The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

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VickyCaramel
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The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#1

Post by VickyCaramel » Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:30 pm

Thankfully, the alt-right, the White Nationalists, White Supremacists and Neo-Nazis really like to write reams about what pisses them off.
This morning I was reading through a rather far right thread on 4chan and I noticed something of a pattern. In fact it had kind of registered with me before so I decided to go looking on the other chans, reddit and anywhere else where I could find the Alt-Right talking about what caused their "red-pill" moment. In fact you can find threads talking about that specific subject, and if you dig deeper you can see that specific events (rather than ideology) drive them. It's in their arguments, examples and analogies.

It turns out that what makes people join the alt-right are criminal events and the way they are portrayed in the media.... with a slight exception.

These events fall into 4 categories including the exception.

1. People who lived in places where crime is committed against whites by minorities. They witnessed it first hand, were victims of it or know victims of it. This category is the exception because it need not involve the media. But we can assume that the media largely ignore it which is the problem.

2. High profile crime incidents where the media portrays it as racist, portraying a black victim and a racist white perpetrator.

3. Crimes which are or should be high profile where it is a black on white crime which the media plays down or ignores.

4. Riots, protests and general civil disobedience where there are obvious racial aspects or contrasts which are ignored, with specific incidents played down or memory holed by the media.

If were going to get scientific about this, it could be the case that when people start talking about crimes, especially if they are ranting about specific crimes, people only join in the conversation talking about similar. However, you don't seem to find people saying they became Neo-Nazi's after just stumbling across Mein Kampf or because they were convinced while attending a lecture by Charles Murray. What you do find is them talking about these kinds of crimes an awful lot, even hypothetically.

Some of those identifying as on the far right are older and have been there a very long time and so they bring up older crimes such as the New York Subway Vigilante shootings, which falls into the second category.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_New_ ... y_shooting

More recent examples include the shooting of Trayvon Martin and the shooting of Michael Brown (plus the aftermath in Ferguson which falls into category four).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trial_of_George_Zimmerman
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferguson_unrest

Examples of the third category are the murders of Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom, the murders of Jourdan Bobbish and Jacob Kudla and the Chicago torture incident.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murders_o ... her_Newsom
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murders_o ... acob_Kudla
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Chic ... e_incident

It should be noted that many of the crimes they talk about in the third category are marked out by their exceptional brutality, cruelty and futility.

I have used Wikipedia as references for consistency so you can see for yourself how each of these cases are documented. The subject of racial controversy is generally kept to a minimum or omitted.

For the fourth category, I am sure I don't need to give examples of riots going back to the 1990s where blacks in particular have destroyed their own neighbourhoods. But I will mention the recent flooding in Texas where there was a contrast between the cooperation by whites and the looting by blacks.

I looked into many of these crime incidents and I have to say that the alt right are largely right. There is no doubt that the media will happy jump on a story when a black person is killed and attribute it to racism. At the same time they will play down any racial aspect to a black-on-white crime.
The extent of the dishonesty is astonishing. It isn't just lies by omission, they will use photographs of thugs when they were children, they will lighten skin colour on photographs, they will label hispanics as whites or coloured depending on their agenda.
And if they find that a story is being used to point out racial issues, they will alter it or memory-hole it completely.

In short, the alt-right have a point about all this stuff which is rather worrying because it's powerful stuff. There is a potent combination here, in that you have injustice, which usually, really is a genuine injustice*. This is combined with the (((media, politicians, pundits, public figures and celebrities))) are lying about it and covering it up. Leaving aside the jewish conspiracies... this really is a conspiracy of sorts.

We know that one of the reasons that conspiracy theories are so addictive is that they are perceived as forbidden or sacred knowledge, which acts as the scarcity principle of persuasion. The fact that they are largely accurate in their accusations means they are not going to let this go until they think everybody knows what they know.

I am sure I don't need to lay out the psychological effects of injustice with a side order of disgust and tribalism. Unlike the far left there is something here to genuinely be outraged and offended about.

The bottom line here is that this is not a problem with the alt-Right, this is exactly how we expect people to behave, it is human nature. There is nothing to fix about the alt-Right in this regard. Fixing the problem has to start with fixing the media even though this will shine a light on another problem. As is said of xenophobia, it can't be a phobia if your fear is reasonable.

