Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

Old subthreads
Apples
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11581

Post by Apples »

Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.
good work - thanks.

Submariner
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11582

Post by Submariner »

Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.

So the source material IS real?

Apples
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11583

Post by Apples »

Submariner wrote:
Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.

So the source material IS real?
http://evebitfirst.wordpress.com/2010/10/07/a-rant/

Guest

Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11584

Post by Guest »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:Etienne is also a french female name. Just sayin' (no expertise whatsoever, except being a (somewhat) frenchman living in France).
Sorry to hear that :violin: and I'll defer to your expertise but at any rate, it's someone having a laugh. The rant is real though, google it.

Reap
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11585

Post by Reap »


Submariner
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11586

Post by Submariner »

Apples wrote:
Submariner wrote:
Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.

So the source material IS real?
http://evebitfirst.wordpress.com/2010/10/07/a-rant/

Thanks Apples.




On a personal note, I just need 2 subscribers to reach 100.

Volunteers are being accepted.

Sulaco
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Posts: 158
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Re: no, seriously.

#11587

Post by Sulaco »

Apples wrote:Aaaaaand the Society for Cutting Up Men shows up:
Etienne Dufour wrote:Dear men:
Blah Blah Blah
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586838
I watched/read Fight Club and decided to mimic Tyler's speech.

JackSkeptic
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Posts: 3222
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11588

Post by JackSkeptic »

Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.
Yep and they are either ignoring it (not a bad thing with a troll) or saying it was out of line. But it's a good example where a whole group can be tarred by trolls as they tried to do to us a couple of weeks back.

If a whole group of people are held to account by the behaviour of trolls and trouble makers that is a dishonest approach. That is exactly the approach SJW's use when they call people misogynists and racists with no evidence whatsoever.

JackSkeptic
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11589

Post by JackSkeptic »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.
Etienne is also a french female name. Just sayin' (no expertise whatsoever, except being a (somewhat) frenchman living in France).
I disagree so I can just *floosh* *floosh*

Sorry, just practising with my new magic word. It wins all arguments automatically. I love it. That Nerd of Redhead is going to cause an international drought with his excessive flooshing.

mordacious1
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Posts: 1050
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OCD

#11590

Post by mordacious1 »

Okay you lurkers out there: Registered membership at the Slymepit now stands at 599. If just one of you dilurks, it will be an even 600. Then I can relax for a while, with a nice round number (599 sounds like a gas station price). Of course, then someone else will register, it will be 601 and the anguish will start all over again. I better get over to A+, I know they will show empathy.

JackSkeptic
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11591

Post by JackSkeptic »

I read that thanks. There is a distinction between the juvenile behaviour exhibited at FtB and those who have integrity. That is obvious to anyone looking in. I do feel people, like PMZ/A+ etc, will eventually be the victims of their own making.

Corylus
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11592

Post by Corylus »

Wonderist wrote:
Thanks Corylus. Just to clarify, the existing term which generally refers to a (lame) form of (almost always Christian, from what I've found) epistemology has 'al' in it: foundationalism. The term I'm proposing (actually, I borrowed it partially from JMS and sort of from Asimov) omits the 'al': foundationism.
Ah, 'splains it! Those baboons were right when then said I my reading comprehension wasn't all that ;)
Thanks for the feedback.
You're welcome.
I remember you from the Greta Holy Fucking Shit On A Stick thread. Appreciated your comments there, too. :D
Ah yes, that Greta thread was on Monopod Man as I recall. This was when I was starting on a slow burn in relation to unevidenced, nasty accusations being thrown around with no thought for the reputations and feelings of others. That poor man.

JackSkeptic
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11593

Post by JackSkeptic »

Corylus wrote:
Wonderist wrote:
Thanks Corylus. Just to clarify, the existing term which generally refers to a (lame) form of (almost always Christian, from what I've found) epistemology has 'al' in it: foundationalism. The term I'm proposing (actually, I borrowed it partially from JMS and sort of from Asimov) omits the 'al': foundationism.
Ah, 'splains it! Those baboons were right when then said I my reading comprehension wasn't all that ;)
Thanks for the feedback.
You're welcome.
I remember you from the Greta Holy Fucking Shit On A Stick thread. Appreciated your comments there, too. :D
Ah yes, that Greta thread was on Monopod Man as I recall. This was when I was starting on a slow burn in relation to unevidenced, nasty accusations being thrown around with no thought for the reputations and feelings of others. That poor man.
I read a comment the other day on the JREF forums. He is still deeply hurt by it. These people have hurt a lot of others, including good people such as Al. If that is what they think is social 'justice' they can stick it.

justinvacula
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11594

Post by justinvacula »

From the "Mindless blathering from FtB" video with disabled comments and view counts:


"You can't be a woman or a fan of women on the internet without being fairly disillusioned fairly quickly in this movement"

- Ashley Fucking Miller


Submariner
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11595

Post by Submariner »

Hey Justin, Good show last night with Justicar. He seems to have brought in a lot of guests.

welch
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Re: no, seriously.

#11596

Post by welch »

Jack wrote:
Submariner wrote:
Apples wrote:Aaaaaand the Society for Cutting Up Men shows up:
Etienne Dufour wrote:Dear men:

Die.

No, seriously. This is a rant, and it’s about you, personally. You, personally, are a ****, because statistics indicate there is an almost 100% certainty that you have either committed a rape, or wanted to commit a rape, or knowingly assisted or defended someone who committed a rape, or mocked a woman who was raped. And no, I’m not dropping links to tell you what you should damn well already know.

Here is what you know: that you are a vile and depraved chunk of flesh that doesn’t matter to the world. You exist in a reality you perpetuate in which value is all relative, in which everything is placed into a hierarchy, which in the end means that nothing has inherent value. You are literally worthless.

And you are willing to do it so long as someone is worth less. So part of the way you deal with that is to try to make women worth less. You whine and whinge and cry about the Big Brother Corporations or Big Brother Government or Big Brother China-taking-all-our-jobs or Big Brother *******-who-beat-you-up-in-seventh-grade or Big Brother who-raped-you, but in the end you lap it up and pass the buck so that you can have someone underneath your own thumb. You only care about your rank in the pecking order, so spare me the crocodile tears.

I used to pity you. I used to feel sorry for you. I used to think most of you got a bad rap and were probably misunderstood.

But women are raped every day and we don’t go on murdering sprees. We don’t hunt men down and torture them to death. Little girls aren’t known for picking the wings off flies or frying ants to death on the sidewalk. Women in war zones are raped en masse and then cry for peace, and I’m expected to swallow your sob story about having a troubled childhood because you never knew your father and that’s why you and your friends drugged and gang-raped a sixteen year old girl.

On a daily basis you, individually and in concert with other men, actively attempt to destroy the lives of a class of people who have, for the most part, never done anything to you. Who have been enslaved and raped and brutalized and forced to raise children you claim or starve or beat or sell, and have for the most part still managed to find it in their hearts to love. Who rarely hurt you back. Who almost never rape or murder you. Who usually only harm you or their children when suffering from deep trauma-related psychoses. We suffer, daily, and you laugh at us, and tell us it’s our fault.

