Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

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bovarchist
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24661

Post by bovarchist »

Wow, that sleepingwytch. He sounds pretty disturbed to me.

JackSkeptic
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24662

Post by JackSkeptic »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
justinvacula wrote:Teresa MacBain to come on Brave Hero Radio - June 22

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/bravehero/ ... sa-macbain

Adding more names for future shows, too...if people are interested in being a guest, please consider PMing! Currently, apart from special events like #WIScfi reporting, we're broadcasting once per week and can't get everyone in [immediately] so it may be quite the queue - but I can keep names of those who wish to talk in my PMbox here. Thanks!
Last time I was a guest on a show, it was ReapSowRadio, and I think I was drunk enough that Reap decided not to archive/air the whole mess.

Still a taker?
He did. I know as I was on it :D

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24663

Post by windy »

BarnOwl wrote:
PZ Myers
24 May 2013 at 4:15 pm (UTC -5) Link to this comment
I don’t get it either. I was just reviewing my talk for tomorrow, and I’ve got a line in there where I say that science isn’t enough…and specifically bring up sociology as a fundamental discipline we need to solve the world’s problems.
:roll:
PZ doesn't consider sociology to be science? :think: Is this some American terminology thing where science is defined narrowly as the natural sciences? (I know sociologists don't always act the part, but it at least aspires to be a social science)

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24664

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Jack wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
justinvacula wrote:Teresa MacBain to come on Brave Hero Radio - June 22

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/bravehero/ ... sa-macbain

Adding more names for future shows, too...if people are interested in being a guest, please consider PMing! Currently, apart from special events like #WIScfi reporting, we're broadcasting once per week and can't get everyone in [immediately] so it may be quite the queue - but I can keep names of those who wish to talk in my PMbox here. Thanks!
Last time I was a guest on a show, it was ReapSowRadio, and I think I was drunk enough that Reap decided not to archive/air the whole mess.

Still a taker?
He did. I know as I was on it :D
Oh, yeah, quite right there Jack. I never saw any link, and somehow I feel it should stay that way... :whistle:

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24665

Post by JackSkeptic »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Jack wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
justinvacula wrote:Teresa MacBain to come on Brave Hero Radio - June 22

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/bravehero/ ... sa-macbain

Adding more names for future shows, too...if people are interested in being a guest, please consider PMing! Currently, apart from special events like #WIScfi reporting, we're broadcasting once per week and can't get everyone in [immediately] so it may be quite the queue - but I can keep names of those who wish to talk in my PMbox here. Thanks!
Last time I was a guest on a show, it was ReapSowRadio, and I think I was drunk enough that Reap decided not to archive/air the whole mess.

Still a taker?
He did. I know as I was on it :D
Oh, yeah, quite right there Jack. I never saw any link, and somehow I feel it should stay that way... :whistle:
Please note my discretion in not mentioning it until you did:) Actually , you were fine. You just kinda faded away.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24666

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Jack wrote:
Please note my discretion in not mentioning it until you did:) Actually , you were fine. You just kinda faded away.
I really was as pissed as pissed can be. It was, like, 3am or something? Maybe even later when we finished. If you have a link, I'll take it in PM. I like to make a fool of meself, but not so much advertising it. Much.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24667

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

If FB is not lying, happy birthday Steersman!

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24668

Post by JackSkeptic »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Jack wrote:
Please note my discretion in not mentioning it until you did:) Actually , you were fine. You just kinda faded away.
I really was as pissed as pissed can be. It was, like, 3am or something? Maybe even later when we finished. If you have a link, I'll take it in PM. I like to make a fool of meself, but not so much advertising it. Much.
You were just doing your Ozzie Osbourne impression. Really, you were OK. I'll send the link.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24669

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

Jack wrote:
Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Jack wrote:
Please note my discretion in not mentioning it until you did:) Actually , you were fine. You just kinda faded away.
I really was as pissed as pissed can be. It was, like, 3am or something? Maybe even later when we finished. If you have a link, I'll take it in PM. I like to make a fool of meself, but not so much advertising it. Much.
You were just doing your Ozzie Osbourne impression. Really, you were OK. I'll send the link.
Muchas thanksias!

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24670

Post by Aneris »

Jack wrote:
jjbinx007 wrote:So there quite a shitstorm going on in the comments:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... an-rights/
Interesting. The dissenters are not getting dogpiled as much as they could have expected. They are being robustly argued with some attacks thrown in. That's fine. It is also notable that the usual suspects are not there such as Josh Spokesgay who always turn any discussion toxic. From this tiny sample size is seems without the rabble rousers some conversation is possible. Also PMZ came down hard on comments wanting people to die. That is fine by me as that does cross the line. It is a shame that PMZ is so quick with the ban hammer. Nothing kills constructive discussion quicker than that.
Josh is there. But PZ moderates now, instead of sitting back and watching it wind up to the extremes. When he has to step in and ask his followers to not wish people to die by comment 22, they still have some way to go I think. Also, large parts were taken up by that POE that doubles as a troubled soul, thereby averted retaliation. They are now looking for the new target, and if the thread keeps going, will find one to hone in.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24671

