Now sponsored by [spoiler]my dick[/spoiler]

[CommanderTuvok]

Fucking Hell. Scented Nectar's EYES.

:scared-eek:

[UnbelieveSteve]

Does Melody say "Everyone has to follow the harassment policy PRIOR TO and during the conference" How does that work? If you EVER violate the harassment policy then you are not allowed to attend? What is the scope of this control over a persons actions? I hope she means threats and such but if I go on an ass-grabbing spree the night before and it doesn't involve anyone attending does that mean I'm banned from the conference?

No. You're perma banned by Hensley because you are a [edit] "Rebecca Watson".

[Lsuoma]

It's so dead it doesn't even know it

[youtube]rW4qx3iCrcg[/youtube]

[Za-zen]

I'll just leave this here.
http://i.imgur.com/KrZ2aVR.jpg
and
http://i.imgur.com/8C0kHwL.jpg
Oophie realizes it's her own damn fault for RTing a parody tweet.
:lol:

Does Melody say "Everyone has to follow the harassment policy PRIOR TO and during the conference" How does that work? If you EVER violate the harassment policy then you are not allowed to attend? What is the scope of this control over a persons actions? I hope she means threats and such but if I go on an ass-grabbing spree the night before and it doesn't involve anyone attending does that mean I'm banned from the conference?

What's concerning about this is that silverman seems to be accepting the premise that Vacula is an undesirable person! I really really fucking hope he's taking the piss out of the stupidity of it.

[Reap]

Does Melody say "Everyone has to follow the harassment policy PRIOR TO and during the conference" How does that work? If you EVER violate the harassment policy then you are not allowed to attend? What is the scope of this control over a persons actions? I hope she means threats and such but if I go on an ass-grabbing spree the night before and it doesn't involve anyone attending does that mean I'm banned from the conference?

No. You're perma banned by Hensley because you are a [edit] "Rebecca Watson".

Ha ha I was wondering if anyone was gonna mention that. I thought it worked quite well.

[BarnOwl]

Someone drank the Kool-aid ...

http://i1158.photobucket.com/albums/p60 ... 950aea.png

So what "happened" to them? :roll:

[Za-zen]

People in the skeptic movement called them out for spouting shit, and they're women!!!

[Cunning Punt]

Ive just made three women uncomfortable in OKC Atheists group by challenging their anti-vax/anti-GMO positions.

SEXISM!!!!

I understand why people might be anti-vax; I know they're wrong, but I get it - needles and strange substances are scary. But I could never figure out the anti-GMO movement at all. Why are people afraid of fucking tomatoes?

Cause it's not just tomatoes it's tomatoes with fish and cow bum DNA...so while it may look like a tomato it really isn't. Then, when you eat them and marvel at their intense flavour you can't help but feel like you've been in some way violated by being forced to eat DNA of cow bum...and it's worse when you are a vegetarian. Also, once digested, the special magic used to fuse the DNA together dissolves and mingles with your own DNA and tomatoes come growing out of your belly button...true that. Just saying......

Here's one thing that bugs me. Obviously you are joking, but when pro GMO people say that GMO modification is just like the selective breeding of plants that humans have been doing for thousands of years, only quicker, I call bullshit. It is qualitatively different to inject the DNA of another species into the nucleus of a plant cell. I'm not saying it's harmful. I don't think it is, but I think it's fallacious to conflate the two things just to score a point in the argument.

[Cunning Punt]

So with that tweet shown above by Melody Hensley - she lays out her plan on stopping JV from attending WISCON2. "Prior" violations of this cons harassment policy will result in banning...

The Fuck?

I predict that she will let him get to the door, then make this big production on how "his kind isn't welcomed here" - and then ban him - wasting money and time.

Then she will go in for the group hugs and say how she is a brave warrior - fighting the injustice.

Yea I can see that happening. If she does try any of that crap I'm gonna be pissed. That is the kind of shit that needs to stop.

Justin, have you lawyered up?

[Scented Nectar]

Fucking Hell. Scented Nectar's EYES.

:scared-eek:

I'm starting to suspect that my mother had an affair with Marty Feldman. :D

[youtube]nxxSIX3fmmo[/youtube]

[BarnOwl]

People in the skeptic movement called them out for spouting shit, and they're women!!!

ZOMG that's terrible!

Disappointing that so many skeptics actually believe Ophelia's woe-is-me martyrdom bullshit. It would be interesting to hold her accountable for her day-to-day activities, which I'm guessing would reveal a good deal of privilege and leisure. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am - many of her own blog posts seem to confirm my suspicions.

[Tigzy]

More amusement at how blind Peezus is to his own foibles:

I was amused lately to be reminded of this debate between John Cleese and Michael Palin, on one side, against Malcolm Muggeridge and Mervyn Stockwood, the Bishop of Southwark, on the other — arguing over The Life of Brian…in 1979. It’s two smart, open-minded people with the ability to critically evaluate truth claims against a pair of pompous old farts who are indignant at the lack of reverence for their ridiculous dogma.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... -atheists/

Pompous old fartitude and ridiculous dogma isn't confined to religion, Peez. Shift the sphere into different but no less dogmatic realms, and Cleese and Palin could very well be partriarchal PUA MRA rape-apologists.

[UnbelieveSteve]

No. You're perma banned by Hensley because you are a [edit] "Rebecca Watson".

Ha ha I was wondering if anyone was gonna mention that. I thought it worked quite well.

I laughed my ass off the first time i heard it. Funny prick Rebecca Watson.

[Apples]

"Elyse" over at Skepchick has a post up about a Glee plotline involving sex between an apparently legally underage female character and somewhat older douchy male character. She actually gets good pushback in the comments, but she herself is completely unable to get away from her compulsion to see the lack of internet outrage about this as a despicable affirmation of rape culture. For her, if the law defines "consent" a particular way and if entirely enthusiastically consensual sex between people close in age is legally defined as "rape," you must see zero difference between that situation and forcible rape.

