegans. They are free to preach to you. You are free to ignore them. You are also free to rant about it just as I am free to point out the fallacies in your reasoning. You made your argument personal, I did not. Way to go.

Additionally, insisting that vegans can't use synthetic materials is also a logical fallacy. It is akin to insisting that atheists not read because the first book printed was the bible. How a process orginiated is not the argument a vegan makes, it is the impact of that process at the present time that is important. Again, this isn't perfect. Again, nothing is. They are just people trying to reduce their impact on the world. You don't have to like their views or subscribe to them, but misrepsenting them only makes you appear angry and vindictive.

[Rope apologist]

I use a computer, but I wouldn't be able to build one if my life depended on it. Or write even the simpliest of programs to run it.

Does that make me a hypocrite as well?

If you won't handle sewage, you have no business using the commode.

Oh, actually, I think I get the point, which I don't think is so much that you have to kill your own animals, but that if you're "above that," what the hell are you doing eating them?

But it's still a fact that if I don't want to, and don't have to, kill and butcher animals, why should I?

[Pitchguest]

Ha! This is good.

Jezebel posted an article calling out a pop singer for "appropriating Latino culture." Nearly every self-identified Latino in the comments is giving the author shit. They mistakenly assume she's White (she's Black), but the lady was dumb enough to mention she once lived near a Mexican neighborhood and occasionally rode in a low-rider, which sounds like something our dear Melody would say. Anyway, she's getting told she's wrong, she's got a stick up her ass, she's manufacturing outrage, she doesn't know the difference between Latino-Chicano-Gangsta, and her white knighting isn't appreciated. On Jezebel.

http://jezebel.com/dear-lana-del-rey-yo ... 1479863180

*Snigger* This is too fucking good.
The conflation of "Latino gangster culture" with Latino culture is contemptible enough but the fact that the author chose to bemoan Lana Del Ray "wearing teardrop tattoos", "sitting on a porch" and "sucking on lollipops" as "cultural appropriation" (as if those things are an integral part of Latin culture) and not "negative racial stereotypes" speaks volumes about her.

That stupid fucker of a writer really asked for it.
Before I started reading the comments, I was asking myself the same questions. Did that stupid bitch not only equated being "Latina" with being a chola? She thinks that being a chola is an intrinsic part of Mexican culture? Did she also called all latinos Mexican? Cause she had a Mexican neighbor with a low rider? lol.
The writer is black. I have a black neighbor with tear drop tattoos. Is he appropriating "Latino" culture? Are tear drop tattoos considered "black"? If so, is the writer acting white for not sporting tear drop tattoos? Is Lana del Rey appropriating black culture?
When will Jenn McWrong suggest that we apply skepticism to face tattoos and low riders? So many questions, so much id politics shit to be angry about. :lol:

The comments really are the best part. It's a lot of Hispanic/Latino/Latina people pitching in, telling the author they're really not offended at all by what Del Rey is doing. Like this comment for instance:

Thank you for your concern but no, we are not so sensitive about everything. And no, most of us don't identify with / need to protect Chola shit. Does this broad expect Latins, all of us, hailing from a dozen different countries, to go all up in arms? Argentine and Puerto Rican, Paraguayan and Mexican, hand in hand, demanding that Del Rey give tear tattoos, the pride and joy of brown people who eat guacamaole (obviously we all do) back to us?

Whoops?

The brilliant thing is, most of them are ignored.

[BillHamp]

Really, and where do you get your B-12?

B12 is produced by bacteria, not plants and not animals. I'm not vegan, so I get B12 from cheese, eggs, etc. Vegans can live healthy lifestyles. Again, the argument that the CAN'T use synthesized products is a fallacy.

Now, I have friends that have been, for long stretches, Vegans. They didn't preach. Nor did they pretend this would work anywhere but in an industrialized society where their food choices could be catered to due to the reality of needing vitamin and mineral supplements because vegan diets are, by nature, incomplete.

We can no more be herbivores (Vitamin B-12) than we can be carnivores (Vitamin C). And for we omnivores to go either route requires appropriate technology and support for us to not suffer the consequences of one of these unsustainable diets. Something that's only (in practical terms) available in the more technologically sophisticated and wealthy parts of the world.

And certainly not on some 10-acre, mule-powered farm in the middle of the jungle.

Yes, most vegans are like that. You can, in fact, get enough B12 without supplement or meat. Mushrooms (they absorb it from the soil bacteria) are a good source of B12 as are some plants that are grown in cow manure (as opposed to synthetic fertilizer. THings like soybean, spinach, and certain grains can be higher in B12 if grown in cow or pig crap than if fertilized with synthetic products. The point, once again, is not that being vegan is easy, but that saying it is impossible is quite wrong.

[Git]

So I guess I'm sexually harassing a woman if I tell her to stop bitching anything she doesn't want to hear.

