There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

Old subthreads
Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15301

Post by Brive1987 »

Shatterface wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Once again, thanks for the zingers. Ouch. :lol:

It’s still not clear, whether Australia 1977 was an ethnostate, whether Switzerland is one or whether Poland is. Or do we look back to Nazism or forward to Spencer-land? Do we howl “ethnostate” at any measure designed to readdress the new demographic initiatives?

Feel free to actually address this question at any time.
Here's my definition of an ethnic state: the psychological condition of being a boring cunt continually waffling on about ethnonationalism being a panacea for society's ills but expecting other people to define it for you.

If it means anything other than the delusion that belonging to a particular ethnicity compensates for your inadequacies as an individual, then you fucking define it, then we'll critique it for you, because you are boring the fucking shit out of people.
I don’t actually use or like the term. But it’s thrown my way, so I thought it worthwhile to know what you gentlemen were waffling on about. It appears your (well Kirbs, but really what’s the dif?) definition is quite different to what I’ve been arguing for.

Agreed definitions. Sometimes they are useful. Even for someone like you, who swims in their own dystopic feelz.

ConcentratedH2O, OM
.
.
Posts: 6555
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:51 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15302

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM »

Footage of Tommy Robinson tackling a nonce;


Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15303

Post by Brive1987 »

Shatterface wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:
Shatterface wrote:
Karmakin wrote: I think the perception people have, is that ethnic identitarianism IS going to be the political framework of the future. There's no ifs ands or buts. You can't stop the oncoming train. It's on its way.
You can add 'historical inevitability' to the elements ethnonationalism shares with communism.
Between this and the liberal call to the inevitability of global cultural mixing, well there are just so many trains on these tracks. ..

At this point I can't even be arsed to Google a yawning gif.
It’s not easy to find one of a baby wearing ear plugs - and at the same time screaming.
Commiserations.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 11165
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15304

Post by free thoughtpolice »

multiculturism=ethnocide
mooning.PNG
(266.59 KiB) Downloaded 233 times

KiwiInOz
.
.
Posts: 5425
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:28 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15305

Post by KiwiInOz »

Kirbmarc wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 12:35 am
snip for Brivety

According to most definitions ethno-state is a country where citizenship is based on ethnicity. So neither Australia 1977 or Switzerland or Poland now are "ethno-states". Nazi Germany (post-Nuremberg laws) and the future hypothetical Spencer-land fit the bill.

By the way Switzerland has football players with ancestors of Albanian ethnicity who are from Kosovo, and who are secular muslims, or from Cote d'Ivoire as members of its national football team. Some "ethno-state".

The problem is that ethno-identitarians, even if they don't explicitly want an ethno-state as it's the commonly accepted definition, is that they STILL want a "primacy" of ethnicity over other considerations. So they paint any influx of non-"ethnic" immigrants as an "invasion" or even "a white genocide" or "the end of the west", they bemoan immigrants who DO integrate within the socio-political background of their host counties as "whites losing their history", they wish to reduce the numbers of non-"ethnic" people living in a specific country as much as possible (ideally to zero in some cases).

The real issue is the focus on emphasizing "ethnic identity" rather than on how to successfully integrate people from different ethnic backgrounds. Are there problems of integration? Sure, of course, and they're not the same problems for all the different ethnic backgrounds. Should immigration be regulated? Of course, according to a series of factors, including housing issues, work issues, and yes, also issues about integration, if necessary. Should we remove or force leave, or discriminate people who already live in a country just on the basis of their ethnic background? No. Should ethnicity be the meter of judgment through which we evaluate people in general, as opposed to beliefs or behavior? No.
https://peterpix.files.wordpress.com/20 ... c_5455.jpg

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15306

Post by Brive1987 »

Kirbmarc wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:19 am

There is no clear border between "ethnicity" and "race". Judaism, technically speaking, isn't a "race", but the Nazis deliberately discriminated against Jews since 1935 in explicitly racialized term. That there are no ethno-states now is a very good thing.

Also you're the one who first brought up the term "ethno-state" in positive terms, saying that you were sympathetic to the idea without defining it, you're the one who promoted ethnic identitarians like Southern, who have EXPLICITLY argued that non-white people in France are going to be "the death of France", or like Mark Collett, who argued that a non-white woman playing Joan D'Arc is somehow robbing white people of their history.