Despite commenters' attempts to talk some sense into her, Elyse makes it clear that she is totally locked into technical and legalistic definitions of consent and rape (wilfully missing the point that defining "ability to consent" as whatever your local legislature happens to say it is -- and eliding the difference between that and real-life particular human situations and psychology -- undermines any attempt to analyze the concept consistently and meaningfully). Par for the Skepchick course.

http://skepchick.org/2013/01/glee-baby- ... got-raped/

[UnbelieveSteve]

Someone drank the Kool-aid ...

http://i1158.photobucket.com/albums/p60 ... 950aea.png

So what "happened" to them? :roll:

....(crickets).....

[ThreeFlangedJavis]

People in the skeptic movement called them out for spouting shit, and they're women!!!

ZOMG that's terrible!

Disappointing that so many skeptics actually believe Ophelia's woe-is-me martyrdom bullshit. It would be interesting to hold her accountable for her day-to-day activities, which I'm guessing would reveal a good deal of privilege and leisure. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am - many of her own blog posts seem to confirm my suspicions.

There you go. The poor women has been forced into a life of leisure. But for the Patriarchy she woulda been an astronaut.

[Tigzy]

...We just had this thing in the UK with burgers being contaminated with horse meat which caused some people (my daughter) to freak out...

I recommend sticking to burgers which are clearly labelled as having no added Shergar.

[Git]

Hey okie demon, watched your latest godcast, good to see you're an Ulster zombie too, i'll send you tickets to ravenhill.

Bloody hell, I'm originally from there too, though I've lived in Albion now for like 15 years.

[Dick Strawkins]

The 'Women in Secularism 2' harrasment policy is here:
http://www.womeninsecularism.org/policy.html

POLICY ON HOSTILE CONDUCT / HARASSMENT AT CONFERENCES
Purpose and Scope of Policy

The Center for Inquiry (CFI) and its affiliates, including the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry and the Council for Secular Humanism, are educational organizations. As part of our educational mission, we hold conferences from time to time. To ensure that everyone attending our conferences is able to participate in them fully, CFI and its affiliates are committed to providing a safe and hospitable environment at our conferences. Accordingly, CFI and its affiliates prohibit intimidating, threatening, or harassing conduct during our conferences. This policy applies to speakers, staff, volunteers, and attendees.

“Conferences” for purpose of this policy includes any educational meeting or gathering organized or sponsored by CFI or its affiliates to which nonemployees are invited. In other words, this policy applies to local or regional meetings, not just national conferences.

This policy supplements the policy on harassment set forth in the CFI employee handbook, which governs the conduct of CFI staff; it does not replace or supersede that policy.

Prohibited Conduct

In general, prohibited conduct includes any abusive conduct that has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with another person’s ability to enjoy and participate in the conference, including social events related to the conference.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, yelling at or threatening speakers or attendees, or any significantly disruptive conduct. By way of example, repeated interruption of a speaker by an attendee is prohibited.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, harassment based on race, gender, sexual orientation, disability, or any other protected group status, as provided by local, state, or federal law. By way of example, abusive conduct directed at someone because of their race is prohibited.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, sexual harassment. By way of example, unwelcome sexual attention, stalking, and physical contact such as pinching, grabbing, or groping are prohibited.

Critical examination of beliefs, including critical commentary on another person’s views, does not, by itself, constitute hostile conduct or harassment. One of the underlying rationales of this policy is to promote the free exchange of ideas, not to inhibit it.

Consequences of Hostile or Harassing Conduct

CFI and its affiliates have a zero-tolerance policy for hostile and harassing conduct. If a person engages in hostile or harassing conduct, appropriate remedial action will be taken, which may include, but is not limited to, expulsion from the conference. Threats of hostile conduct that are made prior to a conference may result in exclusion from the conference.

The exact remedy for hostile or harassing conduct will depend on an evaluation of all relevant circumstances, such as the severity of the conduct and prior violations by the person engaging in prohibited conduct.

When there is a reasonable basis for believing the conduct is illegal, appropriate law enforcement authorities will be notified.

Reporting Hostile or Harassing Conduct; Investigations

Persons who are the targets of, or witnesses to, hostile or harassing conduct should contact conference staff. At smaller meetings, conference staff, including the person(s) in charge of the meeting, will be introduced at the beginning. At larger conferences, conference staff will wear identification and/or will be identified in the conference program.

At larger conferences, phone numbers for hotel/venue staff, local law enforcement, and local emergency medical personnel will be provided to conference attendees to facilitate prompt response to complaints and/or requests for assistance.

Reports of hostile or harassing conduct will be promptly addressed. On some occasions, where conference staff are witnesses to the prohibited conduct, immediate remedial action may be taken. Where a report of hostile or harassing conduct is made to conference staff after the conduct has occurred, reasonable measures will be taken to establish the facts. This will typically include discussion with witnesses, if any, and the person accused of engaging in the prohibited conduct. Inquiries into hostile or harassing conduct will be carried out as confidentially as possible given the circumstances.

Record-Keeping

CFI and its affiliates will make a written record of all complaints/incidents as soon as practicable. These records will be used in connection with implementing this policy. These records will be maintained in the Office of the President & CEO of CFI and will not be disclosed to individuals outside of the organization except as required by law.

[Scented Nectar]

It's so dead it doesn't even know it

[Randy Newman video]

Back in the 80s, I went to a talk by the most awful folk wimmin's musicians ever. Alix Dobkin. She gave a lecture all about how Randi Newman was a horrible sexist because of his lyrics in some song.

Here is an example of Dobkin's "music". Trigger warning for ear pain and misandric words.