Fixed it.

McEwen at Shakesville has a post up about this. If you guessed that she implied that the kid was a rapist in training and that people defending him were a part of rape culture then.... CONGRATULATIONS! Choose a prize from the top 2 shelves.

Unless the kid was a regular at Pharyngula - then *he* would be the real victim.

(BTW - Regular lurker, first-time poster, I will proceed to go fuck myself now...)

Welcome Dobby. Here is your obligatory basket of links for you to...peruse.

basket_cats_wallpaper_0cf79.jpg

(326.09 KiB) Downloaded 206 times

[Mykeru]

Oh, okay, I'm wrong, I guess you showed m--

Wait, you didn't show me anything. Like, oh, I dunno, shoes...clothes...nothing.

Just to have fun, let me give you some specs:

Let's say you are going to be out and about in the late fall in a temperate region at moderate altitude. Show me your kit, including shoes, undergarments, gloves and jacket that would be suitable in a cold, wet climate. They would have to be water-repellent (so no mink oil for you!) and have an R factor not necessarily as good as animal/synthetics, but enough to keep you from freezing. Additional difficultly factor: No cotton, which is referred to as "death cloth" due to it losing all heat retention when wet and being very difficult to dry and, also, racism.

As noble as your convictions may be, you don't get to die for them in this exercise. No synthetics, and none of that awful Inuit stuff made from the bodies of our animal brethren. Those bastards.

You don't get to bullshit, or talk in generalities. Please link to the products in question, which will then be evaluated on how much time search and rescue will have to find your lifeless corpse.

Listen. I said it was difficult, but not impossible. You are arguing a fallacy here by insisting first that vegans live in an inhospital climate and second that they follow only your rules for dress and sustinence. I'm not a vegan. My point was that you are arguing a fallacy. If you want to do that, fine, but don't attack me over points I didn't make.

No philosophy is perfect, including yours, mine, and that subscribed to by most vegans. They are free to preach to you. You are free to ignore them. You are also free to rant about it just as I am free to point out the fallacies in your reasoning. You made your argument personal, I did not. Way to go.

Additionally, insisting that vegans can't use synthetic materials is also a logical fallacy. It is akin to insisting that atheists not read because the first book printed was the bible. How a process orginiated is not the argument a vegan makes, it is the impact of that process at the present time that is important. Again, this isn't perfect. Again, nothing is. They are just people trying to reduce their impact on the world. You don't have to like their views or subscribe to them, but misrepsenting them only makes you appear angry and vindictive.

What did I say about not bullshitting? Let's break some of this shit down.

You are arguing a fallacy here by insisting first that vegans live in an inhospital climate and second that they follow only your rules for dress and sustinence

So, what is the ideal climate for vegans? Is there a geographical locale vegans gravitate towards, just so I can avoid it. And I say avoid it because for me cluster bombing isn't practical at this time.

No philosophy is perfect, including yours, mine, and that subscribed to by most vegans. They are free to preach to you.

I see, as no philosophy is "perfect" (and talk about imposing rules, I didn't know that was one), glaring inconsistencies and impracticality should be no impediment to some douche telling me to do as he says, not as he necessarily does.

You made your argument personal, I did not. Way to go.

No, I made the argument applicable to the real world. Pointing out you're a fuck-head was just a bonus.

Additionally, insisting that vegans can't use synthetic materials is also a logical fallacy. It is akin to insisting that atheists not read because the first book printed was the bible.

Accuse me of logical fallacy in the sentence before you strawman my argument with a bad analogy in the service of a false dichotomy.
Brilliant.

Vegans can use synthetics for all I care, but it speaks to my original point which you probably should have remembered, that Veganism is a lifestyle of privilege requiring post-agrarian if not post-industrial technology. So rather than being the moral high ground, or reducing impact it rides piggyback on those evils while being all smug about it.

[unicorn fucker]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jain_vegetarianism

[tina]

Welcome Dobby. Here is your obligatory basket of links for you to peruse

Yer sposed to give Dobby a sock, dickhead. Evry fule kno that.

Fuck off Dobby.

[Aneris]

You can eat less meat or use lesser animal-based resources and contribute lesser to the suffering and death of animals; and do a tiny part that problematic production of animal based goods is reduced. Whether some people fancy a label, vegan, vegetarian or otherwise is unimportant.

[Southern]

I believe in a balanced diet: for each steak, one leaf of lettuce.

[tina]

Welcome Dobby. Here is your obligatory basket of links for you to peruse

Yer sposed to give Dobby a sock, dickhead. Evry fule kno that.

Fuck off Dobby.

Squid-Socks_45634-l.jpg

(53.84 KiB) Downloaded 177 times

[BillHamp]

Oh, okay, I'm wrong, I guess you showed m--

Wait, you didn't show me anything. Like, oh, I dunno, shoes...clothes...nothing.

