Bleeding from the Bunghole

[CaptainFluffyBunny]

And while I'm ranting (semi-coherently, I hope) why do we get bogged down in these side-show wonders? There are serious problems in making a world run according to their definition of privilege, their idea of social justice and first-world problems and we're deciding how to phrase things so that the permanently fragile and damaged don't get their little feelings hurt?

They of SkepChuck and FFTB loves their little insults. I don't mind mine a bit. Perhaps this is our common ground. They insult, we insult back, but much better (no thanks to me, but kudos to our resident 'shop masters, movie dubbers and general kick-ass (cunt?) wits.) Maybe this, like xtian mockery will work to show them the error of their ways. Logic and reason sure aren't working any wonders.

[Dick Strawkins]

It is possible she does use it somewhere, but not in the examples I've seen so far. Not in your example, either. Or I didn't see it. In the main article she is translating one slang word with another to explain to her audience why it is a problem, and mentions “cunt” because “vagina” wouldn't be the correct counterpart. I understood she is saying: look, here is some sexist politican who says “cunt”, but since this is Ireland, their word is “fanny”. Both of these instances are mentions, not uses. She also discusses language, and is not using the word to insult someone. Finally, she disapproves of the use of such terms in the article, which is also consistent with what I have seen of her so far.

It is correct that in the second comment, another mention, where she explains why typing “cunt” instead of “vagina” would be okay, when it means female genitalia, i.e. synonymous as “vagina”. This indeed suggests that she could have used the word. But since she is describing usage of words, I still maintain it's a mention, or would then suggest that given her near allergic reaction to the word that any ambiguity would be resolved with keeping what is consistent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use%E2%80% ... istinction

I interpret Ophelia's actions to mean that the word "cunt" is acceptable as a slang term for vagina, but it is not acceptable as a pejorative due to it's historical useage as a word to describe women in general as being less than human (in the same way the word nigger was used as a word for black people.) In addition she dislikes the useage of words signifying the vagina as insults, as it equates the vagina as an inherently bad thing.

That, at least, is my take on her thinking on the matter.
She is not treating 'cunt' as a magic word that you cannot or should not use in any circumstance (for example the way US prime time news or discussion shows treat the word nigger - they cannot even mention it even when it is relevant, for example when someone is accused of using it in a racist way the presenter will always change the word to "the N word".)
In line with her thinking, the use of "cunt" as an insult will ALWAYS be wrong and although it's use against a woman is worse, it is still misogynistic if you are using the insult against a man - indeed it will always be misogynistic (vaginas being equated with something you use as an insult.)

I don't find her views incoherent or even inconsistent with her behavior. The trouble is she behaves as if her reasoning is self-evident, unquestionable, and shared by feminists the world over.
But that is not the case.
A prime example of this problem is to highlight the UK feminist and SJW extraordinaire Laurie Penny's thoughts on the use of the word 'cunt'

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/lauri ... -cunt-hint

It is, according to Germaine Greer, the one word in the English language that retains the power to shock. This week, after the third BBC newsman in two months – this time the revered Jeremy Paxman – dropped the c-bomb on live television, it appears that the world's best-respected broadcasting operation is in the grip of a collective and extremely specific form of Tourette's syndrome, whereby presenters can't help but slip the worst word of all into casual conversation. One is reminded of those playground horror stories of cursed words, infectious words that, once read or overheard, niggle away in the forefront of your brain until, like poison, you're forced to spit them out, with deadly consequences. But what – ultimately – is so terribly offensive about the word "cunt"?

The word shocks because what it signifies is still considered shocking. Francis Grose's 1785 A Classical Dictionary of the Vulgar Tongue defines "cunt" quite simply as "a nasty name for a nasty thing". All sorts of people have a problem with 'cunt', even those who normally considerthemselves progressive and enlightened: last week, for example, I was invited to speak at a public meeting where I happened to use the word in reference to a member of the audience.

Horrified silence fell in this roomful of hardened activists, followed a few seconds later by nervously appreciative laughter. The incident later exploded on the internet, with some complaining that I had had no right to use such a provocative and shocking word at a meeting; that the word is too aggressive, too graphic. These, for context, are people who are currently cheerleading calls for a general strike and/or the overthrow of the government, but they still consider a young woman saying "cunt" in public a little too, too much.

What is it about that word? Why, in a world of 24-hour porn channels, a world with Rihanna's "Rude Boy" playing on the radio and junior pole-dancing kits sold in Tesco, is the word "cunt" still so shocking? It's a perfectly nice little word, a word with 800 years of history; a word used by Chaucer and by Shakespeare. It's the only word we have to describe the female genitalia that is neither mawkish, nor medical, nor a function of pornography. Semantically, it serves the same function as "dick" or "prick" – a signifier for a sexual organ which can also be used as a descriptor or insult, a word that is not passive, but active, even aggressive.