"Every Woman Can Be a Lesbian (Alix Dobkin)"
[youtube]xjzs_x5bPiA[/youtube]

And the lyrics:
I heard Cheryl and Mary say
There are two kinds of people in the world today
One or the other a person must be
The men are them, the women are we
And they agree its a pleasure to be
A lesbian, lesbian
Lets be in no mans land
Lesbian, lesbian
Any woman can be a lesbian

Carol is tired of being nice
A sweet smile, a pretty face, submissive device
To pacify the people for they wont defend
A woman whos indifferent to men
Shes my friend, shes a lesbian

And Liza wishes the library
Had men and women placed separately
Ah, but theirs is the kingdom
She knows who shell find
In the HIStory of MANkind
But then shes inclined to be ahead of her time
Shes a lesbian, lesbian
Lets be in no mans land
Lesbian, lesbian
Any woman can be a lesbian

And womens anger Louise explains
On a million second places in the masters games
Its real as a mountain, its strong as the sea
Besides, an angry woman is a beauty
Shes chosen to be a dyke like me
Shes a lesbian, lesbian
Lets be in no mans land
Lesbian, lesbian
Any woman can be a lesbian

So the sexes do battle, they batter about
The mens are the sexes I will do without
Ill return to the bosom where my journey ends
Where theres no penis between us friends
Will I see you again
When youre a lesbian, lesbian
Lets be in no mans land
Lesbian, lesbian
Any woman can be lesbian
Every woman can be a lesbian
________

And with apologies in advance, here's another. Ouch! This hurts me more than it hurts you!

"Beware, Young Ladies | Alix Dobkin"
[youtube]SnbcsiKqRKQ[/youtube]

lyrics:
They say young men are bold and free
Beware! Oh take care!
They'll tell you they're friends, but they're liars, you see
Beware! Oh take care!

Beware young ladies, they're fooling you,
trust them not, they're fooling you.
Beware young ladies, they're fooling you,
Beware! Oh take care!

They smoke, they chew, they wear fine shoes
Beware! Oh take care!
And in their pocket is a bottle of booze
Beware! Oh take care!

Beware young ladies, they're fooling you,
trust them not, they're fooling you.
Beware young ladies, they're fooling you,
Beware! Oh take care!

They put their hands up to their hearts
They sigh, oh they sigh!
They say they love no one but you
They lie, oh they lie.

Beware young ladies, they're fooling you,
trust them not, they're fooling you.
Beware young ladies, they're fooling you,
Beware! Oh take care!

[Dick Strawkins]

According to that policy Justin Vacula has grounds to request the exclusion from the conference of serial harrasser Stephanie Zvan!

[Scented Nectar]

Doh! I left out her worst one. I'm embarrassed to say that I used to have this album and knew all the words.

"Amazon ABCs"
[youtube]OSbajZod7cs[/youtube]

***Puke!***

[UnbelieveSteve]

Everyone ready for #BlockSaturday?
A couple of the culprits responsible for that bullshit.
http://i.imgur.com/Rxd2prK.jpg

[d4m10n]

If you have an hour to kill, this is an example of two slyme, ranting at victim.

[spoiler][youtube]Q99J9df7inE[/youtube][/spoiler]

OMG DOXXXX!

That's BirdTerrifier on the left, BTW. Our guest is one of those women in secularism that we've been hearing about. We were talking about how fanhood and tribalism relate to politics and such.

[SenorBeagle]

...We just had this thing in the UK with burgers being contaminated with horse meat which caused some people (my daughter) to freak out...

I recommend sticking to burgers which are clearly labelled as having no added Shergar.

And now I'm imagining a(n even more) miniature Willie Carson riding me dinner round the living room...

Also, I've been crap at keeping up with things, so: Renee, best of luck to you and your fella! My thoughts is with ye both.

[Za-zen]

According to that policy Justin Vacula has grounds to request the exclusion from the conference of serial harrasser Stephanie Zvan!

You're just plain wrong there vainny's attention toward hateful vacula falls under the provision "our team"

[Git]

((((((hugs)))))) to you Renee and to your bloke.

[Tigzy]

...We just had this thing in the UK with burgers being contaminated with horse meat which caused some people (my daughter) to freak out...

I recommend sticking to burgers which are clearly labelled as having no added Shergar.

And now I'm imagining a(n even more) miniature Willie Carson riding me dinner round the living room...

I'll have a Big MacCreight, please.

:whistle:

[SenorBeagle]

...We just had this thing in the UK with burgers being contaminated with horse meat which caused some people (my daughter) to freak out...

I recommend sticking to burgers which are clearly labelled as having no added Shergar.

And now I'm imagining a(n even more) miniature Willie Carson riding me dinner round the living room...

I'll have a Big MacCreight, please.

:whistle:

I'm all for humour, but this? Neigh, sir, you've gone beyond the pail.

Sorry, I realise that sounded whinny... ;)

[Scented Nectar]

Just went to https://support.twitter.com/forms/abusiveuser and submitted the following (along with details):

By doing mass blockings of people they don't like, the targets are getting their accounts shut down since it triggers a spam alert if one is blocked by too many people at once. Twitter always reopens the accounts, because it was not spam. They are doing another mass blocking today. Every Saturday they manage to get accounts shut down. Please stop them from doing this, or at least make it so that it doesn't auto-trigger the shutdown of accounts. The above tweet link (and tweeter @aratina) is just one in the group who are doing the #blocksaturday campaign. Thanks in advance for looking into this.

Anyone else who's sick of the false flaggings and account shutdowns, might want to also submit a report.

[Submariner]

Hey Guys, that other submarine guy put out another video.It's about playing the victim card.


[youtube]rxXDpLZ2VPA[/youtube]

I'm really starting to like this guy. :popcorn:

[another lurker]

That implies you have also fixed the continuing growth in resource consumption issue. Reduce the population as far as you like. As long as it is non-zero, if the resource demands continue to rise year on year then you eventually exceed whatever limit you put on them.

Now, that is just being disingenuous there, oh Custardy Coward.
If I reduce it to the extremum of just one human, then makes a mockery of your scenario.
There was once a time when the human population was sustainable. This (again) demolishes your above assertion.
This is a continuum, not black & white, sir.
'Fess up and admit that I am correct.

Your "As long as it is non-zero..." nonsense is a travesty against mathematics, physics, poetry & common sense.
Leave it out, sunshine.

Sorry but at what time were things sustainable? I'm not aware of a time in history that there were no famine, starvation etc.