Just to have fun, let me give you some specs:

Let's say you are going to be out and about in the late fall in a temperate region at moderate altitude. Show me your kit, including shoes, undergarments, gloves and jacket that would be suitable in a cold, wet climate. They would have to be water-repellent (so no mink oil for you!) and have an R factor not necessarily as good as animal/synthetics, but enough to keep you from freezing. Additional difficultly factor: No cotton, which is referred to as "death cloth" due to it losing all heat retention when wet and being very difficult to dry and, also, racism.

As noble as your convictions may be, you don't get to die for them in this exercise. No synthetics, and none of that awful Inuit stuff made from the bodies of our animal brethren. Those bastards.

You don't get to bullshit, or talk in generalities. Please link to the products in question, which will then be evaluated on how much time search and rescue will have to find your lifeless corpse.

Listen. I said it was difficult, but not impossible. You are arguing a fallacy here by insisting first that vegans live in an inhospital climate and second that they follow only your rules for dress and sustinence. I'm not a vegan. My point was that you are arguing a fallacy. If you want to do that, fine, but don't attack me over points I didn't make.

No philosophy is perfect, including yours, mine, and that subscribed to by most vegans. They are free to preach to you. You are free to ignore them. You are also free to rant about it just as I am free to point out the fallacies in your reasoning. You made your argument personal, I did not. Way to go.

Additionally, insisting that vegans can't use synthetic materials is also a logical fallacy. It is akin to insisting that atheists not read because the first book printed was the bible. How a process orginiated is not the argument a vegan makes, it is the impact of that process at the present time that is important. Again, this isn't perfect. Again, nothing is. They are just people trying to reduce their impact on the world. You don't have to like their views or subscribe to them, but misrepsenting them only makes you appear angry and vindictive.

What did I say about not bullshitting? Let's break some of this shit down.

You are arguing a fallacy here by insisting first that vegans live in an inhospital climate and second that they follow only your rules for dress and sustinence

So, what is the ideal climate for vegans? Is there a geographical locale vegans gravitate towards, just so I can avoid it. And I say avoid it because for me cluster bombing isn't practical at this time.

No philosophy is perfect, including yours, mine, and that subscribed to by most vegans. They are free to preach to you.

I see, as no philosophy is "perfect" (and talk about imposing rules, I didn't know that was one), glaring inconsistencies and impracticality should be no impediment to some douche telling me to do as he says, not as he necessarily does.

You made your argument personal, I did not. Way to go.

No, I made the argument applicable to the real world. Pointing out you're a fuck-head was just a bonus.

Additionally, insisting that vegans can't use synthetic materials is also a logical fallacy. It is akin to insisting that atheists not read because the first book printed was the bible.

Accuse me of logical fallacy in the sentence before you strawman my argument with a bad analogy in the service of a false dichotomy.
Brilliant.

Vegans can use synthetics for all I care, but it speaks to my original point which you probably should have remembered, that Veganism is a lifestyle of privilege requiring post-agrarian if not post-industrial technology. So rather than being the moral high ground, or reducing impact it rides piggyback on those evils while being all smug about it.

Looks like a sore point for you. I don't want to trigger your suppressed vegan trauma and since this is going exactly nowhere, I'll leave it rest.

[codelette]

The comments really are the best part. It's a lot of Hispanic/Latino/Latina people pitching in, telling the author they're really not offended at all by what Del Rey is doing. Like this comment for instance:

Thank you for your concern but no, we are not so sensitive about everything. And no, most of us don't identify with / need to protect Chola shit. Does this broad expect Latins, all of us, hailing from a dozen different countries, to go all up in arms? Argentine and Puerto Rican, Paraguayan and Mexican, hand in hand, demanding that Del Rey give tear tattoos, the pride and joy of brown people who eat guacamaole (obviously we all do) back to us?

Whoops?

The brilliant thing is, most of them are ignored.

or this one...

Am I the only one who finds it more and more troubling that Jez willfully takes bad parts of a culture and then attributes them to race?

Do you even understand what you're implying? You're implying being a gangster is part of Latino culture (and similar has been done for Black and Ratchet culture). You're attributing extremely negative things to one ethnicity, and saying other people shouldn't/can't be involved in it....

By attributing these actions to poc's "culture" and telling white's "hands off" you're actually saying, "white people, stop behaving poorly, that's part of black/Latino culture"

Like...you are seriously saying this, whether you mean to or not.

So, y'know....

Please stop

:lol:

[Tony Parsehole]

or this one...

Am I the only one who finds it more and more troubling that Jez willfully takes bad parts of a culture and then attributes them to race?

Do you even understand what you're implying? You're implying being a gangster is part of Latino culture (and similar has been done for Black and Ratchet culture). You're attributing extremely negative things to one ethnicity, and saying other people shouldn't/can't be involved in it....

