The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

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BannedAid
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5401

Post by BannedAid »

Louis wrote: Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone.
Intimidating isn't the right word. Exasperating, maybe? Nobody likes taking personal attacks/abuse over trivial disagreements. Reasonable people tend to avoid that kind of environment. Myers takes that avoidance as some kind of victory for reason. It's really, really not.
We've all dealt with creationists, right? We've all had to give them "science 101 for abominable shitheads", we've all referred them to the Index of Creationist Claims, perhaps by page number. Creationist claims are so familiar as to be painful, there's not a lot of change because they tend to rest on a few foundational misunderstandings or lies about things people commonly misunderstand. I hate to say it, because I am possibly putting myself in the position of Feminism Defender (and I really can't be arsed at the moment), but the social sciences, of which feminism is a part, are also worthy of academic study. There are facts, theories, details that need to be understood. Caricaturing it as random ideology is lazy and untrue.
A couple problems with that. First, I've never actually seen anyone who uses that excuse explain "feminism 101" even once. I have seen them use the "feminism 101" retort a million times, though. Second, caricaturing disagreement with some aspects of feminism as creationism is lazy and untrue.
They long, instead for a space where they can discuss things at a slightly less basic level without hand holding and where they can also discuss things that intersect with those things. It's that simple. A group of perfectly normal human beings wanting a place to converse about stuff that interests them without 99% of the bullshit that that seems to attract.
That could just as easily be used an excuse to avoid the known difficulties with their ideology, but fair enough. Have your safe space. Just don't call it Free Thought, because it's not. How 'bout... call it "SafeSpaceBlogs."

codelette
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5402

Post by codelette »

pass, not past

VickyCaramel
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5403

Post by VickyCaramel »

Louis wrote: I'm not holier than thou I'm just as shitty as the next shitty person. The trick is to try not to be. And dear FSM do I fail!
The trick is to not preach at, and try and enforce rules on other people about how not to be. The trick is not to call other people 'shitty' when really they aren't, while acting like a complete shit yourself.

I'm going to decide what not being shitty means, I'm going to reason it out. I will not have it dictated to me by a bunch if self pitying drama queens.

justinvacula
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5404

Post by justinvacula »

codelette wrote:Going to that Women in Secusomething conference seems like a waste of time/money, Justin. They will not let you go past the hotel doors.
"Unless someone has been previously banned for harassment from CFI (please see our harassment policy), they may attend any CFI event or conference.

Best regards,


--
Melody Hensley
Executive Director, Center for Inquiry-Washington, DC
Organizer, Women in Secularism
Certified Secular Celebrant"

Louis
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5405

Post by Louis »

Re: the picking sides and dehumanisation thing, you've all (so far) missed my point! It was contained in the bit UNDER the bit Phil quoted!

Do I think all 'pitters are raving misogynists etc? No of course I bloody don't, said that already, keep up. I've already said I don't think this is about "sides", it's about facts and ethics etc. Here it is again:
But then I don't have to pick a fucking side. This is not a team game. This is about reality. It's about data, and science, and reason. It's about the ethics of the Enlightenment. Can I demonstrate my claims or not, can I support my arguments or not, can I act in such a way as to avoid the maximum amount of damage to others for the minimum inconvenience, can I recognise the value of the person in front of me irrespective of their social status, are their arguments good etc? It's not hard!
Speaking purely for myself, the only "problem" I have with the Slymepit (isn't it obvious yet I don't have a problem with some fictional collective?) extends only to the people I have seen post at Pharyngula who self identified as people from here.

I do have one real problem though. I've invested a bit of my Saturday night posting here, and thus far the majority of the {ahem} discussion has been about Teh Meeness (TM) of PZ/FTB/Whoever. I just don't care. It's an irrelevance. It's bread and fucking circuses. You are distracting yourselves for some reason, or you are being distracted. What matters, and I hope what will happen when Metalogic42 and Za-zen demolish my feeble feminist brain with their AWESUM, are the matters of substance. Is claim X true, not is whoever said claim X an arsehole. What consequences does this have etc. You know the interesting stuff. Thus far too much "Defend PZ or be damned" nonsense. I speak for ME. Period. End of story. I like PZ, I also like Phil. I disagree with them both about different things.. Oh my lack of god that looks almost like nuance. Fuck me deftly there it is.

Oh by the way, Phil should have warned you I am a sarcastic fucker and my tolerance limit is almost zero. ;-)

Louis
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5406

Post by Louis »

Za-zen,
This is not a division between those who dehumanise women, and those who don't.
Correct, in part. It is in places sadly. I've vastly too much experience of the people who dehumanise women to ignore it for a convenient slogan.

Phil_Giordana_FCD
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5407

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Woops! Welcome Vicky (I forgot the common courtesy)

Fuck off!

(there, much better)

Ape+lust
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5408

Post by Ape+lust »

AbsurdWalls wrote:My understanding is that the A+ forum mods and admins are just a bunch of FTBers who decided to set it up? It seems like they have taken complete control of A+, not surprising seeing as nobody else appears to want it. Would Jen have been happy with a secret sub-forum? Would she have been happy with insulting and shunning the people who tried to set up a non-safe space forum for discussing A+ issues (because that's what happened)?
It'll be funny when high drama erupts in the secret safe space (and it will, with that tightly wound bunch). They'll have to make a double-secret safe room. Or concede that triggerless, sanitized "safe spaces" are impossible with humans in them, which I doubt they'll do.

Meanwhile, when they're not ducking into their hidden forum, they're running off everyone who isn't a mod. Eventually, it'll be like any other dead forum, except there'll be ghosts lurking in the walls. Too fucking weird.

mikelf
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5409

Post by mikelf »

rayshul wrote: Also, this is where we keep our patriarchy machine.
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Patriarchy machine? You mean, like:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_li2jg ... o1_500.jpg

AbsurdWalls
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5410

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Ape+lust wrote:
AbsurdWalls wrote:My understanding is that the A+ forum mods and admins are just a bunch of FTBers who decided to set it up? It seems like they have taken complete control of A+, not surprising seeing as nobody else appears to want it. Would Jen have been happy with a secret sub-forum? Would she have been happy with insulting and shunning the people who tried to set up a non-safe space forum for discussing A+ issues (because that's what happened)?
It'll be funny when high drama erupts in the secret safe space (and it will, with that tightly wound bunch). They'll have to make a double-secret safe room. Or concede that triggerless, sanitized "safe spaces" are impossible with humans in them, which I doubt they'll do.

