The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

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AbsurdWalls
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3841

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
AbsurdWalls wrote:
The point of sticking a Wire on Justin would be to prevent "He threatened to kick me in the cunt!" rather than to catch out people who talk to him (it would actually be pretty shitty to release recordings of private conversations he had unless it were necessary for him to defend himself against some accusation). If he only has to be "Schrodinger's bugged conference-attendee" for that function to be performed then all the better.
Shitty? I have to wonder if it wouldn't even be illegal, without the concerned person's consent. Anyway, that line was a joke to insinuate they always lurk here.
I'm not sure whether it's illegal. If it were a tapped phone call that would be the case, but I'm not sure whether the same rules apply in-person. I also wondered whether bootlegging the talks at the conference and releasing them ("Richard Dawkins is a white supremacist, anyone?") would be copyright infringement.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3842

Post by BarnOwl »

From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3843

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

AbsurdWalls:

About bootlegging, the only experience I have is with concerts. Usualy, it's the venue who controls and decides what can/cannot be recorded, photographed, or filmed and by whom. I don't know if lectures and talks are copyrighted (that's actualy an interesting question), but at least I'm almost sure the venue can sue. I don't know about the organizers. In music, the band usualy has a quota of guests for free tickets and press passes, then the venue (not the organizers) decides what medias are allowed to be recorded.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3844

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

BarnOwl wrote:From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"
O-o

"Racial minorities" are not people?????????

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3845

Post by AbsurdWalls »

justinvacula wrote:Thanks for the support and interest in sending me to Women in Secularism. The largest costs, I think, would be transportation and hotel.

The bus fare doesn't seem to be bad: about $150 for a round-trip from Scranton to D.C.

http://i.imgur.com/qJYSK.jpg

$35 for student registration

~$150 a night for hotel room

http://i.imgur.com/KqRuA.jpg

$700 would cover this adventure. If I were to room share or stay in another hotel the price would go down significantly.
I would sincerely suggest also applying to the Surly Amy fund. Even if it's reasonably likely that you will not be her first choice it is a good-faith gesture to make.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3846

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
BarnOwl wrote:From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"
O-o

"Racial minorities" are not people?????????
I'm excited that the logical conclusion of this line of discussion is going to be a painful Atheism+ rap recorded by Carrier, Mcreight et al. to spread atheism to the ghetto.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3847

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:
Gumby wrote:
AnonymousCowherd wrote:How many open-shirted, gold chain wearing disco clowns do they need to be reminded of?
I'm thinking just one:

[spoiler]http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd24 ... 82f4e1.jpg[/spoiler]

*runs*
It's not gold, it's silver. I'll grant the open shirt, but I don't exactly dress like that every day ;)

Touché, nontheless. I may have to change my avatar for the sake of the Pit's "reputation"...
I had in mind more this; https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/imag ... V9aNZMCHcz

And no, Phil, your avatar doesn't trigger my latent coulorophobia at all. Stay away from mirror balls and you'll be right.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3848

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Richard Carrier wrote:As Socrates said, the self-examined life is not worth living.
Fucking moron.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3849

Post by AbsurdWalls »

Richard Carrier wrote:You then quote Nietzsche. Are you thereby verifying my post’s claim that you want atheism to be nihilistically devoid of moral standards and values?
This guy needs to stop thinking he knows anything about philosophy.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3850

Post by codelette »

BarnOwl wrote:From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"
We noticed that on his previous A+ cheerleading blob:
This does not mean you, personally, have to go knocking on doors in ethnic neighborhoods ...
:lol:

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3851

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

Mykeru wrote:
To really get Carrier, just read his self-wanking sidebar description:
He has also become a noted defender of scientific and moral realism, Bayesian reasoning, and the epistemology of history.
Bayesian reasoning?

In the case of Bayesian inference, folks like Karl Popper have rejected it because it's inherently non-falsifiable: "It is prone to the same vicious circle as any other justificationist epistemology, because it presupposes what it attempts to justify."

Pre-supposes what it attempts to justify.

Well, there's Richard Carrier in a nutshell.
Realism - I don't think it means what Carrier thinks it does. And Moral Realism - always ends up requiring a "good-o-meter" that can measure the objective moral value of something, and once you have that, it's a slippery slope to Jesus etc. Hard to see how you can claim to be one (except in the very weakest sense) and be a "Scientific" realist as well. Maybe Carrier is OK with the "weakest" bit.

