Periodic Table of Swearing

Old subthreads
rayshul
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7151

Post by rayshul »

windy wrote:
Notung wrote: And he thinks that MURDER isn't as bad as rape. The killing of another human being. The slaughter of sentient life, such that they no longer exist any more. What?
Haven't you heard, it's "a fate worse than death"!
I've heard a few people say this and I think the reason they do isn't so much about what the crime's results are, but what they would expect the criminal's mentality to be.

Murder for instance is I think something people can imagine themselves doing in the right situation. For example, if someone was seriously threatening my kid, and the situation involved me with a gun in my hand or whatever, then yeah in a high-stress situation I can definitely see myself doing it. If I was a soldier or worked in an enforcement position, then yes, I can see myself killing someone if the situation required it.

But I can't really see an instance where I would want to rape someone. There's no way I can get my head around why I'd feel the need to do it.

I feel like that's why people have a worse reaction to rape than murder. Obviously murder is the worse crime. But murder is often weirdly more understandable, especially within context.

Dilurk
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7152

Post by Dilurk »

Lsuoma wrote:Dilurk is close....


....very close....
Do I win a prize now? Sheeessshhhh

Notung
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7153

Post by Notung »

I think that's right - killing is sometimes justified while rape never is. However, if we compare the unjustified killings with the unjustified rapes (i.e. all of them) we have an easier choice.

People say that rape is worse because of the trauma. Thing is, you could say that about any crime. 'Assault is worse than murder because of the trauma'. There's no trauma with murder (ignoring the relatives, etc), and there often is with assault, so assault must be worse. That doesn't seem right though. I was once beaten up and kicked repeatedly in the head by strangers (one was the cousin of a famous footballer - claim to fame!), and it was slightly traumatic for a time afterwards. If I had died, there wouldn't have been that trauma. I'm very glad I didn't die, even though it meant more trauma than there would have otherwise been. I'd much rather be assaulted than murdered. If I witness a murder and an assault taking place near to each other, I'll intervene (assuming I'm brave enough) to stop the murder, even if it means ignoring the assault. Trauma isn't a sufficient reason for rape being worse than murder.

rayshul
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7154

Post by rayshul »

Even then, unjustified murder vs unjustified rape, it's not equivalent. Rape is, generally speaking, a form of torture. There could be a comparison made between sexual torture vs non sexual torture, but murder is a hugely different thing and I don't think you can really compare them in any way that feels sensible.

What is an unjustified murder? A girl who doesn't like Mondays?

I think arguing something is worse than something else on the basis of trauma experienced is a losing (because it's all subjective) argument, no matter which angle you go at it from.

rayshul
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7155

Post by rayshul »

Short version of what I'm saying: When we say murder is worse, we mean that the results of the act are the worst thing that could happen to a human. When we say rape or torture is worse, we mean that the mental actions of the person committing the act are beyond what we can comprehend or understand as "human" behavior.

Obviously there's situations which involve combinations of both.

rayshul
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7156

Post by rayshul »

Lsuoma wrote:
rayshul wrote:
Lsuoma wrote: Plus she's an annoying-as-fuck whiny-arse bitchcunt...
True, but unfortunately still not a criminal offense.

It feels very weird to try and think this through, to be honest. I've got my own moral values and try not to be biased (as much as possible), but this is one of those situations where I think if I have an opinion, it's going to be pure bias-rage-shit. Which doesn't make me feel great about myself. Heh.
All well and good, but I was just indulging myself in some old-fashioned foul-mouthery, nothing more...
And very nice foul-mouthery it was too. :)

Notung
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7157

Post by Notung »

I think they can be compared - look at it like this:

Someone is holding a gun to your head. They say that you must either rape or kill Person X (who is innocent), or you will be killed yourself (and assume that this is a sufficient reason for you to comply). What do you choose? Surely the lesser moral evil. Which one is that? That's the question. I think it's a sensible one.

They're both actions regarding another person. We could argue this about torture (in general) vs murder as well. What's worse? With torture, they can (potentially) 'get over it'. Maybe they won't, but it is at least possible. Even if they never fully recover, it may still be preferable to death. With murder they can't - it's final and, necessarily, they have no opportunity to ever recover from it.

I have a much more controversial argument that I won't make in case someone is reading this and misunderstands me. If that happens it'll look like I've said something terrible (even though I haven't).

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7158

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Notung wrote:I once made the "murder is worse than rape" claim in real life, and was accused of condoning rape. From then on I learned to be careful, and only state my position on this to people I know to be reasonable in advance!
Steven Novella must be banging his head against the wall with the amount of logical fallacies coming from the mouths of supposed skeptics.