Meanwhile, when they're not ducking into their hidden forum, they're running off everyone who isn't a mod. Eventually, it'll be like any other dead forum, except there'll be ghosts lurking in the walls. Too fucking weird.
recursive prophet wrote:I'm probably making a mistake speaking out here, but after mostly lurking for over 2 months as was suggested by TPTB, I still don't get this place. It truly saddens me to see victims turn on others and become the oppressors, and that is my sense of what is happening here. I have witnessed so many being attacked, then banned for defending their position.

Wind and Julian, I truly sympathize with your anger about how you have been treated in what is billed as a 'safe place.' I've seen it claimed often that those who have lived on the sharp end of the stick are the real experts on the effects. Yet when there is disagreement, that experience is often somehow invalidated by others. Where attempts at understanding should prevail, instead there is hostility.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5411

Post by VickyCaramel »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:Woops! Welcome Vicky (I forgot the common courtesy)

Fuck off!

(there, much better)
Thank you darlin' <3

ThreeFlangedJavis
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5412

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis »

Louis wrote:Cunning Punt,

Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone. Just like I don't necessarily want to post at Place X because their environment doesn't suit me (for example I'd be fucked if there were a no swearing policy. I loves me a swear I do), I don't expect that Pharyngula gets everyone's juices flowing either. Why would I? Different strokes for different folks. It's not wrong to like or dislike the posting environment there, it just is a matter of personal preference.

As for the "you have to dot every i and cross every t" thing, again I disagree. Yes there are intemperate people who will jump on any error, I'm occasionally one of them if I've had a bad day and want to spread the joy around! ;-) But there is more nuance there than you suspect. What there isn't, at this current time (and this has been the case for a while now) is a lot of tolerance for leading people through the basics on certain subjects. It's not about disagreement, it's about having to explain the same damned thing a million times to a large number of rather clueless shitheads. I'm not including you, or specifically anyone, in that category by the way. I'll explain.

We've all dealt with creationists, right? We've all had to give them "science 101 for abominable shitheads", we've all referred them to the Index of Creationist Claims, perhaps by page number. Creationist claims are so familiar as to be painful, there's not a lot of change because they tend to rest on a few foundational misunderstandings or lies about things people commonly misunderstand. I hate to say it, because I am possibly putting myself in the position of Feminism Defender (and I really can't be arsed at the moment), but the social sciences, of which feminism is a part, are also worthy of academic study. There are facts, theories, details that need to be understood. Caricaturing it as random ideology is lazy and untrue.

For the last 2 or 3 years there has been an uptick in certain...let's say...phenomena. The number and unpleasantness of various species of sexists crawling out of the woodwork has increased. Some people, rightly or wrongly, are pissed off about leading every one of those people by the hand through the basics. They long, instead for a space where they can discuss things at a slightly less basic level without hand holding and where they can also discuss things that intersect with those things. It's that simple. A group of perfectly normal human beings wanting a place to converse about stuff that interests them without 99% of the bullshit that that seems to attract.

Oh and I'm not with the Horde on everything. No one in the Horde is with the Horde on everything. You might not have seen that, but I have. Quite a bit.
And does it never occur to you that some of the people who need re-educating actually know an awful lot about social studies and are disturbed at the warped application of terms like 'privilege' and 'patriarchy'? I would suggest that there are things about social studies that the Pharyngulites need to understand. Do you think that Pitters generally are unaware of social studies concepts? Your analogy with creationism highlights the problem. Feminist dogma is not FACT. It is subjective and the flavour of the moment at FTB requires that ridiculous assumptions are made about male and female experience. It also applies academic concepts like Patriarchy and privilege to individuals which is to use them outside of their intended application.

Your description of Pharyngula is not new to many of us. A lot of us have suffered the same Kool Aid poisoning. With respect, you appear to be labouring under the usual delusion that Pharyngula is populated by learned, intellectually honest people and that their critics are ignorant. It's not an issue of Pharyngula not being to peoples' taste. The horde love to make out that people are flouncing ,when in fact they have either been banned or got fed up with just about every statement they make being twisted beyond all recognition.

AbsurdWalls
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5413

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Louis wrote:Re: the picking sides and dehumanisation thing, you've all (so far) missed my point! It was contained in the bit UNDER the bit Phil quoted!
Irony of ironies.

Za-zen
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5414

Post by Za-zen »

If you don't have a problem with the pyt, then that's an AWESUM place to start.

Phil_Giordana_FCD
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5415

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Louis wrote:
Speaking purely for myself, the only "problem" I have with the Slymepit (isn't it obvious yet I don't have a problem with some fictional collective?) extends only to the people I have seen post at Pharyngula who self identified as people from here.

I do have one real problem though. I've invested a bit of my Saturday night posting here
It's Friday, you dum... oh wait. Yeah, ok, it's saturday night.

As far as you don't agree with some things I've said, I'll reiterate: Iron Maiden is FAR better than Metallica, Gin&Tonic is better than Scotch&Coke, and Tinky Winky is still my favorite Teletubby. Suck on it, pal!

(Ok, getting late, had a nice evening meal with assorted winery [it shows, doesn't it?], so I might call it a night. Or not...)

fascination
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5416

Post by fascination »

Louis, you may also be surprised to learn that some of us here volunteer and/or donate to many women's causes. Some of us are even activists for women's causes. How surprised I am to learn that I dehumanize women! I am a young woman and a mother of a lovely daughter. I not only donate to women's shelters and rape crisis centers financially but I have volunteered my time as well. I even signed up to become a certified RAINN (Rape Abuse and Incest National Network) volunteer. I do this on top of my college load, taking care of my daughter and family and my other volunteer work and obligations. Why? Because i enjoy it and i believe it is important. I guarantee you that I have done a hell of a lot more to help other women than many on FTB who just like to yell "gender traitor" at other women. But, I dehumanize women? No...that is not what this schism is about.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5417

Post by Sulaco »

Ape+lust wrote:
AbsurdWalls wrote:My understanding is that the A+ forum mods and admins are just a bunch of FTBers who decided to set it up? It seems like they have taken complete control of A+, not surprising seeing as nobody else appears to want it. Would Jen have been happy with a secret sub-forum? Would she have been happy with insulting and shunning the people who tried to set up a non-safe space forum for discussing A+ issues (because that's what happened)?
It'll be funny when high drama erupts in the secret safe space (and it will, with that tightly wound bunch). They'll have to make a double-secret safe room. Or concede that triggerless, sanitized "safe spaces" are impossible with humans in them, which I doubt they'll do.