There are no other truly empowering words for the female genitalia. 'Pussy' is nastily diminutive, as if every woman had a tame and purring pet between her legs, while the medical descriptor "vagina" refers only to a part of the organ, as if women's sexuality were nothing more than a wet hole, or "sheath" in the Latin. Cunt, meanwhile, is a word for the whole thing, a wholesome word, an earthy, dank and lusty word with the merest hint of horny threat. Cunt. It's fantastically difficult to pronounce without baring the teeth.

It is this kind of female sexuality – active, adult female sexuality – that still has the power to horrify even the most forward-thinking logophile. Despite occasional attempts by feminists such as Eve Ensler to "reclaim" the word cunt as the powerful, vital, visceral sexual signifier that it is, the taboo seems only to have become stronger. Media officials avoid it with the superstitious revulsion once reserved for evil-eye words, as if even pronouncing "cunt" might somehow conjure one into existence. The BBC wouldn't be in half so much trouble if James Naughtie had called Jeremy Hunt MP a "prick" or a "wanker" or a "cold-blooded Tory fucker".

For me, "cunt" is, and will always be, a word of power, whether it denotes my own genitals or any obstreperous comrades in the vicinity. The first time I ever used it, I was 12 years old, and being hounded by a group of sixth-form boys who just loved to corner me on the stairs and make hilarious sexy comments. One day, one of them decided it would be funny to pick me up by the waist and shake me. I spat out the words "put me down, you utter cunt", and the boy was so shocked that he dropped me instantly.

Ever since then, "cunt" has been a cherished part of my lexical armour. I use it liberally: in conversation, in the bedroom, and in debates. I only wish I could hear more women saying it, more of us reclaiming "cunt" as a word of sexual potency and common discourse rather than a dirty, forbidden word. If the BBC continues its oily pattern of vulgar logorrhoea, I'd like to hear Julia Bradbury saying it on Countryfile. I'd like to hear Kirsty Young saying it on Desert Island Discs.

Men have so many words that they can use to hint at their own sexual power, but we have just the one, and it's still the worst word you can say on the telly. Let's all get over ourselves about "cunt". Let's use it and love it.

For someone who grew up in the British Isles/Australia/New Zealand there is probably nothing shocking in what Penny says in that article.
Despite all the raging denials of the US based SJW contingent on B and W and Pharyngula, there IS a regional meaning associated with the word 'cunt' that varies between the English speaking nations, and in the case of the aformentioned places the word 'cunt' is not viewed as inherently misogynistic or associated with an insult only against women (and, indeed, is not neccessarily an insult at all in a lot of circumstances.)

As for Ophelias idea that there is a historical use of cunt that is analagous to the use of the word 'nigger', I have to disagree.
I think this history exists only in her own mind.
It reminds me of Hugo Schwyzer stating that the pejorative, "asshole", was homophobic - there is no real evidential basis for either claim.

In contrast the term nigger was in widespread use as a term for black people in the US during a time period when they were either in slavery or were not given equal rights with white people, for example in 'Huckleberry Finn' or the works of Enid Blyton:
http://wiki.ncac.org/images/0/08/Gollywog3.jpg

(The names of the characters in this childrens story were Golly, Woggy and Nigger!)

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Oh, so I go to sleep, I wake up, and we're back to the 'cunt' debate. Great...

[Guest]

Oh, so I go to sleep, I wake up, and we're back to the 'cunt' debate. Great...

It's actually one of the more interesting debates I've seen here, and way better than putting down Linus with hir major malfunction.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Oh, so I go to sleep, I wake up, and we're back to the 'cunt' debate. Great...

It's actually one of the more interesting debates I've seen here, and way better than putting down Linus with hir major malfunction.

Sure, sure, but this debate has been had on here and at Abbie's place (go check Scented Nectar's archives) numerous times. There seems to be some kind of cultural barrier WRT the use of the word that is very hard to break. The same arguments are made everytime, and everytime we fail to reach an agreement. It's tedious and repetitive. Con!

[Skep tickle]

Oh, so I go to sleep, I wake up, and we're back to the 'cunt' debate. Great...

It's actually one of the more interesting debates I've seen here, and way better than putting down Linus with hir major malfunction.

Phil's probably referring to it being a recurring debate/discussion here over the 1.25 years.

[TheMan]

Is today Ground hog day?

[DownThunder]

What debate? Fuken Straya carnts. They may take our lives but they will never take cunt.

[Brive1987]

People should try not to knock those who are unable to work but able to engage in low-stress activities. People respond differently to different levels of stress. The attitude that you're somehow faking it if you're able to go on a holiday or do hobbyist stuff but not work is very damaging.

