Periodic Table of Swearing

[real horrorshow]

Koreans eat garlic?

I had heard that they get called that by the Japanese. I have no idea if they actually do or did at one time. It was just something someone told me and which I believed without thinking twice. I guess it might or might not be true.

As indicated prior to this, I have formally studied the Japanese language, and interacted with Japanese speakers in fervent attempts to garner a handle on their idiomatic speech peculiarities, and their stock expressions. (In fact, I just purchased two more study tomes, in Japanese, that go into this subject in excruciating detail)
So I feel somewhat confident to remark that I have not heard this expression in any other situation than to "tease a Spetic¹" or other gullible 外人 (gaijin).
(Apart from some young Japanese who have fallen for the old-wive's tale)
They are more likely to call them 'dog-eaters' these days.

Ok, dog-eaters then. I was ordered to refer to that as racialism and not racism. I don't take orders too well.

A quick skim of the Web indicates that the usage (of garlic-eater for Korean by the Japanese) crops up in James Clavell's Shogun a tome generally regarded as being about as reliable as the Carry On films as source of data. It has also been used by Americans to refer to some European immigrants, especially Italians. It even crops up in the hugfest movie It's A Wonderful Life in that way. If garlic-eater means 'one who enjoys/eats a lot of garlic' then I'm a garlic-eater!

I have heard annecdotally that Koreans resent references to them eating dogs, on the grounds that very few of them do so these days. To the extent that dog-eating still goes on, it takes place in several east-Asian countries. Dog-eaters claim it has health benefits I think. Many N. American Indians used to eat dog when game was scarce.

[Lsuoma]

To be fair, "Skepchicks smelly snatch*" was coined by Abbie. Don't deprive her of that glorious term.





*Apostrophe respectfuly omitted.

Actually, I thought it was "smelly skepchick snatch." But I might be wrong.

[Scented Nectar]

A quick skim of the Web indicates that the usage (of garlic-eater for Korean by the Japanese) crops up in James Clavell's Shogun a tome generally regarded as being about as reliable as the Carry On films as source of data. It has also been used by Americans to refer to some European immigrants, especially Italians. It even crops up in the hugfest movie It's A Wonderful Life in that way. If garlic-eater means 'one who enjoys/eats a lot of garlic' then I'm a garlic-eater!

I have heard annecdotally that Koreans resent references to them eating dogs, on the grounds that very few of them do so these days. To the extent that dog-eating still goes on, it takes place in several east-Asian countries. Dog-eaters claim it has health benefits I think. Many N. American Indians used to eat dog when game was scarce.

Ok, so then, what do people get called if they eat dogs that are seasoned with lots of garlic? :P

[real horrorshow]

Ok, so then, what do people get called if they eat dogs that are seasoned with lots of garlic? :P

In those circumstances, I would say that the hurler might have to choose one epithet over another - possibly on the basis of which act they found most objectionable. Attempting to combine the epithets is problematic, in Modern English usage, since a combination of 'dog' and 'garlic' would be - conventionally - phrased 'garlicky dog' not as as 'doggy garlic', even though the epithet-hurler might object more to garlic eating than to dog eating and would prefer to make 'garlic' the subject of the sentence.

Even then, the resulting epithet 'garlicky dog eater', is open to mis-interpretation. It may be taken to mean that the dog-eater is himself 'garlicky' rather than the dog which he eats. Or it may interpreted that the epithet-hurler objects to the eating of 'garlicky dogs' specifically, but not to the eating of dogs generally.*

One might resort to a somewhat old-fashioned sentence structure and hurl: 'eater of garlicky dog', but even then the the second problem of interpretation remains. It may be, that other languages, (especially those of regions such as East-Asia, where both dog eating and garlic eating occur), do not have the problems that Modern English has in this respect.

*It is worth pointing out that dogs themselves do not find dog-eating to be offensive:

"...there is the obvious advantage that dog can be fed on dog. One can reduce one's pack little by little, slaughtering the feebler ones and feeding the chosen with them. In this way they get fresh meat. Our dogs lived on dog's flesh and pemmican the whole way, and this enabled them to do splendid work. And if we ourselves wanted a piece of fresh meat we could cut off a delicate little fillet; it tasted to us as good as the best beef. The dogs do not object at all; as long as they get their share they do not mind what part of their comrade's carcass it comes from. All that was left after one of these canine meals was the teeth of the victim - and if it had been a really hard day, these also disappeared." - Roald Amundsen. "The South Pole."

My bold.

An alternative approach may be for those who object to the eating of dogs, or garlic or both (whether in combination or not) to simply shut up and order something else.

[Scented Nectar]

I guess that they must have all been arguing on the "backchannel" about ads and who controls them. Now Brayton's got an article upset at my video that questioned it. http://freethoughtblogs.com/dispatches/ ... -diatribe/

Ed says:

She also makes many false statements in the comments, like this:

Since posting this, both PZ and Ed have been sporadically turning their comment ads on and off.

I won't bother answering this there, but here instead (which they read anyways), where there's no moderating like most ftblogs (I have no idea what Ed's like in his comment sections). So here's my answer to the above:

Let me reword that:
Since posting this, the comment ads at both PZ's and Ed's have been sporadically turning on and off.

You know, I don't care who sets up ads, nor do I care how it's distributed. It's good that any extra page hits (I'm not talking about 'click throughs', Ed) from PZ's comments benefited all of them. In fact, as long as the ads are not by google (who recently decided to remove them from all newsfeeder viewings), my video shows them a way they can ALL increase their page hits /ad views (not clicks).

Since this video is from a couple months ago, I have no idea what the current state of their comment feeds are like. But, I do stand by what I showed in the video. And I asked a lot of questions that are valid ones. Silly people. Now that they've explained that they use a communal method of sharing the toilet paper, well fine, so what? And if they don't control the ads and feeds, then don't get mad at me for pointing it out. Instead, check that I'm telling the truth by subbing to a bunch of ftb comment feeds, and assuming it's still as I found it a couple months ago (and even if not), go to your tech person and ask "did you put ads on some of our comment feeds but not others?"