Notung
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7159

Post by Notung »

CommanderTuvok wrote:Steven Novella must be banging his head against the wall with the amount of logical fallacies coming from the mouths of supposed skeptics.
Ah well they weren't a skeptic in that instance. But your point stands regardless.

rayshul
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7160

Post by rayshul »

Notung wrote:I think they can be compared - look at it like this:

Someone is holding a gun to your head. They say that you must either rape or kill Person X (who is innocent), or you will be killed yourself (and assume that this is a sufficient reason for you to comply). What do you choose? Surely the lesser moral evil. Which one is that? That's the question. I think it's a sensible one.

They're both actions regarding another person. We could argue this about torture (in general) vs murder as well. What's worse? With torture, they can (potentially) 'get over it'. Maybe they won't, but it is at least possible. Even if they never fully recover, it may still be preferable to death. With murder they can't - it's final and, necessarily, they have no opportunity to ever recover from it.

I have a much more controversial argument that I won't make in case someone is reading this and misunderstands me. If that happens it'll look like I've said something terrible (even though I haven't).
I'm finding it difficult to explain myself here. Ack, I suck at words.

I definitely agree with the situation you've described - that's what I've tried to explain above. But again this is a question of *results*. Your hypothetical person-in-a-sticky-position is given a moral decision to make on the basis of results and chooses to take the "least bad" option of two pretty shitty ones. But by using this hypothetical situation you're basically cutting out the reason I'm arguing that rape and torture are seen as more horrifying - it is because people *choose* to do it.

ERV
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7161

Post by ERV »

Notung wrote:I think they can be compared - look at it like this:

Someone is holding a gun to your head. They say that you must either rape or kill Person X (who is innocent), or you will be killed yourself (and assume that this is a sufficient reason for you to comply). What do you choose? Surely the lesser moral evil. Which one is that? That's the question. I think it's a sensible one.
I watch a lot of TV.

Notung
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7162

Post by Notung »

So virtue versus consequence, in a nutshell?

I just see them as different questions. What does the consequentialist think is worse? I say murder (although the trauma argument is a consequentalist argument too). What does the virtue ethicist think is worse? You say rape - I must admit I'm not sure on that one.

Notung
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7163

Post by Notung »

Hehe love it. By the way, are the newer seasons good? I watched up to Season 9 or 10 I think, and it seemed to get worse.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7164

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Lousy Canuck's title of his latest shit screed (The campaign against Amy Davis Roth) got me thinking about all the campaigns launched by the Skepchicks and FfTBers?

The campaign against Richard Dawkins
The campaign against Russell Blackford
The campaign against Abbie Smith
The campaign against Stef McGraw
The campaign against Lawrence Krauss
The campaign against DJ Grothe
The campaign against Justin Vacula
The campaign against Harriet Hall
The campaign against Thunderf00t
The campaign against Coffee Loving Skeptic
The campaign against Justin Griffin (being a fellow FTBer doesn't protect you when you disobey orders)
The campaign against Jeremy Stangroom
The campaign against "Upskirt Guy"
The campaign against Penn Jillette
The campaign against Benjamin Radford
The campaign against Jerry Coyne
The campaign against The RDF (unsupported accusations of racism gleefully linked to by Queen Bee)
The campaign against Staks Rosch
The campaign against James Onen
The campaign against Brian Dunning
The campaign against ERV
The campaign against NatGeo
The campaign against Bluharmony
........

Essentially, the Baboons make Napoleon and Genghis Khan look like rank amateurs.

*Credit to Phawrongula's "Witch of the Week" page for most campaign data.

Michael K Gray
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7165

Post by Michael K Gray »

CommanderTuvok wrote:Steven Novella must be banging his head against the wall with the amount of logical fallacies coming from the mouths of supposed skeptics.
Unless Saint Beccy utters them.
He gives that a pass.
Fucking hypocrite.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7166

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Michael K Gray wrote:
CommanderTuvok wrote:Steven Novella must be banging his head against the wall with the amount of logical fallacies coming from the mouths of supposed skeptics.
Unless Saint Beccy utters them.
He gives that a pass.
Fucking hypocrite.
What you don't realise, MKG, is that during recording, Queen Bee has electrodes attached to Novella's testicles. That helps to concentrate his mind.

:D

rayshul
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7167

Post by rayshul »

Notung wrote:So virtue versus consequence, in a nutshell?