By attributing these actions to poc's "culture" and telling white's "hands off" you're actually saying, "white people, stop behaving poorly, that's part of black/Latino culture"

Like...you are seriously saying this, whether you mean to or not.

So, y'know....

Please stop

:lol:

And a better response was never written.
Copy/paste for future reference.

[tina]

Welcome Dobby. Here is your obligatory basket of links for you to peruse

Yer sposed to give Dobby a sock, dickhead. Evry fule kno that.

Fuck off Dobby.

Squid-Socks_45634-l.jpg

Sock is 100% vegan with 2.3 tog value, 5.6 wick factor and only fapped in once by PZ Myers

[welch]

Vegans can't use silk anyway, animal product. And yes, I am aware of thermal issues with various kinds of fabric. One does not work outside in -40 for years without acquiring that knowledge.

I wasn't saying cotton is some kind of wonder fabric. It's simply the low-hanging fruit for making clothes from source that isn't an animal product of some form.

Oh, I know. I just wanted to make it clear in proper SJW fashion what a crap human being you are and, therefore from logical necessity, how I shit chocolate truffles.

I have a series of sleeping bags. I keep one of my not-so-great 15 degree bags and a rudimentary survival kit in my car so as not to end up like James Kim. I have a 3-piece modular sleeping bag with a Gore-Tex cover and just bough what is supposedly a -40 military surplus sleeping bag to go with my m1928 haversack kit which I can't wait to try out. And I tried overnighting in 18 degree with just an army blanket like dudes did in Bastogne and damn near froze my ass off. If you've ever seen a mannered and theatrical film like Battlefield, the sight of guys in snowy holes covered by a single blanket makes one's balls shrink. My great-Uncle at the Battle of the Bulge used to wake up next to guys who froze to death, so it's no joke.

My experience in the right clothes to wear, not just wicking layers, but alternating insulating with silky layers so the layers don't bind, has been essential in camping, hiking and especially biking, where I've put together, for example, a three-layer glove system (Merino wool liner, nylon, PVC gloves and an outer Gore-Tex shell) so as to laugh at the lightweights who think "too cold" is a phrase to be used in commuting by bike.

Which is all to say talking noble shit about how one is too moral to wear an Anorak made from animal skins is all well and good when you're a sheltered little hipster-glasses wearing metrosexual tit, but not when actual cold and wet is a part of one's daily experience.

So what the fuck do you wear in -40?

James Kim was either stupid or woefully ignorant. He had a place that was shielded from the weather, reasonably insulated and a source of water. Idiot could have lasted weeks in the car, esp. if he allowed snow to build up around it and just kept the roof and an area around one door clear. He clearly had a way to make fire as well. This is what happens when you think knowledge in one area translates to others.

In -40, layers. thermals, good socks, mucklucks for boots, uniform, and then field jacket with the optional liner. For hats, the standard fuzzy hat with earflaps. We usually added neoprene facemasks, and our own gloves, (USAF gloves sucked at allowing you to work with smallish screws AND keep your hands warm) so really, the only areas exposed to the wind would be right around our eyes.

You weren't COMFORTABLE, but you didn't freeze and you had reasonable mobility.

[welch]

Really, and where do you get your B-12?

B12 is produced by bacteria, not plants and not animals. I'm not vegan, so I get B12 from cheese, eggs, etc. Vegans can live healthy lifestyles. Again, the argument that the CAN'T use synthesized products is a fallacy.

Now, I have friends that have been, for long stretches, Vegans. They didn't preach. Nor did they pretend this would work anywhere but in an industrialized society where their food choices could be catered to due to the reality of needing vitamin and mineral supplements because vegan diets are, by nature, incomplete.

We can no more be herbivores (Vitamin B-12) than we can be carnivores (Vitamin C). And for we omnivores to go either route requires appropriate technology and support for us to not suffer the consequences of one of these unsustainable diets. Something that's only (in practical terms) available in the more technologically sophisticated and wealthy parts of the world.

And certainly not on some 10-acre, mule-powered farm in the middle of the jungle.

Yes, most vegans are like that. You can, in fact, get enough B12 without supplement or meat. Mushrooms (they absorb it from the soil bacteria) are a good source of B12 as are some plants that are grown in cow manure (as opposed to synthetic fertilizer. THings like soybean, spinach, and certain grains can be higher in B12 if grown in cow or pig crap than if fertilized with synthetic products. The point, once again, is not that being vegan is easy, but that saying it is impossible is quite wrong.

actual serious question: but isn't manure "wrong" according to vegan "no animal products" theory? You (obviously) aren't ingesting it, but you are using an animal to get it. It is, literally, an animal product.

