In 2017 Idiocracy is a Documentary

[Bhurzum]

What is it about Bayesian Experts that makes them into sexual preverts?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... g-ai-field

Google AI Researcher Accused of Sexual Harassment

{snip}

The allegations came to light after the recent conference on Neural Information Processing Systems (NIPS) in Long Beach, California. Some attendees complained that aspects of some parties held during the conference were inappropriate and potentially offensive to women. They also condemned a joke about sexual harassment made by Carlin, a member of an amateur band that performed at the NIPS closing night party.

{snip}

So, if I'm understanding this, men are now to blame when a NIPS-slip happens?

If a nip-slips and no men are there to see it, is it still sexual harassment?

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Ater all the time humans have used the Bay area for surfing and swimming, what could have led the sea lions to think enough is enough?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DKH7zoVUMAEMe-V.jpg

I can just smell the cat piss.

[shoutinghorse]

Makes the blue whale look like a da Vinci

Oh yeah?? .. I give you the Farage.

https://i.imgur.com/9g55DhI.jpg

[feathers]

Both of my wife's sisters are in the hospital. One had a heart attack and one is having kidney failure. Nice....

But.... we are off to Vegas this Sunday.

We will get back this coming Friday so I can still cook my traditional steak for Xmas dinner.
Vega, that's where Oumuamua came from. Quite a ride, John. So you won't be here for Christmas? (and the 12000 christmases after that)

...is there something you wanted to say?

[feathers]

Edit: ah, you did it inside the quote tags! Nifty.

[Really?]

Young production assistant has consensual affair with Matt Lauer.

She's the victim. He's a monster.

I didn’t know what to do. He was obviously flirting. But I’d never seen anything like that from Matt before. As a 24-year-old production assistant, I had no idea how to interpret that. I could truly embarrass myself if I said something like, “Where are you going with this?”

We went to lunch. My intentions were purely professional. I thought this was a way to get real-world constructive advice. What that turned into was an opportunity for him to come on to me. It was flattering, confusing, overwhelming. I was nervous. I didn’t know what to do with it. He was clearly trying to guide the conversation. He was there to hit on me and manipulate the situation, and I fell for it. Here’s how I should have known what I was getting myself into. When we left, he told me: “You leave first, and I’ll leave after.” In no lunch I’d ever had at “Today” had anyone suggested we leave separately, as if something was up.

I get back to the office and I couldn’t concentrate. It was like an out of body experience. I know that sounds silly to someone who wasn’t there emotionally, but I couldn’t sit still. I sent him a message, and he wrote back right away.

“meet me.” he said.

“meet you where?” I asked. “matt, think about this first…you have a wife.”

“dressing room.”

“dressing room where?”

“studio.”

“i’ll be there in 20 minutes,” I said.

“I can’t stay that long…I have a car coming at 3:00.”

It was 2:42 p.m.

“okay,” I wrote. “i’ll be over there soon.”

He opens the door. There you go. It crossed the line. It was a consensual encounter. It happened in his dressing room above studio 1A, which was empty in the afternoons. He got in his car and I had to go back to work, and now my life had completely changed.

http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/matt-la ... 202641040/

[feathers]

Jesus Christ.

I'm a "recovering anti-feminist" in that I spent several years in denial about things the patriarchy, male privilege, the wage gap, mansplaining, etc. I think I had a really strong defensive reaction because hearing those things made me extremely disgusted with my own maleness. I have a feeling that a lot of anti-feminists might be experiencing similar emotional responses, and I often wonder how that problem can be fixed. I've noticed that I didn't feel similarly about race, class, or disability. I was fully able to acknowledge that being white, being lower-middle class rather than lower class, and being born in a first-world country gave me advantages. But with gender I couldn't stay objective, and that's somewhat mysterious to me.

I still have the same disgust feelings, but I'm now self-aware about them, which makes it possible for me to set them aside and analyze gender-relations objectively. But it's still really hard to not get nauseated when I think about the fact that I have a male sexuality, male physical strength, and look like a man. It reached a point that I considered gender transition because of my guilt over maleness, though now I think that's not for me. I've also done serious research in how to either chemically castrate myself or to reduce my libido down to zero. Which I understand would be bad medically-speaking, but the idea of not having these urges anymore is very difficult to resist.
[snip]

https://archive.fo/4XSDL

[Shatterface]

Ater all the time humans have used the Bay area for surfing and swimming, what could have led the sea lions to think enough is enough?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DKH7zoVUMAEMe-V.jpg

I can just smell the cat piss.

