Steerzing in a New Direction...

#4201

MarcusAu wrote: ↑
Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑ No Gish galloping, promise. We'll stick to that one item.
What was it people used to say? "Nobody speaks for the 'Pit"

Fine, you Gish gallop. Dorothy or Lillian, your choice.

#4202

Service Dog wrote: ↑ As for "Robokitty is a troll" -- I don't find that claim, on it's own, to be persuasive. But I know Matt & John well-enough... to give their assessment some weight/ with a grain of salt.

How about this: trying to debate in good faith with Robokitty was always like trying to nail Jell-O to a wall.

But kudos to RBK for pointing out that FTP was sharing Communist Chinese agitprop. I doubt he knew, but it comports with his recent posting of Canadian Ingsoc agitprop.

#4203

Haha. I remember when, some years ago, I would try to engage with secular and atheist groups. I always felt that the goal of these groups was to prove to the world (or at least Americans) that atheists are just normal people who happen to be non-religious. Atheists are no better or worse than anyone else. If people start to believe this then atheism could become normalized...and... maybe an atheist could get elected to public office or something. I always felt this was the right goal.

So, I was a member of every atheist group under the sun. I thought that atheists had a political momentum. I was sick of my fellow citizens thinking atheists were arrogant communist perverts.

Well fuck. It turns out that all the activist atheists were arrogant communist perverts.... and they were screaming "I am better than you! I am better than you." So, when I tried to get these groups to be more inclusive of libertarian leaning people like me I was called names. That ship sailed away and I couldn't stop it. I quit every group. They can go be arrogant communist perverts without me.

So, I just ignore them. I trolled them for a while... and that was kind of fun... but I don't bother anymore. I do get a self addressed envelope from AHA every year asking for a donation. I return the form with no donation and write "Get woke go broke!... love, Richard Dawkins". They still send me envelopes.

AHA just made Dr. Fauci Humanist of the Year. WTF. They are all brain dead lemmings.

and who shows up as the real heroes of freedom. Fucking Canadian truck drivers. (mind blow! boom!) Now I am a fan of truck drivers instead of Sam Harris. Yeah.... fuck Sam Harris. Haha.

#4204

John D,
I have never tried to be an activists, but I couldn't agree more.

It's all fucking depressing. Hate the Trump support i see here though...

#4205

I used to get the emails from CfI, too. CfI went full woketard, and right now is in full 'hur-dur, anti-vaxx horse goo gobblers are so stoopid' mode. It's the equivalent of a religion. Calvinism, to be exact.

Yeah, and the 'atheists are just ordinary folks, too' schtick didn't jive too well with 'except we're swingers. And we're not trying to convert, but we're better than you, because we've evolved past that primitive emotion, jealousy, to a state where we're happy when other guys fuck our women.'

Alrighty then. I'll be sure to vote for you as PTA chair, neighbor.

#4206

More WEITardation from Paul Topping.

On doubting election results:

"Saying an election was stolen is something that can be objectively proven one way or another…. [A]ssuming it reaches court they would have to back up their statement with facts.”

On Whoopi Goldberg saying the Holocaust was not about race:

"I’m against them dumping her from the show just because of one stupid comment for which she’s apologized."

Pretty sure the racial animus of the Holocaust can be objectively proven one way or the other.

#4207

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
MarcusAu wrote: ↑
Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑ No Gish galloping, promise. We'll stick to that one item.
What was it people used to say? "Nobody speaks for the 'Pit"
Fine, you Gish gallop. Dorothy or Lillian, your choice.

As it was in the beginning, is now and shall every be... (appreciate the movie reference though).

On a tangential note, for those interesting in fingering the pulse of the online atheist movement...there was recently a migration for the atheist bloggers at Patheos (Hemant etc) to a new site - Only Sky - in response to their being asked to not criticise religion..

Due diligence link follows:
https://religionnews.com/2022/01/04/wha ... t-patheos/

#4208

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑ Dorothy or Lillian, your choice.

Like every kid in town, I was a 'Junior Panther'. The annual membership was inexpensive (or free?) & it came with a t-shirt & season pass to attend football home-games of the 3rd-best-college-in-Iowa. We didn't confine-ourselves to the kiddie seating section, or watching the games closely. The stadium itself was more interesting-- one of only 11 dome stadiums in the world, back then. We ran-around like spazzes & explored. Once, around 6th or 7th grade, I met a girl who didn't attend the normal public school-- she went to the small 'laboratory school' on campus (reflecting the University's origin as a 'Teacher's College'). She liked my jokes & climbing-around the upper rows of empty seats. Maybe I had heard her name before? I don't remember. But the other kids knew she was Annabeth Gish & she acted in movies. (I wonder which roles she had already done? IMDB sez she played the daughter of Jon Voight and Ellen Barkin... which I now think is cool/ but woulda been lost on me back-then). So that's how the rumor started that she was my "girlfriend". If I ever saw her again-- it was, like, once. Where was I? oh-- I think I was saying that Hayden Fry's Hawkeyes were the state's main attraction for football. But Iowa was uniquely dominant in Wrestling, due to Coach Dan Gable. But Dan Gable originated in my town (like a superhero, he began wrestling after his older sister was raped & murdered.) Gable's highschool & college & olympic & coaching record is superhuman. (to be on-a-par with Gable, retiring-player Tom Brady would now have-to become a coach & win 17 superbowls/ including 9 in-a-row). At the '72 Olympics, Gable won all 6 of his matches, without giving-up a single point. One of his coaches in '72 was The Iron Sheik! Speaking of pro-rasslin' Thunderbolt Patterson was from the town adjacent to ours. And Ox Baker-- who fought Snake Plisskin in Escape From New York! The non-WWE-affiliated pro-wrestling Hall of Fame is located there now. The origin of both types of wrestling-- goes-back to a late 1800's wrestler & prolific trainer, called 'Farmer Burns'-- who trained Frank Gotch (the Mike Tyson of the 1910's) So many superheroes in town. I've mentioned-before that Randy Weaver was my neighbor, until he moved to Ruby Ridge. And the real-life Joker-- John Wayne Gacy-- ran the local Kentucky Fried Chicken franchise, back in the '60s. That's where he developed his Pogo the Clown act. Starting in 5th grade, the school wrestling coaches who trained me-- had been the highschool teammates of Dan Gable. So it was a big deal, when Dan Gable dropped-by to observe our practice. We still did the 'Farmer Burns workout' because the men who had coached my coaches had-been coached by Farmer Burns himself. So I was 'trained by' Gable & Burns the same-way Annabeth Gish was 'my girlfriend'. I'm currently watching the 'Cobra Kai' reality tv show follow-up to the 1980's 'Karate Kid' documentary, which may have influenced the telling of this post. Iowa ended all covid restrictions yesterday. https://citizenfreepress.com/breaking/i ... vid-rules/ So life there will soon return to normal, and my phone will ring to tell me the Junior Panthers are getting back-together and if anyone comes between me & Annabeth, I'll have to use my secret Gallop technique on them. Awwwww sheeeeit... I already did!