Meanwhile, when they're not ducking into their hidden forum, they're running off everyone who isn't a mod. Eventually, it'll be like any other dead forum, except there'll be ghosts lurking in the walls. Too fucking weird.
More like rats in the walls. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rats_in_the_Walls

Their resident cannibal will be happy at least.

comslave
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5418

Post by comslave »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Mykeru wrote:
comslave wrote:
Mykeru wrote:
VickyCaramel wrote:
Actually been lurking for a long, long time. Thought I should join the roll call. Numbers matter.
And "taking back" the term "Chill Girl" should annoy them no end. If you can co-opt "sister punisher" too, then you've really got something.
I suddenly had this picture in my head of a buxom female pitter showing with the words "chill girl" emblazened on a slightly too tight white t-shirt. I watch too much porn.
Vicky, there's your cue.
Hold that thought! It shall be done! I shall announce it on Twitter.

Make sure Surly Amy sees it. I hear she has a thing for t-shirts.

Za-zen
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5419

Post by Za-zen »

And hey Vicky. Are you human? Remeber the answer will betray your gender.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5420

Post by Badger3k »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Badger3k wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Louis wrote:

I'm picking the side which doesn't think dehumanisation of women is okay
Errr, that was, how to say, more than awkward. Nobody here thinks dehumanising women is okay. I know you don't pick sides, but honestly, who are these people who actually dehumanise women? Are they posting here? I don't get this.
You got to remember that the definition of dehumanizing women changes to whatever PZ et al say it is. Merely being a member of this forum, or saying certain words (assuming you aren't on the same side, then it's ok) means you dehumanize women. It's a lot easier to say that the "other side" supports dehumanizing women, or doesn't support "humanizing women" (I guess - definitely weird since I've yet to meet anyone who thinks women aren't humans, or people. Second class people, perhaps, with the worst of some of the fundies and radicals, but still people) than it is actually pointing out the real disagreements. Seems to be a classic trick in propaganda techniques that some of them have been working hard on.
Badger, you and I have been alongside Louis long enough to know a bit better, haven't we? YMMV, of course.
Ah - I was definitely misunderstood. I have read him for a while, but really don't know him that well. However, I was speaking in generalities and not saying Louis was doing this. I think he is (was?) only seeing the one side of things, where they do this, however. The very fact that he is here suggests that he doesn't accept everything that he is told, and if I implied that he did, then I apologize, since that wasn't my intent. Damn, not sure that is clear in what I want to say either, but it's close enough I hope.

another lurker
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5421

Post by another lurker »

BannedAid wrote:
Louis wrote: Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone.
Intimidating isn't the right word. Exasperating, maybe? Nobody likes taking personal attacks/abuse over trivial disagreements. Reasonable people tend to avoid that kind of environment. Myers takes that avoidance as some kind of victory for reason. It's really, really not.

They long, instead for a space where they can discuss things at a slightly less basic level without hand holding and where they can also discuss things that intersect with those things. It's that simple. A group of perfectly normal human beings wanting a place to converse about stuff that interests them without 99% of the bullshit that that seems to attract.
That could just as easily be used an excuse to avoid the known difficulties with their ideology, but fair enough. Have your safe space. Just don't call it Free Thought, because it's not. How 'bout... call it "SafeSpaceBlogs."
FTB is for the elite, only. That's the message I am getting. It's a private club!

Michael K Gray
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5422

Post by Michael K Gray »

KacyRay wrote:And what's up with people setting up local car dealerships with test drives for PZ Myers? Are those people that hang out here, or are those examples of more serious personal vendettas from people in his past?
Of course, it just couldn't be one of his students, eh?
I mean, annoyed Uni students who get bad grades for giving lip have never ever done this kind of thing to their teachers.
Not ever in the history of the universe.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5423

Post by justinvacula »

Za-zen wrote:And hey Vicky. Are you human? Remeber the answer will betray your gender.
No is an acceptable answer.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5424

Post by Louis »

AbsurdWalls wrote:
Louis wrote:
debaser71 wrote:But calling people rape enablers, mysoginists, or child molesters is hunk dory. Got it. Thanks.
If that's directed at me I'm pretty sure I never said anything like calling people child molesters is hunky dory without evidence. It's abuse, certainly. Don't know about rape enabler either. Not seen that one. I am mere mortal man after all, can't see everything. (Do I need to point out the irony of a poster on a forum where people uncritically post "hey it's just a joke" as some kind of defence for anything taking obvious offence at derogatory words? Heyyyyy it's just a joke, man. By your own petard be hung)...
To get this straight, you defend yourself (correctly) from any insinuation that you would use the insults debaser17 has listed, by saying you merely share a platform with those people. Fine. Then you claim that debaser17 sharing a platform with people who say "hey, it's just a joke" means his complaint is ironic?

You can't have it both ways.
Hahaha! Can't get anything past you. Nice one Centurion.

Except that's not what I said.

I don't believe I made any defence of myself, I don't need to. Debaser17 was putting words in my mouth (quite dishonest no?). The irony comes from the offence at words in an environment where offence at words has an established history of not being taken seriously. The equivalent would be if I at Pharyngula objected to tone where objections to tone are not taken seriously. So if I was viciously tearing into people, or enjoying its fruits in a tearing environment, and then when I was viciously torn into complained like a tone troll, that would be ironic, no?