Then you tell us you can’t help it. It’s your nature. It’s how you love. It’s how you desire. It’s how you prove yourselves.

All of which leads me to believe that either you’re deluding yourselves about the reality of your choices OR that you really and truly are fundamentally flawed beings. It’s amazing how many of your academic fields and governance – from evolutionary biology, to psychology, to criminal law – are constantly trying to convince me of the latter. Females are human beings, but I’m not sure what you are.

If the world was the tiniest bit just, or fair, or merciful, or righteous, I would be out there with a knife or a gun hunting you down. I would offer you blowjobs for forty dollars behind the building and then dispatch you quickly in quiet solitude. I would be kinder than you, because I would only go after adults. I would be kinder than you, because I would do it quickly and not torture you first. I would be kinder than you, because I wouldn’t call you names or demean you or psychologically terrorize you while I was doing it. You would be released from the psychotic prison of your mind, and there would be one less man out there threatening my mother, my sisters, my daughters, and my self.

You wouldn’t know who I was. I smile at you in that elevator. I dress inconspicuously. I call you “sir” if you’re older. I’m the one who serves you coffee at the drive-thru window, and you crack jokes to try to get me to smile. I’m the one who cleans your office, who you greet by first name and a smile with that little half-wave. I’m the one who tells you to turn your head to the side and cough. I could poison you, I could go through your desk drawer and destroy your finances, I could kill you on the operating table. I could do things to you. You don’t know. I’m your next door neighbor, your secretary, your sister, your wife. I’m the “loud” “fat” woman in your office you dismiss out of hand. I’m the young Asian girl from downstairs you eroticize because of my presumed submissiveness.

It’s ironic, really – you try to subvert, and corrupt, and infect, and distort, and mangle, and destroy our lives because you aren’t even sure you have one. It’s obvious that you don’t deserve one.

You aren’t scared of me, but maybe you should be. Because I know what you are. And I know how this will end.

You think this sounds violent? Don’t even start; I know what you look at when you masturbate.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586838
This stuff gets to stay posted and Noelplum99 gets banned?

This stuff makes me want to join Andrew in the MRM.
While those idiots are getting upset over the 'C' word they seem to be fine with genuine hate speech.

Right now the posts at Nugent's about 'hurtful statements' are a waste of time when focused only on swear words. It misses the whole point as I said yesterday. This is NOT about offensive swear words as many are pointing out over there but it falls on deaf ears. It is about SJW's buying into conspiracy theory crap and using that to control others.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/2013/03/22 ... -justicar/
To some of their credit, even Caine said that rant wasn't cool. Admittedly mild compared to the response such really hateful language like "Abbie smith isn't a hateful bitch", but still.

Apples
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Posts: 2406
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:39 pm

cage rattle

#11597

Post by Apples »

Julian Francisco tweets what we all know -- The A-plussers have made absolute fools of themselves. Aratina Cage shows up to wax indignant:


JackSkeptic
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Posts: 3222
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Location: UK

Re: no, seriously.

#11598

Post by JackSkeptic »

welch wrote:
Jack wrote:
Submariner wrote:
Apples wrote:Aaaaaand the Society for Cutting Up Men shows up:
Etienne Dufour wrote:Dear men:

Die.

No, seriously. This is a rant, and it’s about you, personally. You, personally, are a ****, because statistics indicate there is an almost 100% certainty that you have either committed a rape, or wanted to commit a rape, or knowingly assisted or defended someone who committed a rape, or mocked a woman who was raped. And no, I’m not dropping links to tell you what you should damn well already know.

Here is what you know: that you are a vile and depraved chunk of flesh that doesn’t matter to the world. You exist in a reality you perpetuate in which value is all relative, in which everything is placed into a hierarchy, which in the end means that nothing has inherent value. You are literally worthless.

And you are willing to do it so long as someone is worth less. So part of the way you deal with that is to try to make women worth less. You whine and whinge and cry about the Big Brother Corporations or Big Brother Government or Big Brother China-taking-all-our-jobs or Big Brother *******-who-beat-you-up-in-seventh-grade or Big Brother who-raped-you, but in the end you lap it up and pass the buck so that you can have someone underneath your own thumb. You only care about your rank in the pecking order, so spare me the crocodile tears.

I used to pity you. I used to feel sorry for you. I used to think most of you got a bad rap and were probably misunderstood.

But women are raped every day and we don’t go on murdering sprees. We don’t hunt men down and torture them to death. Little girls aren’t known for picking the wings off flies or frying ants to death on the sidewalk. Women in war zones are raped en masse and then cry for peace, and I’m expected to swallow your sob story about having a troubled childhood because you never knew your father and that’s why you and your friends drugged and gang-raped a sixteen year old girl.

On a daily basis you, individually and in concert with other men, actively attempt to destroy the lives of a class of people who have, for the most part, never done anything to you. Who have been enslaved and raped and brutalized and forced to raise children you claim or starve or beat or sell, and have for the most part still managed to find it in their hearts to love. Who rarely hurt you back. Who almost never rape or murder you. Who usually only harm you or their children when suffering from deep trauma-related psychoses. We suffer, daily, and you laugh at us, and tell us it’s our fault.

Then you tell us you can’t help it. It’s your nature. It’s how you love. It’s how you desire. It’s how you prove yourselves.

All of which leads me to believe that either you’re deluding yourselves about the reality of your choices OR that you really and truly are fundamentally flawed beings. It’s amazing how many of your academic fields and governance – from evolutionary biology, to psychology, to criminal law – are constantly trying to convince me of the latter. Females are human beings, but I’m not sure what you are.

If the world was the tiniest bit just, or fair, or merciful, or righteous, I would be out there with a knife or a gun hunting you down. I would offer you blowjobs for forty dollars behind the building and then dispatch you quickly in quiet solitude. I would be kinder than you, because I would only go after adults. I would be kinder than you, because I would do it quickly and not torture you first. I would be kinder than you, because I wouldn’t call you names or demean you or psychologically terrorize you while I was doing it. You would be released from the psychotic prison of your mind, and there would be one less man out there threatening my mother, my sisters, my daughters, and my self.

You wouldn’t know who I was. I smile at you in that elevator. I dress inconspicuously. I call you “sir” if you’re older. I’m the one who serves you coffee at the drive-thru window, and you crack jokes to try to get me to smile. I’m the one who cleans your office, who you greet by first name and a smile with that little half-wave. I’m the one who tells you to turn your head to the side and cough. I could poison you, I could go through your desk drawer and destroy your finances, I could kill you on the operating table. I could do things to you. You don’t know. I’m your next door neighbor, your secretary, your sister, your wife. I’m the “loud” “fat” woman in your office you dismiss out of hand. I’m the young Asian girl from downstairs you eroticize because of my presumed submissiveness.