[welch]

The comments really are the best part. It's a lot of Hispanic/Latino/Latina people pitching in, telling the author they're really not offended at all by what Del Rey is doing. Like this comment for instance:

Thank you for your concern but no, we are not so sensitive about everything. And no, most of us don't identify with / need to protect Chola shit. Does this broad expect Latins, all of us, hailing from a dozen different countries, to go all up in arms? Argentine and Puerto Rican, Paraguayan and Mexican, hand in hand, demanding that Del Rey give tear tattoos, the pride and joy of brown people who eat guacamaole (obviously we all do) back to us?

Whoops?

The brilliant thing is, most of them are ignored.

or this one...

Am I the only one who finds it more and more troubling that Jez willfully takes bad parts of a culture and then attributes them to race?

Do you even understand what you're implying? You're implying being a gangster is part of Latino culture (and similar has been done for Black and Ratchet culture). You're attributing extremely negative things to one ethnicity, and saying other people shouldn't/can't be involved in it....

By attributing these actions to poc's "culture" and telling white's "hands off" you're actually saying, "white people, stop behaving poorly, that's part of black/Latino culture"

Like...you are seriously saying this, whether you mean to or not.

So, y'know....

Please stop

:lol:

See? You TRY to help some poor 'icans out, and this is what you get. Brown people got no fuckin' appreciation for help from above.

[Tony Parsehole]

Typical vegans. Note the shitty clothing. Probably made from lentil fibres or some other ethically sourced bullshit.
http://www.history.com/images/media/sli ... vivors.jpg

Typical non-vegans. Note the spears, no doubt for hunting boars or other dangerous but tasty creatures.
http://blog.hqperformance.com/wp-conten ... m-army.jpg

[Scented Nectar]

[youtube]ezrUG39WaOI[/youtube]

Feminists don't even try to stick to reality. And that goes double for feminists who are in politics.

[codelette]

See? You TRY to help some poor 'icans out, and this is what you get. Brown people got no fuckin' appreciation for help from above.

I guess "education" was what Sally Strange was trying to do for me one time on Twitter. I explained to her that she had white savior complex and plenty of white guilt, she called me reactionary. :roll:

[Kareem]

The comments really are the best part. It's a lot of Hispanic/Latino/Latina people pitching in, telling the author they're really not offended at all by what Del Rey is doing. Like this comment for instance:

Thank you for your concern but no, we are not so sensitive about everything. And no, most of us don't identify with / need to protect Chola shit. Does this broad expect Latins, all of us, hailing from a dozen different countries, to go all up in arms? Argentine and Puerto Rican, Paraguayan and Mexican, hand in hand, demanding that Del Rey give tear tattoos, the pride and joy of brown people who eat guacamaole (obviously we all do) back to us?

Whoops?

The brilliant thing is, most of them are ignored.

or this one...

Am I the only one who finds it more and more troubling that Jez willfully takes bad parts of a culture and then attributes them to race?

Do you even understand what you're implying? You're implying being a gangster is part of Latino culture (and similar has been done for Black and Ratchet culture). You're attributing extremely negative things to one ethnicity, and saying other people shouldn't/can't be involved in it....

By attributing these actions to poc's "culture" and telling white's "hands off" you're actually saying, "white people, stop behaving poorly, that's part of black/Latino culture"

Like...you are seriously saying this, whether you mean to or not.

So, y'know....

Please stop

:lol:

It's like when that Lorde song controversy: A girl highlights the excess and materialism in pop music, someone on Feministing asks "So why shit on black folks? "

Swear to God, direct quote.

http://feministing.com/2013/10/03/wow-t ... is-racist/

[Really?]

Typical vegans. Note the shitty clothing. Probably made from lentil fibres or some other ethically sourced bullshit.
http://www.history.com/images/media/sli ... vivors.jpg

Typical non-vegans. Note the spears, no doubt for hunting boars or other dangerous but tasty creatures.
http://blog.hqperformance.com/wp-conten ... m-army.jpg

Those non-vegans look incredibly unhealthy. Can you imagine how high their cholesterol and blood pressure must be? They should replace that red meat with tofu.

[Tony Parsehole]

It's like when that Lorde song controversy: A girl highlights the excess and materialism in pop music, someone on Feministing asks "So why shit on black folks? "

Swear to God, direct quote.

http://feministing.com/2013/10/03/wow-t ... is-racist/

Not only racist but "deeply racist" and the reasons given for the accusation are mind-boggling.
This hunt-for-the-racism-in-everything fad is one step away from wearing a tin-foil hat, fucking about with the numbers in 9/11 and linking the answer to the Jews.

[Tony Parsehole]

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2883/1134 ... de28_o.jpg

[Lsuoma]

Parsehole is cooking with gas today!

BTW, here is a cartoon that's up for auction in London soon. What do people think the SJL would make of it?

http://www.dnfa.com/media/dreweatts/inv ... 5916-8.jpg

The caption is "And next time I go out for a quick rape, I want it to stay on!!"