I just see them as different questions. What does the consequentialist think is worse? I say murder (although the trauma argument is a consequentalist argument too). What does the virtue ethicist think is worse? You say rape - I must admit I'm not sure on that one.
I think they are different questions, too - or at least two different ways of approaching a question. I'm trying to explain why people would see rape/torture as being worse - they're attempting to think their way into the criminal's shoes.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7168

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Briefly looking at the comments on the Canuck thread, and they are still acting like the t-shirt and parody suramics were just spontaneous moments of bullying.

Actually, in the real world, the harrassment and bullying of TAM, DJ and various others in the Atheist/Skeptic community has generated a lot of anger and frustration. The mild rebuffs of the t-shirt and whatnot were outcomes of that anger and frustration. In one respect, it is unfortunate that Surly Amy seemed to bore the brunt of the counter protest, since cowards like PZ and Queen Bee ran away with their tails between their legs. But Amy has been part of the "campaign" bullying and harrassing TAM, DJ and others, so her complaints are falling on deaf ears as far as I am concerned.

Perhaps it is time the Baboons began to investigate the reasons WHY there is such a reaction against them. But, they may want to look a little beyond the notion that everyone else but them are sexist, racist, fascist, xenophobic, fatist, etc. They need to realise it is THEY who have a problem. And it is THEY who are the problem for the A/S communities.

ERV
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7169

Post by ERV »

Notung wrote:
Hehe love it. By the way, are the newer seasons good? I watched up to Season 9 or 10 I think, and it seemed to get worse.
Meh, its hit-and-miss, but I still watch it :)

Michael K Gray
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7170

Post by Michael K Gray »

Ophiliar Bansome has some inintentional hilarity happening in her latest post:
Paul Fidalgo has a gut-wrenching open letter to Alexander Aan at Friendly Atheist.
The petition failed, you know.
I should have done more, maybe - I blogged about it twice, the second time with considerable urgency, and tweeted and re-tweeted often
Fuck me?
What else could she have done as a true activist?
And how does one blog "with considerable urgency"??
WTF?
Senility has advanced at an alarming rate.

Hilarious what these retards consider to be their maximum effort!
Bansome probably had to drive to the bank. We all know how exhausting that can be.

Silly Bunt.

cunt
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7171

Post by cunt »

I think i'll be banned if I post again in that almost diamonds thread. Going with the
south park theme. ;)

[youtube]jhv-xZgdy-0[/youtube]

justinvacula
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7172

Post by justinvacula »

Gee, I am astonished Opehlia didn't use this DMCA moment to complain, once again, while refusing to actually come on my podcast, about the 'poor treatment' she received on my podcast concerning her nonthreat emails...

sacha
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rats are my friends

#7173

Post by sacha »

love the new profile image, Tigzy
army_of_rats.jpg
(63.94 KiB) Downloaded 179 times

DW Adams
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7174

Post by DW Adams »

From Canucks The campaign against Amy Davis Roth

http://atheiststoday.com/images/richard_comment.jpg

There are still those who think FtB and Skepchicks ARE the skeptic community. smh

sacha
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7175

Post by sacha »

decius wrote:
Dilurk wrote:
Steersman is a quick learner. I think he'll be salvageable. I'm hoping anyway.

Steersman. Don't you fucking let me down you cunt.
I respectfully disagree with your impression.

A learner would be willing to read what competent people have contributed over the past year or so, especially when specifically pointed to the relevant threads/posts. He flatly refused to do so and chose to drown us with unsupported criticism and baseless magniloquent verbiage instead.

Not to put myself on a pedestal, but I jumped in here with some sharp criticism of my own (some of which I later withdrew with apologies), but only after following closely the discourse for as long as it lasted, or catching up with what I had missed. Lacking the time to do that, I think the way of the learner is to ask questions, rather than making ignorant assumptions and strawmanning everyone for the sake of feeling morally superior at the sound of one's own voice.

Steersmam has just now gratuitously godwinned Commander Tuvok - someone widely respected for his rational approach to issues - beyond recognition, rather than engage him in meaningful dialogue. That gave me the final confirmation of my impressions, which overlap MKG's perceptive conclusions.

Steersman is a pompous windbag and a cunt.
You can't say I did not warn you, Steersman.

AndrewV69
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#7176

Post by AndrewV69 »

Breaking news:
This video was brought to you by the IRMA (Irregular Mens Rights Awareness) association of PUAs.
[youtube]Hj0uUyEzd5I[/youtube]

You may now return to your [ir]regularly scheduled agenda of Slime Pittery and plotting other assorted atrocitys on the Decent Human Beans of this world.

sacha
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7177

Post by sacha »

[quote="Tigzy"]
Was there any need to publish it here though, Justin? I'd say it was a pretty questionable thing to do, /quote]

I agree, Tigzy, I cringed when I saw it.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7178

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Richard:
The reaction against the Skepchicks has been mind-blowing
Yes, of course it was, Dick. That would be the rather tame reaction to months of abuse, harassment and bullying by the Skepchicks and their allies. These wankstains live in a bubble.