I think what really happened is that someone in the backchannel must have brought up the things in my video, questioning it like I did. Well, yesterday and now today, PZ and Ed are both are like "I don't even control that stuff". Whatever. I don't care. I merely demonstrated that some comment feeds were showing ads and some weren't, which made me question it and air my own suspicions. Just after I made the vid, ads became sporadic, but by then, the sporadic ads were also showing on Ed's feed too. Last I saw, there were sporadic ones at both PZ's and Ed's comment feeds, and none on the feeds of the others I sampled.

It was soon after making the video that I unsubbed from all their comment feeds. For an obsessed person, I sure must be a lazy one. I don't feel like bothering to subscribe to, and check, their comment RSS feeds again to see what's currently happening regarding ads. Too much work.

[mikelf]

I won't bother answering this there, but here instead (which they read anyways), where there's no moderating like most ftblogs (I have no idea what Ed's like in his comment sections).

I've read Dispatches since back even before PZ called Ed “that sad panjandrum of the self-satisfied mean, medium, middle, moderate, and mediocre.” I do not recall any comment moderation. Of course, Ed's commenters tended to be of a rather higher quality than PZs with few crossovers (Aquaria being one.) My reading of Dispatches has dropped off to practically nothing since FTB started up, so it may have changed.

[ReneeHendricks]

Futher, I don't think Ophelia has ever told off her bestest friend and little runt Rhys Morgan about his use of the term "cunt" on his Twitter feed.

Ugh, Rhys Morgan. That's the moronic teen who freaked on me and blocked me because I said "asking someone for coffee isn't code for sex". Being the "worldly" *teenager* he is, he told me how wrong I was....before he blocked me and ran away. Snot-nosed little shit.

[Dilurk]

Really Amy? Gonna sue someone for $100,000 for using a picture of one of your derivative summer-camp-for-special-kids art projects?

Jesus, you fuckers are a bunch of thin skinned bullies. And I hate bullies.

I detest bullies.

So, if you would like to sit down and talk about, say, your own doxing of people, false DMCA claims and anything else you might have hidden in your sock drawer that you'd like to become a matter of public record, you've picked a perfect way to do it.

Some people don't have the time and resources to call your bluffs.

I am no lawyer but my understanding was JV had or still has the right to counter sue. I suspect JV would not do this. Sooner or later Amy will DMCA someone who is willing to counter sue.

I do.

Happy hunting, honey.

Here's hoping she DMCAs you. I really detest bullies.

[Scented Nectar]

I am no lawyer but my understanding was JV had or still has the right to counter sue. I suspect JV would not do this. Sooner or later Amy will DMCA someone who is willing to counter sue.

If a DMCA takedown notice is appealed, it's up to the DMCA'er, Amy, to serve real-life lawsuit papers on whoever appealed it (Justin, Tf00t, or ElevatorGate blog). If she doesn't do that within a certain amount of days, the taken down material goes back up. The lawyers she asked wanted $5000 so she didn't go that route. Just as well, since she had no grounds and no damage. If she never actually sues, no one needs to counter sue or defend themselves from her suit. That, plus her babbling about suing Tf00t for $100,000 all sounds like Lolsuits. :)

[acathode]

The whole modern feminism is so fucking out of touch with the Real World and what I thought feminism was supposed to be about.

Reminds me of an article I read in the biggest Swedish morning paper just a few months ago. It's in Swedish, so I cba to translate the whole thing, just going to do the beginning, which is more than enough of a "what planet do you live on?" moment:

Therefore real men eat meat
Killing animals and eating meat is part of the man's assertion of his dominance over animals, women and children. It's time to start discussing the so-called carnocentrism writes Amelie Björck.

(and then the article spirals downwards into some strange, confusing reviews of some books and movies where men kill animals, and a short explanation of carnocentrism)

Basically, when I go to the supermarket and buy a package of meatballs, I'm oppressing women... damn! The more you know...

Yes. These people and reality, does not mix well.

[Mr Danksworth]

Futher, I don't think Ophelia has ever told off her bestest friend and little runt Rhys Morgan about his use of the term "cunt" on his Twitter feed.

Ugh, Rhys Morgan. That's the moronic teen who freaked on me and blocked me because I said "asking someone for coffee isn't code for sex". Being the "worldly" *teenager* he is, he told me how wrong I was....before he blocked me and ran away. Snot-nosed little shit.

Rule number one. If you are an adult, do not argue with teenagers...they are morons.

[Keating]

What does this mean for rapists:
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2 ... alive.html

[ReneeHendricks]

Futher, I don't think Ophelia has ever told off her bestest friend and little runt Rhys Morgan about his use of the term "cunt" on his Twitter feed.

Ugh, Rhys Morgan. That's the moronic teen who freaked on me and blocked me because I said "asking someone for coffee isn't code for sex". Being the "worldly" *teenager* he is, he told me how wrong I was....before he blocked me and ran away. Snot-nosed little shit.

Rule number one. If you are an adult, do not argue with teenagers...they are morons.

It depends upon the teen. I have 3 of 'em at home. All of them quite a bit smarter than Rhys, apparently.

[AndrewV69]

And why the fuck to you bring racism and homophobia in the discussion any chance you get?

Lawl!

Well I offered my theory at least twice and he has not responded yet. So make of it what you will. It is pretty funny in my book that he appears to avoid it.

[Guest]

It's socially acceptable to use so called 'gendered slurs' against men but not against women. And this is because women are oppressed? Really?

I've seen social justice warriors claim that only white people can be racist on account of white privilege and that they are totally not oppressed. Obviously nothing racist can happen to white people either, because they are privileged.

It's so fucking moronic I can't believe these people exist. However, now I think about it, I realise that I have officially been given free rein to call them whatever fucking racist shit I feel like.