Even in indigenous cultures tribes went through phases. Progressed from nomadic to settlements then eventually to specialised processing to the present industrialised food production process.

I suggest nothing needs to be done. Once we reach that point where the depleted resources don't sustain the way we are living we adapt or die off...paving the way for some other life form (intelligent or not). It's always been this way and always will unless humans are the cause of ALL life to be eliminated and earth becomes a dry lump of a rock like our rocky planets in our solar system.

Natures checks and balances is supreme and I don't think humans are immune from those forces. ( sounds pantheistic I know). I'm not concerned if humans end up becoming extinct as unlikely as that may be.

QFT.

And speaking of population, I just love how silly liberals and conservatives love to say 'oh, population growth isn't a problem, the earth can easily support 12 billion people, we just have to grow more food!!!'

Yeah, like people aren't gonna be greedy, or fight over access to these future resources!? And just look at the famine in Somalia - how 'easy' was it to feed the starving people? Oh, not easy at all, was it? Little problem of armed bandits stealing all the food to sell for profit!

[Reap]

Just went to https://support.twitter.com/forms/abusiveuser and submitted the following (along with details):

By doing mass blockings of people they don't like, the targets are getting their accounts shut down since it triggers a spam alert if one is blocked by too many people at once. Twitter always reopens the accounts, because it was not spam. They are doing another mass blocking today. Every Saturday they manage to get accounts shut down. Please stop them from doing this, or at least make it so that it doesn't auto-trigger the shutdown of accounts. The above tweet link (and tweeter @aratina) is just one in the group who are doing the #blocksaturday campaign. Thanks in advance for looking into this.

Anyone else who's sick of the false flaggings and account shutdowns, might want to also submit a report.

Nice. Yea I love the way people try to just shut others up any way possible. Really progressive thinking there people. You should never force on others what you would consider unfair when done to you. Kindergarten knowledge, get some

[d4m10n]

The 'Women in Secularism 2' harrasment policy is here:
http://www.womeninsecularism.org/policy.html

[spoiler]

POLICY ON HOSTILE CONDUCT / HARASSMENT AT CONFERENCES
Purpose and Scope of Policy

The Center for Inquiry (CFI) and its affiliates, including the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry and the Council for Secular Humanism, are educational organizations. As part of our educational mission, we hold conferences from time to time. To ensure that everyone attending our conferences is able to participate in them fully, CFI and its affiliates are committed to providing a safe and hospitable environment at our conferences. Accordingly, CFI and its affiliates prohibit intimidating, threatening, or harassing conduct during our conferences. This policy applies to speakers, staff, volunteers, and attendees.

“Conferences” for purpose of this policy includes any educational meeting or gathering organized or sponsored by CFI or its affiliates to which nonemployees are invited. In other words, this policy applies to local or regional meetings, not just national conferences.

This policy supplements the policy on harassment set forth in the CFI employee handbook, which governs the conduct of CFI staff; it does not replace or supersede that policy.

Prohibited Conduct

In general, prohibited conduct includes any abusive conduct that has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with another person’s ability to enjoy and participate in the conference, including social events related to the conference.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, yelling at or threatening speakers or attendees, or any significantly disruptive conduct. By way of example, repeated interruption of a speaker by an attendee is prohibited.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, harassment based on race, gender, sexual orientation, disability, or any other protected group status, as provided by local, state, or federal law. By way of example, abusive conduct directed at someone because of their race is prohibited.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, sexual harassment. By way of example, unwelcome sexual attention, stalking, and physical contact such as pinching, grabbing, or groping are prohibited.

Critical examination of beliefs, including critical commentary on another person’s views, does not, by itself, constitute hostile conduct or harassment. One of the underlying rationales of this policy is to promote the free exchange of ideas, not to inhibit it.

Consequences of Hostile or Harassing Conduct

CFI and its affiliates have a zero-tolerance policy for hostile and harassing conduct. If a person engages in hostile or harassing conduct, appropriate remedial action will be taken, which may include, but is not limited to, expulsion from the conference. Threats of hostile conduct that are made prior to a conference may result in exclusion from the conference.

The exact remedy for hostile or harassing conduct will depend on an evaluation of all relevant circumstances, such as the severity of the conduct and prior violations by the person engaging in prohibited conduct.

When there is a reasonable basis for believing the conduct is illegal, appropriate law enforcement authorities will be notified.

Reporting Hostile or Harassing Conduct; Investigations

Persons who are the targets of, or witnesses to, hostile or harassing conduct should contact conference staff. At smaller meetings, conference staff, including the person(s) in charge of the meeting, will be introduced at the beginning. At larger conferences, conference staff will wear identification and/or will be identified in the conference program.

At larger conferences, phone numbers for hotel/venue staff, local law enforcement, and local emergency medical personnel will be provided to conference attendees to facilitate prompt response to complaints and/or requests for assistance.

Reports of hostile or harassing conduct will be promptly addressed. On some occasions, where conference staff are witnesses to the prohibited conduct, immediate remedial action may be taken. Where a report of hostile or harassing conduct is made to conference staff after the conduct has occurred, reasonable measures will be taken to establish the facts. This will typically include discussion with witnesses, if any, and the person accused of engaging in the prohibited conduct. Inquiries into hostile or harassing conduct will be carried out as confidentially as possible given the circumstances.

Record-Keeping

CFI and its affiliates will make a written record of all complaints/incidents as soon as practicable. These records will be used in connection with implementing this policy. These records will be maintained in the Office of the President & CEO of CFI and will not be disclosed to individuals outside of the organization except as required by law.

[/spoiler]

It’s missing the part where people can exercise the Hysteric’s Veto: “He disagrees with me and makes me uncomfortable therefore *POOF* he's off the list.”

