Why are you here? 2/28/13 and on

#1

In a recent video I uploaded, I said:

...there are many women on the internet â€“ there are many feminists on the internet, some of them including men, who write about feminism, who write about womenâ€™s issues, who write about anything given in the world, and they donâ€™t receive the level of criticism, negative feedback, what Stephanie Zvan calls harassment and cyberstalking. [...] So the situation is that some people negative criticism and pushback on the internet while others donâ€™t. So there has to be some kind of reason why this is the case. Magical harassment fairies, magical cyberstalking fairies, magical negative dissentersâ€“whatever you want to call themâ€“donâ€™t just appear out of thin air and criticize people on the internet. It doesnâ€™t happen that way.

I'm interested in why posters
(a) joined the Slymepit
and
(b) continue to post in the Slymepit.

Thank you.

#2

I joined the Slymepit because I was disgusted with the treatment D.J. Grothe was receiving in 2012. I first started reading the old version on ERV when I noticed blog hits coming to my site in response to a post I had written, if I recall correctly, that was critical of Rebecca Watson's backing out of TAM. Following this, I started to pay more attention to the 'drama' which I had mostly previously ignored and noticed unfair transgression after transgression against respected members of the skeptic/atheist community. I felt compelled to speak out and fight back in a civil manner.

I continue to post because the nonsense continues. I don't want to see the bad behavior of the 'usual crowd' go unchecked; they should be held accountable for their constant character attacks. This Slymepit provides a great resource for documenting and talking about transgressions and, at the same time, offers a great deal of humor. ...and it's not only criticism of PZ and company - there is all sorts of interesting discussion which takes place here which I find quite enjoyable. It's an intellectually stimulating community with many intelligent posters.

I really enjoy the open nature of this forum; all are invited to post and spar. Everyone is called out on their shit and held accountable by other forum members. I'm much unlike a majority of the active posters here in that I hardly resort to satire and ridicule. I almost always avoid name-calling or 'foul language' when referring to others I disagree with. I'd live the forum to be more civil, but have come to terms with the fact that others have their own methods and objectives which may be different than mine. I'll move forward with my approach as others do the same.

I had stopped posting in the past, especially when I was appointed to my position of leadership with the SCA. I expected to cease all posting had I not resigned from the leadership position - completely flouncing and taking the high road...but we know that didn't happen. After resigning, I even took a bit of a break, if I recall correctly, but ended up back in the thick of things because the transgressions continue...and continue to continue.

I didn't just 'pop out of nowhere' as some seem to believe. It's quite a long story and this is obviously a short post. I feel a moral responsibility to address the nonsense. ...if only PZ, Ophelia, Stephanie, and company would stop the character attacks.

#3

Well, I joined the Pit after lurking it for about four months or so (maybe more). I got here from Franc Hoggle's blog, and I found his blog from the Ask an Atheist episode post about the feminists (where Becky, one of the show hosts, was talking about how she felt the feminists like Ophelia, Greta, Watson, etc. were being unfair and hurting the atheist movement), and I found about Ask an Atheist (on their TV show days) from The Atheist Experience - Russel Glasser had participated on one of the episodes of Ask an Atheist.

So, basically, it's AXP's fault that I got there. Nice job, Matt and Russel!

#4

I actually joined in early December 2012, just because I like to have accounts on sites I read; at that point I was just a passive observer of both sides. What got me to finally post was being lambasted and then banned on Skepchick.org. I continue to post for the same reasons you do - I enjoy the documentation and accountability.

Now where's my edit button?

#5

Speaking of edit buttons, I also enjoy the running jokes and general sense of humor this place has.

#6

jose wrote: Now, you do have this forum and some twitter and youtube accounts and blogs dedicated almost exclusively to cause distress and torment people. They have let you know that repeatedly. You have managed to interrupt many bloggers at FTB from their normal blogging to address your latest attacks. You know you are causing a great deal of distress by being so damn persistent. You were so dedicated, you managed to drive Jen McCreight off blogging for a while, and she won't blog about anything related to atheism or feminism anymore.

Oh look, it's Make Shit Up Day again!

#7

Ah shit, wrong thread >.< Disregard.

#8

Right after elevatorgate I tried to 'tell my story" about being a stay at home dad on Pharyngula. PZ had blogged about some woman journalist and/or soft scientist being invited to a physics conference and how she was made to feel small and how men hit on her. It was a blog post about sexism that wasn't overt. So I figured I could sort of relate my personal story of how, as a man, I get sexism directed at me because I am not in the normal gender role. I was told to shove flaming porcupines and rusty knives (sideways) up my ass. I was called "childmolester71". I saw other thoughtful people making honest posts being told to "die in a fire" and called misogynists. It was the most eye opening moment I've had in the past year and a half. I've learned a lot about feminism, the MRM, and gender issues since then. And if it matters I had been a subscriber to Rebecca Watson's youtube and an admirer of PZ. I was there...and they lost me.

Why do I still post here? Because it's non-moderated.

#9

justinvacula wrote: I'm interested in why posters
(a) joined the Slymepit
and
(b) continue to post in the Slymepit.

Thank you.

a) I can comment, be disagreed with and not get banned.

b) See a) above.

#10

I got here after being dogpiled for my first blog entry on the baboons -

http://greylining.com/2011/07/09/atheis ... -puritans/

One reader pointed me to ERV. I had been documenting what I call the rise of atheist neopuritanism for about 5 years - well before Becky's nappy overflowed. It is a disturbing trend - elevatorgate is just the incident that brought it to the forefront. The puritan tendencies however predate it by several years. The other key event was the personal destruction of TamTamPamela - a fucking highschool kid. It was very much a taste of things to come -

http://greylining.com/2011/03/21/mom-i-poed-my-pants/

I find this shit abhorrent - I have no affiliations, other than the true, original Freethought movement. Beyond that, I am on a one man mission to resurrect classical Cynicism - they were probably the first in our species to reject the supernatural.

http://www.iep.utm.edu/cynics/

And Derek & Clive.