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7179

Post by CommanderTuvok »

Those two Asian girls show all the classic signs of being frequent readers of Skepchick.

I hope they make full recoveries.

mikelf

Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7180

Post by mikelf »

Michael K Gray wrote:Ophiliar Bansome has some inintentional hilarity happening in her latest post:
Paul Fidalgo has a gut-wrenching open letter to Alexander Aan at Friendly Atheist.
The petition failed, you know.
I should have done more, maybe - I blogged about it twice, the second time with considerable urgency, and tweeted and re-tweeted often
Fuck me?
What else could she have done as a true activist?
And how does one blog "with considerable urgency"??
WTF?
Senility has advanced at an alarming rate.

Hilarious what these retards consider to be their maximum effort!
Bansome probably had to drive to the bank. We all know how exhausting that can be.

Silly Bunt.
This, more than anything else, is what pisses me off about Ophelia, PZ, et al. They seem to think things like blogging, tweeting, and jetting around to conferences to talk to a bunch of people that already agree with them actually matter. Newsflash: they don't. The whole lot of them can spend every last minute in their pathetic lives blogging and tweeting about sexism and it won't do a damn thing to make the world a better place for women.

I have always worked in male dominated industries. First, it was heavy manufacturing. Later, oil and gas. Organizational leadership is almost exclusively male. The highest concentration of women were/are in accounting and human resources. But there were also a not insignificant number of women who succeeded in areas like production and engineering and made it to mahogany row. I had the pleasure of working for some and the honor to promote the careers of others. And I can tell you straight up, not one of those women were anything like Ophelia or SurlyAmy. Oh no. These women got up in the morning, pulled their big girl pants on and took the very male power structure on full force. They got shit done. And when someone tried to put a roadblock in their way, they knocked it over and kept right on their way. Crying over a t-shirt or hyperventilating over bad words wasn't part of their repertoire. They would have no sympathy, only disdain for women who would. You tell me who you think is doing more to advance women's rights?

The baboolies are nothing more than sheltered slacktivists. And piss poor ones, at that. They need to stay in their hermetically sealed hamster balls because they'd never cut it in the real world.

sacha
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who

#7181

Post by sacha »

Andrew and Dilurk,

Why such similar profile images?

it makes the dialogue a tad confusing (yes, I know I'm blond). Most people barely glance at the image, in order to know who posted the comment, Nectar's changes, but it's always brightly coloured flora and fauna.

Just an observation.

franc
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7182

Post by franc »

Za-zen wrote:Marcotte is a fuckwit.

What has the pussy riot case got to do with feminism? What because they have tits? The pussy riot case is all about the right to protest, offend! and free speech, something benson marcotte and the rest of the fftb fuckwits oppose.
They do have no fucking idea whatsoever. Pussy Riot is a BIG topic with subtleties those morons can't even begin to comprehend. To say it was all about feminism is the same as tattooing "I am retarded" on your forehead. It's all about Putin and the Orthodox church's complicity with both Putin and non-public, grassroots support for resurging Russian fascism. In otherwords, these ladies are protesting harsh realities, not imaginary grievances.

Pussy Riot's wisdom in doing what they did is debatable. I personally think it was idiotic - there was no possible result other than what has happened. The only way looking forward that they could ever have thought they would succeed in their goals is if martyrdom was the goal. You have to remember this is a church that was mercilessly persecuted by the Soviet regime, and it was probably the only thing the people had to cling to during that darkness. It is not like the churches in the west - the nerves are far too raw, it was overstepping the mark by a mile. That said, the Russian's are now having a cognitive dissonance brainstorm - they are coming out to defend the girls for an act they will also say is indefensible. I think they are getting off remarkably lightly when you consider the bigger picture. If you want to compare Pussy Riot to anything, it's this -

[youtube]p25SdQEnhHI[/youtube]

And also the Queen's Silver Jubilee performance on the Thames outside the Houses of Parliament. If you look closely, you can even briefly spot Richard Branson -





Marcotte, you are indeed a fuckwit. There is more than enough evidence already that you are an ignorant fucking cunt. You can stop now.

sacha
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masquerade party

#7183

Post by sacha »

okay, Barn Owl is no longer an owl. Is it "let's fuck with sacha day"?

franc would say that is every day...

franc
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7184

Post by franc »

Notung wrote:I think that's right - killing is sometimes justified while rape never is. However, if we compare the unjustified killings with the unjustified rapes (i.e. all of them) we have an easier choice.

