Happy 3rd Pit Birthday!

[ThreeFlangedJavis]

Go back to Parody Accountant's post.

The real harm of creationism still happens and you can be an activist or whatever about it.

The real harm of feminism changing college laws happens and you can be an activist or whatever about it.

BUT... The shitposting about feminism/creationism? The constant videos about the subject? The internet seeming to give a shit about feminism/creationism?

That is all a fad.

So by all means write your law makers and express your discontent with legal changes or changes in university policies. But all the time spent shitposting about feminism amounts to pretty well fuck all and it's just another internet fad. How many people spend a bunch of time angrily writing about creationism anymore? It's not about the actual threat, but the PERCEIVED threat by the internet collective. Creationism in the USA is not any less harmful than feminism... Which is to say both are largely annoying but harmless except for a few situations (jesus camps/university campuses) where they are very harmful.

And most people take the view that such-and-such serious problem is not their problem. Or perhaps I'm wrong and you manage to hold every injustice in your mind and constantly work to correct all of them. Sneaker sweat shops are at least as unjust as creationism/feminism in the 1st world.

We all prioritize what we choose to waste spend our time complaining about. Most of us, including me, would be better off using that time to volunteer at a soup kitchen.

But whatever, I don't really have to "defend" my point of view on internet fads because I'll be vindicated in the end. The rest of the internet will move on and stop caring, whether you think that's just or not, and a few stalwarts will be left (like with creationism.) The real activism against feminism/creationism will continue with or without the internet's collective sperging. But like with creationists, the best we can hope for in many cases is that these people (creationists and SJWs) end up dying of old age and then we can move on with some new ideas.

Which ignores the fact that the internet and meatspace are closely entangled. There aren't that many Westerners who don't have their opinions influenced by the internet and it should be obvious to you by now that the 'shitposting' from the perpetually incensed ruins lives and shapes the opinions that public figures are allowed to express. The internet is the most powerful tool on the planet for shaping public opinion. The harm of feminist dogma goes way beyond college campuses, promoting family law which places a blunt instrument in the hands of women with which they can persecute a man for life. Destitution, heartbreak, imprisonment and suicide are the results. Take a look at Deepika Bharadwaj's TED talk on Indian gender based laws and pay heed to the prevalence of vindictive and avaricious false claims flooding the legal system and the resultant despair and suicide. This is radical feminism in action. Even if only universities were affected that would be serious enough with the rapid decline in male attendance and politicisation of education. The gynocentric assumptions utilised and bolstered by feminists affect almost every area of social and political life. The effect on society of fatherlessness and the disenfranchising of men is causing a host of problems and it is only going to get worse. By all means, volunteer at a soup kitchen and ignore the disenfranchisement of generations of men and the increasing radicalisation of minds at universities which ensures that SJW's bullshit will survive well into the future. Your right, but please drop the disingenuous smokescreen.

[Dick Strawkins]

Wait a min, since when did DJ, CFI podcaster extraordinaire, get to boss about exalted CFI Directors?

He used to work for the CFI before he became head of the JREF.
This was a few years back (2009?) and so Melody at that time would have been in her previous role as events organizer at the CFI.

[Brive1987]

Yep that was when he did POI before he left to replace Plait at JREF. Death from Above Bwhahaha

But I doubt that would give him boss rights over Ms DC? Even if she was still doing her event coord shit kicking apprenticeship ...

[blitzem]

Without really knowing the contents of what he is pushing, it is difficult for me to judge. However his defense is straight out of the feminist playbook. I think it would be reasonable that some bad stuff has happened to him. However he is pushing the victim narrative pretty hard. Let the two groups duke it out.

He was basically saying that his PUA ideology comes from being raised by an honourable Muslim father, and that men should be strong and that women should be weak and submit to men.

But yeah, I can see your point. Letting them fight it out keeps me sane...and amused. :D

[Dick Strawkins]

Yep that was when he did POI before he left to replace Plait at JREF. Death from Above Bwhahaha

But I doubt that would give him boss rights over Ms DC? Even if she was still doing her event coord shit kicking apprenticeship ...

From his wikipedia page_

In 2009, while serving as vice president and director of outreach programs, Grothe left CFI to serve as president of the James Randi Educational Foundation.

I guess if he was "vice president and director of outreach programs" he should have had seniority to Melody.

BTW, has anyone been appointed to replace Ron Lindsay?

(Please let it be Melody! Please let it be Melody! :animals-chickencatch: )

[Dick Strawkins]

Without really knowing the contents of what he is pushing, it is difficult for me to judge. However his defense is straight out of the feminist playbook. I think it would be reasonable that some bad stuff has happened to him. However he is pushing the victim narrative pretty hard. Let the two groups duke it out.

He was basically saying that his PUA ideology comes from being raised by an honourable Muslim father, and that men should be strong and that women should be weak and submit to men.

But yeah, I can see your point. Letting them fight it out keeps me sane...and amused. :D

You mean he was being serious? :shock:
I thought he was trolling - at least for the first half but it did appear he was taking himself way too seriously.

[blitzem]

Without really knowing the contents of what he is pushing, it is difficult for me to judge. However his defense is straight out of the feminist playbook. I think it would be reasonable that some bad stuff has happened to him. However he is pushing the victim narrative pretty hard. Let the two groups duke it out.

He was basically saying that his PUA ideology comes from being raised by an honourable Muslim father, and that men should be strong and that women should be weak and submit to men.

But yeah, I can see your point. Letting them fight it out keeps me sane...and amused. :D

You mean he was being serious? :shock:
I thought he was trolling - at least for the first half but it did appear he was taking himself way too seriously.

Well, if he was trolling then I certainly took the bait. But it seemed that he was serious. You might be right, though.

[Keating]

You mean he was being serious? :shock:
I thought he was trolling - at least for the first half but it did appear he was taking himself way too seriously.

Well, if he was trolling then I certainly took the bait. But it seemed that he was serious. You might be right, though.

I assumed he was trolling as well and I didn't even watch the whole thing.

[Parody Accountant]

Latest, from yesterday

http://i.imgur.com/qx0EJ9v.png?1

(mea culpa if someone else posted it & I missed it)

Bwahaha.

[Parody Accountant]

http://i.imgur.com/6oGNLio.png

IMO, there is nothing wrong with the response by the Governmental morons of TSA in this case. The person said they were female, the scanner detected material where cis and trans women don't have material, so the person was detained for further searching/questioning.

SFAIAC, a trans/trans* woman should pass through the female security. But this person is not a trans/trans* woman: they are a man in drag, they are a transvestite, they are a bloke wearing a dress. Until you have the op, you are a man. If you've got a cock and balls, for fuck's sake think about why these TSA cretins are asking you for your gender. They can barely speak human languages, and all they are doing is telling the software/human operator what to expect in certain areas.

Why should you be able to force a woman to search you, playing a woman, only to find a cock and balls in her palm. Isn't that sexual assault? Fuck: do what you want and think of yourself as what you want, but don't expect everyone else to suddenly become enlightened overnight and accept that a bloke wearing a dress is a woman.

And for Meyers: as you're a fan of tentacle rape porn, a person who has had a false sexual assault claim made against them, and have a sexual partners list of exactly one, I would suggest that you steer clear of pronouncing upon sexy stuff. Stick to whinging about the annoying church bells in your cowpoke little shithole, thanks.

http://imgur.com/MKngHxS.jpg

Please. .. template. ... font?

[Dick Strawkins]

You mean he was being serious? :shock:
I thought he was trolling - at least for the first half but it did appear he was taking himself way too seriously.