A number of people have recently suggested people are sure to drift to the right when the media keeps blaming white people for all the world's ills, but thats just gravy for these people. As are the crime statistics about blacks and crime, blacks on welfare or issues like the IQ bell curve. It is not Charles Murray who is to blame, it is the MSM.

As a side note, while the MSM are saying, "look away, nothing to see here" in one instance and blaming whites for racism the next, Nobody except Tommy Sotomayor is trying to shame the black community into getting their shit together. Even his ilk are doing little to address the racism of blacks. The craziest thing of all is that while the MSM is desperately avoiding the subject of black crime, they themselves are uploading videos of it to WorldStarHipHop!

As things stand, the only way I can see the situation changing is an attempt at more censorship of the Alt-Right and alternative news sources which tell us what's really going on. I really can't see the MSM doing a U-turn on this and so people will continue to be red-pilled and despite us saying that the alt-right is tiny minority of the population, we know politics doesn't work quite that way. Although only a tiny proportion of people will ever sign up to Richard Spencer's ethno state and National Socialist solutions, millions more will find themselves agreeing with him over the problems.

A more immediate concern is that the mix of injustice and suppression of the information is the perfect recipe for violence. Although it is with fairly good reason, if anyone is oppressed in the US, it is the Nazis.

One final observation is that despite of huge amounts of racism coming from Europeans in various places on the interwebs, when I actually look at the spectrum from alt-Right to Neo-Nazi, they are talking about US crime and African Americans. Barely a word is spoken about Islam, and yet we are seeing the same things over here with the media and authorities suppressing news about Muslim crimes. On both sides of the pond they are also suppressing news of the violence of the far left. Make of this what you will.

I invite you all to keep one eye on the alt-Right and the media and test my observations.



* The injustice isn't in the sentencing. Whites who lawfully shoot blacks may get dragged through the courts but they usually get off. Blacks who rape, torture and murder whites usually get the death penalty or several life sentences. The injustice is in the media narrative that whites are bad guys while blacks are poor victims. However, while the injustice is against white reputation, it carries the emotion of the crimes and once they are thinking racially, a crime against one is a crime against all.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#2

Post by John D » Sun Nov 26, 2017 8:20 pm

Two other blacks calling for black people to change are Larry Elder and Thomas Sowal. Both are worth a listen

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#3

Post by jet_lagg » Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:59 am

VickyCaramel wrote:
Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:30 pm
Nobody except Tommy Sotomayor is trying to shame the black community into getting their shit together.
I'm mostly on board, but this is demonstrably false. There's a certain massively popular Chris Rock sketch that comes to mind (please do not take that as an invitation Steersman). The sad fact is anyone attempting this will be trageted by my own political tribe because the conventional wisdom is all problems in the black community would vanish if white people could just stop being so racist.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#4

Post by VickyCaramel » Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:12 am

jet_lagg wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:59 am
VickyCaramel wrote:
Sun Nov 26, 2017 6:30 pm
Nobody except Tommy Sotomayor is trying to shame the black community into getting their shit together.
I'm mostly on board, but this is demonstrably false. There's a certain massively popular Chris Rock sketch that comes to mind (please do not take that as an invitation Steersman). The sad fact is anyone attempting this will be trageted by my own political tribe because the conventional wisdom is all problems in the black community would vanish if white people could just stop being so racist.
The key word in that sentence is "shame". For millennium shame has had a vital role in social control, people cared about their reputation and this moderated their behaviour. It didn't stop their crime but at the very least they would try and maintain an illusion of decency.

Larry Elder and Thomas Sowell are academics who throw a bit of shade at the black community because that is the nature of the beast, but they generally speak on the subject in reserved language, they certainly don't set out to shame and humiliate in the way Tommy Sotomayor does.

As far as I can tell Chris Rock had retreated from his famous sketch... he hasn't retracted it but he hasn't pushed it. And on the rare occasions I have seen him in recent years he has actually been pushing a narrative more in line with the thinking of BLM. Maybe he is still on TV a lot in the US, but I am not seeing him as a major player in the culture wars which is largely being fought online.

I know their are others. Candice Owens has made a few comments, so have others, but from what I have seen their line is. "I have no need to fear, hate, or blame white people" and not so much, "Black culture is what I fear, blame and hate".