Hmmm. This could get FUN.

At an awful feminist/sjw-run workshop I was once made to attend, due to being on the stupid board at a co-op where I lived, we were all told that only white people can be racist. If someone non-white does a racist thing, they must be called "racialist" instead, with the understanding that that wasn't as bad as being "racist". So if a Japanese person puts down Koreans, calling them "garlic eaters", I was told I can't call that racist. I didn't bring up the dictionary definitions, but they'd have probably said that was old fashioned, patriarchal, white man's words.

The above workshop was due to a white woman who lived there calling the cops in order to get a car towed from repeatedly blocking her access to the garage she was parked in. She didn't even know who's car it was at first, but the black female owner of the blocking car, who also lived there, claimed her life was put in danger because cops don't like black people. It didn't seem to even matter to her that one of the cops was black.

Later, when the white woman was still trying to get the black woman from blocking her spot (she routinely had to go knocking and asking her to move it again and again, even after the traffic cops were called), the white woman said she would be monitoring her driveway to make sure it doesn't happen again. The black woman freaked out, saying the word "monitor" was a white oppressive word, evoking police authority or something like that. She complained to the board, and thus the workshop. This was also the one I walked out of when they did that stupid game where we were supposed to answer all sorts of personal questions just to make a point about who were or weren't invisible minorities. They asked sex questions, religion, politics, and all sorts of other fuck off that's none of your business questions. I walked out.

You've had some interesting experiences and I enjoy reading about them.

[Scented Nectar]

You've had some interesting experiences and I enjoy reading about them.

Thanks. :)

[BarnOwl]

Therefore real men eat meat
Killing animals and eating meat is part of the man's assertion of his dominance over animals, women and children. It's time to start discussing the so-called carnocentrism writes Amelie Björck.

Do they count fish amongst the animals?

I visited a friend in Stockholm for 5 days or so, and ate a lot of fish during that time. I was quite happy with that (not a vegetarian, though usually 2/3 of my meals are vegetarian/vegan), and I'm lamenting the paucity of pickled herring varieties available here in the US.

I've noticed that there's a tendency for many in the US to refer to themselves as vegetarians (often with an air of self-righteousness), when they happily eat fish and shellfish. Was wondering if there's the same tendency in Sweden.

[Tony Parsehole]

The whole modern feminism is so fucking out of touch with the Real World and what I thought feminism was supposed to be about.

Reminds me of an article I read in the biggest Swedish morning paper just a few months ago. It's in Swedish, so I cba to translate the whole thing, just going to do the beginning, which is more than enough of a "what planet do you live on?" moment:

Therefore real men eat meat
Killing animals and eating meat is part of the man's assertion of his dominance over animals, women and children. It's time to start discussing the so-called carnocentrism writes Amelie Björck.

3 months ago that would have shocked me. I'd probably be writing an e-mail to a mate along the lines of "look at how stupid some people are lawlz" but I'm now too desensitized to even raise an eyebrow. Carnocentrism is just another in a long line of beyond parody, made-up words designed to blame males for everything.
I suppose the Patriarchy is forcing burgers down women's throats? No female has ever killed an animal and eaten it without a man forcing them to do so have they?
*sigh*

[Scented Nectar]

I won't bother answering this there, but here instead (which they read anyways), where there's no moderating like most ftblogs (I have no idea what Ed's like in his comment sections).

I've read Dispatches since back even before PZ called Ed “that sad panjandrum of the self-satisfied mean, medium, middle, moderate, and mediocre.” I do not recall any comment moderation. Of course, Ed's commenters tended to be of a rather higher quality than PZs with few crossovers (Aquaria being one.) My reading of Dispatches has dropped off to practically nothing since FTB started up, so it may have changed.

I used to think that maybe he wasn't as radfem/fanatical as PZ et al, but since moving to ftb, he's shown that he's drunk the ideological koolaid of western radfeminism in a couple of articles since the move. Also, his blog requires registering, and that also put me off, but it is possible that he'd have let me post what I posted here. I don't know. I guess it's possible that he doesn't follow the party line in that regards. Shrodinger's comment deleter/blocker. :lol:

[AndrewV69]

Basically, when I go to the supermarket and buy a package of meatballs, I'm oppressing women... damn! The more you know...

Yes. These people and reality, does not mix well.

I try to keep an eye out on Sweden from time to time as some sort of indicator for future trends in North America and the UK. They have for the last 30 years at least, been a bellweather of future developments here.

The rural Swedish male and female immigration from Thailand for example, I understand that lots of Swedish women are not happy about it so I expect that steps will be taken to curb it, like they have in the UK, where they found that way too many western educated women in a certain ethnic group were having to settle at best for being a 2nd wife.

I take the following as an open shot across the bows. Naturally, and not surprisingly the Swedish men are abusing and oppressing the women (/snark)

Rise in abuse of foreign wives in Sweden: report
http://www.thelocal.se/32110/20110217/

In 2009, 552 women sought help from women's emergency shelters in Sweden due to domestic violence, nearly a 10 percent increase from the 515 women who sought help the year before.

The statistics come from a report released on Wednesday by the National Association of Women's and Young Women's Shelters (Riksorganisationen för kvinnojourer och tjejjourer – ROKS).

According to ROKS, current regulations make it too easy for men to start relationships with foreign women and bring them to Sweden for the sole purpose of taking advantage of them.

"Today legislation is shaped in a way that makes it entirely possible for men to take woman after woman here despite that he subjects her to serious abuses," writes ROKS chair Angela Beausang in an article on the opinion website Newsmill.se.

"This must be changed."

Women caught it in what the group refers to as "wife importing" often lack knowledge about their rights in Sweden and risk being deported if the relationship ends.

According to ROKS, most women who sought help in shelters in 2009 came from Thailand, Iraq or Russia.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

And why the fuck to you bring racism and homophobia in the discussion any chance you get?

Lawl!

Well I offered my theory at least twice and he has not responded yet. So make of it what you will. It is pretty funny in my book that he appears to avoid it.