Well, if he was trolling then I certainly took the bait. But it seemed that he was serious. You might be right, though.

I assumed he was trolling as well and I didn't even watch the whole thing.

The MRA/PUA crowd are notoriously crap at trolling (just look at Paul Elams various debacles) so there is that excuse.

[Parody Accountant]

Concerning 'Shitposting' and 'Fads'

James Caruthers' complaint is self-fulfilling. On one hand, Caruthers attributes feminism's failings to a SJW component. On the other hand, Caruthers declares criticism of that component to be a pointless fad, mere 'shitposting'. The =very reason= that conversation doesn't shift to a more substantial critique... is that the sanctity of feminism is so dutifully protected, like a pristine virgin who only takes it up the butt.

I don't agree with him on all of his points. But I do think Internet giving a shit about creationism has waned, while the percentage of people who think that the world is very young is still alarmingly high.

It's not a fresh fight, there's no new ground to cover. You'd have to make up bayesian bs to be original. probably tons of other reasons too.

I think Caruthers is wrong about sjw. There's plenty of new shit on a daily basis. This is the goddamn golden age not the end.

[Dick Strawkins]

Skepticon's safe sex policy has just been revised.

Conduct Policy
In addition to complying with the Harassment Policy guidelines, Skepticon Attendees are expected to comply with the following Code of Conduct at all conference events.

We define misconduct as deliberate intimidation, stalking, following, harassing photography or recording, sustained disruption of talks or other events, disruptive arguments anywhere at the conference, personal verbal attacks, fights, physical assault, inappropriate physical contact, unwelcome sexual attention, and any other act that may cause harm to oneself or others. Assuming the absence of problematic behavior (intimidation, following, inappropriate physical contact, etc.), criticism or disagreement regarding an attendee’s belief structure will not be construed as harassment. Our conference thrives on its diversity, which includes but is not limited to: sexual orientation, gender, race, ethnicity, ability, beliefs, et cetera. Blatant instances of racism, sexism, homophobia, or other stereotyping and harmful behaviors should be reported to conference staff immediately.

“Yes” means yes; “No” means no; and “Maybe” means no. Please accept no for an answer for any request or activity. You are encouraged to ask for unequivocal consent for all activities during the conference. No touching other people without asking. This includes hands on knees, backs, shoulders—and hugs (ask first!). There are people who do not like to be touched and will respect and like you more if you respect their personal space.
Skepticon attendees who decide to partake in consenting sexual activity are advised to be aware of safe sex practices.
While it is unlikely that individual fellow attendees have HIV, never forget that one of them is a Carrier.

On a more serious note, they appear to have a mass murder policy!

Weapon Threat and/or Active Shooter Policy

Updated May 2, 2014

Skepticon considers a weapon threat to be an expression of an intention to inflict pain or injury via a weapon such as a knife or gun. We do not have to see a weapon to consider it a threat. If an attendee makes a threat of weapon violence to an organizer, volunteer, attendee, speaker, hotel staff, unrelated guest of the hotel, service worker, random person in the lobby, or any other living being they will not be welcome to return to future Skepticon events.

The Department of Homeland Security (DHS) defines active shooter as “an individual actively engaged in killing or attempting to kill people in a confined and populated area; in most cases, active shooters use firearm and there is no pattern or method to their selection of victims.”

If the threat of weapon violence becomes real violence, ie. there is an active shooter (or someone with another weapon) that is identified, the Skepticon leadership will do the following:

1. Notify every one of the shooter’s location.

2. Call 911 and report

Location of shooter
Number of shooters
Physical description of shooter/s
Number and type of weapons
Number of potential victims

3. Direct Skepticon event staff member in each room to identify a room leader. The room leader is responsible to make decisions and provide guidance for everyone in their area. The room leader will decide whether to evacuate, hide, or take action against the shooter based on the location of the shooter.

Evacuate: Select an evacuation route that takes everyone away from the shooter and out of the building. Everyone will need to leave their belongings behind and move quietly and quickly along the route. The room leader assigns someone to lead the group out. The room leader is the last to leave.

Hide: Get into a defensible room and lock or barricade all doors. Turn out the lights and keep everyone quiet.

Take action against shooter: This is the least preferred option. Be loud, aggressive and fast. Commit to the decision and do not hesitate. Do the greatest possible damage in the least time.

http://skepticon.org/policy/

[jimthepleb]

I gotta say, I am glad Carrier exists. If he did not exist then we would have to invent him.

Particulary since lulz from any other source have largely dried up over there now the fallout from Ophie's TERFian indisgressions has long since settled. There just aren't enough bloggers left, most of the bridges have been burned, and Patheos not only eclipsed them, it orbitally captured what was left of their star satellites while mortally offending the kids chosen last, and the thing is, they all know it.

It was as good as it gets six or so years ago. From now on, FTB is in hospice care. PZ might regain a small measure of some of the regulars who got scared off by all the crazy, but his bolt is well and truly shot. I think he's in it for the long term though.

You could not make up Carrier, he is simply not a credible character even for comedy.This is mainly due to his continued inconsistencies and total lack of self awareness which would lead the reader to conclude the writer was a complete idiot.

As to Ftb I do not care what happens to them.I was never here specifically for them or for Atheism plus. I am here as it is one of the few places where genuine free thought is allowed and diverse ideas tolerated and there needs to be one place at least in the AS community that can be a watchdog. It does not matter if there is nothing to see for a while.That's good. But there needs to be somewhere already in place if the morons start to kick off again, which they will from time to time. It does not matter if this place ticks over for a while. People can come, go and come back easily.

It is funny some seem dead keen for the Slympit to stop. Why is that? It makes no sense as if the need for this place no longer exists it will stop or change naturally. Nothing to discuss. Unless you want to bring the place down early that is.

Why are those with SJW tenancies so consistently dishonest and try and hide their true motives? It really is a brain infection.Is it because you HAVE to be dishonest to post at SJW places and that habit reflects in the posts here? It's a bad habit, shake it off before it eats you up.

James has wanted the pit to close forever. Not sure why but it's been evident for a long time.

Jimthepleb from tapatalk.

[Parody Accountant]

Room leader is last to leave?

You guys go first, I'm in charge here

[Parody Accountant]

I went through a month of hating Carruthers. Then I saw something else. I like his posts, and appreciate the ability to aim in both directions without being an oolon fence sitter

[jimthepleb]

I gotta say, I am glad Carrier exists. If he did not exist then we would have to invent him.

Particulary since lulz from any other source have largely dried up over there now the fallout from Ophie's TERFian indisgressions has long since settled. There just aren't enough bloggers left, most of the bridges have been burned, and Patheos not only eclipsed them, it orbitally captured what was left of their star satellites while mortally offending the kids chosen last, and the thing is, they all know it.

It was as good as it gets six or so years ago. From now on, FTB is in hospice care. PZ might regain a small measure of some of the regulars who got scared off by all the crazy, but his bolt is well and truly shot. I think he's in it for the long term though.

You could not make up Carrier, he is simply not a credible character even for comedy.This is mainly due to his continued inconsistencies and total lack of self awareness which would lead the reader to conclude the writer was a complete idiot.

As to Ftb I do not care what happens to them.I was never here specifically for them or for Atheism plus. I am here as it is one of the few places where genuine free thought is allowed and diverse ideas tolerated and there needs to be one place at least in the AS community that can be a watchdog. It does not matter if there is nothing to see for a while.That's good. But there needs to be somewhere already in place if the morons start to kick off again, which they will from time to time. It does not matter if this place ticks over for a while. People can come, go and come back easily.