Post by bovarchist »

Aneris wrote:
Jack wrote:
jjbinx007 wrote:So there quite a shitstorm going on in the comments:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... an-rights/
Interesting. The dissenters are not getting dogpiled as much as they could have expected. They are being robustly argued with some attacks thrown in. That's fine. It is also notable that the usual suspects are not there such as Josh Spokesgay who always turn any discussion toxic. From this tiny sample size is seems without the rabble rousers some conversation is possible. Also PMZ came down hard on comments wanting people to die. That is fine by me as that does cross the line. It is a shame that PMZ is so quick with the ban hammer. Nothing kills constructive discussion quicker than that.
Josh is there. But PZ moderates now, instead of sitting back and watching it wind up to the extremes. When he has to step in and ask his followers to not wish people to die by comment 22, they still have some way to go I think. Also, large parts were taken up by that POE that doubles as a troubled soul, thereby averted retaliation. They are now looking for the new target, and if the thread keeps going, will find one to hone in.
It hasn't escaped my notice that the only reason PZ moderated in that instance is because it made HIM feel uncomfortable. And that, only because he's actually fairly likely to die before Dawkins. So, lesson learned. When you attack others in ways that hit PZ a little too close to home, he will stand up and end that bullshit!

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24672

Post by Nim_Chimpsky »

This whole you can only be racist to minorities or sexist to females due to power dynamics seems very disingenuous. It seems a complete distortion of how the word racism is commonly used. Academic sociologists can't prescribe how certain word is to be used as the meaning of words in the vast majority of cases from use. The sociological definition completely removes the word racism from many of the contexts and situations were the word can be usefully used, engaging in a certain type of untenable linguistic essentialism. Dawkins was and is right to say racism can run both ways.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24673

Post by Dick Strawkins »

There's some delicious irony on show in that pharyngula thread.
154
Tony! The Virtual Queer Shoop

25 May 2013 at 4:22 am (UTC -5)

Andywatson:
Why, why, why can NONE of you ‘both sides are just as bad’ people EVER say what the feminists have said or done that is anywhere as bad as what the Slymepit has? You people always talk vaguely, unable or unwilling to get specific.
So here’s your chance: get specific or leave.

The slymepitters and people like them that have created the rift in the community have engaged in continuous harassment on Twitter (Ophelia Benson has a continuing series where she documents the harassment), the farewell post by Jen McCreight listed in detail the barrage she was under that drove her to take a hiatus. Rebecca Watson has spoken repeatedly about the barrage of vile, unbridled hatred she continues to get. Ophelia and PZ both had images of themselves photoshopped. Greta Christina has a continuing series about what these fuckholes have said and still say about here (stuff about how ugly she is or needs to die or get raped)
These are people who think its funny to joke about raping a Skepchick.
These are people who use gendered slurs as insults because they don’t care if they insult others—BASED ON THEIR GENDER.
These are people that invitite the Westboro Baptist Church to a Women in Secularism conference.
These are people who count among their allies a vacuous, callous, shitbag with ties to A Voice for Men–a women’s hate group.
These are people who create entire videos in YouTube for the sole purpose of calling women c*n*s.
These are people who, when Greta Christina was diagnosed with cancer, intially offered well wishes and a desire to assist her financially only to revoke said offer because people said mean things about them.
These are people who wrote vicious screeds against Greta Christina for asking for financial aid in the first place.
These are people who again treated Greta Christina like dirt because she bought shoes after her treatments.
These are people who think they get a say in what someone does with donated money.
These are people who create fake Twitter accounts in the name of FtB bloggers and say hateful things.
These are people who support Thunderf00t in his misogynistic ranting against anti-harassment policies.
I am sick of you people who act like both sides do it.
Everything I just listed can be found easily. I remember it all, as do many others.
WHAT IN THE EVER LOVING fuck has anyone: PZ, Greta, Ophelia, Jen, Stephanie, Rebecca, Surly Amy, any Pharyngula commenters or anyone on the feminist side ever done that compares to the laundry list of despicable, bottom feeder tactics of the Pitters?
And its going to take a long list of comparable deeds to match what they have done. So if all you can list is “someone told someone to die in a fire” you can stop right now (especially since the commenter who said that long ago apologized and has not said anything like that again AND one example up against the leaning tower of Pit Shit does not compare)

So, can you put up?
I’m not going to hold my breath.

So says Tony...

...in a thread where one of the commenters has posted a link to a screed calling for the murder of every man in the world - and all cis-gendered woman who opposes this genocide.
Your death awaits you men, calculated, seductive, inevitable, complete and utter annihilation, until you sleep forever, until you are nothing but a bad memory in the collective memory of humanity. Should it be the case that cisgendered women are inevitably reactionary, they too should be exterminated, such a situation would leave then only transwomen, agendered and third gendered people. Hopefully this is not the case, but if it would be the case, Red Queen 2nd option should be initiated by the concerned parties, to assume the genocidal task towards ciswomen if they are found to be inexorably reactionary and reflexive due to an innate need for men or an innate and unalterable support of patriarchial goals or the existence of men. This is not to be assumed to be the case, but if it is found to be the case, 2nd option should be enacted, and secret societies and secret associations, ciphers, codes, plans, etc, should be enacted to make 2nd option a reality.
But wouldn't that basically mean killing almost everyody in the world - 7 billlion people?