Poe?

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

[youtube]F4AchHTN-XQ[/youtube]

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

[youtube]uRz8FWPUmpI[/youtube]

[Brive1987]

To make this much simpler, if Ophilia Benson wants to hear the word "cunt" used less, she should stop being one. Any rationale of "words are good when used in this approved way" is bullshit. I will happily give up using the word when SJW stop using "dick"(and any permutation of that word) asshole, dudebro, mansplaining and any other gendered insult I've forgotten.

While I appreciate wanting to keep the good reputation of the 'pit intact :roll: I do not think we will get there by proscribing what language is acceptable for usage. Incorrect or gratuitous use of the word will identify those that are just in it for the lulz, and proper usage will be found in whatever context it naturally inhabits, not by "proper" usage as defined by a bunch of cunts.

I can sympathize. However, while “Reason” is a great thing, it seems that it can also be used merely to support and buttress highly questionable biases and bigotries. As Hume put it, “`Tis not contrary to reason to prefer the destruction of the whole world to the scratching of my finger.”

And relative to the question of epithets, logically and analogously speaking, one has to give some consideration to Benson’s question as to why there is such a disparity in the use of various epithets. Why, for instance, aren’t we using “nigger” more frequently, of say Obama and Neil deGrasse Tyson?

One might reasonably ask what are the reasons for that disparity, what are the different assumptions and values that undergird the different responses and behaviours.

Translated = "if the words were ok more people would use them. They don't so they're not." :doh:

[Brive1987]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

Wrong, very wrong, even. "Unless a woman we like/we approve of says it". Point in case: most women who post here at the Pit.

[DownThunder]

Any attempt to control the ways of my people is racist cultural imperialism.

[Brive1987]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

Wrong, very wrong, even. "Unless a woman we like/we approve of says it". Point in case: most women who post here at the Pit.

We all know chill girls aren't "real women".

[Steersman]

<snip>
And relative to the question of epithets, logically and analogously speaking, one has to give some consideration to Benson’s question as to why there is such a disparity in the use of various epithets. Why, for instance, aren’t we using “nigger” more frequently, of say Obama and Neil deGrasse Tyson?

One might reasonably ask what are the reasons for that disparity, what are the different assumptions and values that undergird the different responses and behaviours.

Translated = "if the words were ok more people would use them. They don't so they're not." :doh:

Such words tend to have their power because people use them in hushed tones and not around “the children!!!”. Bringing them out tends to “pull their fangs”. You might be interested in reading Lenny Bruce’s take on it, a portion of which is this:

Are there any niggers here tonight? Could you turn on the house lights, please, and could the waiters and waitresses just stop serving, just for a second? And turn off this spot. Now what did he say? "Are there any niggers here tonight?" I know there's one nigger, because I see him back there working. Let's see, there's two niggers. And between those two niggers sits a kyke. And there's another kyke— that's two kykes and three niggers. And there's a spic. Right? Hmm? There's another spic. Ooh, there's a wop; there's a polack; and, oh, a couple of greaseballs. And there's three lace-curtain Irish micks. ….

[Steersman]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't. Likewise with "nigger". All sorts of problems develop because people are, I think, not particularly careful about qualifying the circumstances in which the words are used.

PZ is the guy who wants to characterize virtually all "anti-feminists" as having the name "Marc Lepine" - stereotyping and demagoguery writ large. Seems "we" might not want to follow in those particular footsteps.

[Steersman]

Oh, so I go to sleep, I wake up, and we're back to the 'cunt' debate. Great...

It's actually one of the more interesting debates I've seen here, and way better than putting down Linus with hir major malfunction.

Sure, sure, but this debate has been had on here and at Abbie's place (go check Scented Nectar's archives) numerous times. There seems to be some kind of cultural barrier WRT the use of the word that is very hard to break. The same arguments are made everytime, and everytime we fail to reach an agreement. It's tedious and repetitive. Con!

And no doubt, numerous teachers - from "time immemorial" have spoon-fed the same "facts" into a great many different mouths. Seems you're not really taking note of similar changes in the audience.

[Brive1987]

<snip>
And relative to the question of epithets, logically and analogously speaking, one has to give some consideration to Benson’s question as to why there is such a disparity in the use of various epithets. Why, for instance, aren’t we using “nigger” more frequently, of say Obama and Neil deGrasse Tyson?

One might reasonably ask what are the reasons for that disparity, what are the different assumptions and values that undergird the different responses and behaviours.