It’s ironic, really – you try to subvert, and corrupt, and infect, and distort, and mangle, and destroy our lives because you aren’t even sure you have one. It’s obvious that you don’t deserve one.

You aren’t scared of me, but maybe you should be. Because I know what you are. And I know how this will end.

You think this sounds violent? Don’t even start; I know what you look at when you masturbate.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586838
This stuff gets to stay posted and Noelplum99 gets banned?

This stuff makes me want to join Andrew in the MRM.
While those idiots are getting upset over the 'C' word they seem to be fine with genuine hate speech.

Right now the posts at Nugent's about 'hurtful statements' are a waste of time when focused only on swear words. It misses the whole point as I said yesterday. This is NOT about offensive swear words as many are pointing out over there but it falls on deaf ears. It is about SJW's buying into conspiracy theory crap and using that to control others.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/2013/03/22 ... -justicar/
To some of their credit, even Caine said that rant wasn't cool. Admittedly mild compared to the response such really hateful language like "Abbie smith isn't a hateful bitch", but still.
Yes, I clarified that in my later post, it's obviously a Poe/troll. I don't play the guilt by association game they seem so keen on.

Submariner
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11599

Post by Submariner »

Thanks pit!


[youtube]T5VZ6OHRQjE[/youtube]

Reap
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11600

Post by Reap »

justinvacula wrote:From the "Mindless blathering from FtB" video with disabled comments and view counts:


"You can't be a woman or a fan of women on the internet without being fairly disillusioned fairly quickly in this movement"

- Ashley Fucking Miller

And you can't watch that video for more than 5 min without wanting to stab yourself in the eye with a spoon from boredom and a need to find something, anything else to do.

AndrewV69
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Posts: 8092
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:52 pm

Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11601

Post by AndrewV69 »

Submariner wrote:
Tseug wrote:That one is an obvious troll: Etienne is french for Steven, check his facebook favorites and google the text itself. It's a copy-paste from a 2 year old blog post, whose writer actually seems to be more reasonable than she lets on in that rant, but I guess she still falls into the more radical subset.

So the source material IS real?
See for yourself:
https://evebitfirst.wordpress.com/2010/10/07/a-rant/

Here is another "famous" one:
https://evebitfirst.wordpress.com/2011/ ... porter-if/

*shrug*

You will recall I expressed some concern that the label of RadFem was being diluted?

What I really do not want is for the term to be diluted to the point where misogyny is currently. Indiscriminately used to the point where it effectively has the same impact to calling someone a cunt (well at least that is the impact on me anyway).

Reap
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Posts: 630
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:27 pm
Location: Reno Nevada
Contact:

Re: no, seriously.

#11602

Post by Reap »

welch wrote:
Jack wrote:
Submariner wrote:
Apples wrote:Aaaaaand the Society for Cutting Up Men shows up:
Etienne Dufour wrote:Dear men:

Die.

No, seriously. This is a rant, and it’s about you, personally. You, personally, are a ****, because statistics indicate there is an almost 100% certainty that you have either committed a rape, or wanted to commit a rape, or knowingly assisted or defended someone who committed a rape, or mocked a woman who was raped. And no, I’m not dropping links to tell you what you should damn well already know.

Here is what you know: that you are a vile and depraved chunk of flesh that doesn’t matter to the world. You exist in a reality you perpetuate in which value is all relative, in which everything is placed into a hierarchy, which in the end means that nothing has inherent value. You are literally worthless.

And you are willing to do it so long as someone is worth less. So part of the way you deal with that is to try to make women worth less. You whine and whinge and cry about the Big Brother Corporations or Big Brother Government or Big Brother China-taking-all-our-jobs or Big Brother *******-who-beat-you-up-in-seventh-grade or Big Brother who-raped-you, but in the end you lap it up and pass the buck so that you can have someone underneath your own thumb. You only care about your rank in the pecking order, so spare me the crocodile tears.

I used to pity you. I used to feel sorry for you. I used to think most of you got a bad rap and were probably misunderstood.

But women are raped every day and we don’t go on murdering sprees. We don’t hunt men down and torture them to death. Little girls aren’t known for picking the wings off flies or frying ants to death on the sidewalk. Women in war zones are raped en masse and then cry for peace, and I’m expected to swallow your sob story about having a troubled childhood because you never knew your father and that’s why you and your friends drugged and gang-raped a sixteen year old girl.

On a daily basis you, individually and in concert with other men, actively attempt to destroy the lives of a class of people who have, for the most part, never done anything to you. Who have been enslaved and raped and brutalized and forced to raise children you claim or starve or beat or sell, and have for the most part still managed to find it in their hearts to love. Who rarely hurt you back. Who almost never rape or murder you. Who usually only harm you or their children when suffering from deep trauma-related psychoses. We suffer, daily, and you laugh at us, and tell us it’s our fault.

Then you tell us you can’t help it. It’s your nature. It’s how you love. It’s how you desire. It’s how you prove yourselves.

All of which leads me to believe that either you’re deluding yourselves about the reality of your choices OR that you really and truly are fundamentally flawed beings. It’s amazing how many of your academic fields and governance – from evolutionary biology, to psychology, to criminal law – are constantly trying to convince me of the latter. Females are human beings, but I’m not sure what you are.

If the world was the tiniest bit just, or fair, or merciful, or righteous, I would be out there with a knife or a gun hunting you down. I would offer you blowjobs for forty dollars behind the building and then dispatch you quickly in quiet solitude. I would be kinder than you, because I would only go after adults. I would be kinder than you, because I would do it quickly and not torture you first. I would be kinder than you, because I wouldn’t call you names or demean you or psychologically terrorize you while I was doing it. You would be released from the psychotic prison of your mind, and there would be one less man out there threatening my mother, my sisters, my daughters, and my self.

You wouldn’t know who I was. I smile at you in that elevator. I dress inconspicuously. I call you “sir” if you’re older. I’m the one who serves you coffee at the drive-thru window, and you crack jokes to try to get me to smile. I’m the one who cleans your office, who you greet by first name and a smile with that little half-wave. I’m the one who tells you to turn your head to the side and cough. I could poison you, I could go through your desk drawer and destroy your finances, I could kill you on the operating table. I could do things to you. You don’t know. I’m your next door neighbor, your secretary, your sister, your wife. I’m the “loud” “fat” woman in your office you dismiss out of hand. I’m the young Asian girl from downstairs you eroticize because of my presumed submissiveness.

It’s ironic, really – you try to subvert, and corrupt, and infect, and distort, and mangle, and destroy our lives because you aren’t even sure you have one. It’s obvious that you don’t deserve one.

You aren’t scared of me, but maybe you should be. Because I know what you are. And I know how this will end.

You think this sounds violent? Don’t even start; I know what you look at when you masturbate.
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586838
This stuff gets to stay posted and Noelplum99 gets banned?