Obviously she's not getting a hell of a lot of support for this idea but it's interesting that she hasn't been banned.

It is also worth noting that Tony The Virtual Queer Shoop! (I'm still not convinced that he's a POE) uses the standard FTB tactic of associating any single problematic statement made by a member of the slymepit with every other member of the slymepit. Indeed he links actions of trolls opposed to the FTB crowd, to the slymepit.

Is it therefore fair that we now associate SleepingWytch's views with pharyngula?
It makes as much sense as the FTB tactic of linking all of us to any statement they detest, doesn't it?
:shifty:

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24674

Post by Gumby »

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote: TBH Franc can sometimes piss me off with his scorched earth stirring. Some of the writing on his blog is genius, though. He has an uncanny ability to distill things down to their essence with clarity. Guess you have to take the rough with the smooth.
I like Franc, but he's not the end-all to the end-all that he pretends to be.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24675

Post by Michael K Gray »

Gumby wrote:I like Franc, but he's not the end-all to the end-all that he pretends to be.
PZ Myers is proud to announce that the FTB school of mind-reading has acquired another A+ graduate.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24676

Post by rayshul »

It's okay when they advocate genocide, not okay when we use the word cunt. Only one is a bannable offense!

I don't think there's a better demonstration of how stupid this shit is.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24677

Post by Karmakin »

ReneeHendricks wrote:
Voryn wrote:
zenbabe wrote:
Bottom of the page http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/05/23/t ... -generous/
If it seems baffling to you that people are “into” harassment, I don’t know what to tell you. Why else would people harass? (Don’t say autism, for the love of god. People on the spectrum struggle to interpret social signals. Harassers, on the other hand, are masters at manipulating social rules and actual physical space to creep people out as much as they can get away with. It requires careful study of social signaling, not the opposite.) I got harassed on the sidewalk the other day, because that’s just part of the atmosphere of being female. I didn’t catch exactly what the guy said, because he muttered it, but what he wanted out of the situation couldn’t have been clearer. He had that sly smile, that glint in his eye that harassers get when they manage to capture their target’s attention and make them uncomfortable. It’s the feeling of power they have over you, the little jolt they get from putting a bitch in her place. Why people harass is not a mystery. It makes them feel good to exert power. This motivation is all over the Twitter rampage from the pro-harassment forces. They love drowning out useful tweets about real information with their anti-feminist garbage and ranting. It makes them feel good, like they have power. They can harass you and get under your skin and make you write blog posts about them, and then they feel powerful. It’s all of one cloth, and it’s not about unexamined privilege. It’s about being an asshole. We’re asking them to give up this jolt of feeling powerful they get from making other people sad or angry. No wonder they resent us.
This part was also amusing: "MAKE you write blog posts about them"
I read her sidewalk harassment a few times and sat here trying to visualize what was going on. The guy looked at her, smiling, and muttered something that MUST be harassment? The guy couldn't have taken a minor fancy to her and said "Hello" or "How are you?" Shit like that happens all the time here, a smile, nod, and a hello(which is sometimes inaudible) to a random stranger, never considered it harassment! You're getting desperate for victim points Marcotte... :snooty:
This kind of stuff just irks me. It's women like Marcotte that make it so men have no fucking clue what is acceptable when attempting to approach women. I'm surprised she doesn't have a rape whistle, taser, and pepper spray at the ready for each and every public outing.
I think you give her too much credit. It's not the actions that she thinks is harassing. It's the person itself. She's objecting to the existence of "creepy" people. If it was someone who she didn't find personally "creepy" she wouldn't have two problems with that behavior.

It's her own privilege and entitlement at play here.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24678

Post by BarnOwl »

bovarchist wrote: It hasn't escaped my notice that the only reason PZ moderated in that instance is because it made HIM feel uncomfortable. And that, only because he's actually fairly likely to die before Dawkins. So, lesson learned. When you attack others in ways that hit PZ a little too close to home, he will stand up and end that bullshit!
Yes, his "heart condition," which, IIRC refers to coronary artery disease alleviated by stents. Surprising that more of his fans and friends don't get on his case about diet, exercise, and other lifestyle changes. Leisurely walks through cities that you jet around to for conferences just don't hack it for "exercise," I'm afraid.

The proponent of androcide apologizes (sort of):
sleepingwytch
25 May 2013 at 6:21 am (UTC -5) Link to this comment
The chandelier looks incredible, very pretty =~)

I’ve been going through anxiety attacks and dissociation in bed for the last six hours, so I’m about to goto sleep soon, hopefully. Sorry about earlier, I really struggle to be a good humanist.

I hope the conference is going well PZ, and that you enjoy it.
I guess that makes it all OK, right? :roll:

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24679

Post by Gumby »

Karmakin wrote: I think you give her too much credit. It's not the actions that she thinks is harassing. It's the person itself. She's objecting to the existence of "creepy" people. If it was someone who she didn't find personally "creepy" she wouldn't have two problems with that behavior.