And "epistemology of history"? Don't get me started. Hell, if you claim to be a "scienctific realist" the "epistemology" bit is sorted right there.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3852

Post by BarnOwl »

Surprise, surprise! PeeZus, in his eagerness to show off his engagement with social justice issues, misrepresents this WSJ article about 2013 federal tax rate changes for Merkins. The graphic he posts as reflecting the WSJ's ignorance of "poor people" is actually presented in the article as examples of how affluent people in various life situations will be affected by changes in the deductions allowed. There's another graphic in the article, further down the page, which shows quite clearly how poorer Merkins (the unemployed who have sporadic income, students with part-time income, low wage workers with dependent children, etc.) will be disproportionally affected by the expiration of the payroll tax break.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3853

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

Notung wrote:Can anyone else not access the Shermer article? Is the site down? I haven't read it yet!
Yes, the page isn't loading for me.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3854

Post by BarnOwl »

disproportionally -->disproportionately

Clearly I need another espresso.

Guest

Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3855

Post by Guest »

codelette wrote:
BarnOwl wrote:From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"
We noticed that on his previous A+ cheerleading blob:
This does not mean you, personally, have to go knocking on doors in ethnic neighborhoods ...
:lol:
I swear, these people really do go out of their way to prove the Bronze rule. That is, that we tend think that others think/act in a similar fashion to what we would if we were in their situation. If you're thinking that everybody else is actively acting in a sexist/racist fashion, it's often because you have frequent sexist/racist thoughts running through your head, and as such suspect that everybody else is the same way.

No, not really.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3856

Post by Phil_Giordana_FCD »

I have been pointed out on the FB anti-atheism+ page that Carrier's "Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods." is actually not racist, as I first interpreted it. I still don't get what they're trying to say over there, but I've never been known to be the sharpest knife in the drawer. Any help in understanding why my interpretation is wrong would be welcome.

http://www.facebook.com/groups/43616382 ... up_comment

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3857

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

AbsurdWalls wrote:
Richard Carrier wrote:As Socrates said, the self-examined life is not worth living.
Fucking moron.
Ha ha ha ha! Dick Harrier's Socrates should go over like a turd in a puchbowl with the navel gazers at A+

Guest

Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3858

Post by Guest »

BarnOwl wrote:Surprise, surprise! PeeZus, in his eagerness to show off his engagement with social justice issues, misrepresents this WSJ article about 2013 federal tax rate changes for Merkins. The graphic he posts as reflecting the WSJ's ignorance of "poor people" is actually presented in the article as examples of how affluent people in various life situations will be affected by changes in the deductions allowed. There's another graphic in the article, further down the page, which shows quite clearly how poorer Merkins (the unemployed who have sporadic income, students with part-time income, low wage workers with dependent children, etc.) will be disproportionally affected by the expiration of the payroll tax break.
See, that's what pisses me off the most. Theoretically, I should be in agreement with PZ on this issue. I'm a leftist/progressive (or to be accurate, I'm a pro-market demand hawk), but it's really clear that he (and others) have no bloody clue what they're talking about on these issues. They've never really thought of them, they don't understand the nuts and bolts that go on behind the scenes that make up the details of these issues. They're just playing at this stuff.

Truth be told, I suspect that PZ is more concerned about the deduction changes (I.E. stuff that affects him more) than the Payroll Tax Break change (I.E. stuff that affects him less, relatively speaking) because that's the way that SJW's seem to roll.

Their horribleness on class issues stems from a sense of self-entitlement that comes from their own position.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3859

Post by jjbinx007 »

So a commenter on FTB talks about Shermer being "criticised on blogs":

http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... ent-418253
Fuck you Michael Shermer. Fuck you for equating being criticised in a magazine and on blogs with them being dragged from your home, hauled off into concentration camps, shaved, tatooed, beaten, starved, worked to death and finally sent into a gas chamber.
Fuck you.
However, Richard Carrier describes criticism on blogs as harassment when it's done to them:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/carrier/arc ... ment-31584
n other words, the Lee petition exists because women in this movement are being digitally harassed beyond the pale (and not, say, blacks or homeopathy opponents); and feminism is being openly mocked and straw manned by hundreds of atheists (in precisely the way that, say, anti-racism is not).
Fuck, he sounds like a religionist talking about their God being openly mocked.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3860