[youtube]jTifRi3qDkU[/youtube]

Misc links -

http://greylining.com/cynic/
http://greylining.com/onfray/
http://greylining.com/goldenapple/

"I pissed on the man who called me a dog. Why was he so surprised ?" -- Diogenes of Sinope

#11

I first heard of The Slyme Pit by reading Free Thought Blogs; people like PZ Meyers, Ophelia Benson, etc. Iâ€™ve been quite fascinated by this whole â€œElevatorgateâ€ thing and how the controversy just went on and on and on. Even more amazing is how the atheist community has split into opposing camps on this issue. Iâ€™ve been following the â€œdramaâ€ for a good long time trying to decipher the inner workings of atheist gender politics. The Slyme Pit I gathered had a solid reputation for free speech and was the home of the anti-feminists.

I myself have been involved in atheist gender politics of a sort for a long time. I am an atheist and I have been interested in gender politics so by necessity I fall into the â€œatheist gender politicsâ€ realm. I however first started out as a one man show; I was an atheist in favor of patriarchy and traditional gender roles who couldnâ€™t find like minded atheists to hang out with. I did the next best thing and joined a website, The Thinking Housewife, that was pro-patriarchy and political in orientation and therefore would accept an atheist like me even though most of the other people there were Catholics.

Finally just recently I discovered a pro-patriarchy website that wasnâ€™t religious where I really fit in as an atheist; the Feminine Mystique site.

Feminine Mystique
http://femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.com/

The idea behind the â€œFeminine Mystiqueâ€ name is that the women there want their Feminine Mystique back; they want to be honored and admired as women for their femininity, their Feminine Mystique, once again.

Anyways with my new affiliation with the Feminine Mystique site and the Traditional Womenâ€™s Rights Activists or TWRAs that the Feminine Mystique site is the headquarters of I decided to promote this group with its pro-patriarchy ideology and world view at this website to see if I could find any interested takers.

People here might be interested in a post I made at Feminine Mystique that got the attention of PZ Meyers himself!

Rebecca Watson Seeing the Decline of Patriarchy
http://femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.c ... atriarchy/

As to whether Iâ€™ll stick around, I guess that depends on if this place seems productive. I sure do appreciate that you guys havenâ€™t banned me even though what I advocate is so obviously politically incorrect! Iâ€™m glad a place like this exists in the atheist community.

#12

My journey into slyme started with the episode of Skepitcs' Guide to the Universe where Rebecca Watson had a segment decrying the misogyny of the sceptics' movement (more or less, it's been a long time since I listened to it). What she said sounded so out of whack with my own experiences that I went looking for more information, which led me to the ERV threads. Those, along with James Onen's excellent summaries of the events, reinforced my first instincts that something had been off about Watson's interpretation of events. Helped in no small part by the reprehensible behaviour of the Pharyngula lot. And when the ERV threads went away, I followed here.

The reason I'm still here is twofold. Partly to keep up with the drama (although my interest has waned considerably), but mostly because I like a lot of the people here and the atmosphere of the place. It's easily one of the most welcoming places I've encountered on the Internet, even when people are shouting loudly at each other. Which is quite an accomplishment.

#13

(For the record, I find Jesse Powell TWRA's ideas, at best, misguided and archaic. However, I think it's the strength of this place that even flat out wrong notions can be discussed without (too much) shouting, or tears and recriminations.)

#14

I arrived here shortly after this - http://teafueledmadness.blogspot.co.uk/ ... wkins.html

Some naughty Ugandan placed a link here from my blog and an equally naughty virologist who posted a message out saying she was sorry to hear people like me were being yelled at! :D http://teafueledmadness.blogspot.co.uk/ ... e-pit.html

I'd read about Coffeegate from Mr Onen's excellent write up of it and T-Shirtgate managed to knock me over enough to comment on Butterflies and Wheels - I got utterly dogpiled with comments designed to shut me up and pillory me in the same way everyone else has experienced. Even to the point of being accused by the owner of "male normal language" which apparently is not the meaning you think it has!

Decius linked me a message from The Pit and that drew me over.

So if you want anyone to blame for me being here, blame "ophelia" - she is the one who turned me into a Pitter!

I'm here because my opinion is up to scrutiny and I trust posters here to be honest enough to tell me I'm wrong or even right, I can't do this on somewhere like Pharyngula because I'm banned from expressing myself - I have never seen a more oppressive atmosphere except in what I studied for my degree about Stalin and Hitler!

With the likes of PZ, Watson, Benson etc yelling absurd nonsense about all of us being a mixture of rape enablers etc I want to be part of something that criticises the dishonesty of it all. I really object to how they have behave and despite me being no Internet Hero, I more than happy to contribute to showing these people for who they really are.

Plus, you are a bunch of very funny and intelligent people who I'm proud to shout fuck off at! :D

Cheers!

#15

I joined the pit because it is so hard to find a forum with a good mob of like-minded bigoted creeps. I became an ardent misogynist when I was in my teens, because bitchez ain't shit (every dudebro knows that). Luckily, my mother, sisters, and other female loved ones had been brainwashed by the sexism and misogyny that we live and breathe, so they never called me out on my hatred and prejudice. I also strongly dislike racial minorities and various deviant types and have had to search far and wide for a place where I could share my race realism with similarly racist skeptics. The best part of the 'pit is being able to mock and ridicule people just because they are women or non-white or gay and to be surrounded by other MRAs and I particularly love all the photoshops where people put Stephanie Zvan's face on a porno actress - there's a new one practically every day! Also, the coordinated sending of harassing emails to Rebecca Watson is a real pleasure, not to mention calling up car dealerships and giving them PZ's phone number. I keep posting at the pit because, even though we all know the Fc(n) has a monopoly on proper and charitable behavior, it's just fun to bully people for no reason, amirite? w00t! Also there are no paragraph breaks in this post because Reap.