Coke are still experimenting with new flavours? Did they learn nothing from Cherry Coke?

[deLurch]

Rutgers fraternity accused of spiking punch with Xanax
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rutgers-fr ... ith-xanax/

The records state at least 10 SDT members were vomiting and incoherent, some even blacked out from drinking the punch. Sorority members accused the fraternity of putting the anti-anxiety medication Xanax into the punch.

When combined with alcohol, Xanax can produce those symptoms.

The records do not show that any medical reports confirmed Xanax was mixed in the cocktail.

You know what else produces the symptoms of vomiting, incoherence and blacking out? Drinking too much fucking alcohol!

Tip to the frat. Next time keep the alcohol percentage at 2-3% for the sorority girls.

[Old_ones]

What is the point of trying to fix the ideology of someone sentenced to death? I can see why a defendant's lawyer might want this in an effort to try and find some redeemable feature to get his life spared. But for anyone else?

Letter from Charleston church shooter reveals no remorse for killings
A racist Letter from Dylann Roof is in response to an attempt to reform him by former white supremacist Christian Picciolini
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/letter-fro ... -killings/

If he can get statements from Roof showing a change of heart in could enhance his brand. Roof could also potentially reach other white supremacists with an anti-racist message. He might have credibility that other people wouldn't in those circles.

Having said that I don't think there is a lot of chance that this guy will prevail on Roof and I personally wouldn't be wasting my time. The lethal injection is going to take care of Roof's ideology, and I'm fine with that.

[Kirbmarc]

Jesus Christ.

I'm a "recovering anti-feminist" in that I spent several years in denial about things the patriarchy, male privilege, the wage gap, mansplaining, etc. I think I had a really strong defensive reaction because hearing those things made me extremely disgusted with my own maleness. I have a feeling that a lot of anti-feminists might be experiencing similar emotional responses, and I often wonder how that problem can be fixed. I've noticed that I didn't feel similarly about race, class, or disability. I was fully able to acknowledge that being white, being lower-middle class rather than lower class, and being born in a first-world country gave me advantages. But with gender I couldn't stay objective, and that's somewhat mysterious to me.

I still have the same disgust feelings, but I'm now self-aware about them, which makes it possible for me to set them aside and analyze gender-relations objectively. But it's still really hard to not get nauseated when I think about the fact that I have a male sexuality, male physical strength, and look like a man. It reached a point that I considered gender transition because of my guilt over maleness, though now I think that's not for me. I've also done serious research in how to either chemically castrate myself or to reduce my libido down to zero. Which I understand would be bad medically-speaking, but the idea of not having these urges anymore is very difficult to resist.
[snip]

https://archive.fo/4XSDL

Masochism level: over 9000.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Coke are still experimenting with new flavours? Did they learn nothing from Cherry Coke?

Siempre Skank-a-Cola™

[Matt Cavanaugh]

https://archive.fo/4XSDL

Fi fy fo, I smell a poe.

[deLurch]

I could see the Anti-racist seeing this as enhancing his branding. I don't think Dylan Roof has much credibility or hero worship from withing the white identiarian communities as small as they are. Being a loser drug addict that decides to go shoot up a bunch of old people in a church would just make them all look like shit anyway. The white supremacists are so cowed and afraid of any crack downs, they don't do shit.

Personally, if you can't kill off a bad ideology, having the so cowed that they won't act out in a violent fashion is pretty much as good as it gets.

[katamari Damassi]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

[screwtape]

The cockwombles at Wilfred Laurier University keep on giving. They have conducted an internal investigation by a lawyer who has tweeted his support of trans people and diversity, and will not be releasing the results, although the university's president has promised to implement any recommendations - as the article points out how will we know if they do? Next their 'taskforce' studying freedom of expression will start up, and while Lindsay Shepherd was originally offered a place on it, the postgrad students' union president has swiped the spot for herself (and she has stated transgender and non-binary students have been discounted in this affair).