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

codelette wrote:
BarnOwl wrote:From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"
We noticed that on his previous A+ cheerleading blob:
This does not mean you, personally, have to go knocking on doors in ethnic neighborhoods ...
:lol:
No. That might be scary. You can just go eat in "their" restaurants instead. Maybe leave a pamphlet or two.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3861

Post by Karmakin »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:I have been pointed out on the FB anti-atheism+ page that Carrier's "Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods." is actually not racist, as I first interpreted it. I still don't get what they're trying to say over there, but I've never been known to be the sharpest knife in the drawer. Any help in understanding why my interpretation is wrong would be welcome.

http://www.facebook.com/groups/43616382 ... up_comment
I'm not sure if it's traditionally racist, per se, but there's something definitely wrong with that statement. The way the sentence is phrased, it gives the impression of the belief that racial minorities are separate from the class of "people" and as such are separated out. Now there's a charitable way of reading the quote...where people is a superset and racial minorities are a smaller sample of that superset, but if atheism is good for people, it'll be good for racial minorities as well, who are part of that superset.

However, context kills that I think. The larger context is that Carrier seems to repeatedly talk about how messages need to be "crafted" towards minority groups, which means it's pretty obvious that he meant the first impression, and not the more charitable one.

I think the larger question of if it's racism or not is probably just quibbling over definitions. Personally, I think that assuming cultural differences based on race IS racism (even if they end up being valid and true in an individual case), but I'm not sure if that fits the traditional definition of racism. Which means that it probably has to be expanded a bit.

I also think the same issues come up with gender, with SJW's/Neofeminists rejecting the notion that making assumptions based upon a perceived gender culture (whatever that is) is a sexist act.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3862

Post by Mykeru »

comslave wrote:
justinvacula wrote:
$700 would cover this adventure. If I were to room share or stay in another hotel the price would go down significantly.

Seriously, do you honestly think they'll let you in? I wouldn't be surprised if they had you arrested for stalking.
That is exactly the point of the harassment and stalking claims made by Ophelia Benson, Rebecca Watson, Melody Hensley and others.

Benson gets to play "take my ball and go home", ostensibly so future TAMs will cater to her. Rebecca Watson gets preferential treatment and gets to dictate who can attend conferences a even ask her questions, based on almost completely bogus claims. For example, when Watson gave her HFA speech, she claimed Elevatorgate lived locally and was stalking her. The invention seems to have no other purpose but to increase the aura of present danger. Now Hensley has gotten on the bandwagon describing critics as stalkers. Hensley even prevented an anti-vaccine nut from attending a CFI lecture for no other reason than she felt "uncomfortable".

This is not paranoia, this is not a mistake. This is a cold and calculating shit test perpetrated on the skeptical community that works like this: They, on an individual basis refrain from calling people misogynists, stalkers and harassers, subject to continual review and, in exchange, we hand over the skeptical community to them lock, stock and barrel.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3863

Post by jjbinx007 »

BarnOwl wrote:Surprise, surprise! PeeZus, in his eagerness to show off his engagement with social justice issues, misrepresents this WSJ article about 2013 federal tax rate changes for Merkins. The graphic he posts as reflecting the WSJ's ignorance of "poor people" is actually presented in the article as examples of how affluent people in various life situations will be affected by changes in the deductions allowed. There's another graphic in the article, further down the page, which shows quite clearly how poorer Merkins (the unemployed who have sporadic income, students with part-time income, low wage workers with dependent children, etc.) will be disproportionally affected by the expiration of the payroll tax break.
What a fucking lying arsehole. Will he have the integrity to admit his mistake and retract his article? Will his baboons feel bad for not being... you know... skeptical?

Rhetorical. We know the answers to those questions.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3864

Post by Trophy »

BarnOwl wrote:Surprise, surprise! PeeZus, in his eagerness to show off his engagement with social justice issues, misrepresents this WSJ article about 2013 federal tax rate changes for Merkins. The graphic he posts as reflecting the WSJ's ignorance of "poor people" is actually presented in the article as examples of how affluent people in various life situations will be affected by changes in the deductions allowed. There's another graphic in the article, further down the page, which shows quite clearly how poorer Merkins (the unemployed who have sporadic income, students with part-time income, low wage workers with dependent children, etc.) will be disproportionally affected by the expiration of the payroll tax break.
PZ's next article attacks Shermer and claims Shermer thinks he is an infallible god. Would be nice, if just this one fucking time PZ would correct his misleading, false, and incorrect representation of an unbiased article to show us that he does not think he is infallible and that he can admit to his mistakes. But nope. If there is anyone who has a delusion of being a God, it's PZ.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3865

Post by franc »

Rystefn wrote:Awww... Poor Franc. Project much?
The difference between a protopunk riding on the laurels of past generations, preening himself in the mirror, marvelling at his own penis and cleverness and -

me.