This stuff makes me want to join Andrew in the MRM.
While those idiots are getting upset over the 'C' word they seem to be fine with genuine hate speech.

Right now the posts at Nugent's about 'hurtful statements' are a waste of time when focused only on swear words. It misses the whole point as I said yesterday. This is NOT about offensive swear words as many are pointing out over there but it falls on deaf ears. It is about SJW's buying into conspiracy theory crap and using that to control others.

http://www.michaelnugent.com/2013/03/22 ... -justicar/
To some of their credit, even Caine said that rant wasn't cool. Admittedly mild compared to the response such really hateful language like "Abbie smith isn't a hateful bitch", but still.
Yea Caine doesn't like it cause she had one just like it written out and was saving it for a special occasion. Now she's gonna have to come up with a new plan to launch her mission to be the most infamous female serial killer ever. It's her only hope at being successful at somethin. She is a straight up loon

JackSkeptic
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Posts: 3222
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Re: cage rattle

#11603

Post by JackSkeptic »

Apples wrote:Julian Francisco tweets what we all know -- The A-plussers have made absolute fools of themselves. Aratina Cage shows up to wax indignant:


And true to form plays the censorship card, as he did at Nugent's. He tried to get Nugent's to close down some comments then when called out pretended they were just clarifying what his policies were.

These people should cut their losses and move to North Korea, they will be welcome with open arms.

Wonderist
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Posts: 868
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 5:19 pm
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11604

Post by Wonderist »

debaser71 wrote:I tried to read the first foundation book but it took a very odd turn. I was getting into it. It was a bout a math kid and some society that used probability to predict the future...or something like that. Then it was like 5000 years later, I was like wtf!?! and I gave up. I think it still sits on one of my book shelves.
I don't think it was 5000 years, maybe more like 50 or 100. (Actually, Wikipedia confirms it's 50: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_%28novel%29)
The idea is, that math kid (now an old man, who in between parts 1 and 2 has died) has developed a plan to essentially *reduce* the length of the coming galactic dark age from 30,000 years down to a more manageable 1000 years. The intent is to prevent a complete collapse of galactic civilization, and to build up a new civilization that is stronger and more resistant to the tyranny, stagnation, and decay, that has set the coming dark age into motion in the first place. Replace a crumbling empire with a solid foundation, from the bottom up. It's essentially what I'm proposing too, but I don't pretend to have psychohistory, which is just a metaphor for Asimov's predictions of western society's repetition of the fall of Rome. Starting to see the similarities with our efforts against religion, and now secular dogmatism? :geek:

Each of the next four sections tells a new story, with new characters, proceeding linearly through time, building, bit by bit, a stronger and more resilient 'seed' or 'core' of a new galactic civilization, which is simply named Foundation. Each story presents a major 'crisis' point in Hari Seldon's 'plan' based on his psychohistory. He usually appears in the beginning of each story, explaining what the crisis is likely going to be about. But he can't give too much away, or that fucks with the galactic-scale statistics that his psychohistory is based upon. Think of like a theory of thermodynamics (gazillions of particles), but for societies instead. Like a super-advanced form of sociology or sociological engineering. It's all just a conceit for Asimov's views on society, but it makes for a grand, over-arching scheme which plays throughout the whole series of books.

So, each story, some new, plucky heroes emerge, and through their application of science and reason-based cunning, they manage (or. do. they....? ;-) ) to overcome the crisis and you get to see the resolution which Asimov had in mind at the beginning (this is the fun part, IMO). He's quite good at keeping you guessing, but unlike those 'endless mysteries, never solved' stupid TV shows (like X-Files, Lost, whatever), he actually *delivers the goods* for each story. And moves on the the next challenge/crisis.

I would say, give the first three stories a try (perhaps even just the first two). If that doesn't hook you, then sure, maybe it's not your thing. But I think to make a final judgment on such a ... foundational SF classic based only on the first part, you might want to give it another shot.

P.S. Don't bother with the 'prequel(s)', start at Foundation. It's the ... foundation of the rest of the series, *including* the prequel(s), which obviously he wrote later.

P.P.S. Two of my good friends read the Foundation series in high-school, and recommended it to me. True story, I was put off by Asimov's last name (stupid cold war prejudice! I admit it) and the fact that my friends' explanation of the premise of the story just didn't sound that fucking interesting. Boooring. Psychohistory? Some old guy predicts the future, and it plays out exactly (or. does. it.....?) as he predicts? What the fuck is the point of that?! The 'plots' are at a largely societal level? Put me to sleep, why doncha!?

I actually didn't read any Asimov until sometime after 2001, but can't remember exactly when. It was Caves of Steel. I *only* got it because I wanted to 'brush up' on my 'classic SF' to see what all the hooplah was about. It was surprisingly interesting. Not Earth-shattering or anything, but a nice, enjoyable read with some interesting ideas, and approachable main characters. A while later, I decided to finish up the first three of the Robot novels (CoS is the first), and I did, and enjoyed them, and started to like Asimov generally. Then, eventually, again for the purposes of 'brushing up', I picked up Foundation, and then I said, "Ohhhh! I get why everyone speaks so highly of Asimov now!"

He published the main four stories in Foundation between 1942 and 1944 (as serials), and wrote the first story, the intro, later, and published the collection as a novel in 1951. But, consider: in 1942, he was about 22 years old, and so 1944 is 24 years old. And Foundation is considered an uber-classic. The guy was a fucking genius.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11605

Post by Wonderist »

Clarifying: By 'don't bother with the prequels', I mean his *later* novels, Prelude to Foundation, and Forward the Foundation. The first sub-story of the Foundation novel was also a sort of prequel, but it's part of the main novel which is the first, Foundation. It can be confusing. :think:

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11606

Post by EdwardGemmer »

Basketball basketball basketball

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Re: no, seriously.

#11607

Post by Tigzy »

Sulaco wrote:
Apples wrote:Aaaaaand the Society for Cutting Up Men shows up:
Etienne Dufour wrote:Dear men:
Blah Blah Blah
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586838
I watched/read Fight Club and decided to mimic Tyler's speech.
Yeah, I noticed that too. Was initially all for plonking it in the museum, but a quick google suggested that this was the only post 'Etienne Dufour' had made on FTB - implying that this was some sort of drive-by trolling/poeing. In any case, it's been outed as being not exactly sincere, so it gets a pass.

A telling response, I think, from Caine though:

Etienne Dufour:
But women are raped every day
So are men. So are little boys. Among the many people here who have been raped (I’m one of them), we have men who were raped. It’s both insulting and offensive and dismissive of you to act as though such things only happen to women. Also, most men don’t rape. It’s a minority of men who commit rape. Women are also capable of rape, and some of them do.

