Nerds. Nerds EVERYWHERE...

[BarnOwl]

http://www.thefrisky.com/2015-06-05/emm ... explainer/

I didn’t watch the video. I don’t have to

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things

lol

If that's her real dorm room, doesn't it seem rather boring for an art major? I get that she's a "performance artist" rather than a visual artist like a sculptor or painter, but it seems like she'd have a few things on the walls for inspiration and interest. The art majors I knew at university had paintings, collage stuff, prints of works they liked, etc. etc., and did things like paint giant snakes in the stairwells of the college. Our digs were shite too, back then, compared to the upscale rooms that students expect now.

[Kirbmarc]

http://www.thefrisky.com/2015-06-05/emm ... explainer/

I didn’t watch the video. I don’t have to

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things

lol

What a stupid article. What is especially stupid is that Sulkowicz imposes the One True Interpretation ("watch kindly") on her "work of art" by claiming that all other interpretations of her video are "violating her" and "taking part in her rape".

“You might be wondering why I’ve made myself this vulnerable. Look—I want to change the world, and that begins with you, seeing yourself. If you watch this video without my consent, then I hope you reflect on your reasons for objectifying me and participating in my rape, for, in that case, you were the one who couldn’t resist the urge to make Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol about what you wanted to make it about: rape.

Please, don’t participate in my rape. Watch kindly.

Freedom of opinion and interpretation equals rape. Consent means "agreeing with the artist".

What's even more telling is a quote from the article:

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things: How viewers of artworks treat art; whether subjective definitions of rape are useful or objectively true; the public narrative that if a rape is found by an investigative body not to have happened, it automatically means that no consent was violated, regardless of the victim’s opinion on the subject, and whether or not those members of the public or of the investigative body were there; how the public tends to treat rape victims; the sensationalized, titillating way the public is willing to interpret rape; the relationships and differences between art, pornography, and rape; and on, and on, and on.

Standards for consent equal rape, because the only thing that matters is the "victim's opinion".

By the way from what Sulkowicz wrote itìs clear that she doesn't intend her video just as a work of art, or if she does that she's completely misunderstood Magritte's message about images and art.

Here's a video where René Magritte talk about his art.

Reality. For me this word is as void of meaning as the words "concrete", "matter", "abstract".

Magritte's painting is called "The Treachery of Images" (La trahison des images), not "Ceci n'est pas une pipe". Why is this difference important? Because the key to understand the questions that Magritte raises is in the title.

It's a "treachery" that makes our brains think that the painting is a pipe, when it's only the image, the idea of a pipe. Magritte wants to seed doubts about the relationship between the representation of things and the things themselves. He warns the audience that art can lie, that images are treasonous, that the artist is a professional, socially accepted liar. It's an important message to keep in mind when art is used, for example, as propaganda.

If that's what Sulkowicz wanted to express, that the video isn't a rape, but only her idea of a rape, that her video can "lie", the why the hell should people be warned to "watch kindly" otherwise they take part in their rape? People can have any opinion about a representation of a rape: it can be seen as realistic or as unrealistic, as exactly what happened or as completely invented, just like they can think that the representation of a pipe is seen as more or less realistic. It's the "treachery" (trahison) of images, not the "The delusion of images" ("Le delire des images"). The "treachery" can be discovered even before the sentence reveals that the images is not a pipe: people do not try to grab the pipe and take it away, they always know that it's just a representation even when they admire its "realism", and rational people don't think that a fictional rape is dealt with by calling the police.

The sentence only points this out explicitly to make us think about the relationship between art and "reality" (whatever "reality" is, since Magritte also rejected it).

The message is that the representation of rape isn't a rape, just like the representation of a pipe isn't a pipe. If that was the only message, with no added warning, then I could buy the idea that Sulkowicz wanted to provoke the conscience of others and claim her artistic freedom. It would be creepy considering her rape accusation, but it would be a message about the freedom of the artist to use their body and story for artistic expression.

But warning people to "watch kindly" otherwise they take part in her rape is like as if Magritte warned the people who stare at "The treachery of images" to "admire my pipe, it's incredibly realistic and beautiful" otherwise he'd "be offended".Unless this is an example of dada performance art to deliberately provoke the audience to be as unkind as possible, it's pointless. It isn't the artist's job to say what the audience has to think and feel about their art. The artist leaves a message for people to understand, not a demand for people to adhere to the One Right Interpretation otherwise they're horrible people.

By adding her request to "watch kindly" it's clear that either Sulkowicz is a dadaist (or, in modern terms, a huge troll), or she's completely misunderstood the concepts behind Magritte's art (it seems unlikely, given she's an aspiring artist) or that she has completely understood the concepts behind Magritte's art and she's deliberately using her "work of art" in non-artistic way, i.e. she' has produced a propaganda piece and she knows it.

The latter interpretation seems to be the most coherent with Sulkowicz' implicit claims made explicit by the article, which are to say to the public "if you don't believe me, you're raping me again" and "it's rape because I felt it was rape".

The relationship between the idea of a rape and a rape isn't important, otherwise the point of Sulkowicz' art would be that accusations of rape can be fabricated, or that a subjective idea of someone to have been a victim of rape might not mean that they're necessarily a victim of rape, and both are ideas that harm her case, not help it.