Translated = "if the words were ok more people would use them. They don't so they're not." :doh:

Such words tend to have their power because people use them in hushed tones and not around “the children!!!”. Bringing them out tends to “pull their fangs”. You might be interested in reading Lenny Bruce’s take on it, a portion of which is this:

Are there any niggers here tonight? Could you turn on the house lights, please, and could the waiters and waitresses just stop serving, just for a second? And turn off this spot. Now what did he say? "Are there any niggers here tonight?" I know there's one nigger, because I see him back there working. Let's see, there's two niggers. And between those two niggers sits a kyke. And there's another kyke— that's two kykes and three niggers. And there's a spic. Right? Hmm? There's another spic. Ooh, there's a wop; there's a polack; and, oh, a couple of greaseballs. And there's three lace-curtain Irish micks. ….

I agree. I was just poking good natured fun at your style :)

Pink Floyd also comes to mind, though it doesn't really fit:

Are there any queers in the theater tonight?
Get them up against the wall!
There's one in the spotlight, he don't look right to me,
Get him up against the wall!
That one looks Jewish!
And that one's a coon!
Who let all of this riff-raff into the room?
There's one smoking a joint,
And another with spots!
If I had my way,
I'd have all of you shot!

[Steersman]

\<snip>
But you haven’t actually proven that Benson in particular is using or has actually used the word as an insult. Rather questionable to be hanging your argument on such a tenuous “beef”. Rather like “guilty until proven innocent”.

I don't care if she's using it as in insult or not-often an insult is in the eye of the beholder. I really, absolutely do not care. She uses the word, we use the word. My point is that gendered slurs are either wrong, and all sides disarm, or we simply decide to pay attention to the substance of what somebody has to say, rather than get bogged down in parsing fucking insults. Really, that's all it is.

Well then I think that that is unmitigated horseshit. You don’t care whether someone you’re accusing of something actually committed the crime or not?

You might want to take a close look at that “use-mention” article Aneris referred to.

[Dick Strawkins]

If the Shermer case finally comes to trial...

http://i.imgur.com/IajNV9L.jpg

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Ah! Inherit the Wind. Grea

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

...t movie.

[Brive1987]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't. Likewise with "nigger". All sorts of problems develop because people are, I think, not particularly careful about qualifying the circumstances in which the words are used.

PZ is the guy who wants to characterize virtually all "anti-feminists" as having the name "Marc Lepine" - stereotyping and demagoguery writ large. Seems "we" might not want to follow in those particular footsteps.

I don't really *think* the use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny. Obviously context is all.

I was however mocking the SJW world view which provides men limited leeway. I don't think I'm allowing my inner nuance to come out in my posts. :(

[Steersman]

If the Shermer case finally comes to trial...

http://i.imgur.com/IajNV9L.jpg

:lol: :clap: Bravo!

He that troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind:
and the fool shall be servant to the wise of heart.

[James Caruthers]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

What is the distillation process like? Does it involve a lot of cuntkicks? Maybe some Freeze Peach?

[Steersman]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

Sometimes it is, and sometimes it isn't. Likewise with "nigger". All sorts of problems develop because people are, I think, not particularly careful about qualifying the circumstances in which the words are used.

PZ is the guy who wants to characterize virtually all "anti-feminists" as having the name "Marc Lepine" - stereotyping and demagoguery writ large. Seems "we" might not want to follow in those particular footsteps.

I don't really *think* the use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny. Obviously context is all.

I was however mocking the SJW world view which provides men limited leeway. I don't think I'm allowing my inner nuance to come out in my posts. :(

I think that that is a major part of the problem with these discussions - misinterpretations left, right and center. Inter-galactic wars have started for less egregious reasons .... ;-)

[Brive1987]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

What is the distillation process like? Does it involve a lot of cuntkicks? Maybe some Freeze Peach?

Nothing so esoteric. Simply mix:

frogs and snails
And puppy-dogs' tails,

That's what misogyny is made of.

[CaptainFluffyBunny]

\<snip>
But you haven’t actually proven that Benson in particular is using or has actually used the word as an insult. Rather questionable to be hanging your argument on such a tenuous “beef”. Rather like “guilty until proven innocent”.

I don't care if she's using it as in insult or not-often an insult is in the eye of the beholder. I really, absolutely do not care. She uses the word, we use the word. My point is that gendered slurs are either wrong, and all sides disarm, or we simply decide to pay attention to the substance of what somebody has to say, rather than get bogged down in parsing fucking insults. Really, that's all it is.

Well then I think that that is unmitigated horseshit. You don’t care whether someone you’re accusing of something actually committed the crime or not?

You might want to take a close look at that “use-mention” article Aneris referred to.

I did look at that use-mention. It has absolutely no bearing on what I am saying. What am I actually accusing somebody of? Telling me the proper usage of a word vs using the word as an insult? Did I get that wrong? Let me reiterate-her idea of usage of "cunt" is hardly worldwide, nor do I actually have to care if it is. I will not have the proper usage of a word dictated to me by a drama-blogger that is so deep in hypocrisy and censorship that even her minions seem to have a hard time understanding her.