...but all of this is really a side issue. Black people really need to sort out the black people problem in the US.

Having said that, last week I saw a black woman have her daughter take a shit roadside in the high street. The kid was about 7-8, she pulled over her Chelsea Tractor, she pushed the kid out of the back door, where she squatted in the road during Thursday rush-hour while the traffic swerved around her. There are at least a dozen pubs, restaurants, cafes she could have gone to, not to mention various backstreet car parks and alleyways. Some people obviously can't learn how to be civilized just by observation.
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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#5

Post by jet_lagg » Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:58 am

From the wiki:
Cos some people that were racist thought they had license to say nigger. So, I'm done with that routine.
See, this is why we can't have nice things.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#6

Post by VickyCaramel » Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:09 am

jet_lagg wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:58 am
From the wiki:
Cos some people that were racist thought they had license to say nigger. So, I'm done with that routine.
See, this is why we can't have nice things.
His description of their behaviour should be far more insulting that the label.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#7

Post by Lsuoma » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:56 am

VickyCaramel wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:12 am
Having said that, last week I saw a black woman have her daughter take a shit roadside in the high street. The kid was about 7-8, she pulled over her Chelsea Tractor, she pushed the kid out of the back door, where she squatted in the road during Thursday rush-hour while the traffic swerved around her. There are at least a dozen pubs, restaurants, cafes she could have gone to, not to mention various backstreet car parks and alleyways. Some people obviously can't learn how to be civilized just by observation.
My mum used to work in a luxury block of flats in Kensington (in the '80s the price for the flats was around UKL3-5MM, and a couple of time she saw Iranians who lived in the block take a shit in the stairwell.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#8

Post by VickyCaramel » Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:33 pm

Lsuoma wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:56 am
VickyCaramel wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:12 am
Having said that, last week I saw a black woman have her daughter take a shit roadside in the high street. The kid was about 7-8, she pulled over her Chelsea Tractor, she pushed the kid out of the back door, where she squatted in the road during Thursday rush-hour while the traffic swerved around her. There are at least a dozen pubs, restaurants, cafes she could have gone to, not to mention various backstreet car parks and alleyways. Some people obviously can't learn how to be civilized just by observation.
My mum used to work in a luxury block of flats in Kensington (in the '80s the price for the flats was around UKL3-5MM, and a couple of time she saw Iranians who lived in the block take a shit in the stairwell.
The British always prefered the word "wog" over "nigger".
"Nigger" is specifically aimed at blacks, while "wog" is anyone that isn't one of us.

...And when I say "one of us", I mean anyone who isn't a paid up member of the Conservative Party. Savages.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#9

Post by Lsuoma » Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:56 pm


VickyCaramel
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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#10

Post by VickyCaramel » Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:29 pm

The Colonel doesn't quite have the wit of Brigadier Enoch Powell.

(No I can't see the video, I used magic to get the URL, so keep working on it).

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#11

Post by VickyCaramel » Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:31 pm

Hmmm, Major Gowen wasn't a colonel. My mistake.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#12

Post by Steersman » Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:43 pm

John D wrote:
Sun Nov 26, 2017 8:20 pm
Two other blacks calling for black people to change are Larry Elder and Thomas Sowal. Both are worth a listen
I see that Denzel Washington has weighed-in from the same perspective:



And since someone here extended the invitation - or at least broached the subject ... ;-) - some elaboration on the theme, including my comment at Huff Post which - surprise, suprise - didn't live long:





But what's kind of depressing is that people like Grossman & Coates are more or less talking in an echo-chamber, showing no willingness to address different perspectives, or even an awareness that different ones exist and that might hold more water than theirs.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#13

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:43 pm

Both 'Tree of Logic' (a self-identified black conservative woman) and 'Atheism is Unstoppable' (aka Devon Tracey - more of a left-wing provocateur and out-right shit-stirrer) in the You-Tube world regularly weigh in on the subject of race & crime stats.

Sam Harris has done at least a couple of podcasts / interviews on race - including with Charles Murray his-own-damn-self.

The Alt-Right take things a step farther than Race-RealismTM - usually advocating for white separatism or an ethno-state - and some go even further than that. I've not followed too closely but I think this was the cause of the Alt-Lite vs Alt-Right divide.