It's her own privilege and entitlement at play here.
I think that also describes rather well a certain incident involving Rebecca Watson, an unknown male, and an Irish elevator (assuming that incident actually took place, which I have always doubted.) Actually, I've had a 'shop in mind about that very mindset you describe.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24680

Post by Jan Steen »


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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24681

Post by Aneris »

Dick Strawkins wrote:It is also worth noting that Tony The Virtual Queer Shoop! (I'm still not convinced that he's a POE) uses the standard FTB tactic of associating any single problematic statement made by a member of the slymepit with every other member of the slymepit. Indeed he links actions of trolls opposed to the FTB crowd, to the slymepit.

Is it therefore fair that we now associate SleepingWytch's views with pharyngula?
It makes as much sense as the FTB tactic of linking all of us to any statement they detest, doesn't it?
:shifty:
They do this all the time, even before I signed up here. Again, this comes back to where responsiblities lie:
  • We do not conspire on the board to do certain deplorable actions.
  • We do not work together and create depicable photoshops, or videos.
  • We do not help each other how to create material that angers, harasses etc. other people.
  • The twitterers they are complaining about have no connection to the slymepit. They are either different people, or use different nyms. Again, orchestration here does not take place. In fact, they could be FTB regulars just as well.
  • The satire and mockery we DO is out in the open, not edited or deleted and can be viewed. That means, our antgonists can't claim we had "cleaned up" one day their house of cards collapses.
I felt this should be told them somewhere, but I haven't found an opportunity to post it somewhere (or it was denied due to moderation policies).

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24682

Post by Gumby »

rayshul wrote:It's okay when they advocate genocide, not okay when we use the word cunt. Only one is a bannable offense!

I don't think there's a better demonstration of how stupid this shit is.
That's because the word "cunt" is much, much worse than genocide, didn't you know that?

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24683

Post by Gumby »

Aneris wrote:
Dick Strawkins wrote:It is also worth noting that Tony The Virtual Queer Shoop! (I'm still not convinced that he's a POE) uses the standard FTB tactic of associating any single problematic statement made by a member of the slymepit with every other member of the slymepit. Indeed he links actions of trolls opposed to the FTB crowd, to the slymepit.

Is it therefore fair that we now associate SleepingWytch's views with pharyngula?
It makes as much sense as the FTB tactic of linking all of us to any statement they detest, doesn't it?
:shifty:
They do this all the time, even before I signed up here. Again, this comes back to where responsiblities lie:
  • We do not conspire on the board to do certain deplorable actions.
  • We do not work together and create depicable photoshops, or videos.
  • We do not help each other how to create material that angers, harasses etc. other people.
  • The twitterers they are complaining about have no connection to the slymepit. They are either different people, or use different nyms. Again, orchestration here does not take place. In fact, they could be FTB regulars just as well.
  • The satire and mockery we DO is out in the open, not edited or deleted and can be viewed. That means, our antgonists can't claim we had "cleaned up" one day their house of cards collapses.
I felt this should be told them somewhere, but I haven't found an opportunity to post it somewhere (or it was denied due to moderation policies).
Do you really think pointing out these things to them will make any difference in their accusations? You can't reason unreasonable people out of an unreasonable position, or however the old saying goes. Besides, all this has more or less been explained to them before, at various times. Reality means nothing to them, only their war on us matters to them.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24684

Post by Gumby »

Yay, the piranhas are back! Good one Jan.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24685

Post by bovarchist »

Calling someone a cunt isn't "insulting them based on their gender." That's just something whiny cunts say.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24686

Post by Scented Nectar »

Gefan wrote:
Jack wrote: ...I tell you what Marcotte, today I had 3 women on separate occasions look at the bulge in my trousers...
Well, that's what you get for accepting an invitation to "coffee" at Scented Nectar's house.
I was hoping for a foursome, energized by my outrageously strong coffee, but my friends all arrived at different times ("separate occasions"). Ah well, some other time. :D

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24687

Post by Scented Nectar »

Jack wrote:
Gefan wrote:
Jack wrote: ...I tell you what Marcotte, today I had 3 women on separate occasions look at the bulge in my trousers...
Well, that's what you get for accepting an invitation to "coffee" at Scented Nectar's house.
Scented Nectar even had a lift fitted. She leaves nothing to chance.
True. I even went a bit overboard. The building I live in has THREE elevators! It only proves what a sexual predator I am. :twisted:

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24688

Post by Apples »

Some weirdo shows up to make the argument at A+ that atheism/theism are the same thing, buddhism, blah, blah, whatever, gets banned. No big deal.

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4779

But the standard snotty A+ moderator practice of spoiler-hiding people's posts and replacing them with moderator snark? Pick your poison -- Either they have profound contempt for readers and members, who are presumably too stupid and impressionable to be exposed to posts people like Submor and Ceepolk have deemed badthink, or -- more obviously the case -- they just can't resist the cheap thrill of the juvenile 'fixed that for ya' ego trip. Either way, what a fucking dump.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24689

Post by Percentage »

Am I the only one who felt a little weird about that Sleepingwytch thing? I mean she's clearly got problems and for the most part spent that thread apologizing... and if you read that pastebin shit, it's so absurd as to be almost funny.