She uses the word the way she wants to. I use the word the way I want to. She may believe hers is the only correct usage. You may agree with her. Instead of telling me that I'm accusing her of something (using cunt as an insult) tell me why her usage is the only correct usage.

You see, I'm one of those damn fool idiots that believes nobody has a right to tell me that I may only use a word in certain ways. I will use it exactly as I please. She may use the word as she pleases. You may use the word as you please. Really. I am not, not at all, accusing her of anything except insinuating that her idea of the word cunt is the only correct one.

You are making this far too difficult. I accuse her of no crime. But if the word "cunt" is used, I will use at as I see fit, not bend to her or your idea of what is proper usage. I am hoping you see my cuntastic point here.

And again, this is all a side-show, a focus for the laser-like anger of SJW everywhere, and apparently one that has been done to death here. Those of you glazing over at this exchange (which includes meself) please pardon this newbie for rising to the cunt bait.

[Brive1987]

Fluffybuns - you need to check your postmodern privilege

[Za-zen]

[youtube]d-SUhJT3g1c[/youtube]

[Za-zen]

[youtube]NgRtFZsUX7w[/youtube]

[CaptainFluffyBunny]

Crimeny, I have that exact same ukulele.

[CaptainFluffyBunny]

Fluffybuns - you need to check your postmodern privilege

I am afraid that if I do, you will invite me to coffee. Why must you sexualize my 'nym?

[Brive1987]

Fluffybuns - you need to check your postmodern privilege

I am afraid that if I do, you will invite me to coffee. Why must you sexualize my 'nym?

It's was a diminutive which placed me in a position of power. See how you instantly feared rape? QED.

[James Caruthers]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

What is the distillation process like? Does it involve a lot of cuntkicks? Maybe some Freeze Peach?

Nothing so esoteric. Simply mix:

frogs and snails
And puppy-dogs' tails,

That's what misogyny is made of.

[youtube]-pS5ALRqdb4[/youtube]
[youtube]kKW5qz_9NVo[/youtube]
It makes sense when you think of men as toilets.

[Brive1987]

The use of the word cunt is distilled misogyny unless a woman says it.

What is the distillation process like? Does it involve a lot of cuntkicks? Maybe some Freeze Peach?

[youtube]-pS5ALRqdb4[/youtube]
[youtube]kKW5qz_9NVo[/youtube]



Cool, kinda the Doors meet Violent Femmes? Or is that the bourbon talking (again)?

[Steersman]

<snip>
Well then I think that that is unmitigated horseshit. You don’t care whether someone you’re accusing of something actually committed the crime or not?

You might want to take a close look at that “use-mention” article Aneris referred to.

I did look at that use-mention. It has absolutely no bearing on what I am saying. What am I actually accusing somebody of?

Doesn’t look like it was a close one. Seems to me that that is the whole ball of wax, the entire crux of the matter. Take a look again at what you said:

Whatever the motivation, the object is clear-some people will not bow down to demands made by bloviating ideologues. Doing so seems to be surrendering the argument to them when the whole of their argument boils down to "it's okay when we do it."

But, as I and others here have pointed out, Benson hasn’t actually used the word “cunt” herself as an insult: the difference is in the “use-mention” dichotomy. So I think you’re being intellectually dishonest – at best – to insist that her argument boils down to “it’s ok when we do it”. She hasn’t committed that particular crime, yet you still insist that she has.

Telling me the proper usage of a word vs using the word as an insult?

You have to be joking. You’re saying that the word is never used as an insult? You might want to check a few dictionaries. And the previous quote of Smurthwaite about David Cameron being a cunt suggests it can be used that way in the UK as well.

She uses the word the way she wants to. I use the word the way I want to. She may believe hers is the only correct usage.

Seems to me that civilization depends rather critically on having common meanings for words. Can’t see that libraries are going to be more than collections of smudges on paper otherwise. Part of my objection to SJWs and their efforts to redefine “misogyny”, and “sexism”, among others.

Instead of telling me that I'm accusing her of something (using cunt as an insult) tell me why her usage is the only correct usage.

Which usage? Again, you’re ignoring the difference between different uses and connotations of the word. Seems obvious that it can be used in a great many ways, some with some pejorative connotations, and some of quite contrary ones.

However, there is some question as to what the implications are of its rather frequent use as an insult, whether that is a reflection of some intrinsic misogyny or not.