Sulkowicz's video isn't performance art, it's a call for her sisters in radical feminism to come to her rescue. It's way to say "No matter the truth about my accusation, I exposed myself to the misogyny and the scorn of the world. I'm a martyr, oppressed by rape culture. Help me!".

And it seems like the radfems have gotten the message pretty quickly.

[BarnOwl]

Kirbmarc wrote:

Magritte's painting is called "The Treachery of Images" (La trahison des images), not "Ceci n'est pas une pipe". Why is this difference important? Because the key to understand the questions that Magritte raises is in the title.

It's a "treachery" that makes our brains think that the painting is a pipe, when it's only the image, the idea of a pipe. Magritte wants to seed doubts about the relationship between the representation of things and the things themselves. He warns the audience that art can lie, that images are treasonous, that the artist is a professional, socially accepted liar. It's an important message to keep in mind when art is used, for example, as propaganda.

Exactly so. You'd think an art major would be aware of this, especially considering how many of Magritte's paintings address this treachery.

I have a print of Le Blanc Seing in my living room, just as one example. The horse and rider interact with the forest "background" in unexpected ways, so that you become unsure of spatial relationships between static trees and patches of grass, and the moving horse and rider. The woman is riding the horse through the landscape, but the landscape is also moving through them.

[Pogsurf]

Lord Peezus has mastered a creed called skepticism. He demonstrates the ease with which it can be applied in his post "Skepticism is easy".

http //freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2015/06/06/skepticism-is-easy/

I think he should be congratulated for finally debunking the very destructive myth that the Grand Canyon was once populated by a city of giants. I hope he turns this into a feature and even one day covers the subject of confirmation bias. I'm not sure how long I'll have to wait though.

[Kirbmarc]

Kirbmarc wrote:

Magritte's painting is called "The Treachery of Images" (La trahison des images), not "Ceci n'est pas une pipe". Why is this difference important? Because the key to understand the questions that Magritte raises is in the title.

It's a "treachery" that makes our brains think that the painting is a pipe, when it's only the image, the idea of a pipe. Magritte wants to seed doubts about the relationship between the representation of things and the things themselves. He warns the audience that art can lie, that images are treasonous, that the artist is a professional, socially accepted liar. It's an important message to keep in mind when art is used, for example, as propaganda.

Exactly so. You'd think an art major would be aware of this, especially considering how many of Magritte's paintings address this treachery.

I have a print of Le Blanc Seing in my living room, just as one example. The horse and rider interact with the forest "background" in unexpected ways, so that you become unsure of spatial relationships between static trees and patches of grass, and the moving horse and rider. The woman is riding the horse through the landscape, but the landscape is also moving through them.

I think she's completely aware of it and she created her work of art with a specific audience in mind. It's a work of propganda for the radfems. It's a way to become a martyr of the Patriarchy.

Basically, professional victimhood in three easy steps.

The first step of her plan is to persuade a random schmuck to make an unsimulated sex video about a fictional representation of her rape, say it's not a fictional representation of her rape, but at the same time ask people to "watch kindly" and leave a space for comments.

The second step is to wait for people to ask her questions to which she doesn't answer (like "what does this mean?" or "do you want to say that this is what happened"), for others to come in and insult her and for people to post it elsewhere as porn.

The third step is to cry harassment and tell she's a victim of rape culture and that everyone who insults her, "pornifies" her art or asks uncomfortable questions is raping her again.

Then she'll be hailed as a hero and martyr of feminism, and start a career as a professional feminist artist (note that the article already talks about her future career).

Her accusation and whether it's true or not no longer matter. She has made a name for herself, people will be willing to pay for further "expressive feminist art" and she'll go around in tours from college to college and probably set up a Patreon or some other form of e-begging.

In five or ten years she might be a professional indie director admired by feminists everywhere if she plays her cards right.

[CaptainFluffyBunny]

http://www.thefrisky.com/2015-06-05/emm ... explainer/

I didn’t watch the video. I don’t have to

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things

lol

If that's her real dorm room, doesn't it seem rather boring for an art major? I get that she's a "performance artist" rather than a visual artist like a sculptor or painter, but it seems like she'd have a few things on the walls for inspiration and interest. The art majors I knew at university had paintings, collage stuff, prints of works they liked, etc. etc., and did things like paint giant snakes in the stairwells of the college. Our digs were shite too, back then, compared to the upscale rooms that students expect now.

IIRC the rape was supposed to have occured in his room, in the bottom bunk of bunk beds. The top bunk was occupied. No points for accuracy.

[Service Dog]

And all the "Slyme"-bashing. Wow. Talk about a scapegoat. Question. How many people here regularly engage in any sort of flirtatious activity with people you're not intimately familiar with? Especially the men. I suspect that answer is rather low.

I suspect the number approaches zero. We're some boring fucks. Carrier don't know shit about the pit :D

I tell strangers on the the street they look hot. No one has fainted or gone fetal yet.

[Kirbmarc]

skepticism is easy. When absurd claims are made, it’s trivial to either reject them because proponents fail to provide credible evidence for them, or they provide ‘evidence’ that is clearly fake.

Challenge accepted!

When absurd claims are made

"1 in 5 women is raped or sexually assaulted in college" or "We're all descendant of an African matriarchy where rape didn't exist"

it’s trivial to either reject them because proponents fail to provide credible evidence for them or they provide ‘evidence’ that is clearly fake.

Like this or like this.