I said that I had said nothing about calling people child molesters being okay. I thought I was clear about that. It seems you've read it as I said nothing *at Pharyngula* blah blah blah. My statement was global, your reading was limited to Pharyngula. Apologies if I didn't make that clear enough.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5425

Post by AndrewV69 »

Louis wrote: But there is more nuance there than you suspect. What there isn't, at this current time (and this has been the case for a while now) is a lot of tolerance for leading people through the basics on certain subjects. It's not about disagreement, it's about having to explain the same damned thing a million times to a large number of rather clueless shitheads. I'm not including you, or specifically anyone, in that category by the way. I'll explain.
If I remember correctly, I tried to explain that once over at the baboon board to some proto-MRA who was complaining about the schrodinger's rapist business.

(I believe I posited that it was reasonable for some women to feel that way and likened it to riding a bicycle and being awarded a "door prize" ... and yes one day they are going to pull my MRA card but till then ... )

In any event, of course it would eventually become a burden, going over the same shit over and over and over and over and over once again. But how you respond to that I think speaks volumes about yourself and your movement.

As for nuance, just because I can not recall seeing it does not mean it is not there. Perhaps it is in hiding. I dunno. I hardly drop by there anymore.

Nowadays I depend on others to report on the latest zany material those wild and crazy (not to mention lovable) bell ends produce over there.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5426

Post by Za-zen »

Louis wrote:Za-zen,
This is not a division between those who dehumanise women, and those who don't.
Correct, in part. It is in places sadly. I've vastly too much experience of the people who dehumanise women to ignore it for a convenient slogan.
Sorry Louis, i know you're having a shitload of posts to reply to, so much so that i almost missed this response!

In what places is there this division?

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5427

Post by fascination »

Louis wrote:Re: the picking sides and dehumanisation thing, you've all (so far) missed my point! It was contained in the bit UNDER the bit Phil quoted!

Do I think all 'pitters are raving misogynists etc? No of course I bloody don't, said that already, keep up. I've already said I don't think this is about "sides", it's about facts and ethics etc. Here it is again:
But then I don't have to pick a fucking side. This is not a team game. This is about reality. It's about data, and science, and reason. It's about the ethics of the Enlightenment. Can I demonstrate my claims or not, can I support my arguments or not, can I act in such a way as to avoid the maximum amount of damage to others for the minimum inconvenience, can I recognise the value of the person in front of me irrespective of their social status, are their arguments good etc? It's not hard!
Speaking purely for myself, the only "problem" I have with the Slymepit (isn't it obvious yet I don't have a problem with some fictional collective?) extends only to the people I have seen post at Pharyngula who self identified as people from here.

I do have one real problem though. I've invested a bit of my Saturday night posting here, and thus far the majority of the {ahem} discussion has been about Teh Meeness (TM) of PZ/FTB/Whoever. I just don't care. It's an irrelevance. It's bread and fucking circuses. You are distracting yourselves for some reason, or you are being distracted. What matters, and I hope what will happen when Metalogic42 and Za-zen demolish my feeble feminist brain with their AWESUM, are the matters of substance. Is claim X true, not is whoever said claim X an arsehole. What consequences does this have etc. You know the interesting stuff. Thus far too much "Defend PZ or be damned" nonsense. I speak for ME. Period. End of story. I like PZ, I also like Phil. I disagree with them both about different things.. Oh my lack of god that looks almost like nuance. Fuck me deftly there it is.

Oh by the way, Phil should have warned you I am a sarcastic fucker and my tolerance limit is almost zero. ;-)
Ok hon, sorry I missed your post before I posted mine above. I must admit that the dehumization comment bothered me but I obviously misunderstood. Just ignore my previous rant, er, I mean post.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5428

Post by clownshoe »

Prunella - A Fairy Tale for the Online Atheist Community:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFE_Hqo0jhI

VickyCaramel
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5429

Post by VickyCaramel »

comslave wrote:

Make sure Surly Amy sees it. I hear she has a thing for t-shirts.
wasn't going to bother with the shit, besides it won't go with my pearls which somebody has requested to see for some inexplicable reason.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5430

Post by VickyCaramel »

Za-zen wrote:And hey Vicky. Are you human? Remeber the answer will betray your gender.
...still waiting for the test results. They don't work weekends.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5431

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Louis wrote:
AbsurdWalls wrote:
Louis wrote:
debaser71 wrote:But calling people rape enablers, mysoginists, or child molesters is hunk dory. Got it. Thanks.
If that's directed at me I'm pretty sure I never said anything like calling people child molesters is hunky dory without evidence. It's abuse, certainly. Don't know about rape enabler either. Not seen that one. I am mere mortal man after all, can't see everything. (Do I need to point out the irony of a poster on a forum where people uncritically post "hey it's just a joke" as some kind of defence for anything taking obvious offence at derogatory words? Heyyyyy it's just a joke, man. By your own petard be hung)...
To get this straight, you defend yourself (correctly) from any insinuation that you would use the insults debaser17 has listed, by saying you merely share a platform with those people. Fine. Then you claim that debaser17 sharing a platform with people who say "hey, it's just a joke" means his complaint is ironic?

You can't have it both ways.
Hahaha! Can't get anything past you. Nice one Centurion.

Except that's not what I said.

I don't believe I made any defence of myself, I don't need to. Debaser17 was putting words in my mouth (quite dishonest no?). The irony comes from the offence at words in an environment where offence at words has an established history of not being taken seriously...
No, you still don't get it. What you are saying is not true. If somebody here started smearing anyone as being a child molester offence would be taken. Even suggesting people are bad parents was called out quite comprehensively a few days back.

AndrewV69
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5432

Post by AndrewV69 »

KarlVonMox wrote:I also don't want to hijack this thread with a discussion about viruses, as much as ERV and others might love it - the appearance of Louis here is quite interesting by itself.
TrueFax - as much as 8% of human DNA comes from those fuckers. No one wants to talk about it though.

/conspiracy

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5433

Post by EdwardGemmer »

Louis wrote:Cunning Punt,

Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone. Just like I don't necessarily want to post at Place X because their environment doesn't suit me (for example I'd be fucked if there were a no swearing policy. I loves me a swear I do), I don't expect that Pharyngula gets everyone's juices flowing either. Why would I? Different strokes for different folks. It's not wrong to like or dislike the posting environment there, it just is a matter of personal preference.