I feel like, if there were ever time to cut someone a break, that would have been it. But she got piled on as if she was a slymepitter.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24690

Post by Jan Steen »

PZ Myers wrote:When they photoshop our faces onto porn, when they call us “manginas” and “cunts”, when they flood CFI conference streams with denigrating insults to the speakers, they are not making “free inquiry”, they are not using “free speech” in a “quest for truth” or to advance “human dignity”.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ?wpmp_tp=1

I may have asked this before, but who has ever photoshopped PZ Myers onto porn? This is an accusation that is regularly made, but I doubt any of the Slymepit photoshoppers has the required combination of a poor sense of humour, dubious ethics and above all a strong enough stomach to do such a thing.

As for "denigrating insults" (are there non-denigrating insults?), look who's talking. If PZ got a dollar for every time he used the word "asshole" he could quit scrubbing aquariums for a living.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24691

Post by Lsuoma »

Jan Steen wrote:
PZ Myers wrote:When they photoshop our faces onto porn, when they call us “manginas” and “cunts”, when they flood CFI conference streams with denigrating insults to the speakers, they are not making “free inquiry”, they are not using “free speech” in a “quest for truth” or to advance “human dignity”.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ?wpmp_tp=1

I may have asked this before, but who has ever photoshopped PZ Myers onto porn? This is an accusation that is regularly made, but I doubt any of the Slymepit photoshoppers has the required combination of a poor sense of humour, dubious ethics and above all a strong enough stomach to do such a thing.

As for "denigrating insults" (are there non-denigrating insults?), look who's talking. If PZ got a dollar for every time he used the word "asshole" he could quit scrubbing aquariums for a living.
A troll on one of the Nugnut threads linked to PeePee and Grag shopped onto gay porn. A Pitter (!) (me) pointed this out to NugNut and he edited it out.

BTW, how IS that dialogue going?

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24692

Post by bovarchist »

I just watched the Raising The Bar episode of South Park, and it made me think of FTB.

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24693

Post by Dick Strawkins »

Jan Steen wrote:
PZ Myers wrote:When they photoshop our faces onto porn, when they call us “manginas” and “cunts”, when they flood CFI conference streams with denigrating insults to the speakers, they are not making “free inquiry”, they are not using “free speech” in a “quest for truth” or to advance “human dignity”.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ?wpmp_tp=1

I may have asked this before, but who has ever photoshopped PZ Myers onto porn? This is an accusation that is regularly made, but I doubt any of the Slymepit photoshoppers has the required combination of a poor sense of humour, dubious ethics and above all a strong enough stomach to do such a thing.

As for "denigrating insults" (are there non-denigrating insults?), look who's talking. If PZ got a dollar for every time he used the word "asshole" he could quit scrubbing aquariums for a living.
The only porno photoshops were those posted to Nugents site by some anonymous asshole.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24694

Post by Gumby »

Lsuoma wrote: BTW, how IS that dialogue going?
http://cdn4.pix.avaxnews.com/avaxnews/f ... edium.jpeg

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24695

Post by Jan Steen »

Lsuoma wrote:
Jan Steen wrote:
PZ Myers wrote:When they photoshop our faces onto porn, when they call us “manginas” and “cunts”, when they flood CFI conference streams with denigrating insults to the speakers, they are not making “free inquiry”, they are not using “free speech” in a “quest for truth” or to advance “human dignity”.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ?wpmp_tp=1

I may have asked this before, but who has ever photoshopped PZ Myers onto porn? This is an accusation that is regularly made, but I doubt any of the Slymepit photoshoppers has the required combination of a poor sense of humour, dubious ethics and above all a strong enough stomach to do such a thing.

As for "denigrating insults" (are there non-denigrating insults?), look who's talking. If PZ got a dollar for every time he used the word "asshole" he could quit scrubbing aquariums for a living.
A troll on one of the Nugnut threads linked to PeePee and Grag shopped onto gay porn. A Pitter (!) (me) pointed this out to NugNut and he edited it out.

BTW, how IS that dialogue going?
So a Pitter pointed it out. Guilty by association. Now let's attack Peezus for promoting genocide.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24696

Post by Aneris »

Lsuoma wrote:BTW, how IS that dialogue going?
After a month of ... hiatus, it's starting up again.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24697

Post by Apples »

That 'Thugs in Cheap Suits' thread is a fucking gong show and a half. At first I thought the winner was Gregory Greenwood's hilarious lecture about how Lindsay has fallen victim to the Golden Mean fallacy:
Gregory Peenwood wrote:The ‘Golden Mean’ fallacy is a problem that afflicts many arms of society, especially the media. The view that it is always best to assume the middle ground between any two intellectual poles, no matter how great the gulf in understanding between the people expressing those two opposed opinions may be – not that people are allowed to hold whatever beliefs they choose, but that all ideas and ideologies have at the base level equal intellectual validity irrespective of little things like evidence, and that the ideal position lies somewhere in the middle between any pair of opposed viewpoints – is one of the most problematic attitutes in modern society. It creates space for unevidenced and socially harmful ideas to gain unjustified legtimacy.