#16

I arrived here after a long youtube journey to the realization that I was not an agnostic, but actually an atheist. I began watching James Randi videos, The Atheist Experience vids, Thunderf00t's vids and Justicar's vids. I began making my own videos after watching and reading the A+theism Noelplum99 interactions.

I found Scented Nectar's youtube channel and she kind of suggested that I check the pit out. I lurked for a while to get the feel for the place, and found it to my liking. The PC bullshit is not worshiped here, and it reminded me of the interesting and decidedly non-PC discussions I had with other nuclear submariners while in the Navy. In other words, I felt right at home.

I continue to post here because the PC gender feminist ideology that some want to conflate with atheism is still making waves and being divisive (IMO).

#17

I'm here because fuck you all up the gary!

#18

I used to read Science Blogs and started reading the original version of this thread on ERV when Elevator-gate hit. I'm not part of any community atheist or skeptical (though I would be considered both). I keep coming back here because it's so damned entertaining even if I don't really have much to add.

#19

justinvacula wrote: I'm interested in why posters
(a) joined the Slymepit
and
(b) continue to post in the Slymepit.

a) I lurked at Pharyngula during EG and at ERV after. When the transition to a forum was being made I was concerned it might stall due to lack of commenters, so I delurked and started posting.

My intro post has some background: http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... t=LMU#p133

b) I continue to read and post because I find it entertaining.

Some elaboration: I see the Slymepit as performing a sort of muckraking/watchdog service regarding FTB and cohorts, while also being entertaining. I am among those who wishes that the 'pitters would "aim higher" regarding civility and comedy, but I pretty firmly believe that they should be able to say what they wish without coercive interference. This freedom counterintuitively makes the Slymepit feel much *safer* to me than places like Pharyngula (I never would have delurked at Pharyngula, even if I agreed with everything).

#20

I've been a reader and lurker on skeptical forums for a long time, about 10 or 12 years.

I was a very frequent reader of the JREF forum, never had the inclination to post there but I learned a lot about skepticism from reading their threads. I also frequented forums and blogs about religion, atheism, creationism and evolution.

My first glimpse of ElevatorGate was on the JREF, where I found out the original story, the continuing saga and the opinions of several of the posters.

At the same time, I used to read Pharyngula from time to time and I noticed how the "feminist" ideology was permeating every post.
When PZ posted this comic, describing it as reality, I got tired of it and started doing some searches about this male privilege thing, and reading blogs that discussed this concept.
After that, somehow I ended up at Tfoot's blog, and followed him on twitter, and then I started reading his posts about the skepchicks and Hall's T-shirt and the rest of stuff and following people he retweeted, and somehow I ended up at Scented Nectar's blog, and then I followed her link to the pit and read the whole thread.

Why am I interested on the pit and why am I posting here?
I like skepticism. I don't have a blog, a youtube channel and I don't tweet, so I'm mainly a non-entity, but I like skepticism, and learning about skepticism and logical and critical thought has been a part of my life for a long time. I like Randi's ideas, I like Sagan's ideas, and I like the ideas of several posters and bloggers in these so called "community", so reading all these people calling themselves skeptics but not behaving like one was pretty jarring to me.

But I also approach this from the gender angle, since reading and learning about all this has also brought me to being interested in gender issues, egalitarianism and men's issues, which is something I never thought about before, and FTB, A+ and the skepchicks have several views on feminism, equality and men/women relationships I find invalid and even sometimes offensive.

For these two reasons, I find countering the FTB rethoric important, maybe not in a real life context, but in a cyber-space, intellectual context.

I also enjoy the lulz aspect of the pit, the community feeling and the fact that between the lulz and the satire there are interesting conversations, topics and ideas.

#21

Ericb wrote:I used to read Science Blogs and started reading the original version of this thread on ERV when Elevator-gate hit.

Same here, a former Scienceblogs regular and stuck around for ERV's thread since it seemed the most open discussion about EG and issues relate to "women in skepticism".

LMU wrote:I see the Slymepit as performing a sort of muckraking/watchdog service regarding FTB and cohorts, while also being entertaining. I am among those who wishes that the 'pitters would "aim higher" regarding civility and comedy, but I pretty firmly believe that they should be able to say what they wish without coercive interference.

And this.

LMU wrote:This freedom counterintuitively makes the Slymepit feel much *safer* to me than places like Pharyngula (I never would have delurked at Pharyngula, even if I agreed with everything)

Actually, that freedom kind of reminds me of Pharyngula a few years ago. Even if the flaming sometimes got out of hand, it seemed like a healthier community then. I'm a porcupine that escaped the reserve before it got fenced in ;)

#22

I'm here because any group/ideology that preaches equality for women while vocally holding the idea that being white and/or male is a reason to disregard someone is without a doubt inherently wrong. That they miss the irony of that is just special. It doesn't help their case that concepts like patriarchy and rape culture are gross simplifications of much larger issues, that they're all too stupid to see that the privilege is just a pseudo-psychological redressing of stereotyping, that things like "teal deer" and "freeze peach" are entirely attempts to retard actual conversation by belittling criticism and wordiness, that they want to language police some words while completely devaluing other words better saved for the actual problems they (claim they) want to address, and fuck that robotic fuck Nerd of Redhead for (among many, many reasons) misusing Hitchen's Razor (most egregiously against Noelplum).

That sentence was far too long. I even left out the part where they treat women like children, but I figure that one is well-known and covered by the pit tagline, "The Radical Notion That Women Are People AND Adults."

I don't post here often for a couple of reasons, the biggest being ZOMGFastboard and that the diversity in the pit generally means anything I would have to say is covered by the regulars anyway. I can easily say that one of the reasons is *not* that I'm afraid to post for fear of a dogpile; that only only applies to FfTB/A+. I feel safe and welcome at ~~TAM~~ the slymepit.