I get the anger, I really do. That said, don’t imagine that screed of yours helps in any way. It doesn’t.
Seems that 'Etienne' articulated Caine's feelings a touch more incivilly than Caine would prefer. Did she sign Dan Finke's civility pledge, by any chance...? :whistle:

welch
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11608

Post by welch »

You know that any second now, PeeZus will disemvowel/delete that post, then throw Etienne in the dungeon.

Yep.

Any second.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11609

Post by welch »

BAAAHAHAAHAHA....Eucliwoo is in the dungeon too, for:
Sockpuppetry and slymepittery.
BAAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAA

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11610

Post by Wonderist »

Guest wrote:
Wonderist wrote: Rape culture as used by FTB/SJWs is not grounded in evidence. It's not a well-enough defined concept to *be* grounded in evidence, as it's unfalsifiable. It's emotional, faith-based reasoning. Belief without sufficient evidence.
Could you go into a little more detail about this? Like you, I'm not really certain what "Rape Culture" is, but from what I hear it just seems like SJWs say that shit like rape jokes or not immediately swallowing every online asshole's sob story about rape is evidence of/contributing to "Rape Culture," whatever it is.
The fact that it's not clearly defined and delineated is exactly the problem I'm pointing at and saying, "Um, that's unfalsifiable," continuing, "You'll point to A and say, 'Look, evidence of rape culture!' And I'll find a counter-example B, and you'll say, 'That's not what I mean by rape culture, dummy.'" The definition is so vague that it allows anything or nothing to qualify as 'rape culture', depending on the whims of the person pointing at it.

Those whims are what I mean by 'emotional, faith-based reasoning'. It's like when people say they prayed for something and it came true. You dig into those stories, and they don't add up. It *always* always always comes down to, "Well, I just have faith. I like faith." No good *reason*, just faith. Faith is no reason. Literally.

Is every rape joke part of rape culture? No? So what's the dividing line? Ambiguous, you say? Unfalsifiable, I say. It is up to the person making the claim to define what they are claiming. It is also up to that person to *show*, to *demonstrate* how it could potentially be falsified. In other words, they *must* give *some* example like this: "We would know my hypothesis is incorrect if we saw ...".

If their potential example is logically actually *possible* to actually see, then we have something that is potentially falsifiable. The more plausible that potential example is, the more powerful their theory will be, if in the end it is finally proved to be the best theory remaining.

Compare feminist 'theory' claims with claims of the existence of demons or the devil influencing world events (or personal events), and you'll get an idea of why their 'theory' is not scientific.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11611

Post by Skep tickle »

:o :shock: :lol: @ the "Adria Richards did everything right" thread at Pharyngula. It's the gift that keeps giving.

Yeah some of the Pharyngulites are saying "not cool" to Etienne, but they're saying it, not (as of post #1038) using sharp knives to flense the ass who posted it.

(I read PZ's knives/flense/ass comment as using "ass" as in "jackass" not as in "rectum" so didn't see him alluding to ass-raping w/ knives. Didn't necessarily intend that as a "charitable" reading, that's just what I saw in it. To me, seeing an ass-raping reference is stretching it, though given the porcupine meme I can see why people would read it that way.)

Anyway, here's a jaw-dropper from that thread (unless sarcasm is intended; if so, it's IMO too subtle to tell):
Pteryxx

24 March 2013 at 1:11 am (UTC -5) Link to this comment
Women at work make puns and double entendres all the time. Does that mean they’re making themselves uncomfortable with sexist banter?
Obviously, you do not in fact believe women are people.


The "Women make double entendres too" line is from shirakawasuna, who is getting flak for other comments (for example from #1035 NateHevens, former "Nice Guy(TM) and MRA") because "people (yourself included) have come in [to that particular thread] to go 'WHAT ABOUT TEH MENZ?!?!?!?', and they aren’t what this thread is about."

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Re: no, seriously.

#11612

Post by Wonderist »

Jack wrote:I wonder if PMZ will memory hole it though.
PMZ is definitely a keeper.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11613

Post by greylurker »

Hi all,
to keep mordacious1 happy, have got the pyt to 600. Been lurking here since July 2012, after watching the 'Dear Muslima' thing explode.
Thanks for doing the hard yards by preserving the evidence of craziness before it gets memory holed.
Liked Asimov's Foundation and Robot stories, but after 40 years I still think Arthur C Clarke's are the best - clear, concise stories with (unusually) no religious waffle or grandstanding, just technical people trying to sort problems out.
Back to lurking.
Peter E.

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Re: Adria Richards & Pycon

#11614

Post by Skep tickle »

Even assuming the 2 men in the audience at Pycon were purposefully making double entendres, how's that sexist, and how's it sexist against women? I could see it as sexually objectifying (for the purposes of a double entendre) the man whose code they admired, and maybe penises (?), and clearly it made Adria Richards uncomfortable and angry and apparently it felt like the last straw to her, but I fail to see how anything they said was directed to her or sexist against women.

And how would the sotto voce double entendres of 2 people in the audience ruin the chances of an 11-yr-old girl going into a STEM field in the future, as an adult? Particularly when they're not about women or women's abilities in the field? I can see a pervasive culture of sex-related jokes being wearing and inappropriate (unless your field is comedy), and I could see asking the 2 people to keep it down when others sitting nearby could easily hear what they're saying, but as others have said the self-righteous and very public way AR approached this if anything probably only made it more difficult for women to be welcomed in her field.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11615

Post by DW Adams »

greylurker wrote:Hi all,
to keep mordacious1 happy, have got the pyt to 600. Been lurking here since July 2012, after watching the 'Dear Muslima' thing explode.
Thanks for doing the hard yards by preserving the evidence of craziness before it gets memory holed.
Liked Asimov's Foundation and Robot stories, but after 40 years I still think Arthur C Clarke's are the best - clear, concise stories with (unusually) no religious waffle or grandstanding, just technical people trying to sort problems out.
Back to lurking.
Peter E.

Welcome! Now fuck off.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11616

Post by Skep tickle »

greylurker wrote:Hi all,
to keep mordacious1 happy, have got the pyt to 600. Been lurking here since July 2012, after watching the 'Dear Muslima' thing explode.
Thanks for doing the hard yards by preserving the evidence of craziness before it gets memory holed.
Liked Asimov's Foundation and Robot stories, but after 40 years I still think Arthur C Clarke's are the best - clear, concise stories with (unusually) no religious waffle or grandstanding, just technical people trying to sort problems out.
Back to lurking.
Peter E.
Thanks for getting us to a nice round number! And hurray for numbering systems based on the number of fingers most humans have!! :D

Next goal 666?

I'm sure someone else will give you the traditional welcome of "fuck off". I understand its purpose, but it's not my style, so may I be the first (and perhaps only) one to say "Welcome!" to membership even though you've been here long-term. Now you can use the "first unread post" function, which can be very useful to keep up here...!