If one side says “women are people too, and deserving of respect” and the other says “no they aren’t – women are one part sex toy, one part incubator, and all the wholly owned property of men”, then it should be obvious that these ideas are not equal, and that the ideal position does not lie in a middle ground that says women are mostly human, but aren’t equal to men. Attempting to deny the humanity of women flies is the face of our understanding and is monstrously socially toxic. There is no need to pretend that the two ideas must be treated as having the same intellectual weight, anymore than once must pretend that flat earth theories have equal weight with a modern understanding of the structure of the planet, and reflexively adopting the ‘middle ground’ in such a case makes no more sense than assuming that the earth must be dish-shaped because that form lies between a flat plane and a sphere.

Ron Lindsay may have lots of company when it comes to embracing the golden mean fallacy, but one would hope that a rationalist would know better, or at least might be able to recognise that fault in themselves when it is pointed out to them.
Thanks Gregory - When I first read Lindsay's speech I didn't realize he was legitimizing the idea that women are "one part sex toy, one part incubator, and all the wholly owned property of men,” but you've really opened my eyes.

But then Simpleflower/sleepingwytch trolled them and trolled them good. Getting Xanthe to defend her and provoking Azkyroth to tell Xanthe to "fuck right the hell off" was masterful, followed by the comical "I really want to change and be a good humanist, but being shunned and scorned at places like Pharyngula has made me a reluctant genocidal maniac." All in all, a spectacular smoking wreckage derail, certainly worthy of the infamous instigator of hugsgate.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... an-rights/
http://www.freezepage.com/1369488899BTJMUTSKZB

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24698

Post by Jan Steen »

Don't tell me that the rape and death threats emanating from the Slymepit are a fabrication too?

(Rhetorical question, no need to answer.)

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24699

Post by Tigzy »

Aneris wrote:
Jack wrote:
jjbinx007 wrote:So there quite a shitstorm going on in the comments:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... an-rights/
Interesting. The dissenters are not getting dogpiled as much as they could have expected. They are being robustly argued with some attacks thrown in. That's fine. It is also notable that the usual suspects are not there such as Josh Spokesgay who always turn any discussion toxic. From this tiny sample size is seems without the rabble rousers some conversation is possible. Also PMZ came down hard on comments wanting people to die. That is fine by me as that does cross the line. It is a shame that PMZ is so quick with the ban hammer. Nothing kills constructive discussion quicker than that.
Josh is there. But PZ moderates now, instead of sitting back and watching it wind up to the extremes. When he has to step in and ask his followers to not wish people to die by comment 22, they still have some way to go I think. Also, large parts were taken up by that POE that doubles as a troubled soul, thereby averted retaliation. They are now looking for the new target, and if the thread keeps going, will find one to hone in.
What Peez said:
PZ Myers

24 May 2013 at 12:14 pm (UTC -5)

Please do not start talking about age and the expectation of death. I wish everyone involved a long life — it’s all we atheists have, you know — and take no pleasure in picturing the loss of anyone.

I’m also a little sensitive to it. I have a heart condition and a family history of early death due to heart disease, so I expect the other side will have an opportunity to gloat over my funeral before anyone else’s.
What does he mean by 'start'? Rage-tears Josh has been at this sort of thing for ages. Don't think I've ever seen Peez call him on it:

http://i.imgur.com/NeqJD1c.png

http://i.imgur.com/7szgIY2.png

In fact, Josh isn't all that far removed from Simpleflower/Sleepingwych. Unlike the berk who seeketh hugs because she's genocidal, nasty ol Spokesgay has always gotten a pass on it; why Peez's sudden morality on the matter now, I wonder?

http://i.imgur.com/ZCjKa7g.png

Maybe its okay if you're only part-time genocidal? *shrugs*

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24700

Post by DW Adams »

Maybe all the graves are getting to him.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24701

Post by Lsuoma »

Gumby wrote:
Lsuoma wrote: BTW, how IS that dialogue going?
http://cdn4.pix.avaxnews.com/avaxnews/f ... edium.jpeg
My roflcopter went soi soi soi

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24702

Post by LMU »

Percentage wrote:Am I the only one who felt a little weird about that Sleepingwytch thing? I mean she's clearly got problems and for the most part spent that thread apologizing... and if you read that pastebin shit, it's so absurd as to be almost funny.

I feel like, if there were ever time to cut someone a break, that would have been it. But she got piled on as if she was a slymepitter.
Sleepingwytch is simpleflower (they signed the pastebin letter as such). Simpleflower was an A+ poster for a while, participated in some interesting conversations, and eventually left. Some time later, dudewheresmyhat posted here at the slymepit that they knew simpleflower personally, and said that simpleflower was a poe.

Kareem
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24703

Post by Kareem »

It's scary that so many of the FTB crowd think history will look down on them as ahead of their time. Logically, if the future is egalitarian, then the #killallmen and only minorities can be racist talk will seem silly in a world where race and sex doesn't matter.