[Time to call it a day; night all]

[Cunt of Personality]

http://i.imgur.com/UcAmfvL.jpg

[jimthepleb]

As mentioned or suggested, I think you're missing her point. She didn't call anybody a cunt - at least that I can see. All she is doing is pointing out that someone else is doing so - and mentioning the word in the process. Very different kettles of fish - methinks. Doesn't help "our" credibility, I think, to ignore that distinction.

"Actually I too think liberal use of the word cunt, in the right context by the right people, is a healthy reaction to people who use it as an epithet to degrade and belittle women or to insult men by comparing them to women’s genitalia. Kate Smurthwaite convinced me of that when I saw her perform in Dublin. But “liberal use” as an epithet by bullies is another matter."

But that is still not her calling anybody a cunt - note her use of "use", as in "liberal use as an epithet". Again a question of the "use-mention" dichotomy that she has discussed in some detail in previous posts on her original blog.

However, I suppose if she has been acting like an upper-class British twit – as you described earlier – then maybe there would be some justification for calling her a twat.

But, as she doesn’t seem to be acting that way in this case, one might wonder what relevance those prior actions might have. Seems to me that, as she suggested on a Richard Dawkins post – the source of Badger’s signature if I’m not mistaken, one might wonder why “cunt” is more prevalent than “prick” or “nigger”. Since they seem rather analogous, one might question the reason for that asymmetry. Are there simply more “cunts” in the class “woman” than there are “pricks” in the class “man”, than “niggers” in the class “black people”? Is the first case simply “more of a gal thing”? Or maybe it is a reflection of some endemic sexism ….

I realise this has been repeated ad nauseum, but this is a purely American use of the word. the rest of the English speaking world use 'cunt' as a non-gendered epithet much as 'dick' is used.
Calling many Brits (for example) a 'daft wee cunt' would cause more offence for suggesting the person was daft rather than a cunt. Whilst this is not a universal, and the hand-wringing has started to manifest this side of the Atlantic, it bears repeating.
Either way, the word is either beyond the pale, or it isn't. Unless you are Ophelia Benson, in which case it serves as an expedient example of whatever point she is trying to prove.

[James Caruthers]

[youtube]WpZeHEbvDuM[/youtube]
Finally, a dry analysis of what causes rape. I was especially happy to see a mention of the disconnect between a rapist telling you why he or she rapes, and why he or she actually rapes. In her latest tfoot video, Watson didn't seem to understand the notion that rapists lie.
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t196 ... _spock.jpg

[Phil_Giordana_FCD]

Yeah, Ophelia has always been honnest and straight-forward about her views on epîthets. *yawn*

[James Caruthers]

Cool, kinda the Doors meet Violent Femmes? Or is that the bourbon talking (again)?

All I know is that picture of the baby drumming is fucking badass.

[jimthepleb]

ninja'd by every cunt....I'm such a cunt.

[bhoytony]

[youtube]TGajpAuhaWQ[/youtube]

[BarnOwl]

Either way, the word is either beyond the pale, or it isn't. Unless you are Ophelia Benson, in which case it serves as an expedient example of whatever point she is trying to prove.

Her current point seems to be that she isn't getting the attention she thinks she deserves. No vague internet threats, no egregious 'shoops, no recent wimminz in secularism* meetings at which to be terrorized by Justin Vacula.

* Since I've already demonstrated my complete lack of SJW sensitivity by criticizing People of Limited Work Ethic Spoons, I'll dig myself in even deeper by stating that I loathe wimminz in xyz-type meetings of just about any kind.

[Brive1987]

Maryville Kansas appears to be singlehandedly trying to provide the long sought but often elusive proof of rape culture .....

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... nd-rapist/

In this case I have to toe PZs line - largely because it is devoid of ideology, his outrage is a simple expression of the presented facts, complete with video evidence.

[bovarchist]

All I know is that picture of the baby drumming is fucking badass.

Guaranteed to make SJW heads explode in eighteen different directions. Also, badass.
[youtube]uhBiNx749Zw[/youtube]

[yomomma]

To make this much simpler, if Ophilia Benson wants to hear the word "cunt" used less, she should stop being one. Any rationale of "words are good when used in this approved way" is bullshit. I will happily give up using the word when SJW stop using "dick"(and any permutation of that word) asshole, dudebro, mansplaining and any other gendered insult I've forgotten.

While I appreciate wanting to keep the good reputation of the 'pit intact :roll: I do not think we will get there by proscribing what language is acceptable for usage. Incorrect or gratuitous use of the word will identify those that are just in it for the lulz, and proper usage will be found in whatever context it naturally inhabits, not by "proper" usage as defined by a bunch of cunts.

Damn straight!

Sometimes I get the feeling that some pitters are one cornflake shy of Stockholm syndrome.