I do.

Rystefn talks about doing.

What a hero. 90's alt.flame. Any more and his brain breaks.

I'd suck you off if your mohawk was any more than a glossy magazine cover. It's not. Rystefn, you are typhos.

You stuck your dick in a pudgy pink thing. How foul. And it's your merit badge.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3866

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

jjbinx007 wrote:So a commenter on FTB talks about Shermer being "criticised on blogs":

http://freethoughtblogs.com/butterflies ... ent-418253
Fuck you Michael Shermer. Fuck you for equating being criticised in a magazine and on blogs with them being dragged from your home, hauled off into concentration camps, shaved, tatooed, beaten, starved, worked to death and finally sent into a gas chamber.
Fuck you.
However, Richard Carrier describes criticism on blogs as harassment when it's done to them:

http://freethoughtblogs.com/carrier/arc ... ment-31584
n other words, the Lee petition exists because women in this movement are being digitally harassed beyond the pale (and not, say, blacks or homeopathy opponents); and feminism is being openly mocked and straw manned by hundreds of atheists (in precisely the way that, say, anti-racism is not).
Fuck, he sounds like a religionist talking about their God being openly mocked.
Digitally harrassed? I assume he doesn't mean with a finger? That would be harrassment. Photonically harrassed - not so much.

As for the rage plotz, read what he said you dumb yutz. Your family's history entitles you to not one whit of extra moral authority, but it should have taught you that rationality and tolerance are better than screaming, vindictive anger. You don't "own" the Holocaust, and if learning about it is one way that people can come to understand evil, just maybe it will be less likely to happen again. If you can't or won't learn that, it's you who is spitting on graves.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3867

Post by welch »

Mark Neil wrote:
welch wrote:Blah Blah Blah, Yap Yap Yap, PooPoo PooPoo etc.
If you want to converse like a grown up, you know where my post is, reply to that. Otherwise, I'm not your mother, and I don't have to coddle you while your having a temper tantrum. "Fuck you and the camel you came in".
That would have worked better if one of the folks here with some brains hadn't pointed it out to you earlier. When you decide to ask your questions in a way that merits serious response chuckles, I certainly shall respond appropriately.

Until then, I shall continue to well, also respond to you in the way I see appropriately. Don't worry, you're not special. I treat all the assclowns like this.

Or is this how you're going to make me flounce?

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3868

Post by AnonymousCowherd »

Phil_Giordana_FCD wrote:I have been pointed out on the FB anti-atheism+ page that Carrier's "Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods." is actually not racist, as I first interpreted it. I still don't get what they're trying to say over there, but I've never been known to be the sharpest knife in the drawer. Any help in understanding why my interpretation is wrong would be welcome.

http://www.facebook.com/groups/43616382 ... up_comment
It would be racist if you said it Phil. Or anyone else here.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3869

Post by welch »

fascination wrote:
Steersman wrote:
And for the “heads-up”, although I only see one reference to me there by one Raging Bee – about whom Welch had some choice words – probably because she and I have had some “words” over Shermer in the context of Brayton’s rather sorry attempt to refute the charge that FfTB has turned into an “Atheist Cult”.
That Raging Bee is not very nice, eh? I noticed that she/he/they referred to you as "boy". Isn't that as sexist as referring to a grown woman as "girl"? Oh, there I go thinking again...
I think Bee was the one I backed into a corner about how bitching people out about being sexist is kind of hypocritical if you're calling someone a poptart. They then tried to tell me "poptart" had NO meaning other than the toaster pastry. It was the worst attempt at recovery ever, and hi-fucking-larious.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3870

Post by welch »

Steersman wrote:
somedumbguy wrote:they're all sexist. they're all elitist. they're all racist.
it took social justice warriors and a heap of feminist to really turn me into a curmudgeon and I resent it.
anything that can fuck these assholes over the better.

they are their own worst enemies, the sad part is their message is so overwhelmingly accepted without question or critical thought.
“It’s darkest just before the dawn” – or just before it goes pitch-black, depending on your residual optimism.