It is funny some seem dead keen for the Slympit to stop. Why is that? It makes no sense as if the need for this place no longer exists it will stop or change naturally. Nothing to discuss. Unless you want to bring the place down early that is.

Why are those with SJW tenancies so consistently dishonest and try and hide their true motives? It really is a brain infection.Is it because you HAVE to be dishonest to post at SJW places and that habit reflects in the posts here? It's a bad habit, shake it off before it eats you up.

James has wanted the pit to close forever. Not sure why but it's been evident for a long time.

Jimthepleb from tapatalk.

Pfft well it said I wasn't logged in. But apart from that it seems to work. Laptop has gone to the computer hospital. I can only 'invent' it so much with gaffer tape. Still waiting for my invite to the White house. But I bet I won't get one cos I'm not a fellow Muslim.

[Brive1987]

Yep that was when he did POI before he left to replace Plait at JREF. Death from Above Bwhahaha

But I doubt that would give him boss rights over Ms DC? Even if she was still doing her event coord shit kicking apprenticeship ...

From his wikipedia page_

In 2009, while serving as vice president and director of outreach programs, Grothe left CFI to serve as president of the James Randi Educational Foundation.

I guess if he was "vice president and director of outreach programs" he should have had seniority to Melody.

BTW, has anyone been appointed to replace Ron Lindsay?

(Please let it be Melody! Please let it be Melody! :animals-chickencatch: )

Quite possibly.

However there may be some ambiguity about his non-title. He appears to be a VP and Director of his own small pond. That extra row of gold sounds suspiciously like a vanity off-set to a failed raise. It probably got him closer to the centre of the staff photo - but I suspect her direct chain of command bypassed his niche.

http://i.imgur.com/wcI50AX.jpg

[jimthepleb]

I went through a month of hating Carruthers. Then I saw something else. I like his posts, and appreciate the ability to aim in both directions without being an oolon fence sitter

I don't hate JC at all. His input interests me and confuses me in equal measure. I think he has an agenda but am not clear on what it is. I note he's the only person to have heavily promoted a white supremacist idea, but suspect he was just being an 'edgelord'.

[Cnutella]

“ ‘Come into my parlour’, said the spider to the fly”. :-) But sorry if the experience of discussion with me is so difficult or traumatic. Though I think that, in general – with many people and most conversations, the problem is different frames of reference, different ways of phrasing things.

Actually, after these clarifications, On this topic, we may not actually disagree on much. The disagreements I see are ones of personal opinion and taste.

Generally agree with you about “psychologically debilitating” and “loneliness is bad for most humans”. And there is probably some justification for characterizing it as a “modern condition”, at least if we can agree that a more communal style of living was probably more common in previous eras. However, I’m not sure Richardson had any obligation or intent to “suggest alternative strategies”, only to suggest or delineate some problematic aspects to sex robots. Which I think she more or less succeeded at, even if her bias against men and a reliance on feminist dogma was all too evident.

I would argue that all she provided was an example of questionable relevance in which, given the choice between a metal mom that dispenses food and one covered in fur, baby monkeys pick reassurance and comfort. Either way, the end result was maladjusted monkeys. I would like to know what relevance it has to already grown (and presumably already poorly socialized) humans. It seems clear that when the choices are either a completely mechanical device or one that kind has monkey characteristics, monkeys are biased towards the monkeyesque one, but only when a real monkey mom isn't an option. Presumably the same holds true in human society, or there wouldn't be a realdoll industry at all. However, this is a substitute for a real woman and, particularly as Richardson is anti prostitution and (as her argument is an objectification one) presumably anti-porn, what panacea is she offering to the men of WizardChan beyond "well we need to have a conversation".

The thing is, any number of things can be misused or used compulsively as an emotional substitute for an underlying issue (such as depression, dysphoria or loneliness) - eating compulsively, watching TV, watching porn, smoking pot or playing computer games.

I recall reading that there have been a number of sociological studies on alienation (no idea whether any of them are worth a damn, but as the cateogry of people living on their own is expanding in the census, I think it's reasonable to assume an increase in loneliness. It is also prett clear that more communal ways of living were more typical in the past, just as they are today in less technologically dependent societies. It appears to be a necessity for a number of reasons.

As for “better than none whatsoever”, I think there are a number of salient and crucial differences between the first set of solutions you suggested – pets, vibrators and fleshlights – and the sex robots: rather clear that the former are not the “real-meal-deal” whereas the latter is rather clearly attempting to pass itself off as that – basically peddling a delusion.

You might argue that a fleshlight is even more reductionist and objectifying because it reduces women down to the role of a vagina.

Also, is there anything wrong with a delusion, particularly if it is your only option?

And which shows some uncomfortable similarities with religion and its promise of “life everlasting”, either in the presense of Jesus or in the 144 arms of the houris – depending on your taste and accidents of birth.

Provides existential comfort; gets people through periods of grief and long dark winter nights.

What’s the harm in believing that Jesus or 72 Virgins will be waiting for us when we die?

What indeed?

[Cnutella]

You could not make up Carrier, he is simply not a credible character even for comedy.This is mainly due to his continued inconsistencies and total lack of self awareness which would lead the reader to conclude the writer was a complete idiot.

Fair point.

As to Ftb I do not care what happens to them.I was never here specifically for them or for Atheism plus. I am here as it is one of the few places where genuine free thought is allowed and diverse ideas tolerated and there needs to be one place at least in the AS community that can be a watchdog. It does not matter if there is nothing to see for a while.That's good. But there needs to be somewhere already in place if the morons start to kick off again, which they will from time to time. It does not matter if this place ticks over for a while. People can come, go and come back easily.

I do enjoy the people here, and the free ranging conversation. I also love Internet drama, and although I am selfishly sad about the FTB drama mine tapping out on one level, It is much better for atheism and a whole array of potential targets who might otherwise have been accused publicly based on the sketchiest hearsay. I watched FTB begin its downward slide with horrified fascination; I'm happy to see that it has been left in the dust by the majority, even from its own fanbase. Along with Atheism Plus, FTB is an object lesson in what happens when SJW ideologues take control.

It is funny some seem dead keen for the Slympit to stop. Why is that? It makes no sense as if the need for this place no longer exists it will stop or change naturally. Nothing to discuss. Unless you want to bring the place down early that is.

I might have missed that. I have seen some people question the Pit's relevance post-FTB, but it is a freewheeling discussion board. and there will always be something else to talk about or laugh at.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Canadian feminists are islamophobic bigots! I don't always agree with Roosh, but he nails it here!
[youtube]Ot4tDl6T-tY[/youtube]

I dunno, man. He openly admits that his beliefs come from Islam and he is up here trying to spread them. The Canada I live in has freedom of religion and freedom from religion. Like I said in a comment I left on the video, why should he automatically gain dominance just because of an accident of birth. For dam sure he wouldn't be saying the same things if he was born female. At least, I hope he wouldn't.

Er...yeah, fuck that cunt. I'm not gonna start crying over some religious fuck getting attacked by feminists or anyone else for being a bigoted and over-zealous religious bigot.

And this dude looks 100% white. If he looks middle-eastern, then so do I.

[Tribble]

Don't know what to make of this observation, so I'll put it out there:
Today I skimmed through FTB, read a little bit of this, little bit of that... and I realised that I can't connect to anything they say anymore. Nothing. Everything I read, from start to end, article or comments, was, in my opinion, either of no particular interest to me, or just plain dumb horseshit.