Read all about it

Undoubtedly the investigation will clear the idiotic professors in the Communications Studies department, and the taskforce will then confirm that free speech takes second place to banning hatespeech, where hatespeech will be defined as any opinion not in complete agreement with social justice norms.

In a related thought, it occurs to me that a misunderstanding of the meaning of 'justice' lies at the heart of this, in that justice is not fairness in the sense of equality or equal division of goods, it is fairness in the sense of all getting their just desserts. If the legal system defined justice as fairness in the first sense, all disagreements would be resolved with an equal division of the contested property (Solomon had something to say about that), and in criminal matters the blame would be equally apportioned to the criminal and the victim. No one receives their due if the outcome must be equality. The fictional dystopias of the most sinister kind, where individuality is ruthlessly stamped out (Metropolis, 1984, Brave New World) are presumably looked at as forms of paradise by those who have swallowed this nonsense. They want to ensure that the blank slates they think we all are will come out of the sausage machine exactly alike, and do not understand that this is simply another flavour of oppression.

You do not relieve oppression by making all equal; you do it by making all free.

[Old_ones]

Jesus Christ.

I'm a "recovering anti-feminist" in that I spent several years in denial about things the patriarchy, male privilege, the wage gap, mansplaining, etc. I think I had a really strong defensive reaction because hearing those things made me extremely disgusted with my own maleness. I have a feeling that a lot of anti-feminists might be experiencing similar emotional responses, and I often wonder how that problem can be fixed. I've noticed that I didn't feel similarly about race, class, or disability. I was fully able to acknowledge that being white, being lower-middle class rather than lower class, and being born in a first-world country gave me advantages. But with gender I couldn't stay objective, and that's somewhat mysterious to me.

I still have the same disgust feelings, but I'm now self-aware about them, which makes it possible for me to set them aside and analyze gender-relations objectively. But it's still really hard to not get nauseated when I think about the fact that I have a male sexuality, male physical strength, and look like a man. It reached a point that I considered gender transition because of my guilt over maleness, though now I think that's not for me. I've also done serious research in how to either chemically castrate myself or to reduce my libido down to zero. Which I understand would be bad medically-speaking, but the idea of not having these urges anymore is very difficult to resist.
[snip]

https://archive.fo/4XSDL

I get this guy a little bit - I had to recover from feminism. I tend to be able to take harsh criticism because I've had a lot of it at various points in my life, and I was deluded into thinking there was some value in feminism because of it's institutional power in academia.

But there is nothing wrong with feeling disgust when you are confronted by certain kinds of criticism. If people are libeling you and shaming you for being the person you were born as, or if people are holding you to impossible standards of behavior you should feel disgusted. You should be disgusted by the people who reflexively hate you because of their own baggage, and you should avoid the trap of searching through their criticism for validity. There is no validity in "the patriarchy" or "manspreading" these are hateful distortions authored by shitty people who don't understand society, history or human interaction.

Fuck 'em. Haters gonna hate and cuckolds gonna cuck.

[deLurch]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I haven't seen the movie. But some people walk into a movie and think it is total shit that lacks substance. Other times people walk in and just enjoy a good action flick.

[Shatterface]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

[MarcusAu]

I thought this was interesting - some of the usual suspects turn up (ie Pepe, Mike Cernovich)...and then we have PZ's lawyer himself - Mark Randazza, who is involved in the sense he is defending the 'Alt-Right''s free speech.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQ1-P1X2ue8

Suck on it PZ - this is the guy that is going to profit from any donations given to your legal defense.

[katamari Damassi]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

Ok, then replace" Mary Sue" with "an idealized character nearly without flaw, who easily overcomes any challenges he/she faces, and is instantly befriended-admired-loved by all except for the antagonist." Better?

[Shatterface]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

Ok, then replace" Mary Sue" with "an idealized character nearly without flaw, who easily overcomes any challenges he/she faces, and is instantly befriended-admired-loved by all except for the antagonist." Better?

Like I said, nothing interesting to say.

Mary Sue is like patriarchy. Some people are going to see it everywhere.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Somebody should investigate why Wilfre Laurier employs -- actually writes checks to -- a freak like Nathan Rambukkana, whose

... research addresses topics such as digital intimacies, the relationship of intimacy and privilege, hybridity and mixed-race identities, the social and cultural aspects new media forms, and non/monogamy in the public sphere. It is situated disciplinarily at the nexus of communication and cultural studies; methodologically within discourse analysis; and draws theoretical energy from a wide range of sources such as feminist, queer, postcolonial, and critical race theories; semiotics, affect theory, event theory and psychoanalysis.