Skepticism is easy! Why won't more people apply it to their favorite theories? It's a mysterious mystery!

[Tigzy]

Lord Peezus has mastered a creed called skepticism. He demonstrates the ease with which it can be applied in his post "Skepticism is easy".

[snip]

I think he should be congratulated for finally debunking the very destructive myth that the Grand Canyon was once populated by a city of giants.

:lol: :lol: That's almost as pathetically redundant as when Becky got a whole Popsci article out of telling us that hey guys, guess what? Those ghost detector thingies are a load of bunk, dontchaknow!!

[Shatterface as Guest]

If that's her real dorm room, doesn't it seem rather boring for an art major? I get that she's a "performance artist" rather than a visual artist like a sculptor or painter, but it seems like she'd have a few things on the walls for inspiration and interest. The art majors I knew at university had paintings, collage stuff, prints of works they liked, etc. etc., and did things like paint giant snakes in the stairwells of the college. Our digs were shite too, back then, compared to the upscale rooms that students expect now.

You are forgetting she's a narcissist who's subject matter and material are herself.

Anything else would be a distraction.

Shatterface

[Malky]

http://www.thefrisky.com/2015-06-05/emm ... explainer/

I didn’t watch the video. I don’t have to

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things

lol

What a stupid article. What is especially stupid is that Sulkowicz imposes the One True Interpretation ("watch kindly") on her "work of art" by claiming that all other interpretations of her video are "violating her" and "taking part in her rape".

“You might be wondering why I’ve made myself this vulnerable. Look—I want to change the world, and that begins with you, seeing yourself. If you watch this video without my consent, then I hope you reflect on your reasons for objectifying me and participating in my rape, for, in that case, you were the one who couldn’t resist the urge to make Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol about what you wanted to make it about: rape.

Please, don’t participate in my rape. Watch kindly.

Freedom of opinion and interpretation equals rape. Consent means "agreeing with the artist".

What's even more telling is a quote from the article:

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things: How viewers of artworks treat art; whether subjective definitions of rape are useful or objectively true; the public narrative that if a rape is found by an investigative body not to have happened, it automatically means that no consent was violated, regardless of the victim’s opinion on the subject, and whether or not those members of the public or of the investigative body were there; how the public tends to treat rape victims; the sensationalized, titillating way the public is willing to interpret rape; the relationships and differences between art, pornography, and rape; and on, and on, and on.

Standards for consent equal rape, because the only thing that matters is the "victim's opinion".

By the way from what Sulkowicz wrote itìs clear that she doesn't intend her video just as a work of art, or if she does that she's completely misunderstood Magritte's message about images and art.

Here's a video where René Magritte talk about his art.

Reality. For me this word is as void of meaning as the words "concrete", "matter", "abstract".

Magritte's painting is called "The Treachery of Images" (La trahison des images), not "Ceci n'est pas une pipe". Why is this difference important? Because the key to understand the questions that Magritte raises is in the title.

It's a "treachery" that makes our brains think that the painting is a pipe, when it's only the image, the idea of a pipe. Magritte wants to seed doubts about the relationship between the representation of things and the things themselves. He warns the audience that art can lie, that images are treasonous, that the artist is a professional, socially accepted liar. It's an important message to keep in mind when art is used, for example, as propaganda.

If that's what Sulkowicz wanted to express, that the video isn't a rape, but only her idea of a rape, that her video can "lie", the why the hell should people be warned to "watch kindly" otherwise they take part in their rape? People can have any opinion about a representation of a rape: it can be seen as realistic or as unrealistic, as exactly what happened or as completely invented, just like they can think that the representation of a pipe is seen as more or less realistic. It's the "treachery" (trahison) of images, not the "The delusion of images" ("Le delire des images"). The "treachery" can be discovered even before the sentence reveals that the images is not a pipe: people do not try to grab the pipe and take it away, they always know that it's just a representation even when they admire its "realism", and rational people don't think that a fictional rape is dealt with by calling the police.

The sentence only points this out explicitly to make us think about the relationship between art and "reality" (whatever "reality" is, since Magritte also rejected it).

The message is that the representation of rape isn't a rape, just like the representation of a pipe isn't a pipe. If that was the only message, with no added warning, then I could buy the idea that Sulkowicz wanted to provoke the conscience of others and claim her artistic freedom. It would be creepy considering her rape accusation, but it would be a message about the freedom of the artist to use their body and story for artistic expression.

But warning people to "watch kindly" otherwise they take part in her rape is like as if Magritte warned the people who stare at "The treachery of images" to "admire my pipe, it's incredibly realistic and beautiful" otherwise he'd "be offended".Unless this is an example of dada performance art to deliberately provoke the audience to be as unkind as possible, it's pointless. It isn't the artist's job to say what the audience has to think and feel about their art. The artist leaves a message for people to understand, not a demand for people to adhere to the One Right Interpretation otherwise they're horrible people.

By adding her request to "watch kindly" it's clear that either Sulkowicz is a dadaist (or, in modern terms, a huge troll), or she's completely misunderstood the concepts behind Magritte's art (it seems unlikely, given she's an aspiring artist) or that she has completely understood the concepts behind Magritte's art and she's deliberately using her "work of art" in non-artistic way, i.e. she' has produced a propaganda piece and she knows it.