That was kind of a rhetorical question.

[Munkhaus]

Re Oolon and his enlightened 'not wanting to offend' cunt arguments.
Draw Mohammed day= great!
Photoshop PZed and Twatson= campaign of harassment! Wahaaaargh!

Alternatively, substitute 'dick/prick/etc' for 'cunt' and use your same arguments on Fftbs. Sit back and bask in the warmth of the ensuing conflagration.

TL;DFR
Double standards Aka hypocrisy.

[real horrorshow]

Basically, when I go to the supermarket and buy a package of meatballs, I'm oppressing women... damn! The more you know...

Meatballs? MeatBALLS? You mouth-raping phallocrat!

[Tigzy]

Re Oolon and his enlightened 'not wanting to offend' cunt arguments.
Draw Mohammed day= great!
Photoshop PZed and Twatson= campaign of harassment! Wahaaaargh!

Alternatively, substitute 'dick/prick/etc' for 'cunt' and use your same arguments on Fftbs. Sit back and bask in the warmth of the ensuing conflagration.

TL;DFR
Double standards Aka hypocrisy.

Regarding 'Draw Mohammad Day' - as to what the FfTBers general view on this remains, as far as I'm aware, debatable. I recall some kerfuffle a while back on Pharyngula about how DMD had been hijacked by racists, and that proper, decent atheists like themselves shouldn't participate in it because of this. That said, it was generally agreed - if I remember rightly - that it's fine to draw Mohammed on any other day other than that day because...well, of the racists I suppose.

I dunno. It was all very silly and I switched off pretty soon, because I'm pretty sure that those racists with a grudge against dark-skinned muslims in particular will continue to make racist Mohammad cartoons on days other than DMD too.

[justinvacula]

I am no lawyer but my understanding was JV had or still has the right to counter sue. I suspect JV would not do this. Sooner or later Amy will DMCA someone who is willing to counter sue.

If a DMCA takedown notice is appealed, it's up to the DMCA'er, Amy, to serve real-life lawsuit papers on whoever appealed it (Justin, Tf00t, or ElevatorGate blog). If she doesn't do that within a certain amount of days, the taken down material goes back up. The lawyers she asked wanted $5000 so she didn't go that route. Just as well, since she had no grounds and no damage. If she never actually sues, no one needs to counter sue or defend themselves from her suit. That, plus her babbling about suing Tf00t for $100,000 all sounds like Lolsuits. :)

I was taken aback when reading 'Surly Amy's recent post detailing not only how she sought legal advice from -- as she says -- four law firms but also goes on to mention "defamation" and "complications." She also never ASKED me to take the photo down; the heavy-handed DMCA was all I received as far as I know (It would be quite odd for me to miss an email like that from Amy).

Amy writes,

I looked for a lawyer.

I contacted 4 law firms. No one would take the case for under a $5,000 retainer because of the defamation and complications of the case that were involved. You see, when Justin filed his counter claim saying he had rights to my image and then bragged about it all over the internet, another copycat troll did the same. Someone else posted a WHOLE BUNCH of my photos and lied about me. I had asked for those photos to be removed before I asked Justin to take the one photo down, But when troll saw Justin bragging about how you could file a counter DMCA claim to fight the evil feministâ„¢ who wants to censor all the poor mens, troll did the same. Troll filed THREE counter DMCA claims. So I had two men using a trick in the system to gain access to my artwork.

Then Amy says

No, I filed a perfectly valid copyright claim. My photos and my art were used without permission and potentially made money for at least one person who used them. The fact is, I simply could not afford a lawyer to fight the BS counter claims.

Does Amy really consider what is legal and what is illegal -- even if we are to grant her, for sake of argument, that what I did was illegal -- to be the final word on whether legal action should happen?

Here's the deal Amy...because I know you are reading this as are your friends:

I don't hate you. I don't hate anyone. I don't wish harm on you or your friends. I have a penchant for critiquing bad ideas whether they are from someone identifying as a male or a female. Prior to 2012, as you should know, I was actually sympathetic to the Skepchick network and, if I recall correctly, authored an application to apply for a position as a contributor to the Skepchick network!!! Following attacks on Staks Rosch and others, I started to ask questions and eventually saw many problems with the assertions and arguments made on your network which led me to not be a fan.

I've publicly disagreed with Jerry Coyne, Lawrence Krauss, Phil Zuckerman, Massimo Pigliucci (who is one of my favorite personalities in this community), PZ Myers, Lousy Canuck, The Thinking Atheist, and so so so many more people. This isn't an anti-woman issue as your friend Rebecca Watson and your friends made it out to be while you stand by on the sidelines saying -- to my knowledge -- nothing in response to debunk these claims that I am "anti-woman" or otherwise can't be trusted around women or with their personal details.

...and you want an apology?

I have indeed made my mistakes. We all have. ...and I would like you to admit the same thing if you want an apology. I don't see apologies as unilateral matters when it is the case that both parties made mistakes.

[Saint N.]

Regarding 'Draw Mohammad Day' - as to what the FfTBers general view on this remains, as far as I'm aware, debatable. I recall some kerfuffle a while back on Pharyngula about how DMD had been hijacked by racists, and that proper, decent atheists like themselves shouldn't participate in it because of this. That said, it was generally agreed - if I remember rightly - that it's fine to draw Mohammed on any other day other than that day because...well, of the racists I suppose.

IIRC, vocal concerns about the political correctness of DMD didn't start until after elevatorgate last year, and even then it was largely the FTB commenters that were crying racism at the whole thing (not so much the bloggers themselves). In previous years (and this year) PZ was fine with the whole thing, so was the TAE crew (Matt drew muhammad on the air), I don't remember B&W ever objecting either. The other ones (blah hag, almost diamonds, lousy canuck), almost no one was reading prior to their FTB drama antics/shit stirring, so who knows there. I do remember only a handful of commenters objecting on the old SB pharyngula, but being dismissed by the majority (including PZ). This year, the 'DMD=racism, b/c some racists are doing it too' was much more noticeable in the FTB comments than it had been in previous years (on the blogger's independent sites). Well, when you make everything a social justice issue...