But it seems that there is some increasing willingness to face some of the problematic consequences of the dogma surrounding feminism – Thunderfoot’s video, among others, being a case in point, particularly within the skeptic and atheist communities. For instance, while I haven’t read all of it, a post by Kate Donovan on FTB’s Ashley Miller seems like a step in the right direction. ….
Well the FTB lot doesn't know when to stop. Every time they get away with some bit of acting stupid, they can't stop, they have to push it a little farther until even the kindest souls are like....yeah, okay, I can't even take you seriously, you're just an assclown. They're learning that no, not every statement or argument gets to be taken seriously. You do have to do SOME work for that.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3871

Post by welch »

Steersman wrote:
somedumbguy wrote:they're all sexist. they're all elitist. they're all racist.
it took social justice warriors and a heap of feminist to really turn me into a curmudgeon and I resent it.
anything that can fuck these assholes over the better.

they are their own worst enemies, the sad part is their message is so overwhelmingly accepted without question or critical thought.
“It’s darkest just before the dawn” – or just before it goes pitch-black, depending on your residual optimism.

But it seems that there is some increasing willingness to face some of the problematic consequences of the dogma surrounding feminism – Thunderfoot’s video, among others, being a case in point, particularly within the skeptic and atheist communities. For instance, while I haven’t read all of it, a post by Kate Donovan on FTB’s Ashley Miller seems like a step in the right direction. ….
The comments are enlightening, not fit the content, that's mostly pants, but to show how even self-proclaimed "rational thinkers" are just as likely to only care about "winning" the argument as opposed to actual discussion.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3872

Post by BarnOwl »

No surprise again, the Pharyngula commentariat have swallowed PZ's dishonesty-flavored Kool-Aid, and are opining that their salaries are less than the taxes paid by the people in the WSJ graphic.

So they expect to be paid for whingeing and playing "victim of social injustice" on the internetz all day? :lol:

Gotta leave for work. My income falls somewhere between that of the affluent people in the affluent people graphic, and the poor people in the payroll tax break graphic. I'll lose some money from the expiration of the payroll tax break.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3873

Post by welch »

codelette wrote:
BarnOwl wrote:From Carrier's piece:
Moreover, if atheism is good for people, it ought to be good for racial minorities as well. We should want to spread the movement into their neighborhoods.
WTF kind of segregated environment does Carrier reside in? "Spread the movement into their neighborhoods?"
We noticed that on his previous A+ cheerleading blob:
This does not mean you, personally, have to go knocking on doors in ethnic neighborhoods ...
:lol:
Oh don't go hating on the honky. He means well, he's just stupid, because you know, honky. He so clueless it's almost cute. I bet he has lots of non-honky friends.

Outwest
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3874

Post by Outwest »

Steersman wrote:
aweraw wrote:[spoiler]
Steersman wrote:
aweraw wrote:Addressing Caine's unwillingness to consider Alexa stats as evidence that more men than women visit FTB:

http://i.imgur.com/5Z7f1.png
I don’t know much if anything about Alexa’s methods of collecting stats, but I notice that when I do a mouse-over of the question mark adjacent to the “Gender; Male” line I see “relative to the general internet population, males are overrepresented at FTB”. And similarily with the Female line which says “females are underrepresented”. Whether that is 60-40 or 80-20 or even 30-70 seems to be a moot question. And there's also the question as to how the internet population correlates with the general atheist population.

Although it might yield some interesting results to actually ennumerate all of the commenters at FTB and assign sexes to them based on various statements they’ve made – still doesn’t say much about the lurkers but might still be of some use.
[/spoiler]

Not arguing strictly for their accuracy... more that Caine was provided evidence after asking for it, and then dismissed it without any consideration at all, based on flakey reasoning.
Maybe. Although her assertion that “a fuzzy algorithm” does not “equal actual statistics” seems a reasonable point: whatever method Alexa is using, the mouse-overs strongly suggest that they themselves are not putting a lot of weight on them.