[Scented Nectar]

Just went to https://support.twitter.com/forms/abusiveuser and submitted the following (along with details):

By doing mass blockings of people they don't like, the targets are getting their accounts shut down since it triggers a spam alert if one is blocked by too many people at once. Twitter always reopens the accounts, because it was not spam. They are doing another mass blocking today. Every Saturday they manage to get accounts shut down. Please stop them from doing this, or at least make it so that it doesn't auto-trigger the shutdown of accounts. The above tweet link (and tweeter @aratina) is just one in the group who are doing the #blocksaturday campaign. Thanks in advance for looking into this.

Anyone else who's sick of the false flaggings and account shutdowns, might want to also submit a report.

Nice. Yea I love the way people try to just shut others up any way possible. Really progressive thinking there people. You should never force on others what you would consider unfair when done to you. Kindergarten knowledge, get some

Their maliciousness under the guise of righteousness is just appalling. They know it's getting accounts falsely shut down, but they are always the victims just fighting back. They pretend they are on the defensive instead of the offensive and thereby justify all and any actions against us. They are nothing more than scientology imitators with a 'fair game' policy where anything is allowed as long as it's against their 'enemies'.

[BarnOwl]

Whatever you think of their message, you might have to admit that protesting topless in Switzerland in January is pretty tough:

Davos protest

[Chilly P.]

Here is an example of Dobkin's "music". Trigger warning for ear pain and misandric words.

Damn you, SN. I totally musically rubbernecked by clicking that.

I always pondered what might happen if we gave various separatist groups a portion of isolated Federal Lands or some Atolls in the Pacific to settle, and let them have what they wanted. Something like "The Village". I don't think most of them would last very long. The only caveat would be that they have cameras in public places and meeting places, so we can watch and hear the fireworks as they fall apart or descend into tyranny.

[justinvacula]

How much notice will that give him?

Effectively none, but perhaps enough to spare him the bus trip.

It's a damn shame there even needs to be a discussion.

[Scented Nectar]

Here is an example of Dobkin's "music". Trigger warning for ear pain and misandric words.

Damn you, SN. I totally musically rubbernecked by clicking that.

I always pondered what might happen if we gave various separatist groups a portion of isolated Federal Lands or some Atolls in the Pacific to settle, and let them have what they wanted. Something like "The Village". I don't think most of them would last very long. The only caveat would be that they have cameras in public places and meeting places, so we can watch and hear the fireworks as they fall apart or descend into tyranny.

My apologies for those minutes you'll never get back, and for the trauma and nightmares which are sure to follow.

I like the idea of putting them on their own camera filled island somewhere. :D

[bhoytony]

Here is an example of Dobkin's "music". Trigger warning for ear pain and misandric words.

Damn you, SN. I totally musically rubbernecked by clicking that.

I always pondered what might happen if we gave various separatist groups a portion of isolated Federal Lands or some Atolls in the Pacific to settle, and let them have what they wanted. Something like "The Village". I don't think most of them would last very long. The only caveat would be that they have cameras in public places and meeting places, so we can watch and hear the fireworks as they fall apart or descend into tyranny.

They already have their Fortress of Solitude in Chernobyl where they plan their social justice revolution, little knowing that they are just livestock on Simpleflower's longpig ranch.

Speaking of Russian fortresses I watched that film that decius mentioned, The Brest Fortress, and I can recommend it.

[justinvacula]

The 'Women in Secularism 2' harrasment policy is here:
http://www.womeninsecularism.org/policy.html

[spoiler]

POLICY ON HOSTILE CONDUCT / HARASSMENT AT CONFERENCES
Purpose and Scope of Policy

The Center for Inquiry (CFI) and its affiliates, including the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry and the Council for Secular Humanism, are educational organizations. As part of our educational mission, we hold conferences from time to time. To ensure that everyone attending our conferences is able to participate in them fully, CFI and its affiliates are committed to providing a safe and hospitable environment at our conferences. Accordingly, CFI and its affiliates prohibit intimidating, threatening, or harassing conduct during our conferences. This policy applies to speakers, staff, volunteers, and attendees.

“Conferences” for purpose of this policy includes any educational meeting or gathering organized or sponsored by CFI or its affiliates to which nonemployees are invited. In other words, this policy applies to local or regional meetings, not just national conferences.

This policy supplements the policy on harassment set forth in the CFI employee handbook, which governs the conduct of CFI staff; it does not replace or supersede that policy.

Prohibited Conduct

In general, prohibited conduct includes any abusive conduct that has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with another person’s ability to enjoy and participate in the conference, including social events related to the conference.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, yelling at or threatening speakers or attendees, or any significantly disruptive conduct. By way of example, repeated interruption of a speaker by an attendee is prohibited.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, harassment based on race, gender, sexual orientation, disability, or any other protected group status, as provided by local, state, or federal law. By way of example, abusive conduct directed at someone because of their race is prohibited.

Prohibited conduct includes, but is not limited to, sexual harassment. By way of example, unwelcome sexual attention, stalking, and physical contact such as pinching, grabbing, or groping are prohibited.

Critical examination of beliefs, including critical commentary on another person’s views, does not, by itself, constitute hostile conduct or harassment. One of the underlying rationales of this policy is to promote the free exchange of ideas, not to inhibit it.

Consequences of Hostile or Harassing Conduct

CFI and its affiliates have a zero-tolerance policy for hostile and harassing conduct. If a person engages in hostile or harassing conduct, appropriate remedial action will be taken, which may include, but is not limited to, expulsion from the conference. Threats of hostile conduct that are made prior to a conference may result in exclusion from the conference.

The exact remedy for hostile or harassing conduct will depend on an evaluation of all relevant circumstances, such as the severity of the conduct and prior violations by the person engaging in prohibited conduct.

When there is a reasonable basis for believing the conduct is illegal, appropriate law enforcement authorities will be notified.

Reporting Hostile or Harassing Conduct; Investigations

Persons who are the targets of, or witnesses to, hostile or harassing conduct should contact conference staff. At smaller meetings, conference staff, including the person(s) in charge of the meeting, will be introduced at the beginning. At larger conferences, conference staff will wear identification and/or will be identified in the conference program.