I'm pretty certain it has to do with the fact that FTB is a cesspool of fringe progressivism, but even their 'atheist' topics, something with which I should be able to connect, don't speak to me in any meaningful way. I'd like to think this was different in the past, but I'm not even sure about that. Did I ever find FTB really interesting ? Did I ever really agree with anything they brought forward ? Did I change? Did they change?

I really don't know, but I feel it's high time for a final divorce...

I did the same thing earlier this year. The old blogs changed or left. The base case in point is if you look at the evolution of Pharyngula.

Once upon a time it was the premiere science blog on the Internet. Now what little science there is, is often mis-represented like it was interpreted by some dumb-ass like "The Food Babe." Meanwhile, there's very little about atheism and what there is does come through a filter of personal politics rooted the defective-moral absolutism of toxic-SJWism.

[Ape+lust]

Please. .. template. ... font?

This? :D

http://imgur.com/54QMeAc.jpg

And the font is called Alex Brush:

http://www.fontsquirrel.com/fonts/alex-brush

[RonSwanson]

I am here as it is one of the few places where genuine free thought is allowed and diverse ideas tolerated and there needs to be one place at least in the AS community that can be a watchdog. It does not matter if there is nothing to see for a while.That's good. But there needs to be somewhere already in place if the morons start to kick off again, which they will from time to time. It does not matter if this place ticks over for a while. People can come, go and come back easily.

Well said!
:clap:

[Tribble]

I went through a month of hating Carruthers. Then I saw something else. I like his posts, and appreciate the ability to aim in both directions without being an oolon fence sitter

I don't hate JC at all. His input interests me and confuses me in equal measure. I think he has an agenda but am not clear on what it is. I note he's the only person to have heavily promoted a white supremacist idea, but suspect he was just being an 'edgelord'.

Ah, so I'm not the only one who noticed that.

[Dick Strawkins]

Don't know what to make of this observation, so I'll put it out there:
Today I skimmed through FTB, read a little bit of this, little bit of that... and I realised that I can't connect to anything they say anymore. Nothing. Everything I read, from start to end, article or comments, was, in my opinion, either of no particular interest to me, or just plain dumb horseshit.

I'm pretty certain it has to do with the fact that FTB is a cesspool of fringe progressivism, but even their 'atheist' topics, something with which I should be able to connect, don't speak to me in any meaningful way. I'd like to think this was different in the past, but I'm not even sure about that. Did I ever find FTB really interesting ? Did I ever really agree with anything they brought forward ? Did I change? Did they change?

I really don't know, but I feel it's high time for a final divorce...

I did the same thing earlier this year. The old blogs changed or left. The base case in point is if you look at the evolution of Pharyngula.

Once upon a time it was the premiere science blog on the Internet. Now what little science there is, is often mis-represented like it was interpreted by some dumb-ass like "The Food Babe." Meanwhile, there's very little about atheism and what there is does come through a filter of personal politics rooted the defective-moral absolutism of toxic-SJWism.

In his post about Dawkins and Ahmed's clock, Myers did his usual 'bah-humbug' style dismissal of other more famous atheists:

People are noticing that self-proclaimed leaders of atheism are targeting a 14 year old boy — for being enthusiastic about electronics?

I’m fast learning why “movement” is a synonym for “shit”.

His approach here is interesting for two reasons. First, the line about the 'self-proclaimed leaders of atheism' links to a think progress piece that quotes both Bill Maher and Richard Dawkins, and yet neither of them say anything out of the ordinary:

On his talk show, Real Time With Bill Maher, the host said Mohamed deserved an apology but teachers reacted reasonably in targeting the boy.

“People at the school thought it might be a bomb … because it looks exactly like a f*cking bomb,” he said during a panel discussion with Mark Cuban, Jorge Ramos, George Pataki, and Chris Matthews. “It’s not the color of his skin. Somebody look me in the eye right now and tell me. Over the last 30 years, if so many young Muslim men … and he’s young, 14, but that’s not like it’s never happened before, hasn’t blown up a lot of sh*t around the world. And this kid deserves an apology, because he wasn’t one of them… Over the last 30 years, it’s been one culture that has been been blowing sh*t up over and over again.”

He also pointed out that the idea that Mohamed could’ve brought a bomb to school wasn’t unfounded, as several American teenagers have joined ISIS to the shock of people who knew them well.

Famous atheist and biologist Richard Dawkins agrees that Mohamed suffered an injustice, but the praise he received was uncalled for.

“If the reassembled components did something more than the original clock, that’s creative. If not, it looks like hoax,” he tweeted. “Disassembling & reassembling is great. But you shouldn’t then claim it was your “invention.”

As people have said here previously, Dawkins is on a hiding to nothing by criticising the kid over this story, but what he actually said here does fit with the facts of the story (unlike his later speculation that Ahmed may have some ulterior motive for his action).

Myers, as we have come to expect, takes the Greta Christina approach - he makes up his mind beforehand, depending on what the correct progressive thing is to say, and then acts like it is madness to even think about taking a skeptical approach to the subject.

The other notable thing is Myers last line:

I’m fast learning why “movement” is a synonym for “shit”

Hardly the most witty of insults.

There is not really an atheist movement, any more than there is a 'not believing in Santa' movement.

But there is a feminist movement, a progressive movement, a socialist movement.
And indeed various religious movements, trade union movements, educational movements etc.

[James Caruthers]

Concerning 'Shitposting' and 'Fads'

James Caruthers' complaint is self-fulfilling. On one hand, Caruthers attributes feminism's failings to a SJW component. On the other hand, Caruthers declares criticism of that component to be a pointless fad, mere 'shitposting'. The =very reason= that conversation doesn't shift to a more substantial critique... is that the sanctity of feminism is so dutifully protected, like a pristine virgin who only takes it up the butt.

I'm just telling you how the internet is. I'm not proscribing on an individual level how you ought to be. Shitposting is fun.

But yes, please tell me what good youtube response videos, twitter hashtag slacktivism and forum shitposting does to further activist aims in the real world in opposition to feminism.

Nobody stops antifeminists from making substantial critiques of feminism. It just rarely happens because everyone is busy being an outraged keyboard warrior no matter which side they're on. Which is part of the fad.

[Parody Accountant]

Please. .. template. ... font?

This? :D

http://imgur.com/54QMeAc.jpg

And the font is called Alex Brush:

http://www.fontsquirrel.com/fonts/alex-brush

Might not do anything, but this seems ready for multiple easy "deep thoughts" by pz myers.

Thanks!

[Parody Accountant]

What is the Carruthers white supremacy angle?

[James Caruthers]

Concerning 'Shitposting' and 'Fads'

James Caruthers' complaint is self-fulfilling. On one hand, Caruthers attributes feminism's failings to a SJW component. On the other hand, Caruthers declares criticism of that component to be a pointless fad, mere 'shitposting'. The =very reason= that conversation doesn't shift to a more substantial critique... is that the sanctity of feminism is so dutifully protected, like a pristine virgin who only takes it up the butt.

I don't agree with him on all of his points. But I do think Internet giving a shit about creationism has waned, while the percentage of people who think that the world is very young is still alarmingly high.

It's not a fresh fight, there's no new ground to cover. You'd have to make up bayesian bs to be original. probably tons of other reasons too.

I think Caruthers is wrong about sjw. There's plenty of new shit on a daily basis. This is the goddamn golden age not the end.

I dunno man. Feels like it has gotten old. Tumblr is all little kiddies with dumb ideas who will grow out of it (Dashcon was all kiddies) and then some crazy nuts. Mainstream SJW is boring, just them saying stupid shit as per usual with little variety.