Furthermore, if you think that Switzerland is populated and run in the interests of an ethnic group, when there are roughly 250,000 of people who would be defined as "non-white" in Switzerland, plus roughly 200,000 people from the Balkans, who are "white" but muslims, then you're pretty delusional. A strong focus on integration through social institution and many requirements for immigration to become a citizen do not mean that the country is "ran in the interest of an ethnic group".

Hell, muslims (or at least people who are identified as much) make up 5% of all residents in Switzerland, while only 2.6% of residents in Australia. Yet according to you Switzerland is an "ethno-state" while Australia apparently isn't. :bjarte:
Ethnicity (and race) work better for groups than for individuals. My concern has always been for the ‘essential character’ (a term no less or more loose than other constructs) that determines national identity. And against the pomo forces demanding deconstruction of same. In whose camp I place yourself and, at a more extreme level and with different motivations, SJWs.

I don’t like “ethnostate” as “in the interests” runs the gamut from Swiss National and canton concerns, through to current day Poland and into Nazi Germany.

Your continued use of the term annoys me because you never made it clear where in a given post you were placing the needle. In fact it changed according to your need.

In Australia the term would refer to a 1970s, 1980s state quite different to Hungary the Walloons or France.

Alt-lite are making strong demographic based arguments and arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process. Liberals aren’t.

If you haven’t the capacity (or desire) to approach these alt people in a considered fashion and come to your own conclusions, well tough.

KiwiInOz
.
.
Posts: 5425
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:28 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15307

Post by KiwiInOz »

InfraRedBucket wrote:
John D wrote: This is good.
Yikes! Does she really say "The deportation of a dozen illegal gang bangers" in the first minute?
Fair enough. A gangbang should be both legal and consensual.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 11165
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15308

Post by free thoughtpolice »


KiwiInOz
.
.
Posts: 5425
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:28 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15309

Post by KiwiInOz »

I hadn't realised that Little House on the Prairie had been laying pipes in my childhood.

KiwiInOz
.
.
Posts: 5425
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:28 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15310

Post by KiwiInOz »

Is Mongolia the feminist utopia?

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 11165
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15311

Post by free thoughtpolice »

Alt-lite are making strong demographic based arguments and arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process.
It sounds like you are using an alt-right version of the po mo slogan generator. Are you working at making your writing hard to understand?
It reminds me of arguing with an SJW about the concept of say white privilege and they answer back with strings of horseshit philosophical jargon that is word salad that they think makes them sound really sophisticated.

KiwiInOz
.
.
Posts: 5425
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:28 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15312

Post by KiwiInOz »

Has anyone heard from Fluffy Bunny? I hope that his wife is ok.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15313

Post by Brive1987 »

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Alt-lite are making strong demographic based arguments and arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process.
It sounds like you are using an alt-right version of the po mo slogan generator. Are you working at making your writing hard to understand?
It reminds me of arguing with an SJW about the concept of say white privilege and they answer back with strings of horseshit philosophical jargon that is word salad that they think makes them sound really sophisticated.
Are we back to talking like a five year old. :(

I assume “demographic based arguments” is kosher.

Deconstruction = the intentional dismantling of status quo values and concepts that together define national identity.

Structures = groups and collectives (in this case) with broadly aligned (albeit seperate) agendas. liberal media, Universities, progressive church, liberal organisations, SJW clans, global business entities .....

The problem with the alt right is their conspiracy based interpretation of these structures and their focus on race instead of a unique national identity (and functional society) based on shared cultural values, tradition and heritage.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 11165
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15314

Post by free thoughtpolice »

KiwiInOz wrote: Has anyone heard from Fluffy Bunny? I hope that his wife is ok.
Here is hoping he is just busy and the Mrs. will mend.She sounds like a special gal.

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 11165
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15315

Post by free thoughtpolice »

Brive1987 wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Alt-lite are making strong demographic based arguments and arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process.
It sounds like you are using an alt-right version of the po mo slogan generator. Are you working at making your writing hard to understand?
It reminds me of arguing with an SJW about the concept of say white privilege and they answer back with strings of horseshit philosophical jargon that is word salad that they think makes them sound really sophisticated.
Are we back to talking like a five year old. :(

I assume “demographic based arguments” is kosher.

Deconstruction = the intentional dismantling of status quo values and concepts that together define national identity.