#23

I came after Elevatorgate - I'm one of the early chill girls and started posting from the second ERV 'pit thread. The idea of a woman being afraid of a man in an elevator and blaming *him* for daring to talk to her pretty much blew my brain and contracted virtually every notion I had about what feminism meant.

I was originally optimistic that people would see sense and realise that women weren't all fucking crazy, but I've lost that optimism now. So I just hang around to laugh at lulz and to bitch. It is virtually the only place that I can talk without fearing that someone's going to try and get me fired from my job - Lsuoma is quite a trustworthy fellow. :)

#24

I found ERV during the elevator kerfuffle, but was battling on behalf of absurdism elsewhere. Mainly the old AXP blog, which was my regular haunt at the time. I shook my head in disbelief at the loons and their rape narrative, which was starting to dominate and silence the conversation. As an absurdist this really should have been, not only what i expected, but more corn to pop, but the level of discourse from supposed intellects actually frustrated me. i became my own absurdist muse, so i walked away from the topic.

AXP joined the ftb network, and there was a major shift in their moderation culture. Any topic which arose remotely connected to the sjw mob, became eggshells or ban. My ban came after a kerfuffle with swanny on a third blog, where she accused me of deliberately attempting diminish a woman by shortening her name, claiming this was an abusive tactic used by men, and if i had done it on her blog i would have been banned. the crazy was overpowering, it was beyond absurd.

I related this incident at AXP in a post that it wasn't off topic on. Evidencing it as dogmatism, Wagner snarked at me (cause he had fuck all else), i snarked back, Glasser's opinion on the incident was that i was now a "confirmed asshole" (cause he had fuck all else) and banned me.

That was my final wake up call that the sjw mob infesting online atheism, wouldn't contemplate debate, never mind dissent. so i shifted my posting habit to ERV, for the most obvious of reasons. You don't get fucking banned by assholes who can't rebut your argument.

#25

I used to spend a lot of time reading the Skepchick blog, as well as Skepticblog, the JREF blogs, and a few others, with an occasional dip of the toe into Pharyngula.

But even back then, I think it was about 4 years ago, I thought Watson and PeeZus were a matched pair of hypocritical and deeply dishonest asses.

My initial discomfort with teh Lord PeeZus started when he posted a rant saying "The Bible is the cause of all the world's troubles", which is such a ridiculous overstatement, especially coming from someone who is supposed to be an educator, a professor, a professional intellectual.

I am a life-long atheist, and perceive the bible as nothing more than an interesting, if quircky, set of mostly fictitious narratives that provide some interesting insight into the past. PeeZus's bible rant immediately reminded my of the puritans of the 50s who used to scream that rock-and-roll caused unwed pregnancies, drug addiction, sex out of marriage, and so on and so forth. That was when I knew for certain that teh PeeZus was just a moron.

Anyway, after having been banned from the Skepchick blog for my second or third time, I came across a link (I think it was on Skepticblog) to ERV's July 2011 "Bad Form, Rebecca Watson" post, when it was still quite new. I think at the time there were only about 20 or so comments. I was immediately struck with the open honesty of the dscussion, and the clear fact that even if everyone disagreed with what you had to say, there was no censorship, no stifling of independant thought, no Room 101. I decided I had to to stay and see what developed.

Although I have had many disagreements with many Pyt posters, I still feel that the Pyt, for all its shortcomings, is one of the most honest and open ongoing dscussions regarding the FfTB, Skepchick, and A+ blogs and group of communities to be found on the 'net.

#26

Oh, yes, like the quiet walrus up above, I too want to say that I feel safe and welcome at the Pyt.

#27

Because people Like Josh, Gay of the Dead... or is it Josh, Friendly Neighborhood Newsgay... whatever and company think I belong with shitheads like you. Apparently being ok with disagreeing means you're sexist and this is seems to be a safe place to criticize anyone and everyone (which believe me, there's plenty to go around).

#28

I'm here because I came across this advert at Freethought Blogs:
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-503940

#29

Why am I at the Slymepit?

Last year when some of the YouTube atheist folks on my sub list went to FTB and I began seriously paying attention to the atheist and skeptiuc blogospheres I was disgusted. Starting with the Thunderf00t removal for the awful crime of disagreeing with PZ, seeing just how pointless, vindictive and self-victimizing the narrative emanating from Skepchick had gotten and noticing the winds of very authoritarian groupthink and censorship beginning to swell in certain communities I began to separate myself from the whole thing.

Things finally got to the point where I was seeing ghosts of Dick Cheney's "with us or against us" mindset in Richard Carrier's A+ manifesto, and "Mean Girls" in many of the popular women organizers and speakers who were shaming and insulting any woman who challenged or voiced dissent with them with allegations of disagreeing for the sake of "teh menz". While I agreed with the fundamental ideas that FTB/Skepchick/A+ claimed to be for, I saw them as the Tea Party of the left and wanted nothing to do with their witchunting for blog hits, their hypocrisy, their doxxing, their profiting off victimhood and their perpetuating the narrative of women as weak and helpless from the control of the evil cis hetero white man.

When I got to the point where I was reading these sites only to observe the insanity of the asylum I noticed certain enemies lists perpetuated most of them: MRA, Slymepit, YouTube commenters, Justin Vacula, Dawkins, Harris, libertarians, JREF/Grothe etc. I decided to investigate for myself and began following the Slymepit. The Pit, despite being so demonized by the likes of FTB, holds a policy of free expression and a true ideas marketplace that I felt was missing from so-called "skeptics" elsewhere. While I disagreed with some of the Pit's content, I felt that any group of true independent folks who value critical examination of things were not going to have sacred cows outside of obeying basic legal statutes and that I was going to just have to agree to disagree on some things if I wanted to engage in a place that actually valued free expression of ideas. I found that the majority of the posters here are gender egalitarians such as myself and that even the people whose philosophies and politics didn't align with mine could be engaged in discourse with without the vitriol and ad hominem judgments rampant in FTB-land.