And who publishes gobbedlygook on deviant sexual lifestyles, such as:

“‘Queer’ Heterotopias and the Role of Autonomous Media Space in Radical World Building.”

“Uncomfortable Bridges: The Bisexual Politics of Outing Polyamory.”

“Taking the Leather out of Leathersex: BDSM Identity and the Implications of an Internet-Mediated Sadomasochistic Public Sphere.”

“Uncomfortable Bridges: The Bisexual Politics of Outing Polyamory.”

[Matt Cavanaugh]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

Ok, then replace" Mary Sue" with "an idealized character nearly without flaw, who easily overcomes any challenges he/she faces, and is instantly befriended-admired-loved by all except for the antagonist." Better?

Oh, you mean like Jyn in ROGUE ONE?

Am I detecting a pattern here?

[Really?]

I thought this was interesting - some of the usual suspects turn up (ie Pepe, Mike Cernovich)...and then we have PZ's lawyer himself - Mark Randazza, who is involved in the sense he is defending the 'Alt-Right''s free speech.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQ1-P1X2ue8

Suck on it PZ - this is the guy that is going to profit from any donations given to your legal defense.

PZ on Pepe in June 2016.

https://i.imgur.com/btXC5Oc.jpg

[Shatterface]

Somebody should investigate why Wilfre Laurier employs -- actually writes checks to -- a freak like Nathan Rambukkana, whose

... research addresses topics such as digital intimacies, the relationship of intimacy and privilege, hybridity and mixed-race identities, the social and cultural aspects new media forms, and non/monogamy in the public sphere. It is situated disciplinarily at the nexus of communication and cultural studies; methodologically within discourse analysis; and draws theoretical energy from a wide range of sources such as feminist, queer, postcolonial, and critical race theories; semiotics, affect theory, event theory and psychoanalysis.

And who publishes gobbedlygook on deviant sexual lifestyles, such as:

“‘Queer’ Heterotopias and the Role of Autonomous Media Space in Radical World Building.”

“Uncomfortable Bridges: The Bisexual Politics of Outing Polyamory.”

“Taking the Leather out of Leathersex: BDSM Identity and the Implications of an Internet-Mediated Sadomasochistic Public Sphere.”

“Uncomfortable Bridges: The Bisexual Politics of Outing Polyamory.”

I'm so glad we cured cancer so academics can find time for this shit.

[free thoughtpolice]

I am afraid we are coming to the point where men are revealed to be such disgusting pigs that we will never get laid again, even by gay guys.
And to those of you that say not all men are like that, go anally rape yourself with a dozen sea urchins. Have you heard a misogynist joke and not punched out the teller? Saw a criticism of Anita Sarkeesian without dispatching an angry response and flagging it to you tube?
Then you are as just as responsible as Weinstein or Jack the Ripper.
As a pharynguloid recently observed:

As for the commentators who are saying that they would never have a relationship with a man again, I can entirely see why you feel that way – it is a wholly reasonable continuation of the principle of Schrodinger’s Rapist. With so many sexual abusers in the world (more and more coming to light each day), and no easy way of telling from outward indications which men are predatory and which are not, why should anyone be expected to take the risk?

As a man myself, it would be easy to be indignant, and cry about how unfair it is, and that I am a good man who would never do such a terrible thing, and why should men like me suffer for the crimes of others? But that is just what a still undiscovered predator would say.

[Shatterface]

I'm sure that the podgy pink-haired problem glasses harridans are swearing off men on principle and it has nothing to do with the fact they couldn't get laid on an oil rig.

[Brive1987]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I haven't seen the movie. But some people walk into a movie and think it is total shit that lacks substance. Other times people walk in and just enjoy a good action flick.

And some people come in and actually take a crap in their seats in appreciation and then stew in the bolognese with their trapped compatriots for two hours.

Which, apparently, is exactly what happened to PZ while watching Star Wars according to his latest post.