ConcentratedH2O, OM
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11617

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM »

greylurker wrote:Hi all,
to keep mordacious1 happy, have got the pyt to 600. Been lurking here since July 2012, after watching the 'Dear Muslima' thing explode.
Thanks for doing the hard yards by preserving the evidence of craziness before it gets memory holed.
Liked Asimov's Foundation and Robot stories, but after 40 years I still think Arthur C Clarke's are the best - clear, concise stories with (unusually) no religious waffle or grandstanding, just technical people trying to sort problems out.
Back to lurking.
Peter E.
http://i.imgur.com/Kh5byY4.jpg

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11618

Post by Wonderist »

welch wrote:BAAAHAHAAHAHA....Eucliwoo is in the dungeon too, for:
Sockpuppetry and slymepittery.
BAAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAA
He should correct that: slymepittery being banned by the slyme pit.

At least it would be more factual, though it wouldn't make much sense as reason. :P

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11619

Post by Stretchycheese »

Skep tickle wrote: Anyway, here's a jaw-dropper from that thread (unless sarcasm is intended; if so, it's IMO too subtle to tell):
Pteryxx

24 March 2013 at 1:11 am (UTC -5) Link to this comment
Women at work make puns and double entendres all the time. Does that mean they’re making themselves uncomfortable with sexist banter?
Obviously, you do not in fact believe women are people.


The "Women make double entendres too" line is from shirakawasuna, who is getting flak for other comments (for example from #1035 NateHevens, former "Nice Guy(TM) and MRA") because "people (yourself included) have come in [to that particular thread] to go 'WHAT ABOUT TEH MENZ?!?!?!?', and they aren’t what this thread is about."
Wow, that is just plain batty. Pteryxx is kind of like a radfem version of Bill O'Reilly, where instead of saying "you obviously hate America!" it's crap like "you obviously don't think women are people!" or "you just hate women!" It's the typical tactic of an ideologue to shut down debate by impugning sinister motives on people who suggest alternative points of view, nuance, or other factors that don't fit into the FTB crowd's dogmatic narrative.

Another thing I noticed. I found that the FTB crowd don't seem to use satire as much. They might use satire in other contexts, but when it comes to feminism, it's like some sacred cow where they always have to go into dead serious mode. They can't seem to use satire effectively against their critics but their critics often use satire against them. Dogmatism and authoritarian viewpoints don't mix that well with satire, as was shown when Fox News tried to introduce their version of a right-wing Daily Show.

Overall, the Slymepit is to FTB, as the Daily Show and Colbert are to Fox News.

JackSkeptic
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11620

Post by JackSkeptic »

welch wrote:BAAAHAHAAHAHA....Eucliwoo is in the dungeon too, for:
Sockpuppetry and slymepittery.
BAAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAA
Aww poor EU. Telling people what they do not want to hear is a criminal offence over there. EU when you get to 18 you'll be formidable. Keep it up but stop with that weird crap ok? Don't ask me or anyone else for links to a site hosting porn for a start.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11621

Post by Apples »

Wonderist wrote:
welch wrote:BAAAHAHAAHAHA....Eucliwoo is in the dungeon too, for:
Sockpuppetry and slymepittery.
BAAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAA
He should correct that: slymepittery being banned by the slyme pit.

At least it would be more factual, though it wouldn't make much sense as reason. :P
For what it's worth, Erikthebassist pointed out in T'dome that she was one of the only people ever banned at the 'Pit.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586379

AndrewV69
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11622

Post by AndrewV69 »

Corylus wrote: Ah yes, that Greta thread was on Monopod Man as I recall. This was when I was starting on a slow burn in relation to unevidenced, nasty accusations being thrown around with no thought for the reputations and feelings of others. That poor man.
Pretty standard tactics for quite a large segment of a certain type in general I would say. For some reason I am reminded of the recent Rebecca Meredith incident.

You can see how it was portrayed in the Telegraph, Guardian and Daily Mail:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/un ... kling.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ty-glasgow

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z2NKf8C5v1

But it is not till you get to the Spectator than you start to get an idea as to what might have really happened:

http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/885 ... -up-girls/
GUU members claim the booing was directed at the girls for going off-topic to indulge in feminist rhetoric (the motion was ‘That this House regrets the centralisation of religion’) and that male speakers were similarly booed if they became irrelevant. According to a pompous statement on Facebook by the debate’s chief adjudicator, the remarks complained about were overheard by women sitting behind the hecklers.

Skep tickle
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Re: fisted bottoms and poo-loving geese

#11623

Post by Skep tickle »

Apples wrote:Golliblog is my new favorite freedom fighter on that thread. He's got the NerdBot's number:
http://i.imgur.com/YhZ4qxS.jpg

He repeats the question, and StupidSally is delighted to step in it up to her neck:
http://i.imgur.com/pN2agXN.jpg

That's right, fellow misogynists -- according to SallyStrange, if someone were to open the Pharyngula homepage in any professional context where someone else might see it, they would be eligible for a charge of sexual harassment.
And someone else weighs in (bolding added):
Amphiox

24 March 2013 at 9:58 am (UTC -5) Link to this comment

Would opening PZM’s blog in a workplace where others could see it constitute sexist behaviour because of the sexual innuendo?

That you are demented enough to think that the term “random ejaculations” is sexual innuendo of any sort whatsoever tells us far more about the sort of filth you leave lying around in your own brainpan than anything else.

SallyStrange follows up with: "Is there no guide to what constitutes sexual harassment in your workplace, golliblog? That would be an oversight; you should probably mention it to someone."

The key message I've taken away from attending sexual harassment sessions at my institution has been: "Perception is reality."

Doesn't really matter what you said, did, or intended; if someone perceives it as harassment, that's their reality. Not that an independent investigation would necessarily agree with them, but after being dragged through the mud for a few miles or months, being found blameless may not matter all that much.

EdwardGemmer
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11624

Post by EdwardGemmer »

Aaron Craft is a pimp.

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OCD

#11625

Post by mordacious1 »

by greylurker » Sun Mar 24, 2013 11:15 am • [Post 11613]

Hi all,
to keep mordacious1 happy, have got the pyt to 600. Been lurking here since July 2012, after watching the 'Dear Muslima' thing explode.
Ah, nice round and firm, six hundred...no change.

Welcome and you don't even have to "fuck off" (unless you want to, of course).

JackSkeptic
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Re: Adria Richards & Pycon

#11626

Post by JackSkeptic »

Skep tickle wrote:Even assuming the 2 men in the audience at Pycon were purposefully making double entendres, how's that sexist, and how's it sexist against women? I could see it as sexually objectifying (for the purposes of a double entendre) the man whose code they admired, and maybe penises (?), and clearly it made Adria Richards uncomfortable and angry and apparently it felt like the last straw to her, but I fail to see how anything they said was directed to her or sexist against women.