However, Reap quoted some statistics here the other day which seem a little more credible: the Atheist Census suggests, on the basis of some 24,000 respondents, that 32% of the population are female while 67% are male – so about a 2 to 1 ratio in favour of males. How that correlates with the Internet and general populations is, of course, moot, but it seems like a reasonable starting point. Would be interesting to go through the commenters on Pharyngula and see whether that 2:1 ratio is at all close to being a valid approximation.
I've been saying for a long time that the commenters over at FTB are young and mostly male. All without looking at any stats for the page. The reason I believed this was a) the style of writing and b) the lack of critical thinking skills in argumentation.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3875

Post by Outwest »

Pitchguest wrote:I expected the turd to be dishonest, dodge questions, obfuscate, redefine words, etc, but I at least thought he'd be able to keep a cool head under fire. But he couldn't even manage that. Instead of he came off as agitated, extremely snappy and just eager to swipe at whatever Reap, Al or Brian said.

It became painful to listen to when you realise he's not even going to be that decent. Even when the subject of misogyny came up, when you realise that none of the people here at the 'pit have said anything misogynistic or anything that could be considered misogynistic, even in the new redefined version courtesy of Julia Gillard, does he recant and simply attempts to slimily implicate the behaviour of the 'pit as misogynistic. It was just ... meh.

There comes a point when you just quit dealing with turds of that sort. Unless oolon changes the way he operates, it's going to stay that way.
It was hilarious! Oolon couldn't come up with a coherent argument to refute anything Reap, Al, Brian, and later, Rene said. It was good though that he at least had the courage to come on the show. I believe he knew he was probably going to be pilloried, but he hung in there and stuck to his guns. Even if the guns were empty.

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Why posting here is now like licking urinals

#3876

Post by franc »

[spoiler]http://i.imgur.com/azykz.png[/spoiler]

Outwest
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3877

Post by Outwest »

justinvacula wrote:
comslave wrote:Opinion:
I strongly suspect if the Slymepitters held a convention, we may not get greater numbers, but we'd probably get a greater percentage of women simply because the women here don't seem to be scared shitless of men.

Select:
1. Agree
2. Disagree
1000 times this
I think we'd have a very diverse crowd and be able to attract good speakers that actually know something about their subject. This forum is already proof of that in my mind.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3878

Post by Philip of Tealand »

Errmmm earlier I posted viewtopic.php?p=50443#p50443

Was I correct in that it came from Pharyngula's Thunderdrome that Commander Tuvok and Another Lurker got their screenshots from?

I am starting to worry that I got it mixed up with Butterflies and Wheels and I don't want to have my facts wrong. I don't mind accusing PZ of things he has done but if it was Ophelia I'd like to accuse the right person

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3879

Post by Outwest »

Skep tickle wrote:
justinvacula wrote:... $700 would cover this adventure. If I were to room share or stay in another hotel the price would go down significantly.
I'd pitch in to help you attend.
Here as well. The question remains though: would they let you in? You misogynist bastard! :D

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3880

Post by jjbinx007 »

Is there an download of Colon's appearance on Reapsow yet?

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3881

Post by Outwest »

Mykeru wrote:
Useless Lurker wrote:Has anyone here noticed Richard Carrier's current post on his blog at FTB titled "Atheism+ : The Name for What’s Happening"?

He seems concerned that the "haters" might be the majority among atheists/skeptics, admits in the comments that he doesn't follow the A+ forum, displays considerable hostility toward opponents, and generally goes on at more length than I feel like commenting about at the moment.

He gets a surprising amount of push-back in the comments, but from who?
Carrier complaining about the "anti-feminist" threats and harassment is so divorced from reality, along with his boilerplate acronym responses, that he's hardly worth engaging. Like Dillahunty he has some idealized model of what's happening, but being so very fucking effete, he's never get boots on the ground. But why? How is it that Carrier comes out on his moral high-horse without apparently having a clue what's actually going on, about the reality of the supposed harassment, and thinking the problem in atheism is swarming hordes of misogynists?

To really get Carrier, just read his self-wanking sidebar description:
He has also become a noted defender of scientific and moral realism, Bayesian reasoning, and the epistemology of history.
Bayesian reasoning?

In the case of Bayesian inference, folks like Karl Popper have rejected it because it's inherently non-falsifiable: "It is prone to the same vicious circle as any other justificationist epistemology, because it presupposes what it attempts to justify."

Pre-supposes what it attempts to justify.