Link to lot: "And next time I go out for a quick rape, I want it to stay on!!"

[Angry_Drunk]

In my experience (admittedly constrained to the local North Sonoran variety) "hispanics" are pretty much the last group to give a singular fuck about whitey "appropriating" their culture.

Tell one of the local Mexicans that they're being "appropriated" and their response is likely to be along the line of: "Shit gringo, we've been stealing your culture for 500 years. Now go enjoy your burrito."

[Matt Cavanaugh]

.

Apparently Avicenna got robbed and assaulted in his house (minor stitches). I felt sorry for him until I read his pain was further compounded by the 'pit (Or so it seems).

My place got robbed last week and I actually have been debating on whether to tell people or not about it.
Partly because there exists a vocal amount of atheists who don’t really care all that much for FTB and who would utilise any opportunity to bash anyone who happens to be part of it irrespective of the issue. It’s made it a problem.

It’s impossible to be anonymous and tell people what I do because the anonymity makes the claim “fake”. It’s impossible to not be anonymous because then the insults get personal.

But I got robbed last week.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/amilliongod ... te-robbed/

The guy is just a clown with a martyr complex. He should take up religion, he'd fit right in.

I submitted a reasoned defense of Slymepit skepticism and contra the "hyperskeptic" strawman. Avicenna is the only FtBer I'll bother to engage with, as ze 1) allows dissenting comments; 2) seems to be fairly reasonable despite working from some terribly flawed premises.

Won't fall for Ophelia Van Pelt's football again, and why bother registering on pharyngula when I'm surely already pre-banned. And the rest of the lot are such incredibly shitty, long-winded writers, I'm not even sure what the fuck they're saying.

[John Greg]

acathode said (http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... 12#p149812):

IMO, if you wouldn't kill the animal yourself, if you're not yourself prepared to "blow the brains out of another living creature" - because you find it to messy, or immoral, or sad, or just couldn't stand the though of taking a living creatures life, or for whatever reason - then you shouldn't eat it. Anything else is just hypocritical, and very disrespectful, to both the life of the animal, and to the person who did killing for you.

Yes, indeed.

And don't use wood unless you farm/log the trees. And don't eat bread unless you farm the wheat. And don't eat veggies unless you farm the veggies. And don't wear leather unless you farm the leather beast. And don't use rubber anything unless you farm the rubber trees. And so on and so forth. Nonsense. False dichotomies and all that.

I'm not a hunter myself, but I know plenty, including both my parents, and none of them derive any pleasure or satisfaction from the messy kill bit. For some, there's the thrill of the hunt, which is similar to say, what a fisherman feels when he's hooked a big fish, but none AFAIK actually enjoy the messy seconds where the shot has landed and the life drains from the animal.

Ah bullshit. I call total shenanigans and toxic delusion on that bunch of Walt Disney happyland nonsense.

[Selenite]

Not only racist but "deeply racist" and the reasons given for the accusation are mind-boggling.
This hunt-for-the-racism-in-everything fad is one step away from wearing a tin-foil hat, fucking about with the numbers in 9/11 and linking the answer to the Jews.

I think of this as "Clickbait Feminism".

That article has hit a sweet-spot for grabbing people's attention.

If the article attacked Big Problems, people might agree. Maybe they'd leave an 'I agree! Racism is bad!' comment. But no one's going to get sucked in. Big Problems are obviously bad. There's no one to shout at. And fixing Big Problems takes real work. So that sort of article fades away.

Instead, there's a formula. "That popular song/videogame/movie is the Worst Thing Ever. If you support it, you're Literally Hitler." Every time, the comment section explodes.

The article will get a rise from the fans of the popular thing. It'll get a rise from academic-types who want to argue about nuance. And it'll suck in clickbait-activists who're looking for an excuse to shout about their cause.

Anita Sarkeesian has made a fortune form the formula. It seems to be what drives a lot of the FTB people, too.

I don't even think it's deliberate. Authors write articles on a bunch of stuff. They select future topics based on comments/attention. And pretty soon, their style has evolved into "5 Small problems in popular things that will destroy civilization as we know it"

[mordacious1]

I don't know if anyone has posted this new spread of our mascot:

http://www.eonline.com/news/490170/hot- ... topstories

[Matt Cavanaugh]

SallyStrange has been busy promoting #dearcisfeminism on Twitter. She just retweeted this:

Wait, what?!?

:doh:

Oh, zit's probably referring to how some non-European cultures -- before being forcible subjected to Western mores -- used to have a separate pronoun to describe all the little boys whose genitals they'd hacked off and doomed to a life of prostitution. Who are we to judge?

[Lsuoma]

I don't know if anyone has posted this new spread of our mascot:

http://www.eonline.com/news/490170/hot- ... topstories

Fap, fap, fap!