The latter interpretation seems to be the most coherent with Sulkowicz' implicit claims made explicit by the article, which are to say to the public "if you don't believe me, you're raping me again" and "it's rape because I felt it was rape".

The relationship between the idea of a rape and a rape isn't important, otherwise the point of Sulkowicz' art would be that accusations of rape can be fabricated, or that a subjective idea of someone to have been a victim of rape might not mean that they're necessarily a victim of rape, and both are ideas that harm her case, not help it.

Sulkowicz's video isn't performance art, it's a call for her sisters in radical feminism to come to her rescue. It's way to say "No matter the truth about my accusation, I exposed myself to the misogyny and the scorn of the world. I'm a martyr, oppressed by rape culture. Help me!".

And it seems like the radfems have gotten the message pretty quickly.

I just wanted to say that I think this is a brilliant summary and I also agree with you that she is perfectly aware of what she is doing. It scares me that this generation is producing people like this with apparently little attachment to reality and even more that they can be looked up to.

[Billie from Ockham]

It seems to me that her posting this video will have the effect of convincing any reasonable juror or judge that she is psychologically disturbed in some way. This may have the effect of shifting the responsibility for her public actions against Nungesser, onto her University. If they facilitated the harassment of Nungesser by indulging a psychologically disturbed individual then they alone may have to face the downstream consequences.

I like your theory, except for one thing: Paul N was not suing her, just the university, the president, and her thesis advisor. If anything, then, the posting of video can only move things towards her being sued, not away.

[Tony Parsehole]

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8861/1853 ... 9eb7_o.png
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyat ... 2065078231

[Guest]

thefrisky.com 2015-06-05/emma-sulkowiczs-ceci-nest-pas-un-viol-an-explainer/

I didn’t watch the video. I don’t have to

“Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol” is, I hope you can see, an absolutely brilliant and tremendously nuanced critique of so many things

lol

If that's her real dorm room, doesn't it seem rather boring for an art major? I get that she's a "performance artist" rather than a visual artist like a sculptor or painter, but it seems like she'd have a few things on the walls for inspiration and interest. The art majors I knew at university had paintings, collage stuff, prints of works they liked, etc. etc., and did things like paint giant snakes in the stairwells of the college. Our digs were shite too, back then, compared to the upscale rooms that students expect now.

If that's a representation of the dorm room she was raped in, then it was the first day of classes. If that's Paul's dorm room and he just got there from Germany then perhaps he hadn't the time to clean things up, decorate.

I just want to know about the walking into the halls naked stuff.

[Tony Parsehole]

Lord Peezus has mastered a creed called skepticism. He demonstrates the ease with which it can be applied in his post "Skepticism is easy".

[snip]

I think he should be congratulated for finally debunking the very destructive myth that the Grand Canyon was once populated by a city of giants.

:lol: :lol: That's almost as pathetically redundant as when Becky got a whole Popsci article out of telling us that hey guys, guess what? Those ghost detector thingies are a load of bunk, dontchaknow!!

You knew this was coming.

[Aneris]

Fighting the Good Fight: GamerGate, NotYourShield, and Neo-fascism by Carolyn Jong Concordia University December 2014

The SJW favourite method to conflate the Other into a demonic gestalt that is part Men’s Right Activist, part Fascist, part Neoconversative, part Troll, and part Harasser can now be studied in an acamedical paper by Carolyn Jong. It’s am impressive demonstration of Postmodernist Academedia.

Ms Jong concedes that #NotYourShield did include diverse groups, but thinks this is just for the show. But if the charge was that GamerGaters were allegedly entirely white men, and Gamergaters – indeed – demonstrate that this isn’t true by showing their colours under #NotYourShield, it does exactly what it was meant to do: that Social Justice Warriors used false premises to advance their propaganda.

In many more remarkable ways this is the one of the most idiotic papers I’ve ever read. She tries to link GamerGate to the Christian Right and Neo-Fascism, yet has to concede that the underlying culture is infused by that of sites like Reddit and 4/8Chan, which she correctly descripes as radically anti-authoritarian. How such an anti-authoritarian fascism is even conceivable is of course not worth a discussion, because she relies on readership incapable of rational thought that might be blinded by surface analogy (e.g. core games are often military themed...). The fact that GamerGate also produced celebrities is described as if somehow suspicious, despite that she notes that otherwise the culture relies on anonymous participants. Here she has it backwards, because only people with a pseudonym (a name that is consistently used) can gain an opinion leader status. The trick is a bit similar to what FreethoughtBlogs people are doing: making invisible their own safe space leaders and their tightly-knit safespace dwellers around them, while playing up people on the other side that are opinion leaders who may even have just a disorganized audience (i.e. there is no Dawkins’ “horde”). Jong’s whole thing falls apart once put into a bigger context of social justice warriorism, which played out similarily in many other areas, such as RaceFail or Elevatorgate.

I’ve written it many times and I think, beneath the surface it’s Jong and other Social Justice Warriors who are close to fascism. Who has the concept of a “safe space” that mirrors closely that of a healthy Volkskörper that must be protected from subversion? Who wants to erode the presumption of innocence in law and who generally just wants to dispose of people (and their ideas) that are deemed “problematic”? Who does it already with routine wherever the opportunity presents itself, using campus kangarooh courts, or no-platforming or the banning and blocking features on social media? Who wants to get rid of art that might be “triggering” or is otherwise “problematic”, parallel to the Nazi idea of “Entartete Kunst” (degenerate art)?