People say that rape is worse because of the trauma. Thing is, you could say that about any crime. 'Assault is worse than murder because of the trauma'. There's no trauma with murder (ignoring the relatives, etc), and there often is with assault, so assault must be worse. etc...
You want to throw them, ask where getting thrown into a middle eastern secret police black prison sits?

Guest

Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7185

Post by Guest »

I think TAM is eager to have skepchicks break their association with them... And it's all the better if they don't have to say "go away'. The skepchicks expect so much and it's never enough. They treat speakers they don't like (and DJ) like shit. They have become more of a liability than an asset. Who wants to invite skepchicks anywhere given the hoops they'll be made to jump through. They seem so spoiled and such a tawdry representation of American female skepticism. It's more fun to make fun of them than dancing around trying to please them.

Contrary to Richard's, opinion very few people who go to skeptic meetings even know who PZ or the skepchicks are. The atheists/skeptics who go to my local meetups never mention them-- in fact few of the hundreds of atheists on facebook even mention them. The barely make a blip on other forums and skepticblogs.

They really have an exaggerated sense of their self importance. (Brayton didn't know who Paul Kirby was though she rights for international periodicals-- but he expects that people know who he is.) If they all decided to boycott all conferences where people spoke who they didn't like, very few people would care. Ed and PZ seem to think they yield much more influence than they do. At one time, there were so few speakers-- now there is a glut-- and more and more are rising to the top. The freethought bullies are making themselves into hasbeens like Laden.

The people at freethought blogs are a very insular group and they are losing fans faster than they can make new ones. They think they should be able to dictate how conferences are run and who should be invited. Who wants the hassle? I bet all of their speaking engagements start drying up after skepticon (Where PZ and Watson are already scheduled to speak.) Would anyone be buying surlyramics if more popular names in the freethought community weren't pushing it? Camp Quest donations are way down; PZ's book is on the back burner; Greta's book isn't doing so great; Ophelia has lost her ability to prod people into action; and if they don't generate continual controversy, very few people will read them.

Bluharmony's latest: http://www.skepticblogs.com/musingsfrom ... t-married/

Guest

Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7186

Post by Guest »

I think it's funny when people say they'll never go to TAM now... because I don't believe any of them would go in the first place-- not if they had to pay... like normal people do. They just want to imagine that their opinion matters. It's silly-- like me saying I'd never buy surlyramics now. I just never would have bought them period. I always thought it was weird when people praised them... I figured they were either trying to be nice or trying to make money that would be recycled into JREF. I remember the first time I saw them after hearing glowing stuff about them from someone on stage at TAM-- and I just couldn't believe that they were talking about such amateur simple kludgy crappy stuff. PZ bragged about buying some for his wife-- but the whole thing just seemed sort of frivolous and sexist to me. But I'm not into jewelery... and I figured maybe they were seeing something that I couldn't. Or maybe everyone was just saying it was good because the money went to a good cause. I don't see how she could have much of a market for that stuff outside of Big skeptic conventions like TAM.

Mr Danksworth
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7187

Post by Mr Danksworth »

Thanks Guest. For both the link to Blu's latest and your measured words. The only thing that saddens me is that the further downfall of Fftb and Skepchik will only enforce their cult of victimhood.

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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7188

Post by franc »

Mr Danksworth wrote:Thanks Guest. For both the link to Blu's latest and your measured words. The only thing that saddens me is that the further downfall of Fftb and Skepchik will only enforce their cult of victimhood.
Don't be sad - look how Jonestown ended.

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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7189

Post by Lsuoma »

franc wrote:
Mr Danksworth wrote:Thanks Guest. For both the link to Blu's latest and your measured words. The only thing that saddens me is that the further downfall of Fftb and Skepchik will only enforce their cult of victimhood.
Don't be sad - look how Jonestown ended.
The Baboollies and Crapchicks will go out, I think, though, not with a bang, but a slow fizzle accompanied by a whiny whimper. They will think it's a desperate shout of rage, but there will no longer be an audience...

Dick Strawkins
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7190

Post by Dick Strawkins »

The Pelagic Argosy wrote:
Tigzy wrote:
cunt wrote:Stephanie Zvan is here to lecture on the finer points of the american legal system. I know what you're thinking "who the fuck is Stephanie Zvan" As it turns out she is a freethoughtblogger who knows much about laws and shit. How