As for the "you have to dot every i and cross every t" thing, again I disagree. Yes there are intemperate people who will jump on any error, I'm occasionally one of them if I've had a bad day and want to spread the joy around! ;-) But there is more nuance there than you suspect. What there isn't, at this current time (and this has been the case for a while now) is a lot of tolerance for leading people through the basics on certain subjects. It's not about disagreement, it's about having to explain the same damned thing a million times to a large number of rather clueless shitheads. I'm not including you, or specifically anyone, in that category by the way. I'll explain.

We've all dealt with creationists, right? We've all had to give them "science 101 for abominable shitheads", we've all referred them to the Index of Creationist Claims, perhaps by page number. Creationist claims are so familiar as to be painful, there's not a lot of change because they tend to rest on a few foundational misunderstandings or lies about things people commonly misunderstand. I hate to say it, because I am possibly putting myself in the position of Feminism Defender (and I really can't be arsed at the moment), but the social sciences, of which feminism is a part, are also worthy of academic study. There are facts, theories, details that need to be understood. Caricaturing it as random ideology is lazy and untrue.
I think "disappointing" is the word I would use with that place. I was actually pretty excited to find it, as I consider myself an atheist feminist who hates creationism in schools and have a degree in zoology. I'm pretty liberal and very interested in African-American issues because my kids are biracial and I am a public defender in a fairly large city, so I represent a lot of poor black people. Pharyngula seemed right up my alley and I was excited to post there. I enjoyed arguing with people, to whatever extent I could, but the VAST majority of argument against me could be boiled down to me being stupid, white, male, privileged, etc. It was lazy and really not uncommon from what you would find on any message board about anything - religion, football teams, republicans, whatever. People there simply could not separate out the ideas and arguments with the person behind them, which is why there were so many attacks on my character and anyone's character who might actually disagree with something. So it was disappointing, because I has felt that atheism prided itself on moving on from the idea that having slightly different beliefs is a good reason to hate someone, but apparently we have not.

Louis
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5434

Post by Louis »

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
<snip>

And does it never occur to you that some of the people who need re-educating actually know an awful lot about social studies and are disturbed at the warped application of terms like 'privilege' and 'patriarchy'? I would suggest that there are things about social studies that the Pharyngulites need to understand. Do you think that Pitters generally are unaware of social studies concepts? Your analogy with creationism highlights the problem. Feminist dogma is not FACT. It is subjective and the flavour of the moment at FTB requires that ridiculous assumptions are made about male and female experience. It also applies academic concepts like Patriarchy and privilege to individuals which is to use them outside of their intended application.

Your description of Pharyngula is not new to many of us. A lot of us have suffered the same Kool Aid poisoning. With respect, you appear to be labouring under the usual delusion that Pharyngula is populated by learned, intellectually honest people and that their critics are ignorant. It's not an issue of Pharyngula not being to peoples' taste. The horde love to make out that people are flouncing ,when in fact they have either been banned or got fed up with just about every statement they make being twisted beyond all recognition.
No I don't think the 'pitters are generally anything. Fuck me isn't that obvious yet?

Yes I do think there are loads and loads of things the pharyngulites (me included) can learn. GO AND TELL THEM. Or if that doesn't work, set up a separate place like this and dedicate your effort there. Where's the problem? If this stuff is so easy to rebut, detail it and rebut it. Please. You'll be doing me a favour. Instead it's team this, kool aid that, why?

What did I say I was here explicitly not to do? Defend every blog and poster of FTB. I don't care about your issues with people on FTB. It's not my problem.

Feminist dogma isn't fact? Subjective? Well that was specific and detailed, thanks. Doubtless some elements of feminism are dogma and are subjective. Sure. No argument there. Not all of it is though. And for me those are the interesting bits. Is that another example of this nuance I've heard so much about?

Kool aid? Delusion? Did I claim every poster on FTB was a social sciences whizz? No. Did I say that there are some relevant experts there who do do things rather well? Yes. Did I say all critics are ignorant no? Hell, if you're going to engage at least engage with what I said and a little less bitterness.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5435

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Vicky, your avatar looks suspiciously like Giana Michaels' (don't search it on google image, or if you do, thank me directly) lips and nose. Not using a stock photo, are you? It's really frowned upon here, and everyone is using their real pics as avatar.

Ok, it's off to bed for me. Wine and prolonged sobriety don't mix well...

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5436

Post by Gumby »


another lurker
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5437

Post by another lurker »

Gumby wrote:Just leaving this here...

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... a85365.jpg
Good call Josh. You really need to protect the skeptic/athiest community from dangerous pitters like fascination here:

fascination wrote:
Louis, you may also be surprised to learn that some of us here volunteer and/or donate to many women's causes. Some of us are even activists for women's causes. How surprised I am to learn that I dehumanize women! I am a young woman and a mother of a lovely daughter. I not only donate to women's shelters and rape crisis centers financially but I have volunteered my time as well. I even signed up to become a certified RAINN (Rape Abuse and Incest National Network) volunteer. I do this on top of my college load, taking care of my daughter and family and my other volunteer work and obligations. Why? Because i enjoy it and i believe it is important. I guarantee you that I have done a hell of a lot more to help other women than many on FTB who just like to yell "gender traitor" at other women. But, I dehumanize women? No...that is not what this schism is about.
Clearly, pitters such as fascination are a danger to the entire community. You must take precautions now to protect yourself form her, her mistogyny, and her, her, penchant for rape!

yeah! More power to you Josh! Keep up the good fight!

Louis
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5438

Post by Louis »

fascination wrote:
<snip>

Ok hon, sorry I missed your post before I posted mine above. I must admit that the dehumization comment bothered me but I obviously misunderstood. Just ignore my previous rant, er, I mean post.
No worries. I was about to get to your post, glad I read this first.

Let's be clear, and this is to everyone, let's wipe the slate clean: I don't think anyone* here is dehumanising women right this second. I'll let you know when I do, but this is getting tiring so if I miss some shit, meh, I'm only human!