#4209

From where I'm sitting, it's not WEIT and all the atheist communities that went off the rails, but you who radicalized.

Four years ago, the idea of vaccines being mandatory if you want to go to school or cross borders was uncontroversial. Now it's suddenly tyranny to want people to gain immunity without subjecting themselves and their neighbours to uncontrolled infection, in the midst of a global pandemic that resulted in nearly half a million excess deaths in the US. The silver lining is the disease is on the mild side when it could've been so much worse, and it's served as an indictment of how fragile this globalized economy is, with all the redundancy optimized away in the name of efficiency. Imagine what climate change is going to do, if you haven't decided that's a communist plot as well.

#4210

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑ And coincidentally just saw this posted at Atheists For Liberty:

novella.jpg

Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship

#4211

John D wrote: ↑ and who shows up as the real heroes of freedom. Fucking Canadian truck drivers. (mind blow! boom!) Now I am a fan of truck drivers instead of Sam Harris. Yeah.... fuck Sam Harris. Haha.

https://cantruck.ca/statement-by-canadi ... -protests/

While a number of Canadians are in Ottawa to voice their displeasure over this mandate, it also appears that a great number of these protestors have no connection to the trucking industry and have a separate agenda beyond a disagreement over cross border vaccine requirements. As these protests unfold over the weekend, we ask the Canadian public to be aware that many of the people you see and hear in media reports do not have a connection to the trucking industry.

The vast majority of Canadian truck drivers are vaccinated. Keep that in mind before you idolize them.

#4212

murtzuphlus wrote: ↑Hate the Trump support i see here though...

https://www.meme-arsenal.com/memes/1549 ... 5e07cc.jpg

Deus Vult!

#4213

Trump's not been the same since he came out...

...in support of vaccines.

#4214

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑
John D wrote: ↑ and who shows up as the real heroes of freedom. Fucking Canadian truck drivers. (mind blow! boom!) Now I am a fan of truck drivers instead of Sam Harris. Yeah.... fuck Sam Harris. Haha.
https://cantruck.ca/statement-by-canadi ... -protests/

While a number of Canadians are in Ottawa to voice their displeasure over this mandate, it also appears that a great number of these protestors have no connection to the trucking industry and have a separate agenda beyond a disagreement over cross border vaccine requirements. As these protests unfold over the weekend, we ask the Canadian public to be aware that many of the people you see and hear in media reports do not have a connection to the trucking industry.
The vast majority of Canadian truck drivers are vaccinated. Keep that in mind before you idolize them.

yeah… so I have no interestn in having this stupid convo with you… yeah… so fuck off!

#4215

I suppose Kitty assumes I am unvaccinated. Well… I am vaccinated and boosted. I am older and my wife has many health conditions. So… when I assess my safety profile I decided to get the jab. But… this was my choice and my wife’s choice. The jab has side effects and doesn’t work all that well over time. What I object to is forcing people to take this fucking experimental jab. It should be a choice. We have tortured and damaged our children because of excessive caution. Five year old kids should not get the jab. Healthy adults should be able to decide if they want the jab. Kitty can suck my ass.

#4216

Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship

What, exactly, does AFL censor?

#4217

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ From where I'm sitting, it's not WEIT and all the atheist communities that went off the rails, but you who radicalized.

Yet it's the WEITards who want to imprison people for disputing the official narrative, Center for Inquiry that's urging its followers to NOT inquire for themselves, but instead trust 'the experts.' And of course, woke fucks like AHA who support BLM and translunacy.

Four years ago, the idea of vaccines being mandatory if you want to go to school or cross borders was uncontroversial. Now it's suddenly tyranny to want people to gain immunity without subjecting themselves and their neighbours to uncontrolled infection, in the midst of a global pandemic that resulted in nearly half a million excess deaths in the US. The silver lining is the disease is on the mild side when it could've been so much worse, and it's served as an indictment of how fragile this globalized economy is, with all the redundancy optimized away in the name of efficiency. Imagine what climate change is going to do, if you haven't decided that's a communist plot as well.

... all the Gish galloping.

#4218

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ The vast majority of Canadian truck drivers are vaccinated. Keep that in mind before you idolize them.

All the more heroic of them to take a stand for freedom and the bodily autonomy of others.

I don't believe you're stupid enough to think the protest is anti-vaxx, as opposed to anti-totalitarianism. You pretending that proves you're a troll.

#4219

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship
What, exactly, does AFL censor?