Source: Jong, Carolyn (2014)
http://www.academia.edu/10100661/_Fight ... eo-fascism

[Pitchguest]

Fighting the Good Fight: GamerGate, NotYourShield, and Neo-fascism by Carolyn Jong Concordia University December 2014

The SJW favourite method to conflate the Other into a demonic gestalt that is part Men’s Right Activist, part Fascist, part Neoconversative, part Troll, and part Harasser can now be studied in an acamedical paper by Carolyn Jong. It’s am impressive demonstration of Postmodernist Academedia.

Ms Jong concedes that #NotYourShield did include diverse groups, but thinks this is just for the show. But if the charge was that GamerGaters were allegedly entirely white men, and Gamergaters – indeed – demonstrate that this isn’t true by showing their colours under #NotYourShield, it does exactly what it was meant to do: that Social Justice Warriors used false premises to advance their propaganda.

In many more remarkable ways this is the one of the most idiotic papers I’ve ever read. She tries to link GamerGate to the Christian Right and Neo-Fascism, yet has to concede that the underlying culture is infused by that of sites like Reddit and 4/8Chan, which she correctly descripes as radically anti-authoritarian. How such an anti-authoritarian fascism is even conceivable is of course not worth a discussion, because she relies on readership incapable of rational thought that might be blinded by surface analogy (e.g. core games are often military themed...). The fact that GamerGate also produced celebrities is described as if somehow suspicious, despite that she notes that otherwise the culture relies on anonymous participants. Here she has it backwards, because only people with a pseudonym (a name that is consistently used) can gain an opinion leader status. The trick is a bit similar to what FreethoughtBlogs people are doing: making invisible their own safe space leaders and their tightly-knit safespace dwellers around them, while playing up people on the other side that are opinion leaders who may even have just a disorganized audience (i.e. there is no Dawkins’ “horde”). Jong’s whole thing falls apart once put into a bigger context of social justice warriorism, which played out similarily in many other areas, such as RaceFail or Elevatorgate.

I’ve written it many times and I think, beneath the surface it’s Jong and other Social Justice Warriors who are close to fascism. Who has the concept of a “safe space” that mirrors closely that of a healthy Volkskörper that must be protected from subversion? Who wants to erode the presumption of innocence in law and who generally just wants to dispose of people (and their ideas) that are deemed “problematic”? Who does it already with routine wherever the opportunity presents itself, using campus kangarooh courts, or no-platforming or the banning and blocking features on social media? Who wants to get rid of art that might be “triggering” or is otherwise “problematic”, parallel to the Nazi idea of “Entartete Kunst” (degenerate art)?

Source: Jong, Carolyn (2014)
http://www.academia.edu/10100661/_Fight ... eo-fascism

The hits just keep on coming. ISIS, KKK, and now Anders Behring Breivik. How is it that so many social justice warriors are so absolutely fucking mental?

By the way, spot on analysis, Aneris.

[Karmakin]

Fighting the Good Fight: GamerGate, NotYourShield, and Neo-fascism by Carolyn Jong Concordia University December 2014

The SJW favourite method to conflate the Other into a demonic gestalt that is part Men’s Right Activist, part Fascist, part Neoconversative, part Troll, and part Harasser can now be studied in an acamedical paper by Carolyn Jong. It’s am impressive demonstration of Postmodernist Academedia.

Ms Jong concedes that #NotYourShield did include diverse groups, but thinks this is just for the show. But if the charge was that GamerGaters were allegedly entirely white men, and Gamergaters – indeed – demonstrate that this isn’t true by showing their colours under #NotYourShield, it does exactly what it was meant to do: that Social Justice Warriors used false premises to advance their propaganda.

In many more remarkable ways this is the one of the most idiotic papers I’ve ever read. She tries to link GamerGate to the Christian Right and Neo-Fascism, yet has to concede that the underlying culture is infused by that of sites like Reddit and 4/8Chan, which she correctly descripes as radically anti-authoritarian. How such an anti-authoritarian fascism is even conceivable is of course not worth a discussion, because she relies on readership incapable of rational thought that might be blinded by surface analogy (e.g. core games are often military themed...). The fact that GamerGate also produced celebrities is described as if somehow suspicious, despite that she notes that otherwise the culture relies on anonymous participants. Here she has it backwards, because only people with a pseudonym (a name that is consistently used) can gain an opinion leader status. The trick is a bit similar to what FreethoughtBlogs people are doing: making invisible their own safe space leaders and their tightly-knit safespace dwellers around them, while playing up people on the other side that are opinion leaders who may even have just a disorganized audience (i.e. there is no Dawkins’ “horde”). Jong’s whole thing falls apart once put into a bigger context of social justice warriorism, which played out similarily in many other areas, such as RaceFail or Elevatorgate.

I’ve written it many times and I think, beneath the surface it’s Jong and other Social Justice Warriors who are close to fascism. Who has the concept of a “safe space” that mirrors closely that of a healthy Volkskörper that must be protected from subversion? Who wants to erode the presumption of innocence in law and who generally just wants to dispose of people (and their ideas) that are deemed “problematic”? Who does it already with routine wherever the opportunity presents itself, using campus kangarooh courts, or no-platforming or the banning and blocking features on social media? Who wants to get rid of art that might be “triggering” or is otherwise “problematic”, parallel to the Nazi idea of “Entartete Kunst” (degenerate art)?