#30

So, I'm here after being wined and dined by a Fortune 50 company with too much good wine and food inside me, and want to apologise for editing SDG's Marcotte comments. I now believe I should have let them stand, and will do so with similar post in the future.

I felt peculiar about it then, and feel bad about it now. The Pit should be the home of absolute no censorship.

Thanks all. I fly back to WA tomorrow, so maybe I'm having a visceral, hind-brain fear of being so close to those horrible anti-freethought dogmatists [youtube]Casey Luskin, and the Discovery Institute members[/youtube] FeeFee and McNeight. At least I'll be closer to the sec Renee Hendricks and John Greg!

#31

Gak. Not sure where the formatting came from. I tried and failed to contrast Benson and other Seattle-based dogmatists with Luskin and other Seattle-based dogmatists.

Anyway, FWIW Benson is a place in Oxfordshire in the UK. There is an RAF base there with a weather station and it's often reported as being the coldest place in England, if not the UK. And yes, it's fucking freezing on the SE edge of the Banbury plain.

#32

Cheers Lsuoma, cheers.

#33

I came here after reading many blogs on the Elevatorgate/Skepchick/A+ drama and realised that all the supporters of A+ and Skepchick were acting like children with their shunning of other people whose views doesn't agree with their own views.

#34

I joined to stalk Franc.... he still owes me $50...with interest compounding since 1986 should be a tidy sum by now. :)

I don't post much but read avidly. Have learnt heaps already particularly with argumentative styles, some new words to use. I've realised I've been sceptical for years but I called it being "cheeky" or playing the devils advocate. I've learnt more about feminism in the last 6 months than ever, so much so I can have a decent discussion with the partner. She tends to lean on the radical side.

Don't care much for the FTB side of things. I've only ever posted comments there twice and on one of those Josh the Gay guy came down like a ton of bricks but it was funny. I tend to think the FTB5 have painted themselves into a bit of a corner. Any science based original articles will be scrutinised extensively and that makes it a risky proposition. It's much easier and safer to create drama where there isn't but that's only going to last a short while. I'm predicting Ophelia to give it up by your summer.

#35

Around November 2011, I saw the witch-hunts from the front row and was disgusted. I saw FTB distort the truth of what was happening, and unfairly blogged about people, telling lies, misquoting others, and misconstruing their meaning. They wrongfully labeled people as misogynists, rape-supporters, rape-enablers, etc, simply for disagreeing on subjective issues. It was ironic because most of the sexist statements I've seen came from FTB, like Greta Christina telling men to listen to her, because she was trying to get us laid (as if men are primarily mindless sex machines, only looking for sex, and will blindly nod in agreement). They are the ones who imply that other women are or should feel the same as them on subjective issues, and presume to set rules for both men and women on subjective issues where there is no right or wrong.

I was mostly alone in arguing against FTB, because most of the people in my corner of the internet tend to blindly take FTB's side, assuming that they are right. The few (women) who disagreed with FTB remained silent, because they feared being wrongly tarred and feathered, as they witnessed happening to others.

I was granted admin privileges at the Phawrongula wiki to add incidents which I saw happening at the time. I avoided the Slime Pit, because everyone there was a stranger to me, and I didn't feel as if I were articulate and internet savvy enough to contribute. After the incident with D.J. Grothe, I looked at the Slime Pit again, and the water looked fine, so I decided to jump in. I received a warm welcome, and mostly stayed because of the humor.

#36

Hi. I'm here because I have a deep and abiding hatred of A+ and someone said that like monded loons hang out here.

#37

belial wrote:Hi. I'm here because I have a deep and abiding hatred of A+ and someone said that like monded loons hang out here.

Welcome to the pit! Here's your mandatory basket of links:
http://simplywash.com/images/dirty-laundry.jpg

Now fuck off.

#38

belial wrote:Hi. I'm here because I have a deep and abiding hatred of A+ and someone said that like monded loons hang out here.

Hello and welcome! Most of the forum's activity takes place in the active undead thread: http://www.slymepit.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=31 Some regulars read and post in those threads exclusively, but that's no reason not to participate in other threads.

#39

I am here because I found my neglected blog linked to this site I got a lot of hits so I checked you (the site, not you Vacular) out. I found an odd parallel universe. I had clashed with Ophelia on the same, but different grounds, and was searching for an answer to how this once rational woman had lost her marbles (I work for the NHS, I hope it's a conscious choice...genuinely). If it's only radical feminism, that's a positive outcome for me.

Rational feminism - or egalitarianism - need more female advocates. It literally pains me a lot to see very clever women like Ophelia - supposed atheists - set their stall out with deus ex machina epidemiologies such as social constructionism (the axiomatic bedrock of orthodox feminism today) and the flawed internal logic which appears to prove that patriarchy(bad) = misogyny (bad) = patriarchy (bad).

You can probably tell I'm not a logician, but even I can see the fucking gaping flaw in that! Ophelia is cleverer than me. I am at a genuine loss at why she cannot see it.

So in essence: don't give a shit about egos â€“ especially mine. I'm an idiot. Want to find answers and solutions. That - I think - is why I am an idiot (but I am a more common or garden idiot too - that's my bottom line :) )

#40

DGS wrote:...So in essence: don't give a shit about egos â€“ especially mine. I'm an idiot. Want to find answers and solutions. That - I think - is why I am an idiot (but I am a more common or garden idiot too - that's my bottom line :) )

I never even graduated High School (that I've been fortunate enough to wind up in a position to semi-retire at 43 makes me extremely grateful to live in a society and at a time when so much opportunity is available).
One of the reasons I like the Pit is that just about everyone here is seriously smart. I'm constantly aware of being out of my depth here and I find that oddly reassuring. Conversely, I'm unnerved by how often, outside of the Pit, I'm the smartest person in the room. I shouldn't be the smartest person in the room ever. Even if I'm alone in it.
No-one here takes themselves too seriously either. There seems to be a pleasant correlation between seriously smart people and self-awareness.