Well, there's Richard Carrier in a nutshell.
That's the whole problem with Bayes Theorm, you can prove or disprove whatever you want by adjusting assumptions, not facts.
I could prove you don't, and never have, existed.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3882

Post by Trophy »

LOL! Y'all should read the thread about that R-tard Roosh. All the pure pharyngulite are fighting each other because Caine said that "dick" is a gendered insult and should not be used (Caine of all the people!! WTF!). Apparently, "dick" is okay because of "power differential".
Daisy wrote:Also: Power differentials? Wut r those? One of the worst decisions the Horde ever made was that saying “dick” is just as bad as saying “cunt.” Right, because male gendered slurs pack the same punch as female gendered slurs.
Caine wrote:The “decision” was that gendered insults and slurs are wrong and unnecessary, full stop. Your argument reminds me of those who defend the use of cunt because it’s used “differently” where they live... If it makes things easier for you, just fucking ignore me. I get enough abuse from people, I don’t need it from you.
Daisy wrote:Oh, fuck you. I didn’t “abuse” you. I disagreed with you, vociferously. And I was a lot more respectful toward you than you are toward most people.
LOL!

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3883

Post by Philip of Tealand »

Daisy wrote:Oh, fuck you. I didn’t “abuse” you. I disagreed with you, vociferously. And I was a lot more respectful toward you than you are toward most people.
Wooooooooooooooooooaaaaaaaaaaahh Daisy, be careful young lady - you know what happens to those who disagree with The Drama Society!

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3884

Post by franc »

Trophy wrote:
LOL!
YOU still owe me an explanation why you pissed on my corpse?

Metalogic42
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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3885

Post by Metalogic42 »

Outwest wrote: That's the whole problem with Bayes Theorm, you can prove or disprove whatever you want by adjusting assumptions, not facts.
I could prove you don't, and never have, existed.
That's not a problem with BT per se, but with how people use it. Garbage in, garbage out.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3886

Post by Trophy »

franc wrote:
Trophy wrote:
LOL!
YOU still owe me an explanation why you pissed on my corpse?
Probably because I disagreed with you on something? I don't remember much.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3887

Post by Lurkion »

Hey, so I'm still fighting with an FTBer on my blog about a post Greta Christina made about rape prevention. It's been like 3 days and page long posts each time.

It's getting a bit tiring when they ignore what I say...

Essentially, their argument is:

1. she's not wrong (supplemented by 'if she's wrong, some other people are also wrong, sometimes too'); and
2. so what if she's wrong - she doesn't intend to be taken seriously and we shouldn't hang her for it!

There is also a bit of "You're not a lawyer! I don't believe you! You're not employing legal skills in the exact way that I, a layperson, would expect a lawyer to employ their legal skills nor delivering the same result that I, a layperson, believe a lawyer would deliver if employing their legal skills in the correct way'.

People can join in if they like and tell me (and them!) if I'm wrong.

http://unsolicitedcomment.wordpress.com ... christina/

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3888

Post by Reap »

jjbinx007 wrote:Is there an download of Colon's appearance on Reapsow yet?
soon

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3889

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Philip of Tealand wrote:Errmmm earlier I posted viewtopic.php?p=50443#p50443

Was I correct in that it came from Pharyngula's Thunderdrome that Commander Tuvok and Another Lurker got their screenshots from?

I am starting to worry that I got it mixed up with Butterflies and Wheels and I don't want to have my facts wrong. I don't mind accusing PZ of things he has done but if it was Ophelia I'd like to accuse the right person
The original posts were at B&W, but for some reason, one (or many more) were reproduced at the Thunderdome.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3890

Post by Git »

Notung wrote:Can anyone else not access the Shermer article? Is the site down? I haven't read it yet!
Yup, can't access it either.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3891

Post by justinvacula »

Metalogic42 wrote:
Outwest wrote: That's the whole problem with Bayes Theorm, you can prove or disprove whatever you want by adjusting assumptions, not facts.
I could prove you don't, and never have, existed.
That's not a problem with BT per se, but with how people use it. Garbage in, garbage out.
BT is about probabilities and is a great inductive reasoning tool. With more data to adjust your prior probabilities, the inference is stronger.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3892

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Perhaps one of the Baboons has sent in a complaint about how the article is sooooooooo sexist, or summat. Let's face it, that is not below them.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3893

Post by Philip of Tealand »

CommanderTuvok wrote:
Philip of Tealand wrote:Errmmm earlier I posted viewtopic.php?p=50443#p50443

Was I correct in that it came from Pharyngula's Thunderdrome that Commander Tuvok and Another Lurker got their screenshots from?