Even as early as the 90's, an issue of Static Shock (co-created by the late Dwayne McDuffie) pointed out the flaw in the idea that minorities can't be racist by displaying a member of one minority attacking a members of another.

I'm all for social justice, but a lot of this theory is just their version of debating how many angels can dance of the head of a pin.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24704

Post by Jan Steen »

LMU wrote:
Percentage wrote:Am I the only one who felt a little weird about that Sleepingwytch thing? I mean she's clearly got problems and for the most part spent that thread apologizing... and if you read that pastebin shit, it's so absurd as to be almost funny.

I feel like, if there were ever time to cut someone a break, that would have been it. But she got piled on as if she was a slymepitter.
Sleepingwytch is simpleflower (they signed the pastebin letter as such). Simpleflower was an A+ poster for a while, participated in some interesting conversations, and eventually left. Some time later, dudewheresmyhat posted here at the slymepit that they knew simpleflower personally, and said that simpleflower was a poe.
Simpleflower posted as "Marianne" on the Slymepit last month:

viewtopic.php?p=85433#p85433

LMU
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24705

Post by LMU »

Jan Steen wrote:
Simpleflower posted as "Marianne" on the Slymepit last month:

viewtopic.php?p=85433#p85433
Thanks I'd forgotten! Also: Thank you for the pharyngulanhas!

bovarchist
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24706

Post by bovarchist »

Kareem wrote:It's scary that so many of the FTB crowd think history will look down on them as ahead of their time. Logically, if the future is egalitarian, then the #killallmen and only minorities can be racist talk will seem silly in a world where race and sex doesn't matter.

Even as early as the 90's, an issue of Static Shock (co-created by the late Dwayne McDuffie) pointed out the flaw in the idea that minorities can't be racist by displaying a member of one minority attacking a members of another.

I'm all for social justice, but a lot of this theory is just their version of debating how many angels can dance of the head of a pin.
History will look down on them as an embarrassingly blatant example of how left-wing idealogues can become repressive once they start devaluing Freeze Peach. It's demagoguery, nothing more.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24707

Post by Tigzy »

Sleepingwytch is currently quite active on the latest Pharyngula threads, and is quite busy dishing out some invective towards them. Have to admit, it's quite amusing to see how the presence of this loon is leaving the babs in quite a kerfuffle: on the one hand, she advocates exterminating half the human population (totes bad, even if it is the more privileged half), but she does have mental health issues - so it would, er, be totes ableist to come down too hard on her. Awkward.

Also, presuming Sleepingwytch is indeed Simpleflower, she's pretty inconsistent:
sleepingwytch

25 May 2013 at 6:53 am (UTC -5)
I guess in today’s privileged Western world, where the cruelty of middle-ages style torture is largely absent and smacking a kid is considered abuse (things I’m quite glad about), it’s very easy to find a decline in violence irrelevant. It’s not.
You’re really fucking sick, I hope the first time you viciously lay a hand on a child, your ass gets thrown in jail for child abuse.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-624627

Now contrast this with what Simpleflower said on the A+ forum:
I'm all for a society where kids (and adults too) who do that sort of thing get confronted by the state and have their heads kicked in ruthlessly and thrown in juvvie or jail if need be where they can whine about free speech in the dungeon with all the other assholes.
http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic ... =25#p38935

So yeah...it's either having a poorly thought-out stance, or Sleepingwytch/Simpleflower (again, presuming they're the same) reckons child abuse should only be reserved for those kids who deserve it.

Or maybe it's just down to being mental. Who knows.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24708

Post by Gumby »

Gumby wrote:
Karmakin wrote: I think you give her too much credit. It's not the actions that she thinks is harassing. It's the person itself. She's objecting to the existence of "creepy" people. If it was someone who she didn't find personally "creepy" she wouldn't have two problems with that behavior.

It's her own privilege and entitlement at play here.
I think that also describes rather well a certain incident involving Rebecca Watson, an unknown male, and an Irish elevator (assuming that incident actually took place, which I have always doubted.) Actually, I've had a 'shop in mind about that very mindset you describe.
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... f7c05b.png

Sulaco
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24709

Post by Sulaco »

Gumby wrote:
rayshul wrote:It's okay when they advocate genocide, not okay when we use the word cunt. Only one is a bannable offense!

I don't think there's a better demonstration of how stupid this shit is.
That's because the word "cunt" is much, much worse than genocide, didn't you know that?
Like the line in Apocalypse Now: "We teach them to drop fire on people, but won't them write the word fuck on their helmet."

AndrewV69
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24710

Post by AndrewV69 »

That is a pretty common trope in the Manosphere and is pretty much taken as a given. Christian bloggers such as Laura Grace Robinson and Dalrock mention it all the time. Not to mention Susan Walsh (Girl Game) and Chateau Heartiste (PUA).