[TFJ]

Justin:

I have indeed made my mistakes. We all have. ...and I would like you to admit the same thing if you want an apology. I don't see apologies as unilateral matters when it is the case that both parties made mistakes.

Nothing wrong with an unreciprocated apology for posting Surly's details. Can't speak for you, but I'm fairly convinced you were just a bit naive. But that's all you have to apologise for. Don't hold your breath waiting for any of the bastards to apologise for anything substantial. They show no evidence of the introspection required to comprehend the nature of their actions. They're as happy as pigs in shit to be liars for A+. Don't accept any pressure to meet the fuckers halfway.

[AndrewV69]

Don't hold your breath waiting for any of the bastards to apologise for anything substantial. They show no evidence of the introspection required to comprehend the nature of their actions. They're as happy as pigs in shit to be liars for A+. Don't accept any pressure to meet the fuckers halfway.

I tend to agree that JV should not expect anything from his detractors other than more of the same.

Speaking of which, here is one take from the manosphere on a critic of the A+theists, but he goes one step further. I can not say I agree with his take on Aethism in general, but I think his perspective is interesting.

http://www.staresattheworld.com/2012/10 ... n-taliban/

Naomi Chambers is an Atheistkult/Skeptic, who recently criticized the Atheist+ community. I’m going to go out on a limb here, and guess that you’ve never heard of them (good for you!), but it’s a fairly major fight going on in the Atheist Community right now. Essentially – following Rebecca Watson’s Elevatorgate nonsense, Dawkins ridiculing of her, and a manufactured ‘descrimination’ against female Atheists – the community split. Atheist+ are the open Marxists of the movement, with all the nonsensical and ill-defined Social Justice and so forth which acts as a screen for “We will destroy all forms of healthy human relationships! Power to the Wimminz!”

This is just mean of me.

The regular Atheists will argue that these are a fringe group; I beg to differ. Atheist+ is not just the logical outcome of Leftist/post-Christian/Atheistkult; it’s secretly the guiding principle of all Modern Atheism.

[bhoytony]

Carnocentrism is just another in a long line of beyond parody, made-up words designed to blame males for everything.
I suppose the Patriarchy is forcing burgers down women's throats?
*sigh*

Not burgers, but certainly hot dogs.

[Skep tickle]

I came to the whole FtB/A+ debacle late, but it's fascinating to observe. I guess their self-image that they promote (or even allow) critical thinking & skepticism is just part of the pathology. Counting down now to my banning at FtB in 3, 2, 1....

[ERV]

The whole modern feminism is so fucking out of touch with the Real World and what I thought feminism was supposed to be about.

Reminds me of an article I read in the biggest Swedish morning paper just a few months ago. It's in Swedish, so I cba to translate the whole thing, just going to do the beginning, which is more than enough of a "what planet do you live on?" moment:

Therefore real men eat meat
Killing animals and eating meat is part of the man's assertion of his dominance over animals, women and children. It's time to start discussing the so-called carnocentrism writes Amelie Björck.

(and then the article spirals downwards into some strange, confusing reviews of some books and movies where men kill animals, and a short explanation of carnocentrism)

Basically, when I go to the supermarket and buy a package of meatballs, I'm oppressing women... damn! The more you know...

Yes. These people and reality, does not mix well.

After over ten years of not eating red meat, I got seriously ill. Women need to eat red meat, not men.

[real horrorshow]

I can't stream video on the old tin box I'm currently using but:

The regular Atheists will argue that these are a fringe group; I beg to differ. Atheist+ is not just the logical outcome of Leftist/post-Christian/Atheistkult; it’s secretly the guiding principle of all Modern Atheism.

Bollocks. Next.

[Rystefn]

Women need to eat red meat, not men.

My understanding is that a lot of people, men and women, need red meat in their diets to prevent certain types of health issues. Perhaps I'm misinformed, or misremembering (it's been a while), but I'm pretty sure I recall reading about that somewhere or other.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

After over ten years of not eating red meat, I got seriously ill. Women need to eat red meat, not men.

WHY U NO WANT TO EAT MEN?!?

[AndrewV69]

Just so you guys do not forget that I am in fact one of those evil mysognistic MRAs who want to keep all women barefoot pregnant and in the kitchen when not being my personal sex slave and making me a sammitch because like most women are like this (French subtitles for Phil)

[youtube]CX2Qfv5O634[/youtube]

From AVFM, more pushback and one reason MRAs are viewed with horror, because MRAs see themselves as talking truth to power, and the effect is discombobulation if your narrative is that you are suffering from oppression, and are not an oppressor yourself.

The transcript:
http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights ... ibbon-day/

Talking about men and boys has absolutely nothing to do with women at all – which should be a no-brainer. Characterizing non-feminist persons for social change for men as ‘woman-haters’ is far off the mark.

I challenged women on campus to take the pledge: “If it isn’t allowed to require sorority girls to walk in men’s jockstraps and apologize for paternity fraud, false allegations, and women’s-perpetrated child abuse, requiring fraternity men to walk in women’s heels should also not be allowed.”

[youtube]VOMCgoEP7e0[/youtube]

[AndrewV69]

After over ten years of not eating red meat, I got seriously ill. Women need to eat red meat, not men.

WHY U NO WANT TO EAT MEN?!?

BECAUZE WIMMIN MAKE GOOD EATING NOT MENZ!!!!!

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

After over ten years of not eating red meat, I got seriously ill. Women need to eat red meat, not men.

WHY U NO WANT TO EAT MEN?!?

Err, that may have not come out right...

[AndrewV69]

After over ten years of not eating red meat, I got seriously ill. Women need to eat red meat, not men.

WHY U NO WANT TO EAT MEN?!?