Elyse was entertaining but I feel bad, like I'm feeding off someone's personal tragedies and can't stop watching.

And I'm seeing a lot of people on both sides using this little internet spat to fill their pockets, which is a shrewd move but (if it is, as I believe, a fad like creationism was) not likely to be a lasting source of income forever. Although yeah, Amazing Atheist built his career off creationism, even though now he pretty much talks about whatever is topical, including SJWs, so he's not vulnerable to the passing of the creationism fad.

One potential source of lulz is new age horseshit like that Spirit Science channel, which is amazingly popular. Although Martymer was the original pioneer on that score. But there are probably a lot more like it out there.

[James Caruthers]

What is the Carruthers white supremacy angle?

Am I a white supremacist?

I must be.

I went to get a manji tattoo, then I realized later that the guy put it on wrong and it was a swastika. Probably explains why the guy's head was shaved and he had one of his own on his forehead.

[James Caruthers]

James has wanted the pit to close forever. Not sure why but it's been evident for a long time.

Jimthepleb from tapatalk.

On the contrary, I love shitposting and want to continue doing it forever. :dance:

[James Caruthers]

I went through a month of hating Carruthers. Then I saw something else. I like his posts, and appreciate the ability to aim in both directions without being an oolon fence sitter

I don't hate J(esus)C(hrist) at all. His input interests me and confuses me in equal measure. I think he has an agenda but am not clear on what it is.

That makes two of us.

(This is a joke edit, don't ban me plz.)

[Malky]

“People at the school thought it might be a bomb … because it looks exactly like a f*cking bomb,” he said during a panel discussion with Mark Cuban, Jorge Ramos, George Pataki, and Chris Matthews. “It’s not the color of his skin. Somebody look me in the eye right now and tell me. Over the last 30 years, if so many young Muslim men … and he’s young, 14, but that’s not like it’s never happened before, hasn’t blown up a lot of sh*t around the world. And this kid deserves an apology, because he wasn’t one of them… Over the last 30 years, it’s been one culture that has been been blowing sh*t up over and over again.”

It;s the bolded bit here I can't understand about Americans, he seems totallly unaware that the USA has probably blown up "more shoy around the world" than anyone else -nominally in the name of freedom.

[Malky]

“People at the school thought it might be a bomb … because it looks exactly like a f*cking bomb,” he said during a panel discussion with Mark Cuban, Jorge Ramos, George Pataki, and Chris Matthews. “It’s not the color of his skin. Somebody look me in the eye right now and tell me. Over the last 30 years, if so many young Muslim men … and he’s young, 14, but that’s not like it’s never happened before, hasn’t blown up a lot of sh*t around the world. And this kid deserves an apology, because he wasn’t one of them… Over the last 30 years, it’s been one culture that has been been blowing sh*t up over and over again.”

It;s the bolded bit here I can't understand about Americans, he seems totallly unaware that the USA has probably blown up "more shoy around the world" than anyone else -nominally in the name of freedom.

"totally" and "shit" not Shoy need an edit button

[Parody Accountant]

The edit button is spelled 'preview' ;)

[Søren Lilholt]

Don't know what to make of this observation, so I'll put it out there:
Today I skimmed through FTB, read a little bit of this, little bit of that... and I realised that I can't connect to anything they say anymore. Nothing. Everything I read, from start to end, article or comments, was, in my opinion, either of no particular interest to me, or just plain dumb horseshit.

I'm pretty certain it has to do with the fact that FTB is a cesspool of fringe progressivism, but even their 'atheist' topics, something with which I should be able to connect, don't speak to me in any meaningful way. I'd like to think this was different in the past, but I'm not even sure about that. Did I ever find FTB really interesting ? Did I ever really agree with anything they brought forward ? Did I change? Did they change?

I really don't know, but I feel it's high time for a final divorce...

I did the same thing earlier this year. The old blogs changed or left. The base case in point is if you look at the evolution of Pharyngula.

Once upon a time it was the premiere science blog on the Internet. Now what little science there is, is often mis-represented like it was interpreted by some dumb-ass like "The Food Babe." Meanwhile, there's very little about atheism and what there is does come through a filter of personal politics rooted the defective-moral absolutism of toxic-SJWism.

PZ simply fell apart after the heart scare. Some have claimed he was always as bad as he is now, but clearly, at one point he used to be a credible commentator and now he is a certifiable lunatic. There has to have been a reason for this, and the timing at least does point to the heart issue. (Although I accept that correlation doesn't equal causation blah blah)

[Malky]

The edit button is spelled 'preview' ;)

Doesn't work as I suffer from the usual seeing what you thought you have writen rather than what you have actually written :(

[Kirbmarc]

Concerning 'Shitposting' and 'Fads'

James Caruthers' complaint is self-fulfilling. On one hand, Caruthers attributes feminism's failings to a SJW component. On the other hand, Caruthers declares criticism of that component to be a pointless fad, mere 'shitposting'. The =very reason= that conversation doesn't shift to a more substantial critique... is that the sanctity of feminism is so dutifully protected, like a pristine virgin who only takes it up the butt.

I'm just telling you how the internet is. I'm not proscribing on an individual level how you ought to be. Shitposting is fun.

But yes, please tell me what good youtube response videos, twitter hashtag slacktivism and forum shitposting does to further activist aims in the real world in opposition to feminism.

Nobody stops antifeminists from making substantial critiques of feminism. It just rarely happens because everyone is busy being an outraged keyboard warrior no matter which side they're on. Which is part of the fad.

There is some element of truth to this. Internet "activism" isn't as effective as many people believe (or wish to believe) it is. Many "fads" like Creationism or Trutherism come and go as young people get older and more experienced. Most SJW-leaning kids will change their minds, some already are. A few of them will grow into lolcows or fade into obscurity.

However I disagree that anti-SJW thinkers rarely make substantial criticism of SJW ideology only because of "keyboard warriors". People like Cathy Young or Micheal Nugent have relied on "keyboard warriors" as source of good material for their very articulated and nuanced pieces of criticism of general SJW trends (Young) or of specific figures in the SJW "movement" (Nugent).

It's hard to tell where the boundary between "shitposting" and "critical journalism" lies. I believe that the effectiveness or the seriousness of Internet "activism" is hard to gauge. Most "shitposting" is beyond pointless, but among the "shitpost" you could find some criticism that could help some marginally influential people to change their minds and policies.

Nugent, for example, was a supporter of PZ' policies back in the day, before PZ went on a witch hunting spree. And without "Internet activism" he would have had a much harder time to come up with evidence for his arguments against PZ. His dissociation wasn't a major change in the "atheist community", but it contributed to the progressive downfall of FTB.

The "Internet slacktivism" and "shitposting" of the Slymepit was also a part of the evidence that convinced people like Hemant Mehta and JT Eberhard that PZ was bad news.

Larger phenomena of "internet slacktivism" might, in the long run, help some people to come up with evidence, good arguments and the support of the "masses" to stop some SJW-inspired laws.

FTB is dying a quiet death and slowly sinking into an ocean of indifference, but other SJW community are alive and kicking despite the backlash.

Those communities were built on "Internet slacktivism" and already obtained a few successes in the "real world". The "culture war" between SJWs and those who disagree with them isn't fought just on the Internet, but it's hard to deny that the Internet played, and will probably play, a part in the opinions which will inform the decisions of many policy-makers in the future.

Unlike Creationists, who are a laughingstock for everyone who isn't a raving religious fundamentalist, the less "extreme" SJWs still have some clout among the general public of the "progressives" and among celebrities and the media. Anti-vaxxers are a much better comparison.