#41

Gefan wrote:
I never even graduated High School

Me neither. Or 'comp' as it's called here. That's the excuse I give when my grammar shows me up - 'cos it's true.
shouldn't be the smartest person in the room ever. Even if I'm alone in it.
Testify!

No-one here takes themselves too seriously either. There seems to be a pleasant correlation between seriously smart people and self-awareness.

Read it an weep 'FtB's' (did I get that right?)

(now I have chased my tail for a half hour I can take the dog out and go to sleep! Phew!!)

#42

Yikes I totally fekd that quotey thing up!

#43

Metalogic42 wrote:
belial wrote:Hi. I'm here because I have a deep and abiding hatred of A+ and someone said that like monded loons hang out here.
Welcome to the pit! Here's your mandatory basket of links:
http://simplywash.com/images/dirty-laundry.jpg

Now fuck off.

Ooh wow its a wee board veteran swaggering in front of noobs. How impressive I hope in 3 weeks time I get his poise and elan. Until then Ill have to be his Bitch :dance:

rim me asshole!

#44

Seemed like a good idea at the time.

#45

masakari2012 wrote: After the incident with D.J. Grothe, I looked at the Slime Pit again, and the water looked fine, so I decided to jump in. I received a warm welcome, and mostly stayed because of the humor.

I thought we told you to fuck off?

#46

KiwiInOz wrote:
masakari2012 wrote: After the incident with D.J. Grothe, I looked at the Slime Pit again, and the water looked fine, so I decided to jump in. I received a warm welcome, and mostly stayed because of the humor.
I thought we told you to fuck off?

Did that tradition start with masakari? I don't remember.

#47

Unfortunately, no one told me to fuck off. Instead, ERV offered me a choice of a Crab Juice or a Mountain Dew.

#48

First post here. Originally, I thought that the FTB/A+ crowd was alright, but then I started reading the comments on the blog posts at that place and saw how they dealt with people that disagreed with them. That led me to the general conclusion that FTB/A+ was a gang of dishonest scumbags. Those guys are pushing drugs and try to guilt the fuck out of you into accepting their views. This forum seems more honest and seemingly free of the narrow partisan bullshit that FTB/A+ is known for. I remember when Pharyngula used to be good, but that's long gone.

The general FTB/A+ formula for dealing with people disagree with them.
Step 1) Find someone who is stone-cold fuck nuts crazy and blog about it. Repeat.
Step 2) Liken anyone who is respetfully disagreeing to some FTB/A+ blog to the crazies from step 1.
Step 3) ???
Step 4) Profit!

#49

Gefan wrote:
DGS wrote:...So in essence: don't give a shit about egos â€“ especially mine. I'm an idiot. Want to find answers and solutions. That - I think - is why I am an idiot (but I am a more common or garden idiot too - that's my bottom line :) )
I never even graduated High School (that I've been fortunate enough to wind up in a position to semi-retire at 43 makes me extremely grateful to live in a society and at a time when so much opportunity is available).
One of the reasons I like the Pit is that just about everyone here is seriously smart. I'm constantly aware of being out of my depth here and I find that oddly reassuring. Conversely, I'm unnerved by how often, outside of the Pit, I'm the smartest person in the room. I shouldn't be the smartest person in the room ever. Even if I'm alone in it.
No-one here takes themselves too seriously either. There seems to be a pleasant correlation between seriously smart people and self-awareness.

I understand how you feel Gefan. Here in the pit, I feel like a first year student.

#50

I joined slymepit.com mainly to communicate with people who I'd otherwise would not communicate with because frankly I'd be banned off the majority of other skeptical communication mediums out there. At this time I'm not sure if I will stay or even if I will continue to post as I just made this account.

I first came across slymepit.com thanks to a guy with the cow head skull video called MykeruMedia. Slymepit has a nice name and looked pretty lenient on the rules. It looks like a individual can express there thought within slymepit in a way that they do not have to look over there shoulder to see if there following the rules, which makes it easier to get a particular point or points across (I appreciate and value this in a community).

I have always been a skeptic but never really knew it until I joined skepticproject.com formally called conspiracyscience.com. I'm not really on any other skeptic sites besides skepticproject.com, as this is mainly because I'd probably be banned off other sites such as JREF or skeptic.com for posting something that may violate there rules. I've always been apart of tech communities that were small to medium sized and that had rules that were lenient, which led to communicating to very interesting personalities and at that very good/honest criticisms when it came to asking for help/critiques. As skepticproject.com had similar rules as previous tech communities I am apart of, it was easy for me to assimilate into.

I vaguely know what the schism is about in the atheist community, though I think atheism and feminism should be separate not one in the same. I have read some of FTB bloggers such as Greta and PZmyer's blogs and at that they both rub me the wrong way. I'm not involved in the atheist community nor do I actively follow any atheist blogs/videos as I do not identify myself as a atheist. I am spiritual (not religious), I do consider myself a skeptic, I have a interest in studying cults, I like to debunk non-rational thoughts/articles, I hold free voice over IP online group therapy counseling sessions every Sunday which incorporates skeptical thinking in studying problematic groups one may be in or just to learn (I am not a professional counselor), I am a troll though I define myself as a academic troll who uses logic and reason against non-rational thinking, I'm not paid by the government as I do this as a hobby, and I have a interest in economics as I believe strongly in the free market.

In the conspiracy and pseudoscience realm I have problems with Alex Jones, David Ike, William Cooper, any self-proclaimed guru, woo medicine, antivaccers, 9/11 twoofers, chemtrails believers, and on a smaller level groups such as the Venus project, Destinians, the Zeitgeist Movement. On skepticptoject.com site we have debunks to The Zeitgeist Movement movies I, II, and III movies (recommended read).