Structures = groups and collectives (in this case) with broadly aligned (albeit seperate) agendas. liberal media, Universities, progressive church, liberal organisations, SJW clans, global business entities .....

The problem with the alt right is their conspiracy based interpretation of these structures and their focus on race instead of a unique national identity (and functional society) based on shared cultural values, tradition and heritage.
I'm not asking you to talk like a 5 year old. I'm just trying to urge you to try not to be such a pseudo-intellectual pretentious cunt.
Maybe instead of "Alt lite are making strong demographic arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process" did you mean:
"Alt lite are arguing strongly about (traditional) groups that are being misrepresented by SJW rhetoric?"

Steersman
.
.
Posts: 10933
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:58 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15316

Post by Steersman »

Brive1987 wrote:
free thoughtpolice wrote:
Alt-lite are making strong demographic based arguments and arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process.
It sounds like you are using an alt-right version of the po mo slogan generator. ....
<snip>

The problem with the alt right is their conspiracy based interpretation of these structures and their focus on race instead of a unique national identity (and functional society) based on shared cultural values, tradition and heritage.
ICYMI, I'm sure you and many of your *tribe* will want to check out this forthcoming talk with Douglas Murray ["The Strange Death of Europe"], et al in Sydney, August 12 ... ;-) :
DayOfReckoning.jpg
(68.47 KiB) Downloaded 199 times
https://www.pangburnphilosophy.com/full ... e-ji9ryb9w

Steersman
.
.
Posts: 10933
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:58 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15317

Post by Steersman »

Shatterface wrote:
Ministers put curbs on trans rights

Groups that exclude self-identifying women from female-only sites are to be protected


Ministers have vowed to defend women’s rights to exclude transgender people from female-only spaces such as changing rooms, lavatories and swimming sessions.

<snip>

Mordaunt has signalled she is not yet persuaded that people should be allowed to select their gender without requiring a formal medical diagnosis of “gender dysphoria,” in a big shift from the language of Justine Greening, who trailed the proposals a year ago when she was women and equalities minister.

<snip>

A government source said: “An exemption clause on a case-by-case basis is a commonsense solution to some of the objections raised to the government’s plans to make it easier for adults to change their gender legally without a doctor’s certificate.”
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/mini ... 056695238d
Hallelujah; the times, they are a-changin'.

Though no one "should be allowed to select their gender", at least where it has any bearing on government services - if they want to *identify* as any of four or six dozen, and counting, "genders" for their own amusement and jollies then fine - fill yur boots guys and gals and otherkin. But people come in 2 sexes or none. Although it is maybe moot how governments should differentially deal with those groups - driver's licenses, passports, "all-women shortlists", and such.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 15449
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15318

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Isn't there supposed to be a dedicated thread for this annoying shit?

free thoughtpolice
.
.
Posts: 11165
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:27 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15319

Post by free thoughtpolice »


AndrewV69
.
.
Posts: 8146
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15320

Post by AndrewV69 »

KiwiInOz wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 3:51 pm
Is Mongolia the feminist utopia?
I told you guys I spent seven months in Jamaica? I saw pretty much the same thing there. I also witnessed intense intra-female competition everywhere I went.

Yes I got a lot of attention from females half my age.

Old_ones
.
.
Posts: 2168
Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:46 pm
Location: An hour's drive from Hell.

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15321

Post by Old_ones »

MarcusAu wrote: Maybe I am missing something...but does anyone find this explanation convincing?



And if it has managed to change your mind - are you no longer an atheist?
How is that even an argument? We need axia in order to interpret the world, therefore one of the axia has to be a supernatural space monkey who wants to regulate our genitals? I assume there has to be more to this than what he is presenting, because what he is presenting seems absurd. I can't see what could possibly argue for the christian god as a starting point for anything.

rayshul
.
.
Posts: 4871
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:00 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15322

Post by rayshul »

I'm reading a lot of sad times ahead lately, what do you all think the chances are realistically of the ocmplete islamification of europe?

I don't think it'll be possible in the US, given the US has guns and shitty welfare. But I can't see things ending up any other way for Eruope.

Steersman
.
.
Posts: 10933
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:58 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15323

Post by Steersman »

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: Isn't there supposed to be a dedicated thread for this annoying shit?
De gustibus. And I kind of got the impression that the main thread was for topics many people have some interest in, and are willing to make some contributions to. Which seems to be the case.