[deLurch]

BTW, has anyone been appointed to replace Ron Lindsay?
(Please let it be Melody! Please let it be Melody! :animals-chickencatch: )

Not picking Melody would clearly be discriminatory against people with mental health issues. CFI doesn't want to be discrimanatory against women and the mentally ill do they? That would be misogynist & ablest.

As a side note, Ron Lindsay is on his way out. He could do CFI a favor and shit can Melody and save that organization some grief, or he can take the easy way out and let someone else deal with it.

[Dave]

BTW, has anyone been appointed to replace Ron Lindsay?
(Please let it be Melody! Please let it be Melody! :animals-chickencatch: )

Not picking Melody would clearly be discriminatory against people with mental health issues. CFI doesn't want to be discrimanatory against women and the mentally ill do they? That would be misogynist & ablest.

As a side note, Ron Lindsay is on his way out. He could do CFI a favor and shit can Melody and save that organization some grief, or he can take the easy way out and let someone else deal with it.

I have a theory thats been rattling around in my head for sometime. Consider: (a) Melody seems to have come from a well off family, (b) While CFI has other regional offices, CFI-DC seems to be the only one with its own physical office space, all the others seem to run out of post-boxes (c) CFI-DC seems to be run as Melody's own little fifedom and (d) Main CFI doesnt seem to be able to do anything about her. My thought, and this is pure speculation, is that Melody's family are large donors to CFI and are effectively bankrolling CFI-DC, and thats why no one will touch her, because to do so means the loss of donations from her family.

Like I said, pure speculation, but I cant seem to shake the thought.

[Ape+lust]

PZ simply fell apart after the heart scare. Some have claimed he was always as bad as he is now, but clearly, at one point he used to be a credible commentator and now he is a certifiable lunatic. There has to have been a reason for this, and the timing at least does point to the heart issue. (Although I accept that correlation doesn't equal causation blah blah)

I think the comedy with that book probably accelerated his derangement. Books were what made the 4 Horsemen, particularly Sam Harris, an unknown with an improbable bestseller. The chance to do one of his own must've seemed like a ticket to renown and respect. But after 6 YEARS of who knows what, while teasing his boosters with "it's coming along nicely" updates, he produced something with the import of a coloring book.

He may act unruffled, but mean and high strung as he is, he probably feels like he buttfucked himself in front of the world (you did, Peez). Right now, his failure can intrude at any moment through an interview question, a forum post, a web ad, a site bio, a speaker's introduction, and on and on. That can make a man seethe and loathe himself. Y'know, like Peez during waking hours.

[jimthepleb]

We did sort out the Kpny2012 issue so some keyboard warrior ism is sooner effective.
PA the Carruthers Volkisch Swole and Bix Nood stuff was straight from pol and fit white supremacists. I am pretty certain that it was posted with tongue firmly in cheek, but it made me wonder for a while and was sufficient for FT to create an auto edit for a while.

[jimthepleb]

We did sort out the Kpny2012 issue so some keyboard warrior ism is sooner effective.
PA the Carruthers Volkisch Swole and Bix Nood stuff was straight from pol and fit white supremacists. I am pretty certain that it was posted with tongue firmly in cheek, but it made me wonder for a while and was sufficient for FT to create an auto edit for a while.

Kony. ..fuck tapatalk.

Don't know what to make of this observation, so I'll put it out there:
Today I skimmed through FTB, read a little bit of this, little bit of that... and I realised that I can't connect to anything they say anymore. Nothing. Everything I read, from start to end, article or comments, was, in my opinion, either of no particular interest to me, or just plain dumb horseshit.

I'm pretty certain it has to do with the fact that FTB is a cesspool of fringe progressivism, but even their 'atheist' topics, something with which I should be able to connect, don't speak to me in any meaningful way. I'd like to think this was different in the past, but I'm not even sure about that. Did I ever find FTB really interesting ? Did I ever really agree with anything they brought forward ? Did I change? Did they change?

I really don't know, but I feel it's high time for a final divorce...

I did the same thing earlier this year. The old blogs changed or left. The base case in point is if you look at the evolution of Pharyngula.

Once upon a time it was the premiere science blog on the Internet. Now what little science there is, is often mis-represented like it was interpreted by some dumb-ass like "The Food Babe." Meanwhile, there's very little about atheism and what there is does come through a filter of personal politics rooted the defective-moral absolutism of toxic-SJWism.

In his post about Dawkins and Ahmed's clock, Myers did his usual 'bah-humbug' style dismissal of other more famous atheists:

People are noticing that self-proclaimed leaders of atheism are targeting a 14 year old boy — for being enthusiastic about electronics?

I’m fast learning why “movement” is a synonym for “shit”.

His approach here is interesting for two reasons. First, the line about the 'self-proclaimed leaders of atheism' links to a think progress piece that quotes both Bill Maher and Richard Dawkins, and yet neither of them say anything out of the ordinary:

On his talk show, Real Time With Bill Maher, the host said Mohamed deserved an apology but teachers reacted reasonably in targeting the boy.

“People at the school thought it might be a bomb … because it looks exactly like a f*cking bomb,” he said during a panel discussion with Mark Cuban, Jorge Ramos, George Pataki, and Chris Matthews. “It’s not the color of his skin. Somebody look me in the eye right now and tell me. Over the last 30 years, if so many young Muslim men … and he’s young, 14, but that’s not like it’s never happened before, hasn’t blown up a lot of sh*t around the world. And this kid deserves an apology, because he wasn’t one of them… Over the last 30 years, it’s been one culture that has been been blowing sh*t up over and over again.”

He also pointed out that the idea that Mohamed could’ve brought a bomb to school wasn’t unfounded, as several American teenagers have joined ISIS to the shock of people who knew them well.

Famous atheist and biologist Richard Dawkins agrees that Mohamed suffered an injustice, but the praise he received was uncalled for.

“If the reassembled components did something more than the original clock, that’s creative. If not, it looks like hoax,” he tweeted. “Disassembling & reassembling is great. But you shouldn’t then claim it was your “invention.”

As people have said here previously, Dawkins is on a hiding to nothing by criticising the kid over this story, but what he actually said here does fit with the facts of the story (unlike his later speculation that Ahmed may have some ulterior motive for his action).

Myers, as we have come to expect, takes the Greta Christina approach - he makes up his mind beforehand, depending on what the correct progressive thing is to say, and then acts like it is madness to even think about taking a skeptical approach to the subject.

The other notable thing is Myers last line:

I’m fast learning why “movement” is a synonym for “shit”

Hardly the most witty of insults.

There is not really an atheist movement, any more than there is a 'not believing in Santa' movement.

But there is a feminist movement, a progressive movement, a socialist movement.
And indeed various religious movements, trade union movements, educational movements etc.

[deLurch]

Canadian feminists are islamophobic bigots! I don't always agree with Roosh, but he nails it here!
[youtube]Ot4tDl6T-tY[/youtube]

I dunno, man. He openly admits that his beliefs come from Islam and he is up here trying to spread them. The Canada I live in has freedom of religion and freedom from religion. Like I said in a comment I left on the video, why should he automatically gain dominance just because of an accident of birth. For dam sure he wouldn't be saying the same things if he was born female. At least, I hope he wouldn't.

Er...yeah, fuck that cunt. I'm not gonna start crying over some religious fuck getting attacked by feminists or anyone else for being a bigoted and over-zealous religious bigot.

And this dude looks 100% white. If he looks middle-eastern, then so do I.