Source: Jong, Carolyn (2014)
http://www.academia.edu/10100661/_Fight ... eo-fascism

Generally, the way I see this conflict is between people who want power/control over others and between people who have a negative reaction (for whatever reason) to other people having power/control over them. This isn't a black or white thing, of course, it's a spectrum. But the idea that people in the latter camp...which makes up most of the GG movement...can be fascist is absolutely insane. Yes, there's a strong libertarian streak and yes, sometimes that does touch on ideas that we consider right-wing (also touches on ideas that we consider left-wing) But facist? Who the hell ever heard of a fascist libertarian?

There's a certain amount of projection in there. These are people heavily motivated by power/control and assume that everybody else has the same motivations, which simply isn't the case. There's a difference between wanting to kick people out of gaming and not wanting to be kicked out. I don't think that's recognized.

For what it's worth I think it's the exact same battle lines in the A/S sector. I call it the Hegemonic Spectrum for what it's worth. People high on the spectrum and low on the spectrum are doomed to be in conflict.

[katamari Damassi]

Still have the cold. Everytime I think it's getting better the virus rallies. I woke up this morning with my eyes stuck shut.
And sadly, Netflix only has Carry On Cleo available for streaming. I really want to watch so others.

[Jack Wooster]

Still have the cold. Everytime I think it's getting better the virus rallies. I woke up this morning with my eyes stuck shut.
And sadly, Netflix only has Carry On Cleo available for streaming. I really want to watch so others.

A few of them are around on Youtube.

[bhoytony]

Still have the cold. Everytime I think it's getting better the virus rallies. I woke up this morning with my eyes stuck shut.
And sadly, Netflix only has Carry On Cleo available for streaming. I really want to watch so others.

https://kat.cr/the-carry-on-ultimate-co ... 76289.html

Complete and utter shite by the way, but go ahead and fill your boots.

[Kirbmarc]

h/t Aneris:

[quote="Carolyn Jong]At the same time, GamerGaters (as they are commonly called) are relying on the logic of racial segregation embedded in
the ―separate but equal doctrine of the United States, and effectively ghettoizing all those who are not straight, white, able-bodied, cis male supporters. Despite this, many people willingly participate in NotYourShield, in return for the support of other GamerGaters, who may provide them with a sense of belonging, community, and personal validation; provided, that is, that they continue to serve th―common cause by emphasizing their status as women and minorities.[/quote]

There's no evidence being presented for Gamergate supporting the "separate but equal" doctrine. Not a shred of evidence, just the author's "interpretation".

Note also how the "emphasis of status" is bad thing for GamerGare supporters, but a few lines above the same author wrote:

GamerGate is most widely known for the harassment of prominent female and trans game critics, developers, and journalists such as Zoë Quinn, Anita Sarkeesian, Jennifer Frank, Leigh Alexander, Mattie Brice, and Brianna Wu

When she does it, emphasis of status is a good thing.

Also, Carolyn Jong cites Lee Knuttila about 4chan (which Jong identifies as one of the sources of the GamerGate movement). 4chan is defined as:

a culture of automatic dissent. Through insult, rebuttal and mimetic attack, no comment or image or idea is sacred… all ideals can be scrutinized and perhaps most importantly, any positioning of authority will be undermined.

How could this be compatible with fascism and authoritarianism? Jong doesn't explain or offer any evidence.

And that's only the beginning. Jong's paper is riddled with contradictions and void of evidence. Jong's paper is the absolute worst academic work I've ever read. It's a propaganda piece, not a serious academic study.

[free thoughtpolice]

A poem by Brave New Voices (comments disabled for this video):
[youtube]j4m3AJamQYM[/youtube]

[katamari Damassi]

Still have the cold. Everytime I think it's getting better the virus rallies. I woke up this morning with my eyes stuck shut.
And sadly, Netflix only has Carry On Cleo available for streaming. I really want to watch so others.

https://kat.cr/the-carry-on-ultimate-co ... 76289.html

Complete and utter shite by the way, but go ahead and fill your boots.

I found a couple on Hulu. Watching Carry On Screaming. Not liking it as much as Cleo.

[Aneris]

Also, GamerGate, as the Slymepit are predominantly left liberals (but anti-authoritarian to libertarian). No wonder that SJWs always see the same enemies (whether it's in A/S or gaming or elsewhere), because they are projecting and have no facts to back up their lived experiences.

http://i.imgur.com/ton0hrU.png
http://gamepolitics.com/2014/12/29/edit ... right-wing

[Karmakin]

I want to know about the Left Authoritarians in that piechart and how they got involved in GG. Seems to me they took a wrong turn somewhere.

[James Caruthers]

Fighting the Good Fight: GamerGate, NotYourShield, and Neo-fascism by Carolyn Jong Concordia University December 2014

The SJW favourite method to conflate the Other into a demonic gestalt that is part Men’s Right Activist, part Fascist, part Neoconversative, part Troll, and part Harasser can now be studied in an acamedical paper by Carolyn Jong. It’s am impressive demonstration of Postmodernist Academedia.

I used to think it was only conflation and demonization, but you have to accept that people like Davis Aurini and Roosh V are actually all of those things. Well, "harasser" is debatable.