I was referring to your post from Novella. Maybe AfL don't and maybe Novella doesn't directly, but looks like Novella wants to chill free speech by making it expensive.

So I misinterpreted the comment: apologies if I Triggered you, Roy Rogers

#4220

Wasn't Avenatti the attorney that PeeZus used?

Well, he's been convicted of stealing from Stormy Daniels: https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-wor ... note-says/

Seems kinda just that SleeZus would use an attorney like that.

#4221

If he wasn't then fuck it.

#4222

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ The vast majority of Canadian truck drivers are vaccinated. Keep that in mind before you idolize them.

We know that. We aren't a cult. We have are inclusive of differing choices, made freely.
John D got vax'd, Matt didn't.

The line between anti-vax and anti-coercion is only blurred by the Regime.

An Orwellian example is Merriam-Webster dictionary changing the definition of "anti-vaxxer" to include
VACCINATED people who oppose LAWS mandating vaccination:
“Definition of anti-vaxxer – A person who opposes vaccination or laws that mandate vaccination.”

Then, in September 2021, Merriam-Webster changed the definition AGAIN: to include
Vaccinated people who oppose-- not laws-- but, now, mere "REGULATIONS" of any-sort:
Definition of anti-vaxxer: a person who opposes the use of vaccines or regulations mandating vaccination

Justin Trudeau muddies the waters... about the nature of his "fringe minority" opposition, even-further.
Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance Is Strength. and vAx aPaRtHeId iS iNcLuSiViTy:

Useful idiots promulgate the regime's lie:

Those aren't the only Orwellian revisionism of definitions. In the last 3 years, the CDC changed the definition of "vaccine" to include the Trump/Big Pharma mRNA products... which are not "vaccines" according to longstanding definitions: weakened, killed, or fragmented disease, introduce into the body to stimulate immunity.

Then, when the Trump/Big Pharma products failed to meet the "immunity" standard, they changed the definition again in APRIL 2021: omitting the word "immunity", so that FAILED JAB would still qualify.

Things have changed in the last 4 years. Suddenly it was indeed tyranny.

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑
"Four years ago, the idea of vaccines being mandatory if you want to go to school or cross borders was uncontroversial. Now it's suddenly tyranny to want people to gain immunity without subjecting themselves and their neighbours to uncontrolled infection, in the midst of a global pandemic"

Oopsie! ROBOKiTTY just posted MEDICAL DISINFORMATION. Vaccination was NOT mandatory to go to school or cross borders.
Vaccination was CONTRAINDICATED in individuals who already developed Natural Immunity by prior recovery from Measles, Mumps, etc.

But that-too was reversed in the recent Covid Panic. The FAKE NEWS you are echo-ing-- lied to you.

As-did all-sorts of official public institutions... right up to members of the US Supreme Court saying weird shit about Omicron being "just as deadly" as previous variants, and 100,000 imaginary American children on respirators currently

"...in the midst of a global pandemic" is also a FAKE NEWS propaganda phrase, infecting your brain.

In reality, "in the midst of a global pandemic" is a reason NOT to vaccinate. Even vaccines which are effective PRIOR to an outbreak-wave... become counterproductive when administered DURING a pandemic.

Rather than halting the outbreak of a variant... during a pandemic we can't vaccinate Everyone Instantly All At Once.

And so the vax acts only-as a sorting mechanism: to weed-out the variants which are blocked by the vax... thus INCUBATING vax-resistant variants.

Even the partial-protection provided by mid-pandemic vaccination... ensures that super-deadly variants which would ordinarily kill the Patient Zero host body (halting spread immediately)... instead turn Patient Zero into a Typhoid Mary... spreading the deadly new variant to everyone they meet-- killing tens or hundreds or thousands of people. (use the Pit search field to look-up 'Marek's disease'.

No matter how quickly and completely you might vaccinate every human on earth-- in a perfect fantasy-world-- Covid would still survive & re-infect humans... due to the ANIMAL RESERVOIRS which harbor covid.

Even Fauci acknowledged "animal reservoirs" 2 days ago.

"...but Trump" doesn't come-close to being worse than all this shit. Build The Wall. Chy-na is Asshoe. Joe Rogan Did Nothing Wrong.

#4223

Service Dog wrote: ↑"...but Trump" doesn't come-close to being worse than all this shit. Build The Wall. Chy-na is Asshoe. Joe Rogan Did Nothing Wrong.

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/ori ... -nigga.jpg

#4224

Lsuoma wrote: ↑
Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship
What, exactly, does AFL censor?
I was referring to your post from Novella. Maybe AfL don't and maybe Novella doesn't directly, but looks like Novella wants to chill free speech by making it expensive.

So I misinterpreted the comment: apologies if I Triggered you, Roy Rogers

Well, there is a round-about, squint and it might looks like it, sort of cuntishness being practised by Thomas Sheedy, head of AfL (and others too).

If I recall correctly, Sheedy stated that he is against blasphemy laws. But then supported the firing of Michael Sherlock as head of AAI - for Sherlock's calling religion a 'retarded relic' and referring to someone as a 'cunt' on twitter.

Which amounts to supporting a secular blasphemy law.

Sheedy is now an 'advisor' to the AAI - so apparently does not want to ruffle feathers there.

#4225

Two of you instantly dismiss contrary thought as trolling, and you complain about me pointing out that you vandalized this forum into an echo chamber and just abused dissenters until they left or no longer care to put up with this tiresome conspiracy theorizing.

You insist that being anti-coercion is not the same thing as being anti-vax, so why did two of you undermine the vaccines in the same breath?

Speaking of Gish galloping...

In the last 3 years, the CDC changed the definition of "vaccine" to include the Trump/Big Pharma mRNA products... which are not "vaccines" according to longstanding definitions: weakened, killed, or fragmented disease, introduce into the body to stimulate immunity.