Steersman
.
.
Posts: 10933
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:58 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15324

Post by Steersman »

rayshul wrote: I'm reading a lot of sad times ahead lately, what do you all think the chances are realistically of the ocmplete islamification of europe?

I don't think it'll be possible in the US, given the US has guns and shitty welfare. But I can't see things ending up any other way for Eruope.
Not sure where you're reading of course, but Gatestone Institutue - highly recommended BTW - certainly gives some evidence that that - "the complete islamification of europe" - is the way the wind is blowing:
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/1248 ... ritain-may
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/1215 ... many-march
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/1134 ... sm-october
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/1023 ... ce-belgium
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/9431 ... am-october

Etc, etc, etc. The barbarians are at the fucking gates and the clueless left have been busy - literally for decades - cutting off their noses to spite their faces, and everyone else's, by welcoming them with open arms - creating a myriad of fifth columns in the process. ICYMI, a salient quote or two from an interview in The Federalist with one Dr. Zuhdi Jasser, head of the Muslim Reform Movement (MRM):
Q: In the MRM’s inaugural press conference, you said American mosques that reject the MRM’s declaration of principles are part of the problem, while those that accept the principles are part of the solution. How many mosques did the MRM approach? Did most of these mosques accept or reject these principles?

A: We spent significant resources on this outreach over a period of ten months. We reached out through snail mail, e-mail, and telephone to over 3,000 mosques and over 500 known public American Muslims. We received only 40-plus rather dismissive responses from our outreach, and sadly less than ten of them were positive. In fact, one mosque in South Carolina left us a vicious voice mail threatening our staff if we contacted them again. ....

Q: In the last 30 years, Saudi Arabia has spent more than an estimated $100 billion to fund the spread of Wahhabism worldwide (in contrast to the $7 billion the USSR spent spreading communism from 1921 through 1991). How does the MRM hope to compete with these vast Saudi expenditures?

A: That’s the elephant in the room. The West needs a major information program to advance ideas of liberty. The hope is that the free world will take the side of liberty, and theocracies and quasi-theocracies will fall. ....
Prognosis doesn't look particularly good, even in America.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 15449
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15325

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Ah well. A longtime friend, with whom I first connected with in 2008 when we were both being called racists for supporting HRC over obama in the primaries, just unfriended me on FB, said I'd "gone insane" and called me a racist for noting the lies about the immigration photos and for posting "Peterson bigotry shit".

Just a few days earlier, he was cracking up about my anti-trump jokes and said I should have my own podcast.

It's the world that's gone insane.

Hunt
.
.
Posts: 3282
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:04 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15326

Post by Hunt »

Timeless truths, timeless truths. ;)

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15327

Post by Brive1987 »

Driftless wrote: When you talk about "shared ancestry", what is the cutoff date? Can I go back to the common ancestor of humans and chimps so that chimps are part of my ethnostate?
No. That would be stupid.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15328

Post by Brive1987 »

Driftless wrote: chimps
Ah. And what Kirb really meant by nice first post was, of course, “fuck off and pls leave the lynx behind unmolested”

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15329

Post by Brive1987 »

free thoughtpolice wrote:
I'm not asking you to talk like a 5 year old. I'm just trying to urge you to try not to be such a pseudo-intellectual pretentious cunt.
Maybe instead of "Alt lite are making strong demographic arguments around structures which are part of the deconstruction process" did you mean:
"Alt lite are arguing strongly about (traditional) groups that are being misrepresented by SJW rhetoric?"
No. That is not what I meant.

Which is why I wrote what I did. Also you mashed my original sentence.

Which, given the context, is weirdly ironic.

Steersman
.
.
Posts: 10933
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:58 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15330

Post by Steersman »

Old_ones wrote:
MarcusAu wrote: Maybe I am missing something...but does anyone find this explanation convincing?

https: ... twitter.com/jordanbpeterson/status/1009842718158118913

And if it has managed to change your mind - are you no longer an atheist?
How is that even an argument? We need axia in order to interpret the world, therefore one of the axia has to be a supernatural space monkey who wants to regulate our genitals? I assume there has to be more to this than what he is presenting, because what he is presenting seems absurd. I can't see what could possibly argue for the christian god as a starting point for anything.
It's definitely a bit of a weak one, and Peterson's "faith" is predicated on a rather narrow definition, and doesn't show much evidence of awareness of more fundamental aspects. Which is a bit surprising as the dichotomy between faith and reason is rather well plowed ground - though moot how fertile it is.