[James Caruthers]

I have noticed that the traditional conservative voices in GG, MRA etc are the loudest and most obnoxious.

[Skep tickle]

A poem by Brave New Voices (comments disabled for this video):
[.youtube]j4m3AJamQYM[/youtube]

Starting at 2:23, for about a minute, they criticize feminists who see patriarchy/rape-culture everywhere, and slutwalks.

[Skep tickle]

I want to know about the Left Authoritarians in that piechart and how they got involved in GG. Seems to me they took a wrong turn somewhere.

And given the breadth of named categories, what's "Other" mean? Anarchists?

[Cunning Punt]

Need a new tagline for the Pit. Any ideas?

" Ceci N'est Pas Un Accusation de Viol"

[jimthepleb]

Has anyone had any contact with Phil?

[Kirbmarc]

Fighting the Good Fight: GamerGate, NotYourShield, and Neo-fascism by Carolyn Jong Concordia University December 2014

The SJW favourite method to conflate the Other into a demonic gestalt that is part Men’s Right Activist, part Fascist, part Neoconversative, part Troll, and part Harasser can now be studied in an acamedical paper by Carolyn Jong. It’s am impressive demonstration of Postmodernist Academedia.

I used to think it was only conflation and demonization, but you have to accept that people like Davis Aurini and Roosh V are actually all of those things. Well, "harasser" is debatable.

There are some idiots like that, but does this mean that the entire movement is aimed at promoting MRA, fascist, neo-con values?

The MRA-MGTOW side of the tracks should kick out the neo-nazi/neo-fascist/genuinely creepy people, stop the useless whining about stupid shit like "alpha/beta/omega males" "the Redpill" and the PUA techniques and concentrate on real issues threatened by the SJW invasion of society: liberal and equal standards in the justice system (including the most serious Men's Right issues like child support and child visitation rights) and freedom of speech at large (including in higher education, where the SJWs have unofficially banned the discussion of some ideas because they're "triggering").

The problem with MRAs/MGTOWs is that it's yet another way to force a different flavor of identity politics onto the public instead of aiming for humanism and equals standards. There are some legitimate concerns brought forward by the MRAs but they're drowned by a sea of authoritarians, lolcows and butthurt wannabe redpillers/loveshy/permavirgins/assorted frustrated people. The label "Men's Rights" attracts people who are interested in some idiotic shit because it's vague enough that it suffers from the same problem of the label "feminism" : it can mean anything.

GamerGate, on the other hand, seems to have clearer aims: to expose corruption in journalism and to fight the SJW infestation of games with some decent doses of reality. Sure, there are the usual hanger-ons, trolls, the occasional lolcows and people like Aurini, whose views shouldn't be given space in any reasonable movements, but they do not dominate the discourse as much as they do within the MRA/MGTOW movement.

[John Greg]

Ya, Phil seems to be AWOL, which is not like him. I hope all is well.

[Kirbmarc]

Need a new tagline for the Pit. Any ideas?

The "scary, amoral nihilists" of Atheism.

"Beyond facts, reality, or reason".

We're the "uneducable".

All quotes from Carrier's last post where he tries to reconcile his skirt-chasing with radical feminism.

[Tribble]

Fighting the Good Fight: GamerGate, NotYourShield, and Neo-fascism by Carolyn Jong Concordia University December 2014

The SJW favourite method to conflate the Other into a demonic gestalt that is part Men’s Right Activist, part Fascist, part Neoconversative, part Troll, and part Harasser can now be studied in an acamedical paper by Carolyn Jong. It’s am impressive demonstration of Postmodernist Academedia.

I used to think it was only conflation and demonization, but you have to accept that people like Davis Aurini and Roosh V are actually all of those things. Well, "harasser" is debatable.

Are they gamers, or just jerks who flock to one side of any particular issue in order to capture the limelight and push their agendas? We saw the functional equivalent with the SJWs, feminists and many other illiberal 'liberal' activist groups and how they helped to destroy Occupy Wall Street.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

[comhcinc]

Need a new tagline for the Pit. Any ideas?

Titties.



Also get well soon Phil.

[Guest]

Oy! Be well!

[Bourne Skeptic]

Ya, Phil seems to be AWOL, which is not like him. I hope all is well.

Same here!

[Skep tickle]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Trampoline?
Skydiving?
Trip over a kitty?

However it happened, I hope the pain meds are helping and hereby appeal for you to heal quickly!

[SM12]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Quick recovery....

[ERV]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Thank you!

I think it's past time we just wrap that boy in 500 layers of bubble wrap.

[Tribble]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Jesus, it's like the Universe has taken a personal interest in breaking Phil's bones... Tell him our wishes are with him and we hope to see back soon.

[AnonymousCowherd]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Thank you!

I think it's past time we just wrap that boy in 500 layers of bubble wrap.

He'd just set fire to it while smoking.

Get well soon Phil, and for shit's sake, take better care of yourself.

And don't keep a good woman waiting for the price of a lunch. You never know how long you've got.

[insert meteorite stricking Earth gif]

[BarnOwl]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Sending non-woo healing thoughts!