And how would the sotto voce double entendres of 2 people in the audience ruin the chances of an 11-yr-old girl going into a STEM field in the future, as an adult? Particularly when they're not about women or women's abilities in the field? I can see a pervasive culture of sex-related jokes being wearing and inappropriate (unless your field is comedy), and I could see asking the 2 people to keep it down when others sitting nearby could easily hear what they're saying, but as others have said the self-righteous and very public way AR approached this if anything probably only made it more difficult for women to be welcomed in her field.
The whole thing is a simple mess up by someone who wanted (by her words words) to be a hero and got hijacked by the rad fems to push their narrative. Also, why has no one mentioned the obvious fact the word 'dongle' in a sexual context should be offensive to men? Oh that's right, we don't matter because we are not humans with feelings.

Oh and if I were one of those men I would be looking at suing her for gross breach of privacy. Of course he can't do any such thing because he would make himself unemployable.

I wish her well but she really needs to remember actions have consequences. If that is denied there is no justice or ability to interact with humans.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11627

Post by EdwardGemmer »

Hey, does anyone here have a Sonos speaker? I have one and it is the boss, but sometimes the network drops out. Wondering if anyone has tips or experience.

Wonderist
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11628

Post by Wonderist »

greylurker wrote:Hi all,
to keep mordacious1 happy, have got the pyt to 600. Been lurking here since July 2012, after watching the 'Dear Muslima' thing explode.
Thanks for doing the hard yards by preserving the evidence of craziness before it gets memory holed.
Liked Asimov's Foundation and Robot stories, but after 40 years I still think Arthur C Clarke's are the best - clear, concise stories with (unusually) no religious waffle or grandstanding, just technical people trying to sort problems out.
Back to lurking.
Peter E.
Clarke was my favourite for many years, including the time in high school when my friends were trying to get me to read Foundation. My favourite of his at the time, was Childhood's End, the first book I'd ever read whose ending seemed so sad that I cried (strange, there's no sad emoticon available here). I later got hooked on William Gibson, until I realized he's a bit of a one-trick-pony.

Since then 'favourites' are not so important to me. I like Neal Stephenson a lot, Vernor Vinge a *heck* of a lot, and I like lots of the classic SF authors (brushed up quite a bit over the years). Of the classics, one of my big favs is The Stars My Destination, by Alfred Bester. It's a much more mixed bag now, now clear One to Rule Them All. But Asimov's definitely in the rarer company of the lot.

Now! As for Clarke being a faster-moving writer than Asimov? Seriously? An *entire* novel:

Spaceship arrives in solar system. Mission to board the spaceship succeeds. Crew dick around for a bit. Shit happens, but not much in the grand scheme of things. Crew leaves the ship to go back to Earth. Spaceship leaves solar system.

Took an entire novel to tell that story. I told it in six sentences. He's no Dickens, but Asimov beats him by about a year of action per page. By the way, Rendezvous with Rama was my second fav Clarke after Childhood's end, so I'm not dissing it! (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rendezvous_with_Rama)

Apples
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structured die-in-a-fire-log

#11629

Post by Apples »

Somewhat interesting thread over at Zvan's. Unfortunately, several people have read one or the other of the Nugent threads and gotten the impression that people at the 'Pit "want" this or that based on which Nugent thread they read or which posters were more active.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/almostdiamo ... ent-218684
http://www.freezepage.com/1364151994PHEKSQSBAN

For example, since the relevance of feminism was the theme over the last few days, the consensus is: "The Pit doesn't want people to be able to talk about feminism -- just bigfoot or theology." Some people may think this, but I would say plenty of us would be willing and eager to talk about feminism if terms were defined clearly and you could question/discuss its tenets without being accused of sexism/misogyny.

Others seem to think 'Pitters are opposed to any/all "harassment policies" at conferences, which isn't true. Donglegate, however (and Surly Amy's TAM meltdown), shows how careful you need to be about what's in the policy and how you handle reporting/consequences. The Richards thread at Pharyngula lays bare how restrictive and reactive some of these folks are inclined to be about this stuff.

Smhll from A+ and the Nugent threads actually admits in #44 that using gendered profanity doesn't necessarily mean you think women are second class citizens. It's sad that I find this admission so surprising and refreshing, but there it is.

Wowbagger's reply: "Oh, I’m the first to admit that I don’t believe the ‘pit is wall to wall misognyists (or, if there’s a spectrum of such, that they’re all at the 100% woman-haters end) – but in that same breath, they are all complicit in using and approving of misogynistic abuse to achieve their goals."

Submariner
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11630

Post by Submariner »

@ Wonderist:

In high school (several geologic era's ago) I took a SF and Fantasy in Literature course and the required reading was "The Left Hand of Darkness" by Ursula K. Le Guin. A really interesting story with applications in the gender wars. Le Guin posits a race of neutrally gendered people (who only morph into genders for reproduction).

I was very glad I took that course.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11631

Post by Wonderist »

Stretchycheese wrote:Another thing I noticed. I found that the FTB crowd don't seem to use satire as much. They might use satire in other contexts, but when it comes to feminism, it's like some sacred cow where they always have to go into dead serious mode. They can't seem to use satire effectively against their critics but their critics often use satire against them. Dogmatism and authoritarian viewpoints don't mix that well with satire, as was shown when Fox News tried to introduce their version of a right-wing Daily Show.

Overall, the Slymepit is to FTB, as the Daily Show and Colbert are to Fox News.
Right. They *can't* use satire, except for basic sarcasm/snark, because it has too much potential to fuck with the dogma: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satire#Soc ... _functions
Satire, Social and psychological functions wrote:Satire and irony in some cases have been regarded as the most effective source to understand a society, the oldest form of social study.[9] They provide the keenest insights into a group's collective psyche, reveal its deepest values and tastes, and the society's structures of power.[10][11] Some authors have regarded satire as superior to non-comic and non-artistic disciplines like history or anthropology.[9][12][13] In a prominent example from Ancient Greece, philosopher Plato, when asked by a friend for a book to understand Athenian society, referred him to the plays of Aristophanes.[14][15]

For its nature and social role, Satire has enjoyed in many societies a special freedom license to mock prominent individuals and institutions.[16] The satiric impulse, and its ritualized expressions, carry out the function of resolving social tension.[17] Institutions like the ritual clowns, by giving expression to the antisocial tendencies, represent a safety valve which reestablishes equilibrium and health in the collective imaginary, which are jeopardized by the repressive aspects of society.[18][19]

The state of political satire in a given country reflects the state of civil liberties and human rights. Under totalitarian regimes any criticism of a political system including satire is suppressed. A typical example is the Soviet Union where the dissidents, such as Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn and Andrei Sakharov were under strong pressure from the government. While satire of everyday life in the USSR was allowed, the most prominent satirist being Arkady Raikin, political satire existed in the form of anecdotes[20] that made fun of Soviet political leaders, especially Brezhnev, famous for his narrow-mindness and love for awards and decorations.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11632

Post by Wonderist »

Submariner wrote:@ Wonderist:

In high school (several geologic era's ago) I took a SF and Fantasy in Literature course and the required reading was "The Left Hand of Darkness" by Ursula K. Le Guin. A really interesting story with applications in the gender wars. Le Guin posits a race of neutrally gendered people (who only morph into genders for reproduction).