:hankey:

[Brive1987]

Cologne has said "never again" and has taken aggressive moves to thwart any repeat of NYE 2015

"Respect" wrist bands will be deployed on the streets without negotiation and with no right to appeal.

http://www.krone.at/603465

[jugheadnaut]

Somebody should investigate why Wilfre Laurier employs -- actually writes checks to -- a freak like Nathan Rambukkana, whose

... research addresses topics such as digital intimacies, the relationship of intimacy and privilege, hybridity and mixed-race identities, the social and cultural aspects new media forms, and non/monogamy in the public sphere. It is situated disciplinarily at the nexus of communication and cultural studies; methodologically within discourse analysis; and draws theoretical energy from a wide range of sources such as feminist, queer, postcolonial, and critical race theories; semiotics, affect theory, event theory and psychoanalysis.

And who publishes gobbedlygook on deviant sexual lifestyles, such as:

“‘Queer’ Heterotopias and the Role of Autonomous Media Space in Radical World Building.”

“Uncomfortable Bridges: The Bisexual Politics of Outing Polyamory.”

“Taking the Leather out of Leathersex: BDSM Identity and the Implications of an Internet-Mediated Sadomasochistic Public Sphere.”

“Uncomfortable Bridges: The Bisexual Politics of Outing Polyamory.”

These must be the sort of peer reviewed and reproducible papers that Herr Pimlott claimed were the hallmark of communications studies research.

[Brive1987]

Guess I will never be able to make my own mind up now de lurch has made up his.
:mrgreen:

I'll be honest. It was the most hilarious thing ApeLust ever created. Imagine his best work times 100. He set the volume to 11.

But now you will never know.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/proxy ... 36-h236-nc

[Bhurzum]

"Live" Cunt Dongula hosting "This week in stupid" at the London meet-up.

[John D]

Rucka Rucka Ali is pretty good.

[jugheadnaut]

Rucka Rucka Ali is pretty good.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=_snt45unyqY&t=1072s

Wouldn't have taken him for a full-bore objectivist. Although he argues for it better than most.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Cologne has said "never again" and has taken aggressive moves to thwart any repeat of NYE 2015

"Respect" wrist bands will be deployed on the streets without negotiation and with no right to appeal.

http://www.krone.at/603465

So long as it's written in arabic, it should work out just fine.

[shoutinghorse]

At last, a company with some gonads. :clap:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/gene ... 14276.html

[Matt Cavanaugh]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/proxy ... 36-h236-nc

I have no idea what this signifies, but I'm entranced and have been watching for the past 17 minutes.

[Ape+lust]

In freshly plundered morgue skins, Wu is back from teeth-cleaning where she chose "popcorn butter" as her preferred shade of white.

https://imgur.com/oH0mZD8.jpg

[Really?]

In freshly plundered morgue skins, Wu is back from teeth-cleaning where she chose "popcorn butter" as her preferred shade of white.

snip scary picture

She has a fascinating understanding of reality. We need her other ways of knowing in Congress.

[Kirbmarc]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

Ok, then replace" Mary Sue" with "an idealized character nearly without flaw, who easily overcomes any challenges he/she faces, and is instantly befriended-admired-loved by all except for the antagonist." Better?

You can argue that Luke Skywalker was a Mary Sue, too, so it's kind of fitting that the new protagonist is a bit of an escapist character, pretty much flawless and unrealistically competent even with minimum training.

Let's face it, Star Wars was never really that deep or had characters that were more than archetypes. Star Wars is a good action-adventure franchise, but it was never as phenomenally good as many think it is to begin with. Looking back at the first series of movies you realize they're a pastiche of action-adventures cliches, they're sometimes oddly paced and unevenly directed, the writing isn't always phenomenal and the characters are, again, not incredibly deep or complex. Star Wars isn't Citizen Kane or The Godfather.

What makes Rey more annoyingly good at what she does than Luke?

[Kirbmarc]

I think that the original Star Wars trilogy came out at the exact moment, and created some many cliches by mixing together old adventure, fairy tale, philosophy and sci-fi tropes. It's a classic, if only for the reason that it was a source of inspiration for so many other movies. However it's not as flawless or nuanced as many of its fans wishes it could be.

Maybe that's why it's so hard to please Star Wars fans. Maybe the status of a classic of the old Star Wars series is due to the time it came out, and its charm and appeal simply cannot be replicated, not after tons of movies which explored sci-fi fantasies under every possible angle. Maybe trying to recreate what makes people love Star Wars is simply doomed to fail because what people love about Star Wars has a lot to do with its status as the first big hit of a new genre.