At larger conferences, phone numbers for hotel/venue staff, local law enforcement, and local emergency medical personnel will be provided to conference attendees to facilitate prompt response to complaints and/or requests for assistance.

Reports of hostile or harassing conduct will be promptly addressed. On some occasions, where conference staff are witnesses to the prohibited conduct, immediate remedial action may be taken. Where a report of hostile or harassing conduct is made to conference staff after the conduct has occurred, reasonable measures will be taken to establish the facts. This will typically include discussion with witnesses, if any, and the person accused of engaging in the prohibited conduct. Inquiries into hostile or harassing conduct will be carried out as confidentially as possible given the circumstances.

Record-Keeping

CFI and its affiliates will make a written record of all complaints/incidents as soon as practicable. These records will be used in connection with implementing this policy. These records will be maintained in the Office of the President & CEO of CFI and will not be disclosed to individuals outside of the organization except as required by law.

[/spoiler]

It’s missing the part where people can exercise the Hysteric’s Veto: “He disagrees with me and makes me uncomfortable therefore *POOF* he's off the list.”

It's also missing this idea, unless I am overlooking something (?), that people need to follow the policy prior to conferences. Not that I'm in violation of it or anything, but...

[Chilly P.]

QFT.

And speaking of population, I just love how silly liberals and conservatives love to say 'oh, population growth isn't a problem, the earth can easily support 12 billion people, we just have to grow more food!!!'

Yeah, like people aren't gonna be greedy, or fight over access to these future resources!? And just look at the famine in Somalia - how 'easy' was it to feed the starving people? Oh, not easy at all, was it? Little problem of armed bandits stealing all the food to sell for profit!

Also "Nature will take care of it" means a painful death from starvation for mother, father, and child. Isn't it better to shrink the population with birth control and tax/government policy in the first place?

As for catastrophic economic collapse following a drop in population, it seems to me Europe after the Black Death boomed - shortage of labor = more freedom for ordinary people, better standard of living, and ever-increasing investment in labor saving technology because it was now cost effective given the high cost of scarce labor. China had everything necessary to have an industrial revolution ahead of Europe, but never did because the abundant population and low cost of labor made adopting labor-saving technologies cost-ineffective.

The top .1% love a big population, keeps labor costs low but demand sky high for their land, the basis of rent. They ain't making any more land, we can't have it shipped FOB from China "Hi, this is Sam in Texas. I need 1000 more acres added to expand the Austin city limits. How much? 1 Million? Does each acre include several trees and can I get a couple of streams with this large parcel? Excellent. Yes, expect my letter of credit from RBS shortly."

[d4m10n]

How much notice will that give him?

Effectively none, but perhaps enough to spare him the bus trip.

It's a damn shame there even needs to be a discussion.

Did I mention this is all a social experiment? ;)

Hypothesis: CFI has turned their backs on their founding principles of free inquiry and rational debate, in favor of the dogmatic approach of creating 'safe spaces' wherein certain theories cannot be questioned, by preemptively banning anyone who disagrees.

Experimental design: http://www.rockethub.com/projects/13633 ... cularism-2

[justinvacula]

Waiting...

http://i.imgur.com/XnoiIbh.jpg

[Lsuoma]

It's so dead it doesn't even know it

[Randy Newman video]

Back in the 80s, I went to a talk by the most awful folk wimmin's musicians ever. Alix Dobkin. She gave a lecture all about how Randi Newman was a horrible sexist because of his lyrics in some song.

Here is an example of Dobkin's "music". Trigger warning for ear pain and misandric words.

"Every Woman Can Be a Lesbian (Alix Dobkin)"

Randy Newman's been catching shit for decades from people who don't understand irony (i.e. 98% of all Americans). Stand-outs are "Short People"

[youtube]uFmv22ghzQw[/youtube]

and "Rednecks"

[youtube]OchO-UJcslM[/youtube]

I remember reading a review of Rednecks (Rolling Stone, I think) and they complained about his use of the phrase "smart-assed New York Jew" saying it was anti-Semitic (Newman is a Jew, BTW) and completely missed the obvious irony that Newman was displaying. Fucking, fucking stupid.

[Gumby]

You should never force on others what you would consider unfair when done to you.

Well and succinctly put.

I've found that the people who most preach the Ethic of Reciprocity (or whatever variant) are inevitably the ones who never follow it. Hypocritical hatebag fundies spouting "Love your neighbor as yourself" and equally hypocritical hatebag feminists crying "we want equality for all!" are prime examples.

[Mykeru]

So with that tweet shown above by Melody Hensley - she lays out her plan on stopping JV from attending WISCON2. "Prior" violations of this cons harassment policy will result in banning...

The Fuck?

I predict that she will let him get to the door, then make this big production on how "his kind isn't welcomed here" - and then ban him - wasting money and time.

Then she will go in for the group hugs and say how she is a brave warrior - fighting the injustice.

Yea I can see that happening. If she does try any of that crap I'm gonna be pissed. That is the kind of shit that needs to stop.

Justin quoted CFI policy that required being banned from a prior CFI event to be banned from the next. This would not have accomplished Hensley's goal of harassing and smearing Justin while painting herself as victim.

So she just made up her own rules.

Not to be dramatic, but the woman is a dime-store Stalin.

[comslave]

So...new thread and Renee is drunk off her ass...

Care for a cuppa coffee in my hotel room?

RAPE!

[Scented Nectar]

It's so dead it doesn't even know it

[Randy Newman video]

Back in the 80s, I went to a talk by the most awful folk wimmin's musicians ever. Alix Dobkin. She gave a lecture all about how Randi Newman was a horrible sexist because of his lyrics in some song.

Here is an example of Dobkin's "music". Trigger warning for ear pain and misandric words.

"Every Woman Can Be a Lesbian (Alix Dobkin)"

Randy Newman's been catching shit for decades from people who don't understand irony (i.e. 98% of all Americans). Stand-outs are "Short People"

[video]

and "Rednecks"

[video]

I remember reading a review of Rednecks (Rolling Stone, I think) and they complained about his use of the phrase "smart-assed New York Jew" saying it was anti-Semitic (Newman is a Jew, BTW) and completely missed the obvious irony that Newman was displaying. Fucking, fucking stupid.