But I think that's one of the worst aspects of the "Peterson phenomenon" - our tendency to "valorize opinions", as Alice Dreger recently phrased it in a general context, means Peterson very frequently winds up out of his depth; Emperor's New Clothes and all that.

Though I think he still makes some good points, even if they're kind of murky and badly stitched together. The facts of the matter are that we all have different interests and aptitudes and abilities to handle or comprehend different concepts - one doesn't start a child's education by trying to get them to understand quantum mechanics; arithmetic and times-tables aren't less true because they're basic. Likewise with many of the religious concepts Peterson is trying to promote; I think this quote of Dawkins from his The Selfish Gene kind of hits the nail on the head and provides a nice analogy:

Dawkins_SelfishGene_Sctn_1A.jpg
(102.75 KiB) Downloaded 151 times

Anthropomorphizing - "personifying" - the universe can be a be problematic, particularly if one gets overly literal, if it's not done with "due care and caution". But I think it can also provide some significant benefits - and not just to those "further back along the curve".

Kirbmarc
.
.
Posts: 10577
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 8:29 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15331

Post by Kirbmarc »

I've replied to Brive in the designated thread.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15332

Post by Brive1987 »

Kirbmarc wrote: I've replied to Brive in the designated thread.
:lol: no direct relevance or implication.


Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15333

Post by Brive1987 »

Here are two examples of what happens when you push a liberal into a corner.




Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 15449
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15334

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

AFAICT, it was racist of me to post links to these two rightwing publications:

Huffington Post:
Deportation Separated Thousands Of U.S.-Born Children From Parents In 2013
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/ ... 31552.html

Mother Jones:
70,000 Kids Will Show Up Alone at Our Border This Year [2014]. What Happens to Them?
Officials have been stunned by a “surge” of unaccompanied children crossing into the United States.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... l-america/

Keating
.
.
Posts: 2421
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:18 pm
Location: South of anteater guy

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15335

Post by Keating »

I’m not surprised. Both of those sources are fake news sources of the type Shatterface would disapprove.

ThreeFlangedJavis
.
.
Posts: 2181
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:13 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15336

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis »

Old_ones wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 7:57 pm
MarcusAu wrote: Maybe I am missing something...but does anyone find this explanation convincing?



And if it has managed to change your mind - are you no longer an atheist?
How is that even an argument? We need axia in order to interpret the world, therefore one of the axia has to be a supernatural space monkey who wants to regulate our genitals? I assume there has to be more to this than what he is presenting, because what he is presenting seems absurd. I can't see what could possibly argue for the christian god as a starting point for anything.

It takes a lot of thinking for a clunky intellect like mine to parse this one. We obviously don't have anything that we can call an absolute objective basis for deriving axioms of life. I suspect that the Petersonesque conclusion that we need to create a simulation of one is based on the idea that we'd all become nihilists otherwise, or perhaps he just can't abide a worldview that doesn't flow logically from some set of root axioms. Personally, I'm quite happy to know that my preferences are rooted in a jumble of biology and culture modified by experience. Besides, you can derive anything from a belief in a creator depending on the nature of the creator.

ThreeFlangedJavis
.
.
Posts: 2181
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:13 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15337

Post by ThreeFlangedJavis »

rayshul wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:03 pm
I'm reading a lot of sad times ahead lately, what do you all think the chances are realistically of the ocmplete islamification of europe?

I don't think it'll be possible in the US, given the US has guns and shitty welfare. But I can't see things ending up any other way for Eruope.
The chances are not good. Even if the immigrant population figures are correct, which they almost certainly aren't, the vastly differential birth rates will result in a huge demographic swing within a couple of generations even if immigration was halted tomorrow. And by generations, I mean immigrant generations which will probably have a shorter frequency. WRT the UK at least the blind can bale as much straw as they want and make snidey remarks about "The Great Replacement", but there have been enough indications that the political establishment is sufficiently wedded to the notion that there is no such thing as a legitimate indigenous ethnicity (or whatever you want to call it) that has a greater claim to consideration than anyone from the third world who wishes to walk in the door. Racial replacement is now almost an inevitability. The conversation needs to be about preserving standard of living for future generations, stopping the flow of people and integrating the existing population into some realistic national identity.