Hunngghhh!

[John Greg]

Matt Cavanaugh said (http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... 66#p149866):

Oh, for chrissakes! It collapsed under its own weight of words, hit carbon detonation, and super-fucking-nova'd. I mean, y'all sent Wonderist up to bat!

You are absolutely right about the collapse and demise of that joke of ponderosity, but, we didn't exactly send that ridiculously over-verbose drone. He sent himself, as it were, and against careful posts highlighting and explaining his insane over-verbosity, he was immune, utterly immune. Fuck me, when asked to clarify and shorten, he would obfuscate and extend. The so-called moderators really, really, dropped the ball on that whole thing.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Or invent a time machine and go back to prevent colonization!

Bah! I'm going to invent a time machine and go back 1.2 billion years to prevent the evolution of sexual reproduction. Only then will we be free from patriarchal binary gender cis-scum oppression. Or something.

I self-identify as a prokaryote, or as we in our community call ourselves, an Archaeakin. I prefer the pronouns "blob" and "wriggler's". Please check your organelle-haver privilege.

[welch]

See? You TRY to help some poor 'icans out, and this is what you get. Brown people got no fuckin' appreciation for help from above.

I guess "education" was what Sally Strange was trying to do for me one time on Twitter. I explained to her that she had white savior complex and plenty of white guilt, she called me reactionary. :roll:

you're just so ungrateful.

[welch]

It's like when that Lorde song controversy: A girl highlights the excess and materialism in pop music, someone on Feministing asks "So why shit on black folks? "

Swear to God, direct quote.

http://feministing.com/2013/10/03/wow-t ... is-racist/

Not only racist but "deeply racist" and the reasons given for the accusation are mind-boggling.
This hunt-for-the-racism-in-everything fad is one step away from wearing a tin-foil hat, fucking about with the numbers in 9/11 and linking the answer to the Jews.

This tells you everything you need to know about the author:

Now I’m a music lover, but since the only radio stations I listen to are the local hip hop station and NPR,

So fuckin' profound, she bleeds.

[Ericb]

Or invent a time machine and go back to prevent colonization!

Bah! I'm going to invent a time machine and go back 1.2 billion years to prevent the evolution of sexual reproduction. Only then will we be free from patriarchal binary gender cis-scum oppression. Or something.

I self-identify as a prokaryote, or as we in our community call ourselves, an Archaeakin. I prefer the pronouns "blob" and "wriggler's". Please check your organelle-haver privilege.

Many organelles are just exploited prokaryotes. Eukaryote domainism and colonialism must end now.

[welch]

Or invent a time machine and go back to prevent colonization!

Bah! I'm going to invent a time machine and go back 1.2 billion years to prevent the evolution of sexual reproduction. Only then will we be free from patriarchal binary gender cis-scum oppression. Or something.

I self-identify as a prokaryote, or as we in our community call ourselves, an Archaeakin. I prefer the pronouns "blob" and "wriggler's". Please check your organelle-haver privilege.

Get your blob-ass back in the kitchen and wriggle me up some pie!

[Apples]

PZ has a long and cranky post responding to a Mooney article in Mother Jones about reasons why people might cling to supernatural beliefs/have trouble understanding evolution. I skimmed most of it, but this bit jumped out at me (first bit in comic sans is Mooney):

http://i.imgur.com/TOxdJox.jpg?1

What the fuck? This is one of the strangest examples of quote-mining I've ever seen. He quotes Mooney in full, then reproduces the first part of the sentence and tells his readers to stop right there -- then interprets the truncated bit in a manner that exactly reverses its plain meaning and doesn't even make sense given the grammatical structure. The dude is losing it.

[Mykeru]

Looks like a sore point for you. I don't want to trigger your suppressed vegan trauma and since this is going exactly nowhere, I'll leave it rest.

Really, that's all you've got?

James Kim was either stupid or woefully ignorant. He had a place that was shielded from the weather, reasonably insulated and a source of water. Idiot could have lasted weeks in the car, esp. if he allowed snow to build up around it and just kept the roof and an area around one door clear. He clearly had a way to make fire as well. This is what happens when you think knowledge in one area translates to others.

In -40, layers. thermals, good socks, mucklucks for boots, uniform, and then field jacket with the optional liner. For hats, the standard fuzzy hat with earflaps. We usually added neoprene facemasks, and our own gloves, (USAF gloves sucked at allowing you to work with smallish screws AND keep your hands warm) so really, the only areas exposed to the wind would be right around our eyes.

You weren't COMFORTABLE, but you didn't freeze and you had reasonable mobility.