So Mr. Muslim hoping into bars to pick up women. Side stepping the whole alcohol bit, is he what? Getting temporary marriages with the women before sleeping with him? The whole, their racist line because I am Muslim is pure bullshit, he is just using their argument tactics against them, which I fully support.

That said, he seems to promote books on how to pick up women. Honestly, I haven't been overall impressed with the advice dished out by PUAs, but that is just my impression of the field. To me they mostly look like posers. I see nothing intrinsically wrong with wanting to pick up women, or seducing them. Hell, that is what many people, both men and women, are hoping for when they hit the bars on a Saturday night. He just has the audacity to admit it from the get go.

I am aware that Roosh V has a significant reputation on line. But I have close to no clue as to what he really is outside of his PUA stature. I know there is a baying internet mob after him, but one of the key lessons I have learned is never trust what a baying internet mob has to say about someone else. Find out what they are saying themselves prior to taking stock of their character.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Special for Carrier:

http://www.channelate.com/comics/2008-0 ... eiving.jpg

[deLurch]

I have a theory thats been rattling around in my head for sometime. Consider: (a) Melody seems to have come from a well off family, (b) While CFI has other regional offices, CFI-DC seems to be the only one with its own physical office space, all the others seem to run out of post-boxes (c) CFI-DC seems to be run as Melody's own little fifedom and (d) Main CFI doesnt seem to be able to do anything about her. My thought, and this is pure speculation, is that Melody's family are large donors to CFI and are effectively bankrolling CFI-DC, and thats why no one will touch her, because to do so means the loss of donations from her family.

Like I said, pure speculation, but I cant seem to shake the thought.

Well they have a physical address in LA. I had thought they had a DC person just because they had their offices there anyway, and the DC person could either be used for other central office duties, or schmoozing the politicians. Maybe they wanted Melody since perhaps she did a decent job of events coordination as a volunteer at one point in time.

I still think they have her on because her salary either offsets or partially offsets the free accounting services offered by her husband.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

http://i.imgur.com/6oGNLio.png

no one has ever stopped me from boarding an airplane because of my dangerous genitals.

Maybe because the TSA doesn't use microscopes.

[Dave]

I have a theory thats been rattling around in my head for sometime. Consider: (a) Melody seems to have come from a well off family, (b) While CFI has other regional offices, CFI-DC seems to be the only one with its own physical office space, all the others seem to run out of post-boxes (c) CFI-DC seems to be run as Melody's own little fifedom and (d) Main CFI doesnt seem to be able to do anything about her. My thought, and this is pure speculation, is that Melody's family are large donors to CFI and are effectively bankrolling CFI-DC, and thats why no one will touch her, because to do so means the loss of donations from her family.

Like I said, pure speculation, but I cant seem to shake the thought.

Well they have a physical address in LA. I had thought they had a DC person just because they had their offices there anyway, and the DC person could either be used for other central office duties, or schmoozing the politicians. Maybe they wanted Melody since perhaps she did a decent job of events coordination as a volunteer at one point in time.

I still think they have her on because her salary either offsets or partially offsets the free accounting services offered by her husband.

It was a while since I looked this up, but I believe the LA office is in the same address as one of the Board Member's businesses, so still an office of convenience. Central office seems to be in upstate NY, not DC and DC office has been significantly upgraded during Melody's tenure -- used to be above a storefront, now on the second or third floor of what appears to be a fairly nice Foggy Bottom office building, IIRC, and I dont seem to see them doing much lobbying. Yeah, its thin. On the other hand, they list a Buffalo based accounting firm on their 990, so not sure what use they have for Simon's accounting services, on yet another hand, they list Barry Karr as their CFO, who appears to have little to no finance or accounting experience, so perhaps they do need help. Although, I would think they could get accounting help for less than what she is costing them.

[ConcentratedH2O, OM]

http://imgur.com/MKngHxS.jpg

Ah, 'tis a thing of rare beauty, Ape!

[Dave]

It was a while since I looked this up, but I believe the LA office is in the same address as one of the Board Member's businesses, so still an office of convenience.

Either things have changed since I last looked or my memory is faulty. LA office is on Hollywood, the only LA based Board Member is Tabash, whos office is on Wiltshire.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

The meme had already been put out early in the election cycle -- saying obama was not worthy of reelection = implying a black man was not up to job of POTUS.

And you're repeating this stupid argument (and assigning it to Sanders because you're too lazy to read what Sanders said in 2012) because you're white, yes?

You've confused insulting my intelligence with presenting a coherent rebuttal to my argument.

***

On the Bernie front one mans cowardice is another mans common sense.

Challenging Obama would have done any future hopes of running for president more harm than good. You think he's being harassed by #blacklivesmatter? That's nothing to what he would be seeing if it was perceived that a primary challenge would have cause Obamas chances any harm.

The example of Carter/Kannedy ignored the fact that Carter was seen by most democrats as probably losing the next election, the Kennedy run was seen by most as an attempt to slavage the Dems hope for 1980. Ironically, the leading candidacy of Ronanld Reagan gave the Dems new hope for the coming election.

All Bernie would have done in challenging Obama is piss off a lot of Dems.

Carter had been a major disappointment, and his reelection chances were perceived as low, a description that also fit obama in 2012.

Pat Buchanan pissed off a lot of GOPs when he ran against the incumbent, Papa Bush, but he certainly "enlivened the debate" and was instrumental in steering the GOP platform to the right.

Challenging the incumbent has been a regular occurrence in US presidential party politics. Reasons include: ditching a weak incumbent; a new-comer setting oneself up for a future run; promoting an agenda, or protesting that of the incumbent. The conditions in 2012 were ripe for a challenger. That neither Sanders nor any prominent Dem figure chose to run against obama in 2012 is a sign of their political savvy, for they all recognized that obama's race negated all other factors. But political savvy /= courage.

[RonSwanson]

Carter had been a major disappointment, and his reelection chances were perceived as low, a description that also fit obama in 2012.

Obama's reelection chances weren't anywhere near as low as Carter's. In fact, calling them "low" is not right at all. Are you one of those people that thought Nate Silver was full of shit and were blindsided by Obama's reelection? Come on now, Carter was dead in the water. Obama, nowhere near that. You've set up a false equivalency there.

[Matt Cavanaugh]

Conduct Policy
... Assuming the absence of problematic behavior (intimidation, following, inappropriate physical contact, etc.), criticism or disagreement regarding an attendee’s belief structure will not be construed as harassment.

True tolerance of opposing views -- Yay!

... one sentence later ...

Blatant instances of racism, sexism, homophobia, or other stereotyping and harmful behaviors should be reported to conference staff immediately.

Since rejecting SJW dogma is invariably labeled 'racism', 'sexism', 'homophobia', etc., go ahead -- see how far you get with "criticism or disagreement" at Skepticon.

[Oglebart]

PZ simply fell apart after the heart scare. Some have claimed he was always as bad as he is now, but clearly, at one point he used to be a credible commentator and now he is a certifiable lunatic. There has to have been a reason for this, and the timing at least does point to the heart issue. (Although I accept that correlation doesn't equal causation blah blah)

I think the comedy with that book probably accelerated his derangement. Books were what made the 4 Horsemen, particularly Sam Harris, an unknown with an improbable bestseller. The chance to do one of his own must've seemed like a ticket to renown and respect. But after 6 YEARS of who knows what, while teasing his boosters with "it's coming along nicely" updates, he produced something with the import of a coloring book.