[Lsuoma]

To make this much simpler, if Ophilia Benson wants to hear the word "cunt" used less, she should stop being one. Any rationale of "words are good when used in this approved way" is bullshit. I will happily give up using the word when SJW stop using "dick"(and any permutation of that word) asshole, dudebro, mansplaining and any other gendered insult I've forgotten.

While I appreciate wanting to keep the good reputation of the 'pit intact :roll: I do not think we will get there by proscribing what language is acceptable for usage. Incorrect or gratuitous use of the word will identify those that are just in it for the lulz, and proper usage will be found in whatever context it naturally inhabits, not by "proper" usage as defined by a bunch of cunts.

Damn straight!

Sometimes I get the feeling that some pitters are one cornflake shy of Stockholm syndrome.

And boring and humourless as fuck, for the most part.

[yomomma]

Maryville Kansas appears to be singlehandedly trying to provide the long sought but often elusive proof of rape culture .....

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... nd-rapist/

In this case I have to toe PZs line - largely because it is devoid of ideology, his outrage is a simple expression of the presented facts, complete with video evidence.

Yeah, this is a really disturbing case. I really hope ftB doesn't use this case to exploit their own selfish agendas because there really are victims involved here.

I have to wonder though, is this elusive proof of a rape culture or is it more indicative of a grossly under-resourced (if not, non existant) mental health program which serves to identify sociopathic behavior and treat it? If sociopathic behavior can be treated, and I don't know that it can. And why is it a pattern of little sociopaths like Matthew Barnett and Joran vander Sloot having fathers in positions of authority/power? Is it because their parents put their desires and ambitions above their children or they're more inclined to be in denial because it's embarrassing for them?

These are the questions I wish activists would ask instead of applying some sort of imaginary compliance to our society at large. I mean, really. What are the SJW really doing to help in cases like these? While Barnett, assuming the media reports are true and I think they are, deserves to be locked away for a very long time and have the key thrown away, claiming every teenage male or adult male is taught this behavior never actually gets to the root of the problem IMO. (And not that the blog post Brive linked to claimed any of these things. I'm just speaking generally about the SJW/A+ community.)

[Karmakin]

Maryville Kansas appears to be singlehandedly trying to provide the long sought but often elusive proof of rape culture .....

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... nd-rapist/

In this case I have to toe PZs line - largely because it is devoid of ideology, his outrage is a simple expression of the presented facts, complete with video evidence.

Yeah, this is a really disturbing case. I really hope ftB doesn't use this case to exploit their own selfish agendas because there really are victims involved here.

I have to wonder though, is this elusive proof of a rape culture or is it more indicative of a grossly under-resourced (if not, non existant) mental health program which serves to identify sociopathic behavior and treat it? If sociopathic behavior can be treated, and I don't know that it can. And why is it a pattern of little sociopaths like Matthew Barnett and Joran vander Sloot having fathers in positions of authority/power? Is it because their parents put their desires and ambitions above their children or they're more inclined to be in denial because it's embarrassing for them?

These are the questions I wish activists would ask instead of applying some sort of imaginary compliance to our society at large. I mean, really. What are the SJW really doing to help in cases like these? While Barnett, assuming the media reports are true and I think they are, deserves to be locked away for a very long time and have the key thrown away, claiming every teenage male or adult male is taught this behavior never actually gets to the root of the problem IMO. (And not that the blog post Brive linked to claimed any of these things. I'm just speaking generally about the SJW/A+ community.)

Agreed. One of the big problems of SJW-dom is the focus on the culture as a singular whole, which in reality what we're talking about is a whole lot of micro-cultures. Focusing on the singular macro-culture is almost pointless, as people from micro-cultures that are not like what you're subscribing will look at you and go Huh?.

In any case, this script happens a lot. This is basically small-town in-group privilege rearing it's ugly head. Some people are taught that they're above the rules for whatever reason, this results in a lack of empathy for other people and you get tragedies like this. Sometimes it's because they're politically powerful (or in politically powerful families), sometimes it's High School sports, sometimes it's from-here/outsider, sometimes it's racial, and so on. Different small towns have different reasons for the in-group to exist, but where they do it's very dangerous.

Most males are not socialized in this sort of behavior. Most people are not. If the SJW's are interested in fixing this sort of thing...well..here you go. That the Commetariat acts just like a small-town in their levels of in-group privilege however, at least in PZ's neck of the woods probably makes that impossible.

The burning down of the house? Quite frankly, that's just their version of "Calling someone out". They're applying pressure on an individual to get them to either change or leave. And yes, I can believe that it happened in a small town for the reasons described. Small towns are FUCKING NUTS.

[Dick Strawkins]

Maryville Kansas appears to be singlehandedly trying to provide the long sought but often elusive proof of rape culture .....