I had some nostalgia hearing Short People again. It's been years. :)

No, they certainly don't get his irony. I can't remember which song Dobkin whined about (it wasn't Short People), but I doubt it really was sexist. I believed her fully at the time though, and left her talk even more committed to only listening to "wimmin's music". Blech!

I used to volunteer for a company called Womynly Way Productions. They brought all the 'wimmin musicians' to Toronto to perform. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s_music

[Chilly P.]

I have a question about "Pre-Patriarchy", the alleged time prior to roughly the invention of agriculture.

One assertion is that people didn't connect having sex with pregnancy. I find this very hard to believe that people who organized mammoth hunts, built fish dams, figured out that thirsty monkeys lead you to secret water holes, etc. didn't make the connection between the idea that not having sex resulted in not getting pregnant and vice-versa.

Anybody know of any isolated hunter-gatherers, like barely-contacted New Guinea Highlanders, who believe that sex and babies aren't correlated? I mean, is there any ethnology of groups still around in the modern era that supports this claim?

[Gumby]

I have a question about "Pre-Patriarchy", the alleged time prior to roughly the invention of agriculture.

One assertion is that people didn't connect having sex with pregnancy. I find this very hard to believe that people who organized mammoth hunts, built fish dams, figured out that thirsty monkeys lead you to secret water holes, etc. didn't make the connection between the idea that not having sex resulted in not getting pregnant and vice-versa.

Anybody know of any isolated hunter-gatherers, like barely-contacted New Guinea Highlanders, who believe that sex and babies aren't correlated? I mean, is there any ethnology of groups still around in the modern era that supports this claim?

That early people didn't connect sex with pregnancy is straight out of the book "Clan of the Cave Bear". I had never heard anyone make this claim until that stupid book came out.

Claims for and against this hypothesis are entirely unprovable anyway. Even if we could figure out what present-day barely contacted tribes know or don't know about the sex-babies correlation, that would not necessarily apply to hundreds of thousands of years ago.

[Apples]

Hypothesis: CFI has turned their backs on their founding principles of free inquiry and rational debate, in favor of the dogmatic approach of creating 'safe spaces' wherein certain theories cannot be questioned, by preemptively banning anyone who disagrees.

This reminded me of this exchange in the Mods thread today at A+:

It felt a bit like turning up on your first day at university and entering the third years' common room by mistake. Who are these people? Where did they come from? Do they know one another in 'real life'? Are they considered 'experts'? If so, why? And so on. Nothing wrong with that at all, but it unnerved me slightly, and I can see why it might unnerve others.

Thing is, to me, that means the forum is working. This place was constructed explicitly for the purposes of those 3rd+ year student types so they would not have to continue to rehash 1st year level shit over and over and over again, and could move forward from there. The board has I&A for the uninitiated, the rest of the forum for everyone else. AND, we're not all the same level of knowledge on every topic. Someone who's at post-grad level on ableism with a doctorate in feminism might be at second year level on racism and might have little working knowledge on ageism whatsoever. Unnerving? Yes. Challenging people to overcome their privilege blinders isn't going to be exactly comfortable all the time, nor should it.

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... start=1825

LOL. They've really got it all figgered out, don't they. Who knew you could even achieve such advanced degrees in the rigorous esoterica of quantum soshul justicology -- and all for free online? (As long as you submissively nuzzle taint when Ceepolk and Setar are around.)

Whenever they show up with their patented 'basket o' links' for a new poster I think of Heidi or Little Red Riding Hood.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_oSPbKyaO-uw/T ... LE+RED.jpg

[SkepularCharlie]

So with that tweet shown above by Melody Hensley - she lays out her plan on stopping JV from attending WISCON2. "Prior" violations of this cons harassment policy will result in banning...

The Fuck?

I predict that she will let him get to the door, then make this big production on how "his kind isn't welcomed here" - and then ban him - wasting money and time.

Then she will go in for the group hugs and say how she is a brave warrior - fighting the injustice.

Yea I can see that happening. If she does try any of that crap I'm gonna be pissed. That is the kind of shit that needs to stop.

A sweep stakes or betting odds can be generated for this scenario. There are enough different outcomes to lay down some bets on the varying outcomes. I'll put down a dollar on the long shot that MH keeps her mouth shut and JV enjoys the event with no bitching from the Hensley entourage. Those odds surely have to be around 250 to 1.
.
By the way, its my first post here. I've been a long time reader and fan of the SP. Hello boys and girls. Some of you pitters are familiar thru the tweet world.

Cheers, Charlie



Not to be dramatic, but the woman is a dime-store Stalin.

[SkepularCharlie]

So with that tweet shown above by Melody Hensley - she lays out her plan on stopping JV from attending WISCON2. "Prior" violations of this cons harassment policy will result in banning...

The Fuck?

I predict that she will let him get to the door, then make this big production on how "his kind isn't welcomed here" - and then ban him - wasting money and time.

Then she will go in for the group hugs and say how she is a brave warrior - fighting the injustice.

Yea I can see that happening. If she does try any of that crap I'm gonna be pissed. That is the kind of shit that needs to stop.

A sweep stakes or betting odds can be generated for this scenario. There are enough different outcomes to lay down some bets on the varying outcomes. I'll put down a dollar on the long shot that MH keeps her mouth shut and JV enjoys the event with no bitching from the Hensley entourage. Those odds surely have to be around 250 to 1.
.
By the way, its my first post here. I've been a long time reader and fan of the SP. Hello boys and girls. Some of you pitters are familiar thru the tweet world.

Cheers, Charlie



Not to be dramatic, but the woman is a dime-store Stalin.

[AndrewV69]

_____________
@ ... AndrewV69

Seeing as how you have Natalie's ear, do you think you could try to explain to her that in point of fact we are not trying to help her in order to score points against FfTB, et al. We are trying to help her because we are humanists and she is a human being in need -- certainly more in need than someone who wants a new laptop, or sending ToiletBowl to some conference.