References:

Skeptic project Facebook group
https://www.facebook.com/groups/skepticproject/

Main site:
http://skepticproject.com/forum/

TZM movie debunks I, II, and III
http://conspiracies.skepticproject.com/ ... zeitgeist/
http://conspiracies.skepticproject.com/ ... -addendum/
http://conspiracies.skepticproject.com/ ... g-forward/

SP hate mail
http://skepticproject.com/site/hate-mail/

Creepy Clowns: Freethought Bullies and the Threat Narrative Clown Horn

#51

Two days ago, I stumbled across the Melissa McEwan/PZ Myers public BDSM extravaganza. Can you believe it: I totally missed the A+ BS of the past few years (I'm atheist & an occasional blogger but haven't frequented online atheist spots much.) Once in a blue moon, I'd visit Pharyngula -- usually off an RDF link -- for some pretty octopus pix, and was surprised to discover what a major d-bag PZ actually is. I'd crossed swords with McEwan's droogies in the past in political discussions, so I was all like, "oh crap, why did she have to show up and spoil atheism for me, too?"

I rapidly surfed links and read as much as I could on both sides and determined that A-plussers were deadly viruses, which is why it makes total sense they'd be so afraid of Abbie Smith. I summarized the whole thing as best I could on my little blog (it is in bad form to self-pimp here?)

Gen-fem pariahs like McEww try to hijack & ruin everything where ever they show up, but they do tend to slither away again if you refuse to join in their mind-fuck games. Asking them to give simple answers to simple questions usually sends them into paroxysms of echo-chamber whining and entire sick days spent pillow-biting.

So I'd like to be more vocal online to help stop the A+ invasion of the brain snatchers.

#52

I'll be totally honest, part of the reason I post here is that the Pit reminds me of Old Pharyngula, from about 2010 and earlier. I never really posted much, but I would lurk a lot, because it was just so damned entertaining. Yes, yes, it was always heated- that hasn't changed. But back when it was more of an antitheist blog, there was a sense that people were having fun. Creationists got bashed, yeah, but it there was a sort of good-natured "fisking the idiots" vibe. There were religious commenters who hung around and who the regulars even seemed to sort of like, in an antagonistic sort of way. Pete Rooke comes to mind here, among others.

Now? The whole enterprise is just mean-spirited and nasty. No one there is having fun, it's just a shithole of angry ranting from PZ and the rest of the Hivemind. I can't imagine why anyone would want to post there. Whatever.

The Pit can be heated too, but- like I said- in a fun, rough and tumble kind of way.

#53

Percentage wrote:I'll be totally honest, part of the reason I post here is that the Pit reminds me of Old Pharyngula, from about 2010 and earlier. I never really posted much, but I would lurk a lot, because it was just so damned entertaining. Yes, yes, it was always heated- that hasn't changed. But back when it was more of an antitheist blog, there was a sense that people were having fun. Creationists got bashed, yeah, but it there was a sort of good-natured "fisking the idiots" vibe. There were religious commenters who hung around and who the regulars even seemed to sort of like, in an antagonistic sort of way. Pete Rooke comes to mind here, among others.

This! I expressed similar sentiments upthread, but it bears repeating.

#54

windy wrote:
Percentage wrote:I'll be totally honest, part of the reason I post here is that the Pit reminds me of Old Pharyngula, from about 2010 and earlier. I never really posted much, but I would lurk a lot, because it was just so damned entertaining. Yes, yes, it was always heated- that hasn't changed. But back when it was more of an antitheist blog, there was a sense that people were having fun. Creationists got bashed, yeah, but it there was a sort of good-natured "fisking the idiots" vibe. There were religious commenters who hung around and who the regulars even seemed to sort of like, in an antagonistic sort of way. Pete Rooke comes to mind here, among others.
This! I expressed similar sentiments upthread, but it bears repeating.

A week or so ago you posted a link to a Pharyngula thread, from a few years back, in which the craziness was starting to grow but hadn't quite taken over. You could still get away with disagreeing with the screechies and not get instantly banned. On that thread, close to the comment that you had linked, I spotted a snarky comment making fun of the over-the-top rhetoric and throught I recognized the commenters name. A few seconds later it hit me - it was me! - in the days when I used my real life name on messageboards. I started using a pseudonymous handle just to make my pharyngula identity more obvious because there were two other commenters on Pharyngula at the time who had very similar names.
I actually switched to commenting on B and W for a few years after Pharyngula became so cliquey and nasty but the same group went and colonized B and W.

#55

a) I came here after I found out this is where Schroedinger's rapists are supposed to go.

b) I don't post. I found out early in life I was never one of the cool kids, but that worked out okay because I seem to be a pretty good lurker. (See, cool kids would have looked at the date of the last post and kept quiet.)

c) Justin, my sincere apologies but my internal voice ALWAYS says your name so it rhymes with "dracula". Sorry, I can't help it. :-)

#56

Zone_Trooper wrote: c) Justin, my sincere apologies but my internal voice ALWAYS says your name so it rhymes with "dracula". Sorry, I can't help it. :-)

You are not alone.

I don't care how he thinks his name should be pronounced; and I would be offended if he had a problem with that.

#57

I outlined why I am here in my initial post in the Undead Thread, however I was mostly completely drunk at the time so I thought I would elucidate a bit.

I'm here primarily because I was horrified at Richard Carrier's video and blog post last month (http://freethoughtblogs.com/carrier/archives/3351/). Having been not following atheism online much recently I was not aware of "Atheism+" until a couple of weeks ago. I was horrified that someone who is supposed to be part of a rationalist movement could be so irrational and exclusionary, and that the Atheist+ crew, by dint of their exclusive radical focus, were giving the word "atheist" an ugly tinge.

So I spent (wasted) a lot of time reading around the blogosphere. I had a similar reaction to elevatorgate months before (the main reason I lost interest in atheism dramas online).