* Okay, I will confess there are a subset of people who AFAIK post here who I DO think have said various misogynist things. Those people have posted at Pharyngula, because that's the only way until today I'd have seen them. I'll probably avoid dealing with someone I consider entrenched or stupid. That's my limitation, I freely admit I may be wrong, but I don't think I am in certain cases. You can either respect that as the choice of an adult or not. Your call. I'll try to engage as much as I am capable of, until, like I said, it hold no further interest for me. I can be more bluntly honest than that. I have neither infinite time or patience. Neither do you I imagine! ;-)

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5439

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Gumby wrote:Just leaving this here...

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... a85365.jpg
Well, now, that's charming. And very skeptical, of course.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5440

Post by VickyCaramel »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:Vicky, your avatar looks suspiciously like Giana Michaels' (don't search it on google image, or if you do, thank me directly) lips and nose. Not using a stock photo, are you? It's really frowned upon here, and everyone is using their real pics as avatar.
I have never heard of Giana Michaels, she obviously isn't as famous as me, maybe she is stealing my photos?

http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/eDSCF0180-FsnDnIEv.jpg
Here is another photo of me taken on Thursday. It makes my nose look big, but it shows it's me.... human!

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5441

Post by nippletwister »

Louis wrote:Cunning Punt,

Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone. Just like I don't necessarily want to post at Place X because their environment doesn't suit me (for example I'd be fucked if there were a no swearing policy. I loves me a swear I do), I don't expect that Pharyngula gets everyone's juices flowing either. Why would I? Different strokes for different folks. It's not wrong to like or dislike the posting environment there, it just is a matter of personal preference.

As for the "you have to dot every i and cross every t" thing, again I disagree. Yes there are intemperate people who will jump on any error, I'm occasionally one of them if I've had a bad day and want to spread the joy around! ;-) But there is more nuance there than you suspect. What there isn't, at this current time (and this has been the case for a while now) is a lot of tolerance for leading people through the basics on certain subjects. It's not about disagreement, it's about having to explain the same damned thing a million times to a large number of rather clueless shitheads. I'm not including you, or specifically anyone, in that category by the way. I'll explain.

We've all dealt with creationists, right? We've all had to give them "science 101 for abominable shitheads", we've all referred them to the Index of Creationist Claims, perhaps by page number. Creationist claims are so familiar as to be painful, there's not a lot of change because they tend to rest on a few foundational misunderstandings or lies about things people commonly misunderstand. I hate to say it, because I am possibly putting myself in the position of Feminism Defender (and I really can't be arsed at the moment), but the social sciences, of which feminism is a part, are also worthy of academic study. There are facts, theories, details that need to be understood. Caricaturing it as random ideology is lazy and untrue.

For the last 2 or 3 years there has been an uptick in certain...let's say...phenomena. The number and unpleasantness of various species of sexists crawling out of the woodwork has increased. Some people, rightly or wrongly, are pissed off about leading every one of those people by the hand through the basics. They long, instead for a space where they can discuss things at a slightly less basic level without hand holding and where they can also discuss things that intersect with those things. It's that simple. A group of perfectly normal human beings wanting a place to converse about stuff that interests them without 99% of the bullshit that that seems to attract.

Oh and I'm not with the Horde on everything. No one in the Horde is with the Horde on everything. You might not have seen that, but I have. Quite a bit.
Welcome Louis! I've only been posting at the Pit for a couple of weeks, and found it a refreshing blast of honesty.

I have to say, if that is your honest report of pharyngula, you must ignore 80% or more of the comments, and give PZ numerous passes for his rabid, dishonest bullshit.

I started reading pharyngula in 2005, along with a number of other liberal atheist blogs and science/skepticism blogs. It has NEVER been a place where you could ask questions about feminism or social theory and expect anything but grief. A tiny number of commenters would try to be helpful, but even they always assumed they were 100% right, and were never willing to look at their beliefs critically, only preach. I've been hearing that bullshit "101" argument for YEARS, on pretty much every liberal feminist site, including pharyngula. There is no place where the issues are discussed critically, only places where you can learn how to make a better feminist kaleidoscope. The only difference in the past at pharyngula was that there was a slightly higher ratio of posts about atheism or science, instead of constant propaganda.

What I have noticed, is that the more PZ and some others attempt to shoehorn all of the atheist/skeptical/secular community into pseudoscientific, political feminism and social theory, he's getting a bit of pushback from genuine skeptics. So now, he, and many others, ban questioners, delete comments, edit comments, and make plainly outrageous and slanderous comments towards those who don't drink the kool-aid, such as openly comparing non-feminists who may have uttered the word "mangina" to mass murderers. This has become his norm, and the vast majority of his commenters eat it up and encourage it. Several other bloggers have followed suit, and are even attempting to pretty much run the atheist/skeptic/secularist conference scene, decide who gets to be a popular skeptic, and run constant campaigns defaming and lying about those who disagree across multiple blogs.

I'm more than passingly familiar with feminism and social justice efforts. I've probably read more of the relevant material than most of the bloggers and the vast majority of their commenters. But if you don't tow the full party line, you are pariah these days. Feminist activists and much of academic feminism and social justice efforts, and pretty much all of "internet feminism" are rife with manipulated stats, pseudoscience, anti-science, and are overtly hostile to skepticism. Yet even on the lowly blogs, this shit is unquestionable holy writ. They want to stuff it all into secular and skeptical movements, and it's not a good fit.

The people here, and on other blogs that are voicing concern, actually debating social issues, and fighting back against dishonest tactics, are mostly liberals, and many of them are women and minorities, yet we are demonized and slandered regularly. The pharyngula version of feminism is pretty toxic shit...ugly, superficial, anti-scientific, and mostly just patriarchy in lipstick, capitalizing on chivalry and artificial victimization, while ignoring any other perspectives....much like the last 30-40 years of "academic" feminism, it's utterly worthless outside it's own echo chamber. Yet if we dare question or point out flaws, we are compared to Marc Lepine, told that we're being "threatening", or "mansplaining", and quite frankly, having brain-dead idiots who can't even defend their positions say these things is the height of hypocrisy.

If pharyngula readers are the future of secularism or atheism, just admit it's a liberal religious cult and be done.