Then, when the Trump/Big Pharma products failed to meet the "immunity" standard, they changed the definition again in APRIL 2021: omitting the word "immunity", so that FAILED JAB would still qualify.

CDC site in 2017: https://web.archive.org/web/20170421072 ... basics.htm

So no, in 2017, which was 4-5 years ago, the definition was nothing like what you asserted. The definition you provided is for inoculation, and that hasn't changed, even if the word is colloquially interchangeable with vaccination.

There is a change of wording from 'immunity' to 'protection', which was done for people who couldn't understand that immunity has never meant complete invulnerability; it has that connotation only in colloquial language. You will not find definitions of immunity saying it means some kind of absolute force field. There is no 'immunity' standard, because it's a vague word. The 'immune' system is a very fallible thing.

Oopsie! ROBOKiTTY just posted MEDICAL DISINFORMATION. Vaccination was NOT mandatory to go to school or cross borders.
Vaccination was CONTRAINDICATED in individuals who already developed Natural Immunity by prior recovery from Measles, Mumps, etc.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/imz-manage ... index.html

"All states, the District of Columbia, and territories have vaccination requirements for children attending childcare facilities and schools. These vaccination requirements are important tools for maintaining high vaccination coverage and low rates of vaccine-preventable diseases (VPDs). Exemptions from vaccination requirements may apply for some children."

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/ ... llers.html

This article, which has not been updated since COVID, lists two vaccines required of travellers by international law.

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/ ... cerns.html

There's nothing saying vaccines are contraindicated in individuals who already recovered from MMR, only those in the middle of an acute illness.

"...in the midst of a global pandemic" is also a FAKE NEWS propaganda phrase, infecting your brain.

In reality, "in the midst of a global pandemic" is a reason NOT to vaccinate. Even vaccines which are effective PRIOR to an outbreak-wave... become counterproductive when administered DURING a pandemic.

So which is it, is it fake news propaganda or a reason not to vaccinate? You can't have it both ways.

Give citations from reputable peer-reviewed journals that say vaccines are counterproductive during a pandemic, either specifically in the case of COVID or generally.

And so the vax acts only-as a sorting mechanism: to weed-out the variants which are blocked by the vax... thus INCUBATING vax-resistant variants.

Even the partial-protection provided by mid-pandemic vaccination... ensures that super-deadly variants which would ordinarily kill the Patient Zero host body (halting spread immediately)... instead turn Patient Zero into a Typhoid Mary... spreading the deadly new variant to everyone they meet-- killing tens or hundreds or thousands of people. (use the Pit search field to look-up 'Marek's disease'.

So that's this paper: https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/a ... io.1002198

Except the paper's lead author himself came out and wrote this: https://theconversation.com/vaccines-co ... hot-165960

Some choice excerpts:

"Nothing in our paper remotely justifies an anti-vaccine stance. That misinterpretation – if it causes people to choose not to be vaccinated – will lead to avoidable, and tragic, loss of life. A new study estimates that as of early May 2021, vaccines had already prevented nearly 140,000 deaths in the U.S.
[...]
Nothing we have discovered or even hypothesized justifies avoiding or withholding vaccines. If anything, our work adds to reasons for investigating new vaccine schedules – and for developing second- and third-generation vaccines.
[...]
In the history of human and animal vaccines, there have not been many cases of vaccine-driven evolution. But in every one of them, individuals and populations have always been better off when vaccinated. At every point in the 50-year history of vaccination against Marek’s disease, an individual chicken exposed to the virus was healthier if it was vaccinated. Variants may have reduced the benefit of vaccination, but they never eliminated the benefit. Evolution is no reason to avoid vaccination."

#4226

Done with Kitty. Will never reply again. No point discussing complex topics with a troll. You all have fun with this ignorant twat if you enjoy that sort of thing.

#4227

John D wrote: ↑ Done with Kitty. Will never reply again. No point discussing complex topics with a troll. You all have fun with this ignorant twat if you enjoy that sort of thing.

Done with? You've done nothing but hurl abuse and insults this entire time. You haven't tried "discussing complex topics" at all.

Over the years, I've always made a point of being civil. Even when I said things that people here felt the need to insult me over, I always did my best to respond calmly and without abuse. If you find my style of communication, my opinions, or my Internet persona annoying, so be it, but don't act like you made an effort.

#4228

Lsuoma wrote: ↑
Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship
What, exactly, does AFL censor?
I was referring to your post from Novella. Maybe AfL don't and maybe Novella doesn't directly, but looks like Novella wants to chill free speech by making it expensive.

So I misinterpreted the comment: apologies if I Triggered you, Roy Rogers

Novella is the wanker who hosts The Skeptic's Guide to the Universe podcast, the panel of which once featured Beckybooze.

AFL is Justin Vacula's org, and it posted that screenshot from Novella.

#4229

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ you .... abused dissenters

You're fabricating a phony victim narrative.
The pitters you're deeming abuse-victims -- were treated no-worse... than the way they treated the pitters you're-calling abusers.

John D. just flashed you a peace-sign with one hand & a middle-finger with the other-- and said he's done talking to you.

Here's how you characterized others who did the same thing, to my side:

...they left or no longer care to put up with this tiresome conspiracy theorizing.

very-different-- from how you describe John doing it:

Done with? You've done nothing but hurl abuse and insults this entire time. You haven't tried "discussing complex topics" at all.

Don't worry. The REGIME APOLOGIST QUITTERS have an entire internet Safe Space-- where they can rubber-stamp whatever shit Facebook & the CCP & Dr. Jill Biden OMG/yn approves-of this week, with zero concern for being censored, or losing their job for-it, or cops knocking at their door.