Do you think you could do that Andrew?

She's just pissing all over those of us who would like to help her out in her time of need, and that's only going to create bad blood. And it is most certainly not going to make anyone here look kindly on her if she should happen to need help sometime in the future. If she really gets a kick out of burning potential bridges, well ... more power to her, but she's only hurting herself.

Aside from the fact that she has now requested no further help, when I read her bullshit about scoring points, I immediately decided I was not going to continue in my endeavour to help her out. I can't imagine how those who have helped must be feeling right now.

JeeZus Pickles; what an ungrateful bitch.

Wow! Just fucking wow!

Natalie HAS expressed her gratitude!
She's also done the decent thing and let it be known that her needs are covered and would not wish to accept more.
She has spoke of the needs of others (even tho there may be some raised eyebrows over that)
And finally she (consistantly) made it clear that she does not want to be a pawn n the ftb/slyme wars.
For fuck sake what is wrong with that?
Why don't you just ask her for your donation back because you didn't manage to buy her alligence.

I said before that there was an unpleasent whiff of lets show up ftb about all of this.

Your post here really does not come acrosss as just human concern.

Well the back story is I missed a couple of PMs (I have at any given moment a desktop and two laptops going) and John Greg was apparently trying to arrange a donation while I was busy with other stuff.

His post in the forum I ascribe to a certain amount of fustration due to me not seeing his PMs. This board may show me as being online when the reality is I am AFK most of the time.

It seems clear to me that Natalie may not be aware how some of her words may have been viewed, but at the same time, some of her other words makes it also looks that she does appreciate the efforts.

I think at this point, I would be inclined to "let it go". Intent is not magic and all that, but no matter how you look at it, in the end it seems clear that Natalie would like to disengage from the Aethiest community as a whole, while at the same time some residual loyalty to her "in-group" still prompts her to defend then, while also being prompted to acknowledge that the "out-group" are not the monsters that PeeZuss et. al. paint them as and still thank them.

John and the others who contributed may legitimately feel miffed that their intent was characterized the way it was. Just remember these words:

No good deed goes unpunished.

- Clare Boothe Luce
(Otherwise atributed to a fuck ton of other people. You take your pick. I already made mine)

[LMU]

Hello and welcome Charlie :)

[another lurker]

QFT.

And speaking of population, I just love how silly liberals and conservatives love to say 'oh, population growth isn't a problem, the earth can easily support 12 billion people, we just have to grow more food!!!'

Yeah, like people aren't gonna be greedy, or fight over access to these future resources!? And just look at the famine in Somalia - how 'easy' was it to feed the starving people? Oh, not easy at all, was it? Little problem of armed bandits stealing all the food to sell for profit!

Also "Nature will take care of it" means a painful death from starvation for mother, father, and child. Isn't it better to shrink the population with birth control and tax/government policy in the first place?

As for catastrophic economic collapse following a drop in population, it seems to me Europe after the Black Death boomed - shortage of labor = more freedom for ordinary people, better standard of living, and ever-increasing investment in labor saving technology because it was now cost effective given the high cost of scarce labor. China had everything necessary to have an industrial revolution ahead of Europe, but never did because the abundant population and low cost of labor made adopting labor-saving technologies cost-ineffective.

The top .1% love a big population, keeps labor costs low but demand sky high for their land, the basis of rent. They ain't making any more land, we can't have it shipped FOB from China "Hi, this is Sam in Texas. I need 1000 more acres added to expand the Austin city limits. How much? 1 Million? Does each acre include several trees and can I get a couple of streams with this large parcel? Excellent. Yes, expect my letter of credit from RBS shortly."

All true. MKG and I think it was, Anonymouscowherd both made good points, and certainly made me rethink some of the ideas I have had about sustainability.

The history of humanity is littered with cycles of intensification and depletion. Depletion usually wins, in the end - and I do wonder if there is going to come a time when technology cannot solve these problems for us. Conservation is certainly the way to go - but it won't stop groups of people from being greedy bastards and there is not much we can do about it. And then there is weather - still something we cannot really control. And one thing people are not talking about - water. As the earth's population grows, where is the water going to come from? Poor nations certainly cannot afford expensive desalination plants and so on. The best thing, imo, and people are doing this already, is to teach sustainable farming and conservation. And as you said, easy access to birth control will make a HUGE difference.

The issue is really complicated though, and my head hurts just thinking about it. So I am going to stfu right now.

[SkepularCharlie]

Damn it! My first post was accidentally infused with previous quotes. Fucking smart phones certainly make the user appear clueless when navigating and posting on forums.
apologies.
screw you Samsung!

Once again, hello all

[Apples]

strange gods, yeah, I owe you (and others) an apology for baiting. Some meatspace stress got through the human-computer interface. Sorry about that.

Cool, thanks cm.

Nerd: you are cleared for saying “Your unevidenced OPINION is *POOF* dismissed as fuckwittery” again. False alarm.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... 5/#respond

[AndrewV69]

Pretty much every group in freethought claims to be “grounded in the open discussion and exchange of ideas” and that includes FtB and CFI. I would agree that the Pyt tends to live up to it a lot more, as we saw with Louis, for example, not to mention all the running disagreements among regulars.

p.s. SUFTU!

The only way I could even hope to keep up with who agrees/disagrees with who about what would be to maintain a relational database.

Instead, I have defaulted to the stance that there is a nontrivial chance that any two Slymepitters will have three opinions all in violent opposition to each other.

Oh and to compound the issue, there is also the chance, nontrivial also, that any one at any given time may change their mind based on the arguments of the other.

Given the choice, I think I would rather herd cats, nail jelly to the wall, or empty the Great Lakes with a strainer than even try to keep track.

I can be reasonably certain however, that when it comes to PeeZuss Christ, Twatson, the rest of the baboons, and other assorted morons associated with that lot, that the Slymepitters generally do not think too highly about them.

But that is about it.