Al Stefanelli
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5442

Post by Al Stefanelli »

Gumby wrote:R Johnson" helpfully teaches us how we pitters arrived at atheism.
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... fd5ae0.jpg
The final part, "Never think for a second that they’re actually people who’ve thoughtfully come to atheism. Their atheism is unthinking and religious in nature", destroyed me irony meter.

I love how they just cast these blanket judgments...
What a total and complete douche-canoe

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5443

Post by Badger3k »

Louis wrote: Yes I do think there are loads and loads of things the pharyngulites (me included) can learn. GO AND TELL THEM. Or if that doesn't work, set up a separate place like this and dedicate your effort there. Where's the problem? If this stuff is so easy to rebut, detail it and rebut it. Please. You'll be doing me a favour. Instead it's team this, kool aid that, why?
Louis, why do you think this forum, and Abbie's original posting, was set up? Just like at the Discovery Institute, people have tried to explain, tried to present data, tried to present arguments. The result? Most were set on as EdwardGemmer says, inulted, attacked personally, even banned. The arguments were dismissed (generally out of hand, with no discussion) for various reasons, usually with buzzwords like "privilege", or the newish demonization of anyone who disagrees being a "slimepitter". There are a lot of testimonials (anecdotal data) from people who have done that. There are many posts with screencaps of comments that have been deleted or edited. When people who claim to be Freethinkers start using tactics perfected by the Discovery Institute, and have the same openness to challenges, then all that's left is ridicule. I wouldn't waste my time posting a response to anything over there. It would disappear or not be addressed. Plus, if they want a little echo chamber to themselves, they can have it. It's when they, like Creationists, want to try to pervert others to their narrow dogmatic views, then we have issues.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5444

Post by BannedAid »

another lurker wrote:
FTB is for the elite, only. That's the message I am getting. It's a private club!
Yep. I've been thinking the last few days that one of the catalysts of the rift is that some atheists felt the label wasn't quite exclusive enough for them anymore.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5445

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:Vicky, your avatar looks suspiciously like Giana Michaels' (don't search it on google image, or if you do, thank me directly) lips and nose. Not using a stock photo, are you? It's really frowned upon here, and everyone is using their real pics as avatar.
I have never heard of Giana Michaels, she obviously isn't as famous as me, maybe she is stealing my photos?

http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/eDSCF0180-FsnDnIEv.jpg
Here is another photo of me taken on Thursday. It makes my nose look big, but it shows it's me.... human!
Yeah, well, hipster radfem glasses ain't gonna fly with me!

(Did I say "call it a night"? I believe I did. Anyway, welcome Vicky, make yerself at home)

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5446

Post by VickyCaramel »

Gumby wrote:Just leaving this here...

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... a85365.jpg
This is why I signed up here at long last. Let the minority ban the majority. Good luck with that.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5447

Post by Apples »

Louis wrote:Pharyngula IS intimidating. Deliberately. This is a feature, not a bug. It's not for everyone. Just like I don't necessarily want to post at Place X because their environment doesn't suit me (for example I'd be fucked if there were a no swearing policy. I loves me a swear I do), I don't expect that Pharyngula gets everyone's juices flowing either. Why would I? Different strokes for different folks. It's not wrong to like or dislike the posting environment there, it just is a matter of personal preference.

As for the "you have to dot every i and cross every t" thing, again I disagree. Yes there are intemperate people who will jump on any error, I'm occasionally one of them if I've had a bad day and want to spread the joy around! ;-) But there is more nuance there than you suspect. What there isn't, at this current time (and this has been the case for a while now) is a lot of tolerance for leading people through the basics on certain subjects. It's not about disagreement, it's about having to explain the same damned thing a million times to a large number of rather clueless shitheads.
Intimidating? Maybe in the same way changing a shitty diaper is intimidating. There are some bright commenters at Pharyngula who have some well-rehearsed arguments against creationists. But the arguments -- if only you could call them "arguments" instead of flame-fests or struggle sessions -- about "social justice" and "misogyny" are fucking amateur-hour. Yes, Pharyngula is "not for everyone." For example, it's not for people who have a lot of intellectual integrity or have a really deep interest in honesty, fairness, and critical thinking -- especially when it comes to engaging those who are just as bright and well-informed as you are, but who are questioning things you may take for granted, for good or bad reasons.

Do you think BubbaRich was intimidated in this recent thread?

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... /#comments

Or do you think PZ called him a "fucking moron" and banned him because he was articulately asking for evidence of any real attempt to limit diversity in the atheist/skeptical movement? BubbaRich is, obviously, like NoelPlum, ERV, and many others, smarter than your average Pharyngulite. Not really an intimidating environment, just an infuriating and mediocre one if you're not giving pathetic PZ Myers a pass because he's an old friend from Talk Origins.

This isn't about PZ's being mean -- it's about his being smug, sloppy, intellectually-bigoted, and lazy when it comes to anything outside his narrow range of biological expertise, and managing his blog accordingly. It makes Pharyngula repulsive, and, what is worse, boring.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5448

Post by Ape+lust »

Gumby wrote:Just leaving this here...

[spoiler]http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... a85365.jpg[/spoiler]
I like reading his posts in his avatar's voice, as the interludes between screaming about wire hangers.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5449

Post by Badger3k »

Louis wrote:
fascination wrote:
<snip>

Ok hon, sorry I missed your post before I posted mine above. I must admit that the dehumization comment bothered me but I obviously misunderstood. Just ignore my previous rant, er, I mean post.
No worries. I was about to get to your post, glad I read this first.

Let's be clear, and this is to everyone, let's wipe the slate clean: I don't think anyone* here is dehumanising women right this second. I'll let you know when I do, but this is getting tiring so if I miss some shit, meh, I'm only human!