Laura Grace Robinson: http://fullofgraceseasonedwithsalt.blogspot.ca
Dalrock: http://dalrock.wordpress.com
Susan Walsh: http://www.hookingupsmart.com
Heartiste: http://heartiste.wordpress.com

windy
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24711

Post by windy »

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote: TBH Franc can sometimes piss me off with his scorched earth stirring. Some of the writing on his blog is genius, though. He has an uncanny ability to distill things down to their essence with clarity. Guess you have to take the rough with the smooth.
Agreed. FTR I thought franc's most recent eruption went over the line- too close to the FTB-type, wishing death on people, "die in a fire" rhetoric for my taste :snooty:

agarybuseychristmas
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24712

Post by agarybuseychristmas »

So, anyone have some choice quotes for a dramatic reading? I'm bored. Feel free to suggest the accent etc., as well.

bovarchist
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24713

Post by bovarchist »

Who is this Sastra filling in for PZ? I only ask because WAY BACK IN OLDEN DAYS, I knew a Sastra who hung out in the #atheism channel of DALnet. It brings back memories; mIRC was the very first time I became aware of an online atheist community.

Percentage
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24714

Post by Percentage »

Dawkins just posted on Hazel's blog. This should be interesting.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24715

Post by Apples »

Percentage wrote:Dawkins just posted on Hazel's blog. This should be interesting.
Link?

AndrewV69
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24716

Post by AndrewV69 »

Ally Fogg has another article up:

In defence of freedom of speech
http://freethoughtblogs.com/hetpat/2013 ... mment-1284
So I don’t have much in the way of informed opinions about misogyny in video games, I’ll leave that to others. Nonetheless I couldn’t help but be sucked in by the debate surrounding Kickstarter Anita Sarkeesian, as good an illustration as we’ll ever need of the vitriol of the new gender wars. An intense storm of hatred was roused by her modest idea to crowd-fund research into sexism in the games industry. The many thousands of hostile comments posted on Sarkeesian’s YouTube video were of course heavily gendered and sexualised, but so too was some of the retaliation – notably Charlie Brooker’s description of the mob as “idiotic pebbledicks” who are terrified of women.
My comment (I enabled the links here)
http://freethoughtblogs.com/hetpat/2013 ... mment-1284
5
AndrewV69, Visiting MRA, Purveyor of Piffle & Woo

May 25, 2013 at 6:08 pm (UTC 0)

Reply

Your basic premise is wrong.

Anita Sarkeesian has an Encyclopedia Dramatica(1) entry, and that is a clear indication that she was targeted by 4chan(2) for the “lulz”.

It was also pretty clear there was overlap with “Gamer culture”. As a gamer myself I can tell you that insults are par for the course and are designed to rattle you so that your opponent can score and laugh at you. The more over the top the better.

One common argument is that Anita knew exactly what she was doing by not allowing comments elsewhere but only where any prospective backer could see them. And that is all there is to it. You have all been had. Except for Anita.

YMMV

1). http://encyclopediadramatica.se/Feminis ... Chan_Drama
2). http://boards.4chan.org/b/


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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24718

Post by Apples »

In the Google Hangout Vacula posted earlier Sara Mayhew talked about this exchange among Melody, Josh the Spokesgay, and a few others about Melody's accommodation-fail at WIS and Chris Hofstader's damning blog-post about it:



Mayhew pointed out that 1) Melody's first reaction is to say she hopes Chris will update his blog-post, saying that it is misleading ("a lot of things left out/inaccurate") and 2) that both Melody and Josh make it sound like Chris's complaints were somehow subtle or esoteric -- The experience got Melody to "think about things she'd never thought about"; Josh would "never have thought about these things" in Melody's place and is "glad to be woken up."

Incredible - on the one hand you have Ophelia talking about how you need plants in offices because the lack of them may have a disparate impact on women, and on the other you have Josh and Melody making basic empathy/accommodation for the visually-impaired sound like a newly invented technique in sociological rocket surgery.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24719

Post by bovarchist »

Apples wrote:In the Google Hangout Vacula posted earlier Sara Mayhew talked about this exchange among Melody, Josh the Spokesgay, and a few others about Melody's accommodation-fail at WIS and Chris Hofstader's damning blog-post about it:



Mayhew pointed out that 1) Melody's first reaction is to say she hopes Chris will update his blog-post, saying that it is misleading ("a lot of things left out/inaccurate") and 2) that both Melody and Josh make it sound like Chris's complaints were somehow subtle or esoteric -- The experience got Melody to "think about things she'd never thought about"; Josh would "never have thought about these things" in Melody's place and is "glad to be woken up."

Incredible - on the one hand you have Ophelia talking about how you need plants in offices because the lack of them may have a disparate impact on women, and on the other you have Josh and Melody making basic empathy/accommodation for the visually-impaired sound like a newly invented technique in sociological rocket surgery.
Whoa...that was an incredibly insensitive tweet from SpokesGay. Did anybody else catch it? He says he wouldn't have thought of that "in ur place". Does he really not understand that the phrase "in your place" is triggering to a lot of women who have been told what their place is for centuries?
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
:violin:

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#24720

Post by windy »

Apples wrote: Mayhew pointed out that 1) Melody's first reaction is to say she hopes Chris will update his blog-post, saying that it is misleading ("a lot of things left out/inaccurate")
Questioning the lived experience of a marginalised person? Isn't that a big no-no? Expecting a condemnation of Melody "DJ Grothe" Hensley from the usual quarters...

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