On the one hand Rebecca Watson's initial elevatorgate complaint seemed like a storm in a teacup to me and on the other hand I didn't think she deserved all the abuse, at the time. Since then I've formed the opinion that Watson has been milking the trolls for all they are worth to her Just Cause(tm). They are in a symbiotic relationship, trolls get to troll because that's what they like to do and Watson, skepchick/ftb/a+ get tasty trollmilk for their internet indignation. Seriously, there likely are a few misogynists in the atheist movement but no more (and probably fewer) than in the wider community. Exaggeration, hyperbole, shrill indignation etc. for your politics will whittle your follower base down to the radical True Believers which is what seems to be happening now. (Check out the search term "pharyngula" in google trends.)

Last thing on Watson, who I successfully avoided reading anything about for months. I knew she was pretty shallow, self-promoting, and as a skeptic, a featherweight, but a few days ago I read her response to Harriet Hall in this post: http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/ind ... t-critics/ . Holy hell, what an ego! Vapid, self-obsessed, I could go on. In a post barely about Watson, she posted a reply that sounds like she considers herself the centre of the universe.

Anyways, the reason I am here is because of... reason. The FTB/SC/A+ loons are the enemies of reason and I'd love it if Dawkins did an extra part to his video series starring the above mentioned. They've thrown reason away so they can argue politics. As far as I am concerned you can't rationally explore issues without delving into the ugly side sometimes. If you're going to shut down the conversation, crippling the right of reply, just because you don't personally like what you are hearing, you have no business as a skeptic.

If Dawkins, Dennett, Harris and Hitchens are the four horsemen, FreethoughtBlogs, Skepchic and Atheism+ are the hundred midgets.

Thanks for listening :)

#58

A) Years ago I used to be a leader in a few freethought and atheist campus groups, and since then have been a somewhat on-again/off-again follower of freethought, skepticism and atheist blogs and websites. I started lurking here several months ago, reading about this as a 'hate-site' on FtB. I wanted to see what the big fucking deal was.

Turns out the site is not full of hate, but rather is interpreted that way because some people can't differentiate between being an asshole for a laugh, genuine criticism, and hate. Nor do people seem to get that the medium of the internet itself generally influences the way we interact, and not always in positive ways. However, while both this site and FtB have their share of confirmation bias and ridiculousness, the spirit of 'anything goes' in terms of speech on this forum is something I can appreciate. I mean, I know its probably just a consequence of my privilege, but as an adult I can read things I disagree with, view jokes in bad taste, and be part of a forum where other people are mean pricks sometimes (even to me!) without losing my shit emotionally or being harmed =P

My take on forums and blogs is typically most content is of low-value, and I'm looking for the sliver of stuff that interests or enlightens me.

One reason the site is interesting: I believe vulgarity should be an olympic sport. I mean, it certainly is more interesting than dressage and might be equally athletic.

I also appreciate a forum where "fuck off" is more likely to be a term of affection than actual rudeness.

What made me create an account was seeing Al Stefanelli's screenshot of Ubuntu 13.04 running with the Mac theme. I used to read and enjoy some of Al's writing and am myself a (lazy) linux user with some of my devices. Dumb as it is, it just made me feel like this was a place that would be fun to hangout and bullshit in.

I'm also a sorta tech-person with a background in Sociology, who sees some of the intellectual/political problems of the disclipline of Sociology emerging in the online atheist community, the difference being the stark contrast of the environments in which these occur as well as the much greater variation of thought in the atheist community. The intersection between atheism, gender (a subset of Sociological study), and technology/internet has brought me back around, to at least a limited degree.

I don't hold that there are 'two sides', but I do see ample instances of dogmatism and authoritarianism within the "big tent" of atheism, which I find troublesome. This, combined with the over-reactions, dire accusations, and rampant logical fallacies over the past few years is a peculiar emergence for a community ostensibly grounded in reason. Also, I have no issue with feminism, other than the fact that it is one of those words that means so many different things to so many people that it has come to effectively mean nothing. I do have serious umbrage for authoritarians and dogmatists who masquerade as simply representing a particular viewpoint, whether they call themselves feminists, libertarians, christians or whatever. And when this is occurring within groups claiming to represent freethought or skepticism, its time to take pay attention.

B) Well, this is my first post, and I plan to post more, but in all likelihood my posting will likely be the very occasional long-winded screed on a random point or topic followed by long bouts of silence. Unfortunately, I generally lack the brevity needed to post often without spending too much time on writing and/or unintentionally hi-jacking threads with my wall of text spells.

tl;dr Feck off, cunts, being long-winded is my privilege =P

#59

Hello â€œnewbiesâ€ and welcome aboard; yâ€™all seem to be well-aware of the significant differences between the Pit on the one hand, and FfTB/Skepchick/AtheismPlus on the other, and seem rightly, I think, to see the latter largely as wastelands besides which the Pit is frequently seen as an oasis of rationality and skepticism â€“ generally speaking in any case â€“ so Iâ€™m sure youâ€™ll fit right in.

Others frequently provide â€œbaskets of linksâ€ (frequently pictures of kittens and/or sausages) with or without some somewhat contrarian â€œfuck offsâ€ by way of a â€œwelcomeâ€ which you can search for if youâ€™re so inclined, but Iâ€™ll limit myself to the foregoing â€¦.

#60

Why am I here? I was chased here. There was no where else to turn. The zombies had taken over the mall (at least in Minnesota). I needed a safe haven. Somewhere that if I get called out for some of my inane bullshit there is at least a semblance of a chance the criticism will be valid and not just based on my continued retention of an over active dongle (that does mean thyroid right.)

Seriously, I just wanted to hang with the kool kidz. I already ruined my reputation (as a Godless Yankee reprobate) hanging out with all you on Twitter. In for a penny. In for a pound.

#funwithatheism

Enjoy.