I think highly of John D. -- but I won't be surprised if he changes his mind & decides to talk to you again. For the sake of consistency... he should 'stick the robokitty flounce' I suppose. but... shrug. If he was drinking tonight/ he might reconsider tomorrow. But-- Kitty-- you should DEFINITELY give John the same benefit of the doubt-- you gave other pitters who stormed-off. Otherwise you're cherry-picking when to apply your 'rules'.

You insist that being anti-coercion is not the same thing as being anti-vax, so why did two of you undermine the vaccines in the same breath?

Can you admit that's↑ a dumb sentence? Some people are anti-vax. Some people are anti-mandate. Some Are Both, silly.
You haven't identified a contradiction. Have one of these: :twatson:

In my case--

1. I try-to achieve an informed-layman's understanding of the medical realities-- and

2. I err on the side of amplifying dissidents who are being silenced for expression of contrary opinions. (Such as me posting these notes on a video released by Canadian physicians-- after Dr. Malone was banned from Twitter for linking-to the video: https://slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic.ph ... ed#p507363 ) I don't know whether everything in that video was true/ but I know it shouldn't be censored.

so

3. For me, the medical arguments are somewhat moot... that's not where I'm taking-a-stand. My stand is on the political philosophy front-- individual freedom, freedom of conscience, our bodies & our children-- don't belong to the govt, etc. When in doubt-- the burden is on those infringing on my personal rights-- to justify their incursion. Not on me to explain my "No."

Speaking of Gish galloping...

I think 'Gish galloping' is a silly charge, in response to a forum post. Just read it slower! Maybe a flood-of-posts without responding to replies-- would be the equivalent of a gish gallop. But... meh.

The next large chunk-- requires me to exert-effort to check-- which I'm not gonna do between eating dinner & watching Cobra Kai. So I'll put it aside, until later. Thanks for the reply (I hope).

► Show Spoiler

Dog ↑ "...in the midst of a global pandemic" is also a FAKE NEWS propaganda phrase, infecting your brain.

In reality, "in the midst of a global pandemic" is a reason NOT to vaccinate. Even vaccines which are effective PRIOR to an outbreak-wave... become counterproductive when administered DURING a pandemic.
Kitty↑ So which is it, is it fake news propaganda or a reason not to vaccinate? You can't have it both ways.

Have another-one of these: :twatson: Because you're failing at logic, again. I said "In the midst of a global pandemic" is a Fake News propaganda phrase. Like a Thought Terminating Cliché. Which is orthogonal to whether the pandemic-in-question is real or not. Propaganda doesn't care. See?-- you CAN have it both ways.

Give citations from reputable peer-reviewed journals that say vaccines are counterproductive during a pandemic, either specifically in the case of COVID or generally.

Ok... I'll double-check & reply, later.

Same with this:

► Show Spoiler

#4230

Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Wasn't Avenatti the attorney that PeeZus used?

He used Popehat at one point. Niznayu about Avenetti.

#4231

FTR, I'm pro-vax: rabies, tetanus, West Nile, Eastern & Western Encephalitis. Call me an anti-vaxxer again, and I'll send Another Lurker over to fuck you with Steersman's' dick.

#4232

MarcusAu wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑
Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship
What, exactly, does AFL censor?
I was referring to your post from Novella. Maybe AfL don't and maybe Novella doesn't directly, but looks like Novella wants to chill free speech by making it expensive.

So I misinterpreted the comment: apologies if I Triggered you, Roy Rogers
Well, there is a round-about, squint and it might looks like it, sort of cuntishness being practised by Thomas Sheedy, head of AfL (and others too).

If I recall correctly, Sheedy stated that he is against blasphemy laws. But then supported the firing of Michael Sherlock as head of AAI - for Sherlock's calling religion a 'retarded relic' and referring to someone as a 'cunt' on twitter.

Which amounts to supporting a secular blasphemy law.

Sheedy is now an 'advisor' to the AAI - so apparently does not want to ruffle feathers there.

I now see a very noticeable tendency among so-called liberals and leftists to call for censorship.

#4233

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ Two of you instantly dismiss contrary thought as trolling, and you complain about me pointing out that you vandalized this forum into an echo chamber and just abused dissenters until they left or no longer care to put up with this tiresome conspiracy theorizing.

You insist that being anti-coercion is not the same thing as being anti-vax, so why did two of you undermine the vaccines in the same breath?

Speaking of Gish galloping...

In the last 3 years, the CDC changed the definition of "vaccine" to include the Trump/Big Pharma mRNA products... which are not "vaccines" according to longstanding definitions: weakened, killed, or fragmented disease, introduce into the body to stimulate immunity.

Then, when the Trump/Big Pharma products failed to meet the "immunity" standard, they changed the definition again in APRIL 2021: omitting the word "immunity", so that FAILED JAB would still qualify.
CDC site in 2017: https://web.archive.org/web/20170421072 ... basics.htm

So no, in 2017, which was 4-5 years ago, the definition was nothing like what you asserted. The definition you provided is for inoculation, and that hasn't changed, even if the word is colloquially interchangeable with vaccination.

There is a change of wording from 'immunity' to 'protection', which was done for people who couldn't understand that immunity has never meant complete invulnerability; it has that connotation only in colloquial language. You will not find definitions of immunity saying it means some kind of absolute force field. There is no 'immunity' standard, because it's a vague word. The 'immune' system is a very fallible thing.

Oopsie! ROBOKiTTY just posted MEDICAL DISINFORMATION. Vaccination was NOT mandatory to go to school or cross borders.
Vaccination was CONTRAINDICATED in individuals who already developed Natural Immunity by prior recovery from Measles, Mumps, etc.
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/imz-manage ... index.html

"All states, the District of Columbia, and territories have vaccination requirements for children attending childcare facilities and schools. These vaccination requirements are important tools for maintaining high vaccination coverage and low rates of vaccine-preventable diseases (VPDs). Exemptions from vaccination requirements may apply for some children."