Err, that may have not come out right...

Came out perfect for any of the FC(n) or their ilk to swoon or clutch pearls. I sometimes enjoy taunting them.

[Skep tickle]

Women need to eat red meat, not men.

My understanding is that a lot of people, men and women, need red meat in their diets to prevent certain types of health issues. Perhaps I'm misinformed, or misremembering (it's been a while), but I'm pretty sure I recall reading about that somewhere or other.

Iron is a mineral necessary for several biological functions, present in plant-based foods but at lower levels and in a less well-absorbed form than in meat. Menstruating and pregnant women lose iron so need to take more iron in, ideally from better-absorbed forms like meat or supplement form, than do men and non-pregnant non-menstruating women. Children also need more, given their growth including progressive increase in blood volume as they get larger.

Hemochromatosis is a relatively common genetic condition in which the body stores too much iron; it most commonly causes medical problems in men (also in postmenopausal women) given that they don't normally have any ongoing source of iron loss. For this reason, men & postmenopausal are generally not advised to take iron supplements, though I don't know of any general recommendation for men & postmenopausal women without known hemochromatosis to limit red meat to limit increasing iron stores.

Hope that all makes sense.

[Johann the Cabbie]

IIRC, vocal concerns about the political correctness of DMD didn't start until after elevatorgate last year, and even then it was largely the FTB commenters that were crying racism at the whole thing (not so much the bloggers themselves). In previous years (and this year) PZ was fine with the whole thing, so was the TAE crew (Matt drew muhammad on the air), I don't remember B&W ever objecting either. The other ones (blah hag, almost diamonds, lousy canuck), almost no one was reading prior to their FTB drama antics/shit stirring, so who knows there. I do remember only a handful of commenters objecting on the old SB pharyngula, but being dismissed by the majority (including PZ). This year, the 'DMD=racism, b/c some racists are doing it too' was much more noticeable in the FTB comments than it had been in previous years (on the blogger's independent sites). Well, when you make everything a social justice issue...

I seem to remember that blag hag opted not to participate last year because she was worried that some pissed off Muslim would kill her.

[sacha]

*Thrust, not trust.

oh how that made me smile!

[Lsuoma]

Hope that all makes sense.

I'm all in favour of Fe supplements for the baboollies in the form of administration of an iron railing to the fecking teeth from time-to-time.

(note: violent imagery used for humorous purposes only...)

[Tigzy]

Women need to eat red meat, not men.

My understanding is that a lot of people, men and women, need red meat in their diets to prevent certain types of health issues. Perhaps I'm misinformed, or misremembering (it's been a while), but I'm pretty sure I recall reading about that somewhere or other.

You certainly need it when you're on chemo, like my old dad is. He's been told to eat shedloads of red meat...and he's been only too happy to oblige, especially when it comes to liver and bacon. http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/images/sm ... e/huge.gif

[Skep tickle]

Hope that all makes sense.

I'm all in favour of Fe supplements for the baboollies in the form of administration of an iron railing to the fecking teeth from time-to-time.

(note: violent imagery used for humorous purposes only...)

Now, now. That would serve as a autologous source of calcium, as any swallowed teeth dissolved in stomach acid, but wouldn't provide much if any iron. (Iron is absorbed as Fe3+, not as Fe.)

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Oh, so we're discussing heavy metal now?

[Tristan]

Hope that all makes sense.

I'm all in favour of Fe supplements for the baboollies in the form of administration of an iron railing to the fecking teeth from time-to-time.

(note: violent imagery used for humorous purposes only...)

Now, now. That would serve as a autologous source of calcium, as any swallowed teeth dissolved in stomach acid, but wouldn't provide much if any iron. (Iron is absorbed as Fe3+, not as Fe.)

True, but iron oxidizes to Fe3+ quite readily in the stomach. Fun fact: if you crush up some "fortified" breakfast cereals and run a strong magnet through the debris, it'll pull out the (very, very fine) iron filings they add as the iron supplement.

[acathode]

Do they count fish amongst the animals?

Who knows? You need a small dictionary to keep track of all the various kinds of vegetarian and vegan diets... but I guess quite a few don't, these days the arguments for a vegetarian diet seem to mostly focus on the environmental aspects and not so much on the "meat is murder!", and fish are in general better than cows and pigs in that regard, so iirc quite a few "vegetarians" eat fish, sometimes even chicken. I only personally know a few vegetarians though, and they are all going for strictly no animals, no fish, no eggs, .

Also, none of them have the whole smug thing going on, but I've meet their friends, and some of them def. had it going... but who cares? I can stay away from those people if I need to, I feel more sorry for my friends, or at least one of them who is a relative, who is in the opposite end, always getting a few (mostly friendly) gibes during family gatherings and such.

I'm guessing though, if someone fished their fish themselves, and *gasp* killed it themselves, that'd be another thing... For some reason, the Swedish mentality on these things is that it's completely fine to go to the supermarket and buy a nice slab of red meat, but if you're a hunter, and actually kill the animal yourself, you're a very evil guy, who enjoy murdering cute animals...

AndrewV69: As far as I've seen, there's not that much hate going on for the "import wife" things, and there aren't any campaigns to stop it what I know of. There were some tries from ROKS a few years ago, but nothing much is really happening. As it currently is, the whole "import wife" thing is something that only the "losers" do. Due to urbanization, women (and smarter men) are moving away from the rural areas to work or study at universities, left behind are the not-very-successful males, and it is mainly those that might get a "post-order wife".
Therefore, I personally do not think very much is likely to happen, these import women aren't a threat to the urban middle-class women, and therefore they wont care that much. At least as long as the society in general continue to look down on, pity, and snicker at the losers who have to cannot get a "real" wife. If that changed, it might become socially acceptable for THEIR husbands to dump them for a 25yo thai wife that will not only have sex, but also happily cook and clean, then I suspect that we quickly would see articles about the horrible wife slave-trade and so on.
(Do note, I'm not that fond of the import wife thing personally, the whole thing can very much be seen as the rich ruthlessly exploiting the poor. On the other hand, you can also see if from the POV where both the man and the women get a significantly better life out of the marriage. It's one of those gray areas again, and I'm not sure what I actually think yet...)