MarcusAu
.
.
Posts: 7903
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:49 am
Location: Llareggub

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15338

Post by MarcusAu »

JP has been ruminating on this theme some time - as this tweet from back in 2013 shows.
JP tweet.JPG
(39.25 KiB) Downloaded 273 times

Shatterface
.
.
Posts: 5898
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:05 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15339

Post by Shatterface »

Keating wrote: I’m not surprised. Both of those sources are fake news sources of the type Shatterface would disapprove.
I give up. What ARE you talking about? Is it just word salad now?

Shatterface
.
.
Posts: 5898
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:05 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15340

Post by Shatterface »

Watching Luke Cage Season Two at the moment. Lots of Jamaican patois. Love to see SJWs try their pronoun shit on these guys. The more divergent dialects don't seem to distinguish between genders at all.

Driftless
.
.
Posts: 533
Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:13 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15341

Post by Driftless »

Brive1987 wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:24 pm
Driftless wrote: When you talk about "shared ancestry", what is the cutoff date? Can I go back to the common ancestor of humans and chimps so that chimps are part of my ethnostate?
No. That would be stupid.
OK, how about just before humans left Africa.

Brive1987
.
.
Posts: 17791
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:16 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15342

Post by Brive1987 »



:lol: :lol:

InfraRedBucket
.
.
Posts: 1471
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:30 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15343

Post by InfraRedBucket »

JP tweet.JPG
(24.91 KiB) Downloaded 252 times
Hey Prof Peterson, depends what you mean by "faith" , depends what you mean by "God"....

so much for being "more skeptical than the skeptics."

-

Keating
.
.
Posts: 2421
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2015 3:18 pm
Location: South of anteater guy

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15344

Post by Keating »

Shatterface wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:55 am
Keating wrote: I’m not surprised. Both of those sources are fake news sources of the type Shatterface would disapprove.
I give up. What ARE you talking about? Is it just word salad now?
Just trolling you today. Glad I succeeded.

Shatterface
.
.
Posts: 5898
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:05 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15345

Post by Shatterface »

Brive1987 wrote:

:lol: :lol:
I'm at work so not going to click the video but going from the title, is this about white people not ultimately coming from Africa?

Is this some Sun People/Ice People shit? Is this the direction you are going?

Shatterface
.
.
Posts: 5898
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:05 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15346

Post by Shatterface »

Does 'gender' serve any function that isn't better filled by sex? We seemed to get along fine without it for the first few million years.

Shatterface
.
.
Posts: 5898
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:05 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15347

Post by Shatterface »

Matt Cavanaugh wrote: Isn't there supposed to be a dedicated thread for this annoying shit?
Unfortunately the annoying shit won't take the hint.

Tigzy
Pit Art Master
Pit Art Master
Posts: 6789
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:53 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15348

Post by Tigzy »

Generally, I've found the best way to tolerate Brive's ethnostate posts is to imagine the word 'parklife' being sung at the end of each paragraph. Give it a try:
Deconstruction = the intentional dismantling of status quo values and concepts that together define national identity.
Structures = groups and collectives (in this case) with broadly aligned (albeit seperate) agendas. liberal media, Universities, progressive church, liberal organisations, SJW clans, global business entities .....
The problem with the alt right is their conspiracy based interpretation of these structures and their focus on race instead of a unique national identity (and functional society) based on shared cultural values, tradition and heritage.

Lsuoma
Fascist Tit
Posts: 11692
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:58 pm
Location: Punggye-ri

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15349

Post by Lsuoma »

rayshul wrote: I'm reading a lot of sad times ahead lately, what do you all think the chances are realistically of the ocmplete islamification of europe?

I don't think it'll be possible in the US, given the US has guns and shitty welfare. But I can't see things ending up any other way for Eruope.
I think Europe has gone, too. Even though the message, both directly from the goatfuckers, and indirectly from their actions, the white-guild-ridden "elites" continue to stick their heads up their arses.

Apart from Switzerland, which is perfect in every way.

Tigzy
Pit Art Master
Pit Art Master
Posts: 6789
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:53 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15350

Post by Tigzy »

Lsuoma wrote: I think Europe has gone, too. Even though the message, both directly from the goatfuckers, and indirectly from their actions, the white-guild-ridden "elites" continue to stick their heads up their arses.
Western Europe - perhaps. Eastern Europe, not so much.