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/ ... llers.html

This article, which has not been updated since COVID, lists two vaccines required of travellers by international law.

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-health/ ... cerns.html

There's nothing saying vaccines are contraindicated in individuals who already recovered from MMR, only those in the middle of an acute illness.

"...in the midst of a global pandemic" is also a FAKE NEWS propaganda phrase, infecting your brain.

In reality, "in the midst of a global pandemic" is a reason NOT to vaccinate. Even vaccines which are effective PRIOR to an outbreak-wave... become counterproductive when administered DURING a pandemic.
So which is it, is it fake news propaganda or a reason not to vaccinate? You can't have it both ways.

Give citations from reputable peer-reviewed journals that say vaccines are counterproductive during a pandemic, either specifically in the case of COVID or generally.

And so the vax acts only-as a sorting mechanism: to weed-out the variants which are blocked by the vax... thus INCUBATING vax-resistant variants.

Even the partial-protection provided by mid-pandemic vaccination... ensures that super-deadly variants which would ordinarily kill the Patient Zero host body (halting spread immediately)... instead turn Patient Zero into a Typhoid Mary... spreading the deadly new variant to everyone they meet-- killing tens or hundreds or thousands of people. (use the Pit search field to look-up 'Marek's disease'.
So that's this paper: https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/a ... io.1002198

Except the paper's lead author himself came out and wrote this: https://theconversation.com/vaccines-co ... hot-165960

Some choice excerpts:

"Nothing in our paper remotely justifies an anti-vaccine stance. That misinterpretation – if it causes people to choose not to be vaccinated – will lead to avoidable, and tragic, loss of life. A new study estimates that as of early May 2021, vaccines had already prevented nearly 140,000 deaths in the U.S.
[...]
Nothing we have discovered or even hypothesized justifies avoiding or withholding vaccines. If anything, our work adds to reasons for investigating new vaccine schedules – and for developing second- and third-generation vaccines.
[...]
In the history of human and animal vaccines, there have not been many cases of vaccine-driven evolution. But in every one of them, individuals and populations have always been better off when vaccinated. At every point in the 50-year history of vaccination against Marek’s disease, an individual chicken exposed to the virus was healthier if it was vaccinated. Variants may have reduced the benefit of vaccination, but they never eliminated the benefit. Evolution is no reason to avoid vaccination."

Fuck me, RK's been infected with Steerzosis! Get the vaccine, stat!!

#4234

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑
Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Atheists for Liberty == Cunts for Censorship
What, exactly, does AFL censor?
I was referring to your post from Novella. Maybe AfL don't and maybe Novella doesn't directly, but looks like Novella wants to chill free speech by making it expensive.

So I misinterpreted the comment: apologies if I Triggered you, Roy Rogers
Novella is the wanker who hosts The Skeptic's Guide to the Universe podcast, the panel of which once featured Beckybooze.

AFL is Justin Vacula's org, and it posted that screenshot from Novella.

Ah, apols then. If it's Vaccers, it must be good!

#4235

I wonder what Kitty’s definition of “woman” is.

#4236

John D wrote: ↑ I wonder what Kitty’s definition of “woman” is.

Good question, glad you asked it ...

But I wait with bated breath to hear her answer, not least because it's the crux of the whole transgender clusterfuck, it will determine who claims the Golden Apple for the fairest ....

But the issue also has some relevance to the profoundly and virulently anti- science and anti-intellectual sentiments that characterizes so many on both the left and the right, particularly among various anti-vaxxers here and elsewhere.

But as "woman" is used as both a sex (adult human female (produces ova)) and as a gender (any one of a myriad of personalities and stereotypes typical of adult human females), the only rational solution is to qualify every use of the word, i.e., woman (sex) and woman (gender). Q.E.D.

#4237

John D wrote

and who shows up as the real heroes of freedom. Fucking Canadian truck drivers. (mind blow! boom!) Now I am a fan of truck drivers instead of Sam Harris.

They're a bunch of retarded morons, shitting and pissing in the snow and annoying the Ottawans. The Canadian Army has tracked recovery vehicles and armoured bulldozers. If they started to use them to clear the roads, most of these fuckheads would be gone within hours.

#4238

zou3gou3 wrote: ↑ John D wrote
and who shows up as the real heroes of freedom. Fucking Canadian truck drivers. (mind blow! boom!) Now I am a fan of truck drivers instead of Sam Harris.
They're a bunch of retarded morons, shitting and pissing in the snow and annoying the Ottawans. The Canadian Army has tracked recovery vehicles and armoured bulldozers. If they started to use them to clear the roads, most of these fuckheads would be gone within hours.

well then… I am on board with the retarded morons! I guess I need a membership card or something

#4239

Service Dog wrote: ↑
Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:28 pm
You're fabricating a phony victim narrative.
The pitters you're deeming abuse-victims -- were treated no-worse... than the way they treated the pitters you're-calling abusers.

I'll admit there's some exasperation there, so consider it an exaggeration for rhetorical effect.

I'm not saying you're abusers. I'm just extrapolating from this hostility I'm seeing. I don't like to label people in terms of aggressors and victims. Everyone's capable of being abusive. People who are victimized can victimize others at the same time. Everyone's got their own complexities, and people can change, for better or worse. Otherwise, what's the point of having a dialogue?

This constant characterization of me as a troll isn't anything new either, and it's like a broken record.

Service Dog wrote: ↑
Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:28 pm
But-- Kitty-- you should DEFINITELY give John the same benefit of the doubt-- you gave other pitters who stormed-off. Otherwise you're cherry-picking when to apply your 'rules'.