* Okay, I will confess there are a subset of people who AFAIK post here who I DO think have said various misogynist things. Those people have posted at Pharyngula, because that's the only way until today I'd have seen them. I'll probably avoid dealing with someone I consider entrenched or stupid. That's my limitation, I freely admit I may be wrong, but I don't think I am in certain cases. You can either respect that as the choice of an adult or not. Your call. I'll try to engage as much as I am capable of, until, like I said, it hold no further interest for me. I can be more bluntly honest than that. I have neither infinite time or patience. Neither do you I imagine! ;-)
Not to pile on, but it would be helpful for any discussion to say what you consider is a "misogynistic comment". That is a wide-open statement and completely suggestive, and one of the points of debate here and elsewhere.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5450

Post by Louis »

EdwardGemmer wrote:
<snip>

I think "disappointing" is the word I would use with that place. I was actually pretty excited to find it, as I consider myself an atheist feminist who hates creationism in schools and have a degree in zoology. I'm pretty liberal and very interested in African-American issues because my kids are biracial and I am a public defender in a fairly large city, so I represent a lot of poor black people. Pharyngula seemed right up my alley and I was excited to post there. I enjoyed arguing with people, to whatever extent I could, but the VAST majority of argument against me could be boiled down to me being stupid, white, male, privileged, etc. It was lazy and really not uncommon from what you would find on any message board about anything - religion, football teams, republicans, whatever. People there simply could not separate out the ideas and arguments with the person behind them, which is why there were so many attacks on my character and anyone's character who might actually disagree with something. So it was disappointing, because I has felt that atheism prided itself on moving on from the idea that having slightly different beliefs is a good reason to hate someone, but apparently we have not.
Now this I can get behind a bit more. Not entirely but more. There is a lot of noise to signal at Pharyngula. There is a lot of noise to signal, as you note, all over the web. What can I say, you get used to it...perhaps! Getting good quality intellectual debate on the internet, or anywhere, is tough.

Your last sentence interests me, atheism prided itself on moving on from the idea that having slightly different beliefs is a good reason to hate someone? I never got that memo. And me, the President of the Evil Atheist Conspiracy (I fucking am, don't believe anyone who tells you different ;-) ).

I'd argue that, properly understood, that would be an Atheism+ position. But I imagine I'd get murdered! I spend zero time over on the A+ forums, so I have no idea what's going on over there. The initial concept attracts me for a variety of reasons.

AndrewV69
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5451

Post by AndrewV69 »

Michael K Gray wrote:
KacyRay wrote:And what's up with people setting up local car dealerships with test drives for PZ Myers? Are those people that hang out here, or are those examples of more serious personal vendettas from people in his past?
Of course, it just couldn't be one of his students, eh?
I mean, annoyed Uni students who get bad grades for giving lip have never ever done this kind of thing to their teachers.
Not ever in the history of the universe.
I remember one teacher in particular who would regularly find she had a flat tyre at the end of the day. Not caused by a puncture mind you, but someone apparently was fond of removing a dustcap and utilizing a matchstick while presumably walking away.

This went on for an entire term. Never caught the culprit, could have been another teacher or a master for all we know.

nippletwister
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5452

Post by nippletwister »

Louis wrote:
cunt wrote:
<snip>

Obviously though you have some other point to make or you wouldn't be here. Don't keep us guessing. I'm taking your avoidance of the Nerd question as a "yes".
Point? Can't a bloke simply be curious?

And on the Nerd thing: It's not avoidance, I just don't care to play this silly game. Feel free to project all you want though. I'm sure it helps...something.

Uh, not to jump in here if I don't belong, but asking your honest opinion of a prominent, prolific, and fairly rabid commenter on a site you frequent isn't much of a "game" ...but I'm sure you feeling superior is important. Keep projecting!

Za-zen
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5453

Post by Za-zen »

Just incase louis thinks he's chased off my dick carrier grade intellect, i'm off to bec.

Al Stefanelli
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5454

Post by Al Stefanelli »

VickyCaramel wrote:
Gumby wrote:Just leaving this here...

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... a85365.jpg
This is why I signed up here at long last. Let the minority ban the majority. Good luck with that.
Well, isn't that special. For some reason, I'm not surprised, at all.

Oh, by the way,

http://www.picpaste.com/extpics/tits-niuKWP8C.jpg

Thank you very much.

EdgePenguin
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5455

Post by EdgePenguin »

Did you guys spot this gem at A+? Apparently alcoholics don't have problems even remotely comparable with those experienced by the professional victims of that forum:

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3605

Badger3k
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5456

Post by Badger3k »

Louis wrote: I'd argue that, properly understood, that would be an Atheism+ position. But I imagine I'd get murdered! I spend zero time over on the A+ forums, so I have no idea what's going on over there. The initial concept attracts me for a variety of reasons.
Someone needs to tell the few posters left at A+ that, then. If you haven't been reading it you've missed the Opression Olympics, the Great Internet Hug Meltdown, the numerous Permanent Flounces, the Recitation of Privilege, and the many forms of victim-blaming. And the Cannibal wannabe who wants to start an SJW Haven around Chernyobel. If anybody ever writes a study or book about the A+ fiasco, feel free to use those titles for the chapters. Granted, we might include Cromunist's friend, the woo-filled Halffish who thinks it is ok to infect (sorry "convert") innocent and unknowing people with HIV. This is from someone in the medical field, by the way. Not exactly A+, but since he has been held up as an example of a good atheist (I believe, I don't think it was as a skeptic) I think we can include him in the book.

Badger3k
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5457

Post by Badger3k »

Za-zen wrote:Just incase louis thinks he's chased off my dick carrier grade intellect, i'm off to bec.
You're off to bec? Does this mean you're going to die your hair and wear hipster glasses? Maybe get sloshed and go into elevators? Claim to be threatened and victimized and smirk when you tell people how scared you are? :lol:

Badger3k
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5458

Post by Badger3k »

Dye! Dye! Dye! Aargh. Fixed one autocorrect and missed that. Bugger. Does this mean I have dye in a fire?

Michael K Gray
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#5459

Post by Michael K Gray »

Lsuoma wrote:Here's a thought that just struck me, which is, I think, very telling.

We are seeing a CONSTANT stream of people saying, in effect:

"I was a babboollie, but gradually got fed up with what I was seeing and hearing. I heard terrible things about Teh Pitters, but when I came over here to take a look I found that the FC(n) had completely misrepresented you. Sure, it's crude, and you need a thick skin, but Pitters seem to be honest, and adult."

I have not heard of a single instance of reverse Pitflow, so to speak. (Fucking Pitmagnets, how do they work, eh?).

Can anyone name an example? (colon doesn't count, of course - s/h/it was pure wank from the get go.)
Justicar, for a while at least.


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