I tend to cut Kim a little more slack. He didn't intend to end up on that logging road, he made a wrong turn and then a series of bad decisions followed. And when I say bad decisions I mean the kind of bad decisions that are so psychologically compelling that it pretty much has to be beaten out of people in survival training. He should have turned around and back-tracked, for instance, but few people do. The tendency is to not want to give up whatever ground you've "gained" and push on through. He could have been more prepared for a survival situation, but he didn't know that's what he was getting into. Couple that with days of freezing at night, lack of adequate food and everything else, he made one monumentally bad decision: To go out looking for help. Now, he did do something that showed some acumen by following a river, but having no idea where he was he didn't realize a cabin was in closer proximity than any settlement he could find following it. Also, he didn't realize that the gully he put himself into was some 20 degrees colder than the surrounding area and, on top of it, he got wet. Once he started that walk, he showed a certain amount of toughness and determination surviving as long as he did. That he was pushed past the limit was demonstrated by his paradoxical undressing. His body just gave up trying to direct heat to his core in the terminal stages of hypothermia.

Rather than criticize him and think he was a fool, I tend to think when it came down to it, he tried up to the point of death.

I carry spare clothes water, MREs, 9 hour candles that can be placed in a Dinty Moore can after I eat it for warmth, accessory rope, knife, folding esbit stove, etc. etc.but I know if the "shit hits the fan" as preppers like to say, I know it's not going to happen the way I expect.

One thing that has always impressed me about military surplus gloves and glove liners, even the supposedly extreme cold weather ones, is just how much they 1. Suck and 2, Seem to be designed to universally fit no one.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Matt Cavanaugh said (http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... 66#p149866):

Oh, for chrissakes! It collapsed under its own weight of words, hit carbon detonation, and super-fucking-nova'd. I mean, y'all sent Wonderist up to bat!

You are absolutely right about the collapse and demise of that joke of ponderosity, but, we didn't exactly send that ridiculously over-verbose drone. He sent himself, as it were, and against careful posts highlighting and explaining his insane over-verbosity, he was immune, utterly immune. Fuck me, when asked to clarify and shorten, he would obfuscate and extend. The so-called moderators really, really, dropped the ball on that whole thing.

Even before Wonderist and Zvan had buried the entire planet under their competing cases of the word-scours, the entire project was based on a flawed premise. In his initial statement, Nugent alluded to our common ground as atheists. But when the 'other side' has redefined atheism as A plus all sorts of other shit, there is no common ground. And since they insisted that every atheist endeavor include their 'Plus' agenda, and that every atheist accept their propositions as a given not open for debate, there was really nothing left to discuss.

[Lsuoma]

Just for shits and grins I went back last night and reviewed the Bottomless Pit of Endless Wonder, and found my will to live sapping away so fast I had to stop reading it and go and lie down...

[Tony Parsehole]

Just for shits and grins I went back last night and reviewed the Bottomless Pit of Endless Wonder, and found my will to live sapping away so fast I had to stop reading it and go and lie down...

Glad I was on 'Pit-holiday when all that kicked off. I remember seeing an exchange about bananas in a Radio Rentals shop window but that's about it.

[Git]

Welcome Dobby. Here is your obligatory basket of links for you to peruse

Yer sposed to give Dobby a sock, dickhead. Evry fule kno that.

Fuck off Dobby.

Oh right. Here we go then. Here are your socks then Dobby.

cat.jpg

(85.66 KiB) Downloaded 326 times

[rpguest]

In my experience (admittedly constrained to the local North Sonoran variety) "hispanics" are pretty much the last group to give a singular fuck about whitey "appropriating" their culture.

Tell one of the local Mexicans that they're being "appropriated" and their response is likely to be along the line of: "Shit gringo, we've been stealing your culture for 500 years. Now go enjoy your burrito."

chris hardwick already appropriated burritos

[Sunder]

PZ has a long and cranky post responding to a Mooney article in Mother Jones about reasons why people might cling to supernatural beliefs/have trouble understanding evolution. I skimmed most of it, but this bit jumped out at me (first bit in comic sans is Mooney):

http://i.imgur.com/TOxdJox.jpg?1

What the fuck? This is one of the strangest examples of quote-mining I've ever seen. He quotes Mooney in full, then reproduces the first part of the sentence and tells his readers to stop right there -- then interprets the truncated bit in a manner that exactly reverses its plain meaning and doesn't even make sense given the grammatical structure. The dude is losing it.

As soon as I read the words "think deeply" I realized what PZ had done.

That's a primary school parsing mistake.

I'm genuinely having trouble figuring out which bits of PZ's inanity are calculated dishonesty and which parts are just plain stupidity.

[Tony Parsehole]

Do you what the funniest thing on the internet is? PZ Myers quoting somebody he doesn't like.
The way he uses the intrinsic hilarity of comic sans to it's full potential and the transparent Monty Python man in the corner of each quotation is biting satire at it's finest.
My sides literally rip open with involuntary spasms of choking laughter whenever he does it.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Myers-style humour is like a visit to the dentist.