I was very glad I took that course.
Good suggestion. I read her The Lathe of Heaven, which involves (as part of the larger scheme of the book) a similar blending of race and sex. I thought it was well done.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11633

Post by Metalogic42 »

Apples wrote:
For what it's worth, Erikthebassist pointed out in T'dome that she was one of the only people ever banned at the 'Pit.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586379
Caine's response two comments later is extremely facepalm worthy:
Yeah. For all the vaunted Freeze Peach!!1! they toss around, they’ve banned people and edited posts, such as the one with the death wishes on Marcotte.

Metalogic42
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11634

Post by Metalogic42 »

Wonderist wrote:
Stretchycheese wrote:Another thing I noticed. I found that the FTB crowd don't seem to use satire as much. They might use satire in other contexts, but when it comes to feminism, it's like some sacred cow where they always have to go into dead serious mode. They can't seem to use satire effectively against their critics but their critics often use satire against them. Dogmatism and authoritarian viewpoints don't mix that well with satire, as was shown when Fox News tried to introduce their version of a right-wing Daily Show.

Overall, the Slymepit is to FTB, as the Daily Show and Colbert are to Fox News.
Right. They *can't* use satire, except for basic sarcasm/snark, because it has too much potential to fuck with the dogma: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satire#Soc ... _functions
Satire, Social and psychological functions wrote:Satire and irony in some cases have been regarded as the most effective source to understand a society, the oldest form of social study.[9] They provide the keenest insights into a group's collective psyche, reveal its deepest values and tastes, and the society's structures of power.[10][11] Some authors have regarded satire as superior to non-comic and non-artistic disciplines like history or anthropology.[9][12][13] In a prominent example from Ancient Greece, philosopher Plato, when asked by a friend for a book to understand Athenian society, referred him to the plays of Aristophanes.[14][15]

For its nature and social role, Satire has enjoyed in many societies a special freedom license to mock prominent individuals and institutions.[16] The satiric impulse, and its ritualized expressions, carry out the function of resolving social tension.[17] Institutions like the ritual clowns, by giving expression to the antisocial tendencies, represent a safety valve which reestablishes equilibrium and health in the collective imaginary, which are jeopardized by the repressive aspects of society.[18][19]

The state of political satire in a given country reflects the state of civil liberties and human rights. Under totalitarian regimes any criticism of a political system including satire is suppressed. A typical example is the Soviet Union where the dissidents, such as Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn and Andrei Sakharov were under strong pressure from the government. While satire of everyday life in the USSR was allowed, the most prominent satirist being Arkady Raikin, political satire existed in the form of anecdotes[20] that made fun of Soviet political leaders, especially Brezhnev, famous for his narrow-mindness and love for awards and decorations.
Good point. I also think satire is beneficial on a more personal level. I make fun of myself all the time, because if you can't laugh at yourself, what can you laugh at? I'd hate to go through life with my "sooper cereal" face on all the time, and I get the same impression from most of the posters here, but very few on FTB/A+. Humorless forking dongles, the lot of them.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11635

Post by ConcentratedH2O, OM »

Amphiox:
That you are demented enough to think that the term “random ejaculations” is sexual innuendo of any sort whatsoever tells us far more about the sort of filth you leave lying around in your own brainpan than anything else.
Caine, Fleur du Mal:
I just glanced up at the teevee and there was a close-up of a street sign: North socrum loop. That is *not* how I read it.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11636

Post by Metalogic42 »

Ophie's latest blog post, sans quotes:

"I’ve always liked Thomas Paine’s point about revelation in The Age of Reason. 1793, he wrote that. Yet it hasn’t sunk in yet."

She has literally nothing to say except for "durrrrr I like this thing another person said". This really sucks, because she could say so much more about Paine's writing. Maybe even something about its appropriateness to the atheist/skeptic community today. But instead, we get two sentences with no new information, and fewer words than even this very comment on a forum, written off the top of my head.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11637

Post by JackSkeptic »

Metalogic42 wrote:
Apples wrote:
For what it's worth, Erikthebassist pointed out in T'dome that she was one of the only people ever banned at the 'Pit.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586379
Caine's response two comments later is extremely facepalm worthy:
Yeah. For all the vaunted Freeze Peach!!1! they toss around, they’ve banned people and edited posts, such as the one with the death wishes on Marcotte.
Yep, anything with legal ramifications. Are these people real?

Also reading through it is clear many did not read all of the posts there or do not seem to have read anything here. They really are sheep listening to their Pastors. Have they not grasped that they are allowed to think for themselves? That is one of the wonderful things about Atheism. Why do so many throw that away so easily? They are denying themselves their own right to listen to others.

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11638

Post by Pitchguest »

Metalogic42 wrote:
Apples wrote:
For what it's worth, Erikthebassist pointed out in T'dome that she was one of the only people ever banned at the 'Pit.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586379
Caine's response two comments later is extremely facepalm worthy:
Yeah. For all the vaunted Freeze Peach!!1! they toss around, they’ve banned people and edited posts, such as the one with the death wishes on Marcotte.
For all their talk about looking at things *charitably*, they sure can't extend their own, can they? Of course, the "freeze peach" comment is a double-edged sword, implying that Pharyngula has no such thing as "freeze peach" and in fact everything is locked down tight. Even the Thunderdome is not the unmoderated haven it's advertised to be, so that's how far they're willing to go with that idea.

Metalogic42
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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11639

Post by Metalogic42 »

Jack wrote:
Metalogic42 wrote:
Apples wrote:
For what it's worth, Erikthebassist pointed out in T'dome that she was one of the only people ever banned at the 'Pit.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/ ... ent-586379
Caine's response two comments later is extremely facepalm worthy:
Yeah. For all the vaunted Freeze Peach!!1! they toss around, they’ve banned people and edited posts, such as the one with the death wishes on Marcotte.
Yep, anything with legal ramifications. Are these people real?

Also reading through it is clear many did not read all of the posts there or do not seem to have read anything here. They really are sheep listening to their Pastors. Have they not grasped that they are allowed to think for themselves? That is one of the wonderful things about Atheism. Why do so many throw that away so easily? They are denying themselves their own right to listen to others.
I've long suspected that they believe they *are* thinking for themselves, as if being atheists automatically makes them skeptics, because their atheism is diametrically opposed to the "traditional" example of non-skeptical thought: religion. I've seen it before in atheists who believe in healing crystals, palm reading, and the like. The proof will be when they start telling us to "open our minds a little".

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Re: Jim the Pleb Made Me Do It

#11640

Post by Metalogic42 »

To add to the above post, I guess the idea behind Caine's comment is that since we allow "sexism" and "misogyny", we might as well allow anything. Since of course the only difference between calling someone a cunt and an actual death threat is that only the latter is illegal.

Locked