Perhaps in the movie world of today it's impossible to write or direct a Star Wars movie without having the audiences noticing all the cliches, all the stretching of the suspension of disbelief, all the flaws that people excuse in the original trilogy out of respect for its status and/or nostalgia.

[Oglebart]

In freshly plundered morgue skins, Wu is back from teeth-cleaning where she chose "popcorn butter" as her preferred shade of white.

https://imgur.com/oH0mZD8.jpg

Scary fucker, he actually is going for the Dame Edna look

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/imageserver/ ... resize=685

[shoutinghorse]

In freshly plundered morgue skins, Wu is back from teeth-cleaning where she chose "popcorn butter" as her preferred shade of white.

https://imgur.com/oH0mZD8.jpg

[Really?]

In freshly plundered morgue skins, Wu is back from teeth-cleaning where she chose "popcorn butter" as her preferred shade of white.

https://imgur.com/oH0mZD8.jpg

[free thoughtpolice]

So the CDC now is banned from using certain words.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... 778f81bd40

The forbidden terms are “vulnerable,” “entitlement,” “diversity,” “transgender,” “fetus,” “evidence-based” and “science-based.”

In some instances, the analysts were given alternative phrases. Instead of “science-based” or ­“evidence-based,” the suggested phrase is “CDC bases its recommendations on science in consideration with community standards and wishes,” the person said. In other cases, no replacement words were immediately offered.

It looks like science is not only under attack from pomo/feminist ways of knowing, but the ultra conservative appointees Trump put in has banned the words evidence based and science based. I guess his evangelical chums find those more offensive than nigger or any of the politically incorrect words the SJWs hate. Presumably, soon you will not only have to say "science in consideration with community standards and wishes", they will demand that "science" be practiced according to the wishes of community leaders , like preachers, politicians, and businessmen.

[Cabal]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

Ok, then replace" Mary Sue" with "an idealized character nearly without flaw, who easily overcomes any challenges he/she faces, and is instantly befriended-admired-loved by all except for the antagonist." Better?

Oh, you mean like Jyn in ROGUE ONE?

Am I detecting a pattern here?

Was Jyn one, though? Cassian and K2SO don’t exact trust her, nor do the rebel leadership - and she doesn’t give a fuck about the rebellion to begin with.

She’s also given a vague level of backstory as someone who’s had to fight to stay alive, not someone who discovers how to do so in one day, the way Rey does with the Force in TFA.

[Guest_d2e60302]

Is Luke a Mary Sue?

Perhaps, but all Luke is good at is flying an X-wing which SW:ANH suggests is like an aircraft and something that Luke has done with great expertise being a typical teenage boy on a planet in a spacefaring galaxy.

He has the force, but it takes him a great deal of time to master it, and he makes shitloads of mistakes, even with Obi Wan there to train him.

As for politics and other things, he ain't much.

But he is there, and Obi Wan is there, and the Droids are there, not because he is some random kid, but precisely because he is the unknown (to all but Obi Wan) heir.

So I'd say, not a mary sue.

[Cabal]

I am afraid we are coming to the point where men are revealed to be such disgusting pigs that we will never get laid again, even by gay guys.
And to those of you that say not all men are like that, go anally rape yourself with a dozen sea urchins. Have you heard a misogynist joke and not punched out the teller? Saw a criticism of Anita Sarkeesian without dispatching an angry response and flagging it to you tube?
Then you are as just as responsible as Weinstein or Jack the Ripper.
As a pharynguloid recently observed:

As for the commentators who are saying that they would never have a relationship with a man again, I can entirely see why you feel that way – it is a wholly reasonable continuation of the principle of Schrodinger’s Rapist. With so many sexual abusers in the world (more and more coming to light each day), and no easy way of telling from outward indications which men are predatory and which are not, why should anyone be expected to take the risk?


As a man myself, it would be, easy to be indignant, and cry about how unfair it is, and that I am a good man who would never do such a terrible thing, and why should men like me suffer for the crimes of others? But that is just what a still undiscovered predator would say.

I really hate the term “cuck”, and then this pharynguloid comes along...