I'm not sure what rules I've applied here, but I'll have a discussion with anyone willing to engage in good faith. I can't really help when these two are just dripping with contempt.

Service Dog wrote: ↑
Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:28 pm
In my case--

1. I try-to achieve an informed-layman's understanding of the medical realities-- and

2. I err on the side of amplifying dissidents who are being silenced for expression of contrary opinions. (Such as me posting these notes on a video released by Canadian physicians-- after Dr. Malone was banned from Twitter for linking-to the video: https://slymepit.com/phpbb/viewtopic.ph ... ed#p507363 ) I don't know whether everything in that video was true/ but I know it shouldn't be censored.

so

3. For me, the medical arguments are somewhat moot... that's not where I'm taking-a-stand. My stand is on the political philosophy front-- individual freedom, freedom of conscience, our bodies & our children-- don't belong to the govt, etc. When in doubt-- the burden is on those infringing on my personal rights-- to justify their incursion. Not on me to explain my "No."

Okay, so there are a few issues to tease apart here.

1) corporate censorship of platforms they own

I don't believe Twitter should be in the business of content policing. Expecting companies to be the arbiter of standards outside of legal obligations hands them too much power. It's a completely arbitrary exercise of power when social media platforms have so much reach.

2) what to do with harmful speech, and what is censorship

I think most people can agree that the classic example of yelling fire in a crowded theatre is a case where your freedom to say whatever you want needs to be pragmatically balanced against public welfare.

Mass media and social media have shown that they can drive any message viral regardless of its truth value or merit. So what happens when an incendiary or demonstrably false message goes viral and incites harmful action. Call this 'cancel culture', if you will. Free speech advocates would say to let the marketplace of ideas sort it out. Let fact-checkers duke it out with those who are wrong, and the truth will win.

Except it's not so obvious that the truth is winning. That's part of the idea behind the 'Gish gallop' charge. It takes no time to just say things. It takes a lot of effort to research false claims and debunk them. And more likely than not, people lose interest. Snappy sound bytes dominate. And that's why people go for the shortcut. Deplatform those that are seen to spout false or incendiary messages. Most free speech advocates would consider this censorship. But most would not consider it censorship to engage someone in bad faith or to attack someone's character.

I've expressed this belief before on here. I don't see why one is considered censorship and the other isn't. If the goal of a certain action is to influence others to disregard someone's speech without actually addressing the merits of said speech, that to me is censorship -- of a lesser type, but still censorship. People focus only on the bigger acts of censorship while tricks that bypass reasoned debate are given a pass. These must also be called out and combatted.

3) more than just bodily autonomy

You can make a case that bodily autonomy means people should not be compelled to vaccinate, but it goes beyond bodily autonomy. People on your side want bodily autonomy and also the right to access services for which vaccine requirements have traditionally existed, primarily school, healthcare settings, and cross-border travel.

There's no denial of bodily autonomy per se here. Not many care if those who don't want to get vaccinated just keep to themselves and like-minded people. The problem comes when they want to go to school, go to work, or travel across borders and mingle with non-likeminded people while unvaccinated.

Now there's an argument you could make that since work is essential to supporting yourself and your family, making vaccination a requirement to work is de facto deprivation of bodily autonomy. But the fault is not with the vaccine requirement there, but with how labour works in this society. You're free to find work in another field or place with no vaccine requirement. It's not easy, but that's the free market. I believe that needs changing, but that's not a trivial problem to solve.

Service Dog wrote: ↑
Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:28 pm
Have another-one of these: :twatson: Because you're failing at logic, again. I said "In the midst of a global pandemic" is a Fake News propaganda phrase. Like a Thought Terminating Cliché. Which is orthogonal to whether the pandemic-in-question is real or not. Propaganda doesn't care. See?-- you CAN have it both ways.

Why is it orthogonal to whether or not it's true? How is it thought-terminating? Explain it to me.

While we're on this topic, care to explain what you mean by fake news propaganda? Is that expression not itself a thought-terminating cliché? I don't know about you, but I don't just follow what Americans consider the mainstream media. I'm not in the habit of following CNN or MSNBC. I follow news from other countries and in languages other than English. There is broad agreement on truth claims with respect to COVID. Do you have evidence that journalists from around the world with conflicting goals are all in cahoots?

#4240

John D wrote: ↑ well then… I am on board with the retarded morons! I guess I need a membership card or something

Is there snow on your front lawn? You could draw a big yellow D on it.

American-style.... Standing Up!

#4241

Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Fuck me, RK's been infected with Steerzosis! Get the vaccine, stat!!

Time for fafnir to Fisk it point by point, amirite?

#4242

zou3gou3 wrote: ↑ The Canadian Army has tracked recovery vehicles and armoured bulldozers. If they started to use them to clear the roads, most of these fuckheads would be gone within hours.

Genau! Die Auflösung des Freedom Convoys durch Sonderaktion bis Einsatzgruppen! Woher haben sie solche Idee bekommen, Genosse?

#4243

The best part about Trump is that he was a middle finger to all these people. He has few other virtues. For myself in Australia, I miss the days I had someone to vote for. That hasn't been true for ages. I've been leaving my ballot blank for the last several elections because there's literally no one I can feel good about voting for.

That said, as of today, Trump is more popular than Joe Biden.

#4244

The type of the vaccine matters too. I certainly don't think the annual flu vaccine should be mandatory, but it makes a lot of sense for older people to take. The measles one, I'm uncomfortable making mandatory, but it makes a lot more sense for every child to take it. The vaccines that we are currently talking about are a lot closer to the flu vaccine than the measles one.

#4245

The last truck of the Freedumb Konvoy on its way home.