Lsuoma
Fascist Tit
Posts: 11692
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:58 pm
Location: Punggye-ri

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15351

Post by Lsuoma »

Tigzy wrote:
Lsuoma wrote: I think Europe has gone, too. Even though the message, both directly from the goatfuckers, and indirectly from their actions, the white-guild-ridden "elites" continue to stick their heads up their arses.
Western Europe - perhaps. Eastern Europe, not so much.
That will prolly happen later. Turkey is now much more of a threat, with one-man, religious rule. Expect to see lots more threats to the EU from Erdogan.

Old_ones
.
.
Posts: 2168
Joined: Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:46 pm
Location: An hour's drive from Hell.

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15352

Post by Old_ones »

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote:
Old_ones wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 7:57 pm
MarcusAu wrote: Maybe I am missing something...but does anyone find this explanation convincing?



And if it has managed to change your mind - are you no longer an atheist?
How is that even an argument? We need axia in order to interpret the world, therefore one of the axia has to be a supernatural space monkey who wants to regulate our genitals? I assume there has to be more to this than what he is presenting, because what he is presenting seems absurd. I can't see what could possibly argue for the christian god as a starting point for anything.

It takes a lot of thinking for a clunky intellect like mine to parse this one. We obviously don't have anything that we can call an absolute objective basis for deriving axioms of life. I suspect that the Petersonesque conclusion that we need to create a simulation of one is based on the idea that we'd all become nihilists otherwise, or perhaps he just can't abide a worldview that doesn't flow logically from some set of root axioms. Personally, I'm quite happy to know that my preferences are rooted in a jumble of biology and culture modified by experience. Besides, you can derive anything from a belief in a creator depending on the nature of the creator.
I guess if you don't care about making your axioms conservative and parsimonious that could make some kind of sense. I personally think you are right that Peterson's concern about people becoming nihilistic is central to this argument. I think he starts with this conviction that Christianity is the magical antidote to the evils of communism, which seems to be his main worry. Once he has his conclusion locked in about how we are going to save ourselves from totalitarianism then he has to go back and try to find an intellectually rigorous justification for Christianity, since that is the panacea.

I have a lot of problems with this construction. I don't think god is a good axiom. I remember watching Sean Carrol debate William Lane Craig on whether the findings of cosmology provide evidence on the existence of god and Carrol opined that positing a god ultimately has zero explanatory power, because if god is the reason why something happened, then you have to understand the whims of an intelligent being to get to the why. The only explanation you get is "god likes it that way". I don't see how god suddenly becomes helpful as a first principle except by motivated reasoning like Peterson's.

Another problem I have with Peterson's schtick is that Christianity pretty well coexisted with Nazism, and I don't think he addresses that. He wants to blame the excesses of the Nazis on racism, and ignore the fact that Germany was a majority Christian country and that the Nazis made a show of embracing Christianity. You could argue that it was disingenuous (for the leadership anyway) given their bizzare occult dealings behind closed doors, but the rank and file were still walking into battle with "Gott mit uns" stamped on their belt buckles. For that matter, I'm not sure the horrors of the 20th century were so different from the horrors of any other century apart from the fact that they occurred in large post-industrial societies. Human history has seen plenty of rulers who saw themselves as gods, and who demanded total devotion from subjects, and history has seen plenty of instances of humans exterminating each other. The Spanish who explored the new world did absolutely horrendous things to the Aztecs and the tribes the found in the west indies. I don't necessarily see a clear case that there actions were less depraved than the Nazis or that they were being restrained by their Catholicism.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 15449
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15353

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Shatterface wrote: Does 'gender' serve any function that isn't better filled by sex? We seemed to get along fine without it for the first few million years.
There was a profound transformation in humans mumble mumble years ago, when our mind became completely 'plastic', and since then we're no longer like the animals and everything is a social construct. Except being trans, which is something you're born being.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 15449
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15354

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

ThreeFlangedJavis wrote: It takes a lot of thinking for a clunky intellect like mine to parse this one. We obviously don't have anything that we can call an absolute objective basis for deriving axioms of life. I suspect that the Petersonesque conclusion that we need to create a simulation of one is based on the idea that we'd all become nihilists otherwise, or perhaps he just can't abide a worldview that doesn't flow logically from some set of root axioms. Personally, I'm quite happy to know that my preferences are rooted in a jumble of biology and culture modified by experience. Besides, you can derive anything from a belief in a creator depending on the nature of the creator.
It's disappointing that JBP is putting forth this nonsense. I've watched his lectures where he quite accurately describes how human moral behavior is rooted in evolved animal behavior and cites relevant studies. Since Sam Harris uses that evolved sense of fairness & cooperation as his objective starting point for his assertion (The Moral Landscape) that we can objectively agree that creating the most net happiness and the least net suffering is a good thing and our primary objective, the two of them should be able to have a productive discussion on that.