Not wanting to have a relationship with a man ever again because of a handful of rapists = totally reasonable
being worried that a woman in this fear-riven environment might unfairly misjudge = UR A RAPEST

[Cabal]

Not sure if anyone else has encountered this but while discussing that Cat Person shit today, in the context of discussing unreasonable fear and generalisation of men as a group, I got that stat thrown at me again of “but two women are murdered by their partners each week in the UK!”

.....two women? Out of how many in the UK? And you’re using this to claim it’s ok to fear men as a class? Fuck off. Just fuck off. The odds are higher of you getting hit by a car, are you even more scared of traffic? Bollocks. It’s not even two women, it’s barely one and a half on average, and they’ve made a massive rounding up of the number. 52 women a year dying out of however many tens of millions in the UK means schrodinger’s rapist is a reasonable way to live, but men kill themselves at 35 times a higher rate - do we see 35 times the concern for that? From anyone? There is no sense of proportionality in these reactions, but they throw this stat out as if their reaction is some kind of rational cost/benefit analysis and yet they aren’t as “scared” of things they are more likely to be a victim of.

Sorry for the ranting. I daren’t talk about this stuff publicly anymore after this MeToo witch hunt, and I just feel like the world has gone completely mad, and it makes me so goddamn fucking angry being preached at about equality by these hypocrites, and no-one seems willing to call them out as the hypocrites they are. And I thought Christians were problematic.

/rant

[MarcusAu]

I think that the original Star Wars trilogy came out at the exact moment, and created some many cliches by mixing together old adventure, fairy tale, philosophy and sci-fi tropes. It's a classic, if only for the reason that it was a source of inspiration for so many other movies. However it's not as flawless or nuanced as many of its fans wishes it could be.

Maybe that's why it's so hard to please Star Wars fans. Maybe the status of a classic of the old Star Wars series is due to the time it came out, and its charm and appeal simply cannot be replicated, not after tons of movies which explored sci-fi fantasies under every possible angle. Maybe trying to recreate what makes people love Star Wars is simply doomed to fail because what people love about Star Wars has a lot to do with its status as the first big hit of a new genre.

Perhaps in the movie world of today it's impossible to write or direct a Star Wars movie without having the audiences noticing all the cliches, all the stretching of the suspension of disbelief, all the flaws that people excuse in the original trilogy out of respect for its status and/or nostalgia.

Mickey Mouse was never that great either - but that didn't stop Disney from making a fuck-tonne of money off of the concept.

You could argue that by putting out passably OK movies on a semi-regular basis Disney will only build the fan-base. Who were not really that picky to begin with.

I'll not be watching anyway - not my cup of chai latte.

[John D]

Local talent just got wacked. Stephen Henderson won a Pulitzer for outing Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick (Detroit), one of the most evil and corrupt politicians in history. But... he must have tried to score too many ladies in the office. Most of his politics where too far left for me, but he was a good solid smart guy. He was the kind of leftist that you wish there were more of.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/l ... 108636298/

[katamari Damassi]

Is Luke a Mary Sue?

Perhaps, but all Luke is good at is flying an X-wing which SW:ANH suggests is like an aircraft and something that Luke has done with great expertise being a typical teenage boy on a planet in a spacefaring galaxy.

He has the force, but it takes him a great deal of time to master it, and he makes shitloads of mistakes, even with Obi Wan there to train him.

As for politics and other things, he ain't much.

But he is there, and Obi Wan is there, and the Droids are there, not because he is some random kid, but precisely because he is the unknown (to all but Obi Wan) heir.

So I'd say, not a mary sue.

Luke's hero's journey takes 3 movies. Within 30 minutes of The Force Awakens Rey(with no previous training or experience)flies the Millennium Falcon as well as Han Solo. In another 30 minutes she's(again without training) using Jedi mind tricks. In another 30 minutes she's(again without experience or training) defeats a trained light sabre fighter. All the while the other protagonists are fawning over her.
In Star Wars, Han and Leia didn't even like Luke until the end of the movie.

[katamari Damassi]

I think that the original Star Wars trilogy came out at the exact moment, and created some many cliches by mixing together old adventure, fairy tale, philosophy and sci-fi tropes. It's a classic, if only for the reason that it was a source of inspiration for so many other movies. However it's not as flawless or nuanced as many of its fans wishes it could be.