He may act unruffled, but mean and high strung as he is, he probably feels like he buttfucked himself in front of the world (you did, Peez). Right now, his failure can intrude at any moment through an interview question, a forum post, a web ad, a site bio, a speaker's introduction, and on and on. That can make a man seethe and loathe himself. Y'know, like Peez during waking hours.

Yeah, the book situation is interesting, I would love to know how that really went down. Whatever he originally wrote must have been shit-canned, I can't think of another reason why his book ended being old blog posts, instead of the Hitchens-eque tome that he was describing. Maybe we will find out one day? SpecialEd perhaps?

[RonSwanson]

Since rejecting SJW dogma is invariably labeled 'racism', 'sexism', 'homophobia', etc., go ahead -- see how far you get with "criticism or disagreement" at Skepticon.

Exactly right. The fact is that once you come to the conclusion that the person on the other side of the table is racist or sexist or homophobic, well, then there really is nothing to discuss. The way this is framed by SJWs is that their ideological enemies aren't just wrong, their enemies are in fact attempting to "deny their humanity" or something worse. That's why they can't "debate" or "have a discussion" and in fact they ridicule the whole concept of consensus building via debate. People that can keep things cool while debating topics that are highly charged are side-eyed with suspicion. The wider you make that set of "racists, sexists, etc" the more you "win" by not having to even start an exchange of ideas.

[James Caruthers]

RooshV is obviously trolling with his Muslim defense.

[James Caruthers]

I'm just telling you how the internet is. I'm not proscribing on an individual level how you ought to be. Shitposting is fun.

But yes, please tell me what good youtube response videos, twitter hashtag slacktivism and forum shitposting does to further activist aims in the real world in opposition to feminism.

Nobody stops antifeminists from making substantial critiques of feminism. It just rarely happens because everyone is busy being an outraged keyboard warrior no matter which side they're on. Which is part of the fad.

There is some element of truth to this. Internet "activism" isn't as effective as many people believe (or wish to believe) it is. Many "fads" like Creationism or Trutherism come and go as young people get older and more experienced. Most SJW-leaning kids will change their minds, some already are. A few of them will grow into lolcows or fade into obscurity.

However I disagree that anti-SJW thinkers rarely make substantial criticism of SJW ideology only because of "keyboard warriors". People like Cathy Young or Micheal Nugent have relied on "keyboard warriors" as source of good material for their very articulated and nuanced pieces of criticism of general SJW trends (Young) or of specific figures in the SJW "movement" (Nugent).

It's hard to tell where the boundary between "shitposting" and "critical journalism" lies. I believe that the effectiveness or the seriousness of Internet "activism" is hard to gauge. Most "shitposting" is beyond pointless, but among the "shitpost" you could find some criticism that could help some marginally influential people to change their minds and policies.

Nugent, for example, was a supporter of PZ' policies back in the day, before PZ went on a witch hunting spree. And without "Internet activism" he would have had a much harder time to come up with evidence for his arguments against PZ. His dissociation wasn't a major change in the "atheist community", but it contributed to the progressive downfall of FTB.

The "Internet slacktivism" and "shitposting" of the Slymepit was also a part of the evidence that convinced people like Hemant Mehta and JT Eberhard that PZ was bad news.

Larger phenomena of "internet slacktivism" might, in the long run, help some people to come up with evidence, good arguments and the support of the "masses" to stop some SJW-inspired laws.

FTB is dying a quiet death and slowly sinking into an ocean of indifference, but other SJW community are alive and kicking despite the backlash.

Those communities were built on "Internet slacktivism" and already obtained a few successes in the "real world". The "culture war" between SJWs and those who disagree with them isn't fought just on the Internet, but it's hard to deny that the Internet played, and will probably play, a part in the opinions which will inform the decisions of many policy-makers in the future.

Unlike Creationists, who are a laughingstock for everyone who isn't a raving religious fundamentalist, the less "extreme" SJWs still have some clout among the general public of the "progressives" and among celebrities and the media. Anti-vaxxers are a much better comparison.

Ok Ok, I will give you Nugent. But he's like the Shitpost King. He came out with a brilliant series of blog posts following every single thing PZ said about him, refuting all of it and quietly (politely) challenging him on every point. Without flying into a rage.

I think Nugent probably did do some good in the Atheism/Atheism+ discussion... But it's hard to know how much. I'd guess at least as much as the Slymepit though, since he was seen as more credible. He also does real activism in Ireland.

I do think, by volume of comments/videos about SJWism or feminism on the internet, rarely are the comments very substantive. The rest of the internet is not like the Slymepit, and youtube comments are a good example of the level of online discourse re: feminism. The number of channels on youtube who have sprang up or shifted focus to covering SJWs is massive, in keeping with the idea it's a fad (IMO). Used to be there were tons of anti-creationist channels too. A lot of those either went dead or shifted focus. BTW if anyone has good antifeminist videos to share, I would love to see more that offer substantive intellectual criticism. :snooty:

FTB really seems to be over though. Most SJWs I encounter don't consider them anything more than a laughingstock. I see links to manboobz or jessica valenti, but not to PZ Myers. FTB is over. #FTBGate :lol: I guess we can call that the main achievement of a place like the Slymepit, but did we even do anything? Or did FTB self-destruct itself? :lol: PZ was such a fucking dick to everyone, including other SJWs, that he pissed them all off. That lot really are toxic.

I enjoy the discussion at the pit and I'll admit I started off this whole OP because the interesting conversations were waning and I wanted to stir the pot a bit. :dance: We have good discussions here, but I look back on the time spent and wonder what any of the anti-SJW reaction will matter in five years. Will it disappear entirely from our discourse or morph into the new Left vs Right debate? The USA has SJWs on the left and anti-abortion creationists on the right, so I guess I still have to vote liberal if those are my options come election year... Unless I vote Trump.

There is some element of truth to this.

[youtube]l8IuGxP4Pa4[/youtube]

[Dick Strawkins]

PZ simply fell apart after the heart scare. Some have claimed he was always as bad as he is now, but clearly, at one point he used to be a credible commentator and now he is a certifiable lunatic. There has to have been a reason for this, and the timing at least does point to the heart issue. (Although I accept that correlation doesn't equal causation blah blah)

I think the comedy with that book probably accelerated his derangement. Books were what made the 4 Horsemen, particularly Sam Harris, an unknown with an improbable bestseller. The chance to do one of his own must've seemed like a ticket to renown and respect. But after 6 YEARS of who knows what, while teasing his boosters with "it's coming along nicely" updates, he produced something with the import of a coloring book.

He may act unruffled, but mean and high strung as he is, he probably feels like he buttfucked himself in front of the world (you did, Peez). Right now, his failure can intrude at any moment through an interview question, a forum post, a web ad, a site bio, a speaker's introduction, and on and on. That can make a man seethe and loathe himself. Y'know, like Peez during waking hours.

Yeah, the book situation is interesting, I would love to know how that really went down. Whatever he originally wrote must have been shit-canned, I can't think of another reason why his book ended being old blog posts, instead of the Hitchens-eque tome that he was describing. Maybe we will find out one day? SpecialEd perhaps?

I agree with Ape+lust, it was the book debacle that destroyed him.
He alienated many of the big name atheists when he decided to throw in his lot with Watson and the SJWs after Elevatorgate (hence the lack of endorcements for the book when it eventually came out) but that doesn't explain why the book turned out to be a collection of old blog posts stuck together with sticky tape and some free organic glue that Richard Carrier offered.

When this 'book' eventually came out to almost zero interest he chose that moment to petulantly post the grenade post. I cannot see this as a mere coincidence that he chose that exact moment to go public with the accusations against Shermer.