JBP seems trapped here in the solipsism inherent in philosophical musing -- which is ironic considering his detest for the moral relativism of pomo. I saw him get caught up in that during a panel discussion, agreeing with philosopher Patrice Bergeron (okay that's a hockey player, but the name is close), while Bret Weinstein shook his head and finally said, 'I don't get any of this, because as a scientist I guess my brain just isn't wired to think that way about things.'

ConcentratedH2O, OM
.
.
Posts: 6555
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:51 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15355

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM »

Shatterface wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:

:lol: :lol:
I'm at work so not going to click the video but going from the title, is this about white people not ultimately coming from Africa?

Is this some Sun People/Ice People shit? Is this the direction you are going?
It's a blond American woman, and a bloke who sounds Scandinavian, discussing the fact that million-year-old skeletons with bowler hats and umbrellas have been found buried below Chiswick High Street. I flicked around a bit, and the second thing I got to was the woman saying "they don't want us to know about these things", so it's exactly what you're probably imagining.

CommanderTuvok
.
.
Posts: 3744
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 1:18 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15356

Post by CommanderTuvok »

I had a giggle at this satire....Ken Ham ejected from a cinema for shouting "Wrong" every time a character in Jurassic Park said "65 million years ago".

:D

https://babylonbee.com/news/ken-ham-eje ... ion-years/

Driftless
.
.
Posts: 533
Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:13 am

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15357

Post by Driftless »

Matt Cavanaugh wrote:
Shatterface wrote: Does 'gender' serve any function that isn't better filled by sex? We seemed to get along fine without it for the first few million years.
There was a profound transformation in humans mumble mumble years ago, when our mind became completely 'plastic', and since then we're no longer like the animals and everything is a social construct. Except being trans, which is something you're born being.
It seems to me that "gender" now means what "personality" used to mean. For example, it used to be OK to be a "Tomboy". That just meant you were a girl who liked some masculine things more than most girls. But you were still a girl. Now you are a different gender, or transgender.

If you had a list of "masculine traits" and a list of "feminine traits", and you rated yourself 0-100 on each, the only way an SJW would agree that you were a boy/man would be if you scored exactly 100 on every "masculine trait" and exactly 0 on every "feminine trait". Similarly for Girl/Woman. Anything else and you are a different gender. In the past I think you would just say that everyone is different and that is their personality, because not everyone is unique.

Matt Cavanaugh
.
.
Posts: 15449
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 12:38 pm
Contact:

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15358

Post by Matt Cavanaugh »

Brive1987 wrote:

:lol: :lol:
First off, saying "The Out of Africa theory has officially been debunked" is stupid. What would an 'official' debunking even look like?

Then, already at 1:17, the women rejects the idea of a genetic 'bottleneck' especially wrt mDNA, because "there were so many other lineages out there that went extinct that we are descended from."

And then I stopped, because those two are clearly retarded.

Suet Cardigan
.
.
Posts: 1304
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:26 am
Location: England, a bastion of barbarism and cluelessness

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15359

Post by Suet Cardigan »

InfraRedBucket wrote: JP tweet.JPG

Hey Prof Peterson, depends what you mean by "faith" , depends what you mean by "God"....

so much for being "more skeptical than the skeptics."

-
I guess the Ancient Greeks never created a proof of anything because they lived before the founding of Christianity - or do other gods count?

Shatterface
.
.
Posts: 5898
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:05 pm

Re: There are 2018 genders... and a bitch ain't one

#15360

Post by Shatterface »

Most people manage to pay for their groceries and set their watches without a deep understanding of number theory and we get through most days without killing or raping each other without securely grounding our ethics. Axioms seem to be post hoc rationalisations for stuff we are doing anyway.

Locked