For that reason, as well as the unresolved Jewish Question, and most likely other things too - I don't think I'll be signing up any time soon.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#14

Post by jet_lagg » Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:24 am

I've followed it more closely than most, and that's what I saw as well. For every 9 self-described alt-righters who get offended when the media reports they want to forcefully expel jews and other minorities there's 1 who nods and says it's true, that anyone who disagrees is an alt-lite civic nationalist and needs to GTFO.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#15

Post by VickyCaramel » Tue Nov 28, 2017 6:24 pm

MarcusAu wrote:
Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:43 pm
The Alt-Right take things a step farther than Race-RealismTM - usually advocating for white separatism or an ethno-state - and some go even further than that. I've not followed too closely but I think this was the cause of the Alt-Lite vs Alt-Right divide.
What I am getting at in the OP, is that crime/media is the Alt-Right's Palestine.

For example, for every Jihadi who has collected every grievance from the crusades to the mini skirt, there is a pyramid below them. Just beneath are people willing to actively support the Jihad but maybe not be a suicide bomber, at the bottom are a whole load of people, thousands of them, that support Jihad in principle.
You can build the same kind of pyramid with the IRA or Basque separatists. No doubt you could also do it with Antifa or Revolutionary communists.
One of the features of this pyramid is that the people at the pinnacle are grievance collectors and know the history and ideology, which they repeat and self-reinforce. As you go down the pyramid, the people share less values and less grievances. Eventually you start getting into people who share none of the values, are against ideologies but may still share one or two of the grievances. And as I said in the OP, usually this will be some great injustice like an occupation. Thus Palestine is an issue which resonates will all muslims. With the Right it is the media misrepresenting crime.

Here is the important thing... when you get to see some group like ISIS, IRA Antifa or people marching behind Richard Spencer, you are only seeing the tip of the iceberg. There are going to be at least thousands more that are supportive or sympathise to a large degree.

I am not suggesting these large numbers will ever turn into terrorists, they will probably never do much more than march in the streets. But I would suggest that they can turn those numbers into political power.

We can see hundreds marching for Antifa in the US, thousands marching for them in Europe. There will huge numbers of people behind them that have some sympathy, not enough to get out and start smashing up a starbucks, but enough to vote the far left into some degree of power, ie Jeremy Corbyn.

If they stopped banging on about race realism and white ethno states and just played up this core grievance, they have a very effective recruiting tool. And it isn't something any of us can disagree with. In the case of Antifa, you can argue that we all have a much higher standard of life than at any time in human history, but you can't argue that the media isn't covering up the facts about race and crime.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#16

Post by rayshul » Fri Dec 01, 2017 12:55 pm

I really enjoyed your post - you should put it on Medium or something like that. (I want to share it obvs).

I don't have much of a problem with the alt-right because even in NZ I encounter active anti-white racism and bias every bloody day. There's a point where it's just fucking intolerable.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#17

Post by clownshoe » Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:29 pm

jet_lagg wrote: I've followed it more closely than most, and that's what I saw as well. For every 9 self-described alt-righters who get offended when the media reports they want to forcefully expel jews and other minorities there's 1 who nods and says it's true, that anyone who disagrees is an alt-lite civic nationalist and needs to GTFO.
How many of the 1 in 10 are taking the piss though?
The alt-right are such an amorphous blob, and being an anti-edgelord edgelord is part of the deal.

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Re: The alt-right doesn't need fixing.

#18

Post by jet_lagg » Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:45 pm

It's my nature to assume everyone is joking all the time and they have me completely convinced they're serious with regards to forced segregation. Before it went dark I read a lot at Atlantic Centurion and had a good sense of when he was being ironic or not. It was safe to say he was ironic about favoring genocide, but very, very much not ironic about The Jewish Question. I'm paraphrasing, but he would take pains in a post to say "no, we are not civic nationalists, it's not about values, it's about blood." When Mike Enoch, host of The Daily Shoah podcast, was doxxed and revealed to be married to a Jew, this blogger wrote the first post I'd ever seen that didn't contain a single joke and talked about how they were going to move forward from this. The mood was straight out mournful in the comment section. These people will push again, and again, and again every stat they can find on racial IQ differences or how America could drop her violent crime levels down to European nations if you factor our the black population. Short of enacting the day of rope they couldn't be doing any more to signal this what they really believe.

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