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... nd-rapist/

In this case I have to toe PZs line - largely because it is devoid of ideology, his outrage is a simple expression of the presented facts, complete with video evidence.

The case reads as that of an asshole small town taking the side of a well connected local boy against the claims of a girl from an outside family.

There seems to be technical reasons why a prosecution couldn't occur (the boy was 17 and the girl 14 - if he was 18 they could have prosecuted him for statutory rape, or if she was 13 they could have got him on another charge.)
That, and the fact that his relation is a state senator.
It is an unfortunate story of irresponsible behavior by a group of teenagers (the rape is not even the worst bit - the girl was placed on the ground outside her home and could easily have died of exposure.)

What Peezus and his followers seem to be demanding - responsible behavior at parties - seems very difficult to achieve while you have freely available alcohol. The girl in this case had a stash of alcohol in her room that she and her friend were drinking before they slipped off to the boys house. The boy had a similar supply.
It took me years to figure out what level of alcohol I could handle when out with friends, and I have no doubt that the young teenagers in this story can't have been experienced enough to figure it out for themselves.
It's not a question of teaching boys 'not to rape', it's a question of teaching both boys and girls how to be safe in situations where alcohol is available.

[Tony Parsehole]

Mr Logic is a true skeptic, by the way. When a gypsy asked if he wanted to go into her booth and have his fortune told, he replied:
"The very fact that you find it necessary to ask is surely in itself proof of your inability to forsee, several seconds ago, that, at this point, I would not enter your booth."

HA! I remember that one. I take it you had the strip in front of you when you wrote your comment because I'm pretty that's word-for-word what he said.

[Tony Parsehole]

*pretty sure

[TedDahlberg]

*pretty sure

Aw, but we all think you're pretty, too.

[Suet Cardigan]

Mr Logic is a true skeptic, by the way. When a gypsy asked if he wanted to go into her booth and have his fortune told, he replied:
"The very fact that you find it necessary to ask is surely in itself proof of your inability to forsee, several seconds ago, that, at this point, I would not enter your booth."

HA! I remember that one. I take it you had the strip in front of you when you wrote your comment because I'm pretty that's word-for-word what he said.

Yep. It's in the Viz 25th anniversary issue, which I have in from of me at this very moment.

[Tribble]

Sigh. I like to read Ars Technica. They have an article full of speculation on why SciAm and PopSci closed comments.

And, of course, the SJW's have to show up:

Torbjörn Larsson, OM
Ars Scholae Palatinae

Thank you!

Misogyny and racism within science, still all too real.

To which I replied:

Not really.

Looking at the most recent staff photo of the lab my wife works in (which is a perfectly normal and representative lab):

16 graduate students, posts docs and research professors.

8 are men.
8 are women.

7 are Asians. (1 Japanese (from Japan), 3 Chinese (but vastly different regions and not culturally similar in up-bringing), 1 Vietnamese (US born daughter of boat person), 2 Korean (from Korea)).

3 are Europeans (Polish, French, Romanian)

6 are Americans (San Diego, Philadelphelia, Nashville, Saint Louis, and I couple I don't know because they're the new guys and I haven't had time (as a spouse) to really get to know them)

At least one of them is gay.

The highest paid person in the lab is woman. As is the second.

That's the reality of modern, real-world science. Not the made up accusations from an outsider, and a member of one of the most trollish SJW communities on the Internet (I know OM means) who finds racism and sexism everywhere (including where it's not) pointing his ignorant fingers and attacking people he doesn't know and of a profession of which he is completely unfamiliar.

Today's science is men and women from around the globe working together to discover 'how stuff works' regardless of ethnic group, culture, sex, sexual orientation, etc. And if there is the odd sexist/racist/bigot in the crowd, he (or she) keeps their head down and mouth shut as it is absolutely intolerable in the broad scientific community and would be career suicide for even one slip-up.

Bottom-line is, this isn't the 1930s. Or the 1950s. And it's time for ignorant rabble-rousers to shut-up and stop attacking people for attitudes that have abandoned and are decades out-of-date.

It's like they're going to say whatever ignorant shit they can say, regardless that it's not what they think it is... And yet they call themselves 'skeptics.'

[Tribble]

People should try not to knock those who are unable to work but able to engage in low-stress activities. People respond differently to different levels of stress. The attitude that you're somehow faking it if you're able to go on a holiday or do hobbyist stuff but not work is very damaging.

Plus 1. But it's the number of such people who frequent the FfTB ad A+Theism boards, and who claim to be suffering from various non-specific (and often mysteriously undiagnosed) diseases that arouses...suspicion? Questions? Skepticism?

Seems like most of PZ Meyers's commenters are suffering from some sort of disturbance in the miasma, which, conveniently, their doctors are unable to give a name to.

Their humors need adjusting. With a boot.