Maybe that's why it's so hard to please Star Wars fans. Maybe the status of a classic of the old Star Wars series is due to the time it came out, and its charm and appeal simply cannot be replicated, not after tons of movies which explored sci-fi fantasies under every possible angle. Maybe trying to recreate what makes people love Star Wars is simply doomed to fail because what people love about Star Wars has a lot to do with its status as the first big hit of a new genre.

Perhaps in the movie world of today it's impossible to write or direct a Star Wars movie without having the audiences noticing all the cliches, all the stretching of the suspension of disbelief, all the flaws that people excuse in the original trilogy out of respect for its status and/or nostalgia.

Mickey Mouse was never that great either - but that didn't stop Disney from making a fuck-tonne of money off of the concept.

You could argue that by putting out passably OK movies on a semi-regular basis Disney will only build the fan-base. Who were not really that picky to begin with.

I'll not be watching anyway - not my cup of chai latte.

They've been longish toy commercials since 1983. With another trilogy on the way as well as Han Solo and Obi Wan movies on the way, Disney will oversaturate the market, and people will,get sick of it.

[Lsuoma]

Which district is Wuzilla running in?

[KenD]

A friend of a Facebook friend is throwing a fit because I described Rey as a Mary Sue. Even if you're a feminist, how can you see that character as anything other than a Mary Sue?

I just switch off as soon as someone says Mary Sue. I think the concept has become generalised I just dismiss the person using it as having fuck all interesting to say.

Ok, then replace" Mary Sue" with "an idealized character nearly without flaw, who easily overcomes any challenges he/she faces, and is instantly befriended-admired-loved by all except for the antagonist." Better?

You can argue that Luke Skywalker was a Mary Sue, too, so it's kind of fitting that the new protagonist is a bit of an escapist character, pretty much flawless and unrealistically competent even with minimum training.

What makes Rey more annoyingly good at what she does than Luke?

I haven't seen the new one yet, but at least Luke needed a couple of movies and some training scenes before he could go toe-to-toe with the main baddies. He should have had a proper montage though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pQhbchLdbU

The most competence he showed in the first film was blowing up the Deathstar, and the movie did provide a line or two of dialogue to explain his skills.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxVdhAJr1So

Luke's still a Mary Sue, I just think Rey stands out as a worse one.

[Billie from Ockham]

{snip} Within 30 minutes of The Force Awakens Rey(with no previous training or experience)flies the Millennium Falcon as well as Han Solo. In another 30 minutes she's(again without training) using Jedi mind tricks. In another 30 minutes she's(again without experience or training) defeats a trained light sabre fighter. All the while the other protagonists are fawning over her. {snip}

That's exactly what annoyed me, too.

In a comparison of Rey and Jyn, someone (who I can't remember) argued that Rey was a better character because you saw her doing stuff, while you mostly saw things happening to Jyn, at least until she suddenly switches to hero-mode after spending the first hour being a selfish bitch. The problem with this (second) analysis is that everything is so easy for Rey that you're just not impressed. I mean, OK, I get it ... things are easier for a white chick than a black male ... is that supposed to be news?

[Shatterface]

The reason I detest the term Mary Sue is that we go through this every cunting year. A Mary Sue isn't an idealised character, it's an obvious cunting idealised avatar of the author. That's not what Rey is.

If we have to use the fucking term, it is more applicable to Luke who is the same George Lucas avatar you find in THX1138 and American Graffiti: the small town kid who realises the only thing that is holding him back is his fear of the unknown and his sense of obligation.

A Mary Sue is not an idealised character. That's a saint or a paragon.

If you extend the term beyond its relationship to an idealised version of the author what fucking term do we use for that?

And like I said at the start, it's every fucking year we go through this same conversation.

[Billie from Ockham]

I was under the impression that a Mary Sue is simply a character that is just too perfect (and is maybe also unlikable because of this). I didn't think we needed to do any kind of analysis (or, worse, deconstruction) to make this judgment. Was I wrong about this?

[CaptainFluffyBunny]

Which district is Wuzilla running in?

She will not be challenging Rep. Katherine Clark of the 5th District, with whom she shares a suite of advocacy concerns,[8] but rather Rep. Stephen F. Lynch of the 8th District, in an announcement she made on Twitter.[16]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brianna_Wu