The main thing currently is again "men's violence against women", and to some degree, the increased rape statistics. Though the rape statistics are a touchy subject, since the question is already very much owned by the anti-immigrant, anti-islamic "racist" party, who have for years shouted "the Muslims have brought a rape epidemic, they come here and rape our Swedish wifes and daughters!".

One quick point about ROKS though, their reputation is also rather low among the general population, after the documentary "the gender war" (Könskriget, part 1, part 2), where they came across as a men hating, bat shit crazy organization with leaders that believed, among other things, that a satanist cult of powerful and wealthy men performed sexual, ritual sacrifice of small children, despite no real evidence whatsoever having been found for ~20 years.

Also, on an ending note, to be fair, I have to say that I saw quite a few reactions from many feminists to the "carnocentrism" article that where in the lines of "Sigh... shit like this is what turns people into antifeminists". I have to say, there are quite a few number of reasonable and sane feminists here, who've gotten good things to happen, not only for women, but for men to (for example, full support for paid paternity leave), who you can have a reasonable discussion with, without getting the "OMG MISOGYNIST!" thrown in your face.

It's just that the crazy feminists unfortunately are the ones that have the best access and closest ties to politicans, media and academia...

[Dick Strawkins]

Hope that all makes sense.

I'm all in favour of Fe supplements for the baboollies in the form of administration of an iron railing to the fecking teeth from time-to-time.

(note: violent imagery used for humorous purposes only...)

Now, now. That would serve as a autologous source of calcium, as any swallowed teeth dissolved in stomach acid, but wouldn't provide much if any iron. (Iron is absorbed as Fe3+, not as Fe.)

As far as I can remember one of the reasons you need vitamin C in your diet is that it aids the absorbtion of iron.
A quick check on pubmed suggests:

The reasons for its action are twofold: (1) the prevention of the formation of insoluble and unabsorbable iron compounds and (2) the reduction of ferric to ferrous iron, which seems to be a requirement for the uptake of iron into the mucosal cells.

The slymepit is now, officially, a science blog.
:)

[mikelf]

I won't bother answering this there, but here instead (which they read anyways), where there's no moderating like most ftblogs (I have no idea what Ed's like in his comment sections).

I've read Dispatches since back even before PZ called Ed “that sad panjandrum of the self-satisfied mean, medium, middle, moderate, and mediocre.” I do not recall any comment moderation. Of course, Ed's commenters tended to be of a rather higher quality than PZs with few crossovers (Aquaria being one.) My reading of Dispatches has dropped off to practically nothing since FTB started up, so it may have changed.

I used to think that maybe he wasn't as radfem/fanatical as PZ et al, but since moving to ftb, he's shown that he's drunk the ideological koolaid of western radfeminism in a couple of articles since the move. Also, his blog requires registering, and that also put me off, but it is possible that he'd have let me post what I posted here. I don't know. I guess it's possible that he doesn't follow the party line in that regards. Shrodinger's comment deleter/blocker. :lol:

Actually, I wonder if he has. He has always leaned libertarian and, while he has always advocated for equal rights, he never seemed to give much quarter to the "poor, poor, pitiful me" types. Indeed, for the most part, he has seemed to steer clear of the whole drama; only wading in when his hand was forced.

My guess has always been that he sunk his own money into starting FTB. And, rather than take PZ on as an equity partner, Ed cut him a preferential deal as the headline content provider. So, now he has to tacitly support the band of loudmouths on the network because it is his main source of income/recouping his investment. This is all speculation on my part, to be sure.

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

After over ten years of not eating red meat, I got seriously ill. Women need to eat red meat, not men.

Sorry, overload of metaness. We have reached a point in our discourse where I cannot discern sarcasm from humor from idiocy from anything.

Was this a gag? The second sentence has two meanings, one of which is stupid. The first is either hilarious or stupid. Oh Abbie, forgive me for I have become like them: do I go full Nerd of Redhead on you, or do I LOL?

[Skep tickle]

...Fun fact: if you crush up some "fortified" breakfast cereals and run a strong magnet through the debris, it'll pull out the (very, very fine) iron filings they add as the iron supplement.

Very interesting. I'll try that sometime.

The slymepit is now, officially, a science blog.
:)

Sorry :oops:

[Dick Strawkins]

Ed Brayton said:

Second, even if it were true that PZ had found some way to get more ads into his RSS feed, it would do nothing whatsoever to earn him any more money. The ad revenue for this site is divided up solely on the basis of total pageviews, not by how many clickthroughs a given blog gets. The revenue from the RSS feed ads just comes to me in one lump sum; I don’t even know which blog gets more clickthroughs, nor do I care. So even if PZ had discovered some mystical power, it would do him no good here. Another dark conspiracy shot to hell.

Does that make sense?

When I read that paragraph I interpret it to mean that the money coming in to FTB is divided up based on the number of pageviews each blogger gets.
Now considering that PZ is, by far, the most widely read blogger on FTB, it would seem that ANY increase in the ad revenues of FTB will benefit him more than any other blogger there.

PZ has said implied the same himself

All revenue from ads at FtB, without regard to their source, is put into a common pool and shared out to all blogs on the basis of their page views. If I were somehow gaming the system to bring in extra ad money, it would go into the pool and benefit everyone blogging here.

So if the RSS ads bring in an extra throusand dollars then PZ gets, say, 700 dollars and the other 33 bloggers share the remaining 300 dollars between them.

That sounds fair, doesn't it? :whistle:

Social justice in action.