Convoy.jpeg: (61.27 KiB) Downloaded 128 times

#4246

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Fuck me, RK's been infected with Steerzosis! Get the vaccine, stat!!
Time for fafnir to Fisk it point by point, amirite?

:roll: Maybe by once again relying on tradition? No-vaccines were good enough for those "living" during the Black Plague so that should be good enough for us? :roll:

#4247

Keating wrote: ↑ The type of the vaccine matters too. I certainly don't think the annual flu vaccine should be mandatory, but it makes a lot of sense for older people to take. The measles one, I'm uncomfortable making mandatory, but it makes a lot more sense for every child to take it. The vaccines that we are currently talking about are a lot closer to the flu vaccine than the measles one.

Methinks that many if not most of the anti-vaxxer mob would object to making it mandatory that thou shalt not rob banks and not kill, that thou shalt pay thy taxes.

Basically repudiating and abrogating the whole concept of the social contract. Libertarian is one thing, anarchist quite another.

#4248

Yesterday-- February 4, 2022:
Joe Biden Bizarrely Greets Union Construction Workers In Maryland By Telling Them "Don't Jump!" :rimshot:

4 months ago-- September 8, 2021
Joe Biden suffers blunder after telling children ‘don’t jump’ off balcony :rimshot:
"President Biden spoke: “How are you pal, how old are you?”
The child responded: “Seven.”
President Biden quipped: “You are getting old! By the way, the neat thing about America, every time we end up with a problem going into a serious circumstance, we come out better than when we came in. That’s because we are so diverse, that’s America. Be proud of it. And don’t jump. :rimshot:

People responded to the video on Twitter: “He’s made this ‘joke’ in front of cameras at least 4 times in the past year, all to people that were on an elevated level.” :rimshot:
Someone else commented: “He’s used that line before in 2020.”
Others were more critical of Biden online.”

10 Months Ago-- March 9, 2021
Media Rushed Out: President Biden takes no questions after he tells people to "Don't Jump" :rimshot:

17 months ago-- September 1, 2020
"“You finally got out of your basement,” the man declared. “You’re not going to win Pennsylvania.”
Biden, who was wearing a black face mask, pulled it down as he turned and yelled in a deadpan, “Don't jump!" :rimshot:
Moments later, Biden was flying back to Delaware, where, again, only the same small group of reporters was there to greet him."

#4249

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Fuck me, RK's been infected with Steerzosis! Get the vaccine, stat!!
Time for fafnir to Fisk it point by point, amirite?

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/q5mLjKI968g/maxresdefault.jpg

#4250

Keating wrote: ↑ The best part about Trump is that he was a middle finger to all these people. He has few other virtues.

There is the way he says 'China.'

#4251

Even the skin and hair match:

#4252

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: ↑
Lsuoma wrote: ↑ Fuck me, RK's been infected with Steerzosis! Get the vaccine, stat!!
Time for fafnir to Fisk it point by point, amirite?

I din't think so, that would drag on far too much (SWIDT?)

#4253

Obligatory:

#4254

So... back to GLOBOKiTTY. Let's work our way thru this, one step at a time:

John D. said, "Now I am a fan of truck drivers instead of Sam Harris."

Kitty replied:

]
The vast majority of Canadian truck drivers are vaccinated. Keep that in mind before you idolize them.

John replied-- that he's double-vax'd & boosted. (& Matt specified his refusal of the Covid jab/ vs. all the vaccines he accepts.)

I added: "We aren't a cult. We have are inclusive of differing choices, made freely. John D got vax'd, Matt didn't.
The line between anti-vax and anti-coercion is only blurred by the Regime."

Kitty replied:

You insist that being anti-coercion is not the same thing as being anti-vax, so why did two of you undermine the vaccines in the same breath?

Kitty also offered specific refutations to some of the examples I offered— such Orwellian dictionary changes & medical claims.

SO… what I wanna know is… what are we arguing-about?

Namely, ROBOKiTTY, do you even dispute the Premise— that Trudeau & Biden & the Covid Orthodoxy Regime (Big Pharma, Big Tech, ‘mainstream’ newspapers & tv-news, etc.) — have reduced the opponents of coercion… to the inaccurate generalization: “anti-vaxxers”?

Or… do you concede that overall Premise, disputing-only specific Examples I provided ?

Which do you object-to… only the Examples? Or both the Examples & the Premise?

#4255

It's no spinning dancer...but just in case someone feels like a snack...

#4256

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ I'm not sure what rules I've applied here, but I'll have a discussion with anyone willing to engage in good faith.

OK, I'll start...

What % human are you currently - and has it changed since you began posting?

#4257

#4258

MarcusAu wrote: ↑
Sat Feb 05, 2022 12:00 pm
OK, I'll start...

What % human are you currently - and has it changed since you began posting?

I'm 100% human and have always been. But I've long felt pretty fed up with the genetic hand I was dealt and wanted nothing to do with it in some kind of futurist/transhumanist fashion. Imagine having lifelong health issues, and your immune system enjoyed attacking your body more than infections. Probably you might start to wish you could replace the defective parts with something better engineered. I decided to make light of that and turned it into an Internet persona. Perhaps it was silly and difficult to relate to. Maybe the more fantastical aspects of the narrative were unwarranted. Nonetheless, it was not trolling.

#4259

ROBOKiTTY wrote: ↑ Imagine having lifelong health issues, and your immune system enjoyed attacking your body more than infections.

Now imagine the government injects that into kids.

Their fresh little immune systems, ready to fight future disease challenges/ instead are trained-by-injection to devote bandwidth, forever-after, to fighting a specific strain of a specific disease, which ran its course 2 years ago, and never-even threatened children.

#4260

Um... yeah.... I support the truckers.