I am starting to worry that I got it mixed up with Butterflies and Wheels and I don't want to have my facts wrong. I don't mind accusing PZ of things he has done but if it was Ophelia I'd like to accuse the right person
The original posts were at B&W, but for some reason, one (or many more) were reproduced at the Thunderdome.
I shall change my blog accordingly, thank you for the info!

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3894

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Sara brilliantly pokes fun at Surly Amy.

http://www.saramayhew.com/blog/index.ph ... im-a-fake/

I love the coinage of "saramics".

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3895

Post by TedDahlberg »

another lurker wrote:
welch wrote:
CommanderTuvok wrote:Can I just say all you folks are a little late with the Star Trek theme.
Yeah, but every episode of voyager, I wanted them to find a reason to kill half the cast.

No, scratch that, the entire cast. Just blow up the fucking ship and find a plot that wasn't more reliant on yet another holosuite malfunction than TNG

I *hated* Voyager and I hated the captain most of all. What an annoying bitch!

I will admit to having a tiny crush on Tom Paris, however. The actor came to my city for a Star Trek convention, so I thought, what the hell, go see it! He was a total asshat in real life. His jacket was way too big in the shoulders, and his pants were super tight in the crotch and loose in the hips. I mean seriously, wtf? He also spent most of his speech making jokes about how 'short' Patrick Stewart is...he was an arrogant ass to be honest.
You made me recall an interview with Garrett Wang (ensign Kim) on a podcast I listened to a few years ago where he talked about Voyager, and how horrible Kate Mulgrew apaprently was to Jeri Ryan. Interesting, and Wang himself seemed nice enough. I think it's this podcast.

Something I very much appreciate is that pretty much everyone in the cast of TNG seems to be genuinely nice when they're interviewed or whatever, and that they all seem to still be friends. Makes you feel a vague sense of hope for humanity.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3896

Post by Outwest »

justinvacula wrote:
Metalogic42 wrote:
Outwest wrote: That's the whole problem with Bayes Theorm, you can prove or disprove whatever you want by adjusting assumptions, not facts.
I could prove you don't, and never have, existed.
That's not a problem with BT per se, but with how people use it. Garbage in, garbage out.
BT is about probabilities and is a great inductive reasoning tool. With more data to adjust your prior probabilities, the inference is stronger.
That's why I used the word assumptions because when trying to predict the probability of something where there is little data, it because a useless tool. I don't know any statisticians (and I know a few) that would use BT to track the probability of anything.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3897

Post by somedumbguy »

Steersman wrote:
somedumbguy wrote:they're all sexist. they're all elitist. they're all racist.
it took social justice warriors and a heap of feminist to really turn me into a curmudgeon and I resent it.
anything that can fuck these assholes over the better.

they are their own worst enemies, the sad part is their message is so overwhelmingly accepted without question or critical thought.
“It’s darkest just before the dawn” – or just before it goes pitch-black, depending on your residual optimism.

But it seems that there is some increasing willingness to face some of the problematic consequences of the dogma surrounding feminism – Thunderfoot’s video, among others, being a case in point, particularly within the skeptic and atheist communities. For instance, while I haven’t read all of it, a post by Kate Donovan on FTB’s Ashley Miller seems like a step in the right direction. ….
Either I read a different post than the one you haven't read all of, or I am not sensing your irony as you write, or I am just totally clueless, because I don't see Donovan taking on any of the problematic consequences of the dogma in that post -- I just see her quite literally calling for reinforcements in the fight against the disbelievers.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3898

Post by somedumbguy »

I'd really like to take a short course in Bayesian Inference.

I know how the math works from probability way too long ago. I know it's a very big deal in the computing world now, in large part due to how Paul Graham championed it to fight spam.

And I know that in the area of scientific induction, there are many that say it should replace the more traditional test for significance. That's the part I'd like to know more about as well as the claim here that it is a form or subject to circular reasoning.

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3899

Post by Philip of Tealand »

Sorry Commander, I need to clarify - did PZ remove the "offending" comments from the "unmoderated" thread too or was it just Ophelia who commited Damnatio Memorae?

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Re: The Periodic Table's Younger, Sexier, Sibling Thread...

#3900

Post by Cunning Punt »

Reap wrote:
Lsuoma wrote:So, Reap: can we get Eucliowoo next?
Sure why not? Can we wait for my IQ to recover from this last conversation?
You'll need a signed note from her parents.

Locked