[windy]

Reminds me of an article I read in the biggest Swedish morning paper just a few months ago. It's in Swedish, so I cba to translate the whole thing, just going to do the beginning, which is more than enough of a "what planet do you live on?" moment:

Therefore real men eat meat

Ah, Swedish newspapers, always a reliable source of wtf moments. And of course any criticism or ridicule by the proles can be dismissed as "net hate". (The author of this piece -not the same as the above DN article- has previously titled herself a 'bloodroaring ultra ninja-feminist', but one would assume ninja-feminists to be made of sterner stuff and not suffer mental breakdown just because someone wrote a blog article critizing their arguments about FGM, and illustrated it with pictures of women's genitalia.)

[TheMan]

Ed Brayton said:

Second, even if it were true that PZ had found some way to get more ads into his RSS feed, it would do nothing whatsoever to earn him any more money. The ad revenue for this site is divided up solely on the basis of total pageviews, not by how many clickthroughs a given blog gets. The revenue from the RSS feed ads just comes to me in one lump sum; I don’t even know which blog gets more clickthroughs, nor do I care. So even if PZ had discovered some mystical power, it would do him no good here. Another dark conspiracy shot to hell.

Does that make sense?

When I read that paragraph I interpret it to mean that the money coming in to FTB is divided up based on the number of pageviews each blogger gets.
Now considering that PZ is, by far, the most widely read blogger on FTB, it would seem that ANY increase in the ad revenues of FTB will benefit him more than any other blogger there.

PZ has said implied the same himself

All revenue from ads at FtB, without regard to their source, is put into a common pool and shared out to all blogs on the basis of their page views. If I were somehow gaming the system to bring in extra ad money, it would go into the pool and benefit everyone blogging here.

So if the RSS ads bring in an extra throusand dollars then PZ gets, say, 700 dollars and the other 33 bloggers share the remaining 300 dollars between them.

That sounds fair, doesn't it? :whistle:

Social justice in action.

That's how I read it too...of more concern I reckon is that in order to increase page views (and therefore increase potentian click throughs) the writing starts to head towards sensationalism style tabloid stuff just to keep momentum.

[mikelf]

Ed Brayton said:

Second, even if it were true that PZ had found some way to get more ads into his RSS feed, it would do nothing whatsoever to earn him any more money. The ad revenue for this site is divided up solely on the basis of total pageviews, not by how many clickthroughs a given blog gets. The revenue from the RSS feed ads just comes to me in one lump sum; I don’t even know which blog gets more clickthroughs, nor do I care. So even if PZ had discovered some mystical power, it would do him no good here. Another dark conspiracy shot to hell.

Does that make sense?

When I read that paragraph I interpret it to mean that the money coming in to FTB is divided up based on the number of pageviews each blogger gets.
Now considering that PZ is, by far, the most widely read blogger on FTB, it would seem that ANY increase in the ad revenues of FTB will benefit him more than any other blogger there.

It depends. I would assume PZ gets the majority of the page views over there. I would also assume that he is the main driver behind any increase in ad revenues (which is presumably driven, at least in part, by the RSS feed.) If the RSS feed (and associated revenue) increase at a faster rate than PZ's pageviews, then his income would be increasing at a slower rate than the overall networks revenue. If this is true, PZ is (to an extent) subsidizing the other FTB bloggers. Of course, I work in oil and gas and have no understanding of internet business models, so I could be completely off base.

[Saint N.]

Funny tweet and so true,

But if just Matt Dillahunty can do "deep damage" & cause these emotional reactions, they dont have the skin for social justice

[JAB]

My guess has always been that he sunk his own money into starting FTB. And, rather than take PZ on as an equity partner, Ed cut him a preferential deal as the headline content provider. So, now he has to tacitly support the band of loudmouths on the network because it is his main source of income/recouping his investment. This is all speculation on my part, to be sure.

That was my opinion for a while. I felt a bit sorry for Ed that he had got saddled with this mess. Then I saw his comment writing off Coffee Loving Skeptic on Watson's blog while knowing nothing but Watson's version of the events. And then the lines Tfoot quoted from him from the backchannel re ad revenue. My new opinion of him is that the personna he cultivates on his blog is not the real him. He seems far more petty and mean spiritted.

[welch]

I have been making the point that you don't care that groups of women will see it as misogynistic and justify that with anecdotal evidence as Spence admits to. Their offence at being demeaned (In their minds) is not of concern to you.

Firstly: YOU first made the claim that cunt was considered misogynistic in the UK. YOU provided exactly ZERO evidence to support this assertion. Scientific data is better than anecdotal evidence is better than zero evidence. So our anecdotal evidence still trumps your zero evidence. Get it? When you BRING SOME EVIDENCE TO THE TABLE we can continue this conversation in a meaningful way.

We're not looking for individuals in the UK who consider it misogynistic, either. We know Ophelia does. We don't care. You claimed you'd lose your job for using it. I argued the only places you'd get fired for "cunt" are the same situations where you'd get fired for "fucking wanker" (which is gender neutral). You provided ZERO evidence of any kind of widespread view that "cunt" was viewed misogynistic in the UK.

All you've done is distort people's arguments, build straw men and failed to provide any actual evidence to back up your uninformed opinion. Oh, yeah, and your retarded "you haven't used insult X, you're inconsistent!". Yes, I don't think anyone has used the insult "carbuncle" yet, therefore the slymepitters are inconsistent. Fucking hell you are a moron.

And if you complain about the use of "cunt", because it offends a few people, then we may as well complain about atheists who blaspheme (they are offending people!!!). So where is your campaign against blasphemy, oolon?

The "you don't call people nigger, so you're hypocritical about cunt" is mind-bogglingly stupid. I don't call people "cars" either, and I pretty much never call them "peanut butter". People make choices about words all the time, for a wide range of reasons. That doesn't make them hypocritical or cowardly, any more than an atheist is hypocritical for not urinating on the Qu'ran in a mosque during ramadan.

[CommanderTuvok]

Breaking news...

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/ ... 978377.jpg

Just kidding, of course!

[bhoytony]

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/8697 ... eae2f3.png