[Old_ones]

Generally, the way I see this conflict is between people who want power/control over others and between people who have a negative reaction (for whatever reason) to other people having power/control over them. This isn't a black or white thing, of course, it's a spectrum. But the idea that people in the latter camp...which makes up most of the GG movement...can be fascist is absolutely insane. Yes, there's a strong libertarian streak and yes, sometimes that does touch on ideas that we consider right-wing (also touches on ideas that we consider left-wing) But facist? Who the hell ever heard of a fascist libertarian?
(snip)

I have.

The Libertarian National Socialist Green Party LNSGP, is an American organization that cites the National Socialist German Workers Party as its primary ideological inspiration, while also claiming to have incorporated elements of Libertarianism and the Green movement. It has not been established whether LNSGP has any activity or existence other than through the website associated with the domain name nazi.org.

(snip)

LNSGP associate Craig Smith called the party "in many ways, a postmodern reinterpretation of the historical NSDAP", and said it "is about bringing about a more traditional form of society and government while keeping a progressive attitude regarding human quality as well as cultural and scientific achievement." He expresses opposition to "the absolute hegemony of technology and money", and the alienation of "a normalized commerce-dictated global society". He claims not to "hate blacks" or view them as "inferior", yet believes them alien to "Indo-European society" (as he sees whites in Africa, who he thinks "should be repatriated"). He expresses support "for everyone to retain their ancient heritage and that no people should be forced to conform to a universal standard." The LNSGP is suspicious of "absolute universalism and moralism", which it believes, "has its origins in Middle Eastern religious dualism (i.e., Judaism, Christianity, and, to a lesser extent, Islam) and "their modern secular offshoots (e.g., humanism, liberalism, Marxism, etc)".[2]

http://greenpolitics.wikia.com/wiki/Lib ... reen_Party

If you want a more mainstream example of how the two ideologies can come together you can look at the politics of Ron Paul.

Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas) suggested Friday that he wouldn't have voted in favor of the 1964 Civil Rights Act if he were a member of Congress at the time.

Paul, the libertarian Texas Republican who formally announced Friday that he would seek the presidency for a third time, said he thought Jim Crow laws were illegal, and warned against turning strict libertarians into demagogues

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing- ... rights-act

You can have elements of fascism in libertarianism if you are the kind of libertarian who thinks that the government shouldn't act to prevent racial discrimination and the like. Of course the two ideologies also have a lot of positions which are antagonistic to one another. I think the main point that I have in posting these things is that any ideology can be shoehorned into any other. Its even easier to point out the ways in which national socialism and modern identity politics are similar. Everyone knows that national socialism was very much about the Aryan identity, and the allegations that it was suffering covert aggression from a colonizing class (sound familiar?). I think using these sorts of comparisons in order to discredit a movement or ideology (as the author linked by Aneris did) usually just amounts to an ad hom. It can be a good means of satire, but ultimately ideologies should stand on their own merits and not the merits (or demerits) of other things they aren't claiming to be. And all ideologies are usually more useful for propaganda than keeping the trains running on time in any case.

[Gefan]

Apparently, there are still a few kinks to be worked out in the Glorious RadFem Revolution:

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015 ... -pregnancy

[Gefan]

Get well soon (again), Phil.

In the meantime, it would be in really bad taste if someone were to do a shoop of you as Inspector Clouseau :whistle:

[screwtape]

Poor Phil! We'll soon be able to kick him in the Küntschner!

[Lsuoma]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Stay the fuck away from me! It may be catching...

[Really?]

Apparently, there are still a few kinks to be worked out in the Glorious RadFem Revolution:

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015 ... -pregnancy

I actually see this as an important benchmark for parity between the NBA and WNBA. Griner is the first WNBA player who will be fucked sideways for child support, just like so many of the men!

[Bourne Skeptic]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Thank you!

I think it's past time we just wrap that boy in 500 layers of bubble wrap.

Please tell Phil we're thinking about him.

[AndrewV69]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

WTF? I thought Phil was supposed to stay away from trampolines?

Get well soon Phil.

[paddybrown]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Did he go outside like he said he was going to, and step on a rake or fall down a manhole? I warned him about that.

Give him all our best wishes, but be very careful bringing him home. Put him in a wheelchair, the wheel'll come off. Put him on a gurney, it'll roll off down the hill while you're not looking.

[Old_ones]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Holy shit. Why does the universe hate Phil so much?

Give him my best wishes. I hope whatever ancient mummie's curse he incurred wears off soon.

[Pitchguest]

Hello Slymepit!

To those who are concerned about Phil I have a message: a week ago Phil broke left leg's femur and he's in the hospital. He had an operation and the worst is over. He will be back home on Monday(hopefully) and join you again :) Thanks for your worries!

A

Stay the fuck away from me! It may be catching...

Don't worry. It'll just bounce off.

[Brive1987]

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/308/18524 ... 1f69_o.jpg
I don't have Facebook but apparently it's all kicking off over there

If it's not been posted, here is AlexGab's attack on Ophie.

[Shatterface as Guest]

I want to know about the Left Authoritarians in that piechart and how they got involved in GG. Seems to me they took a wrong turn somewhere.

And given the breadth of named categories, what's "Other" mean? Anarchists?

Anarchists are Left Libertarian.

The first book I read on anarchism was George Woodcocks Anarchism: A History of Libertarian Ideas and Movements.

It's only really the US where Libertarian has come to mean right-wing.

Shatterface

[John Greg]

Thanks A. Pass on regards to Phil and a good recovery.

Maybe he should just lock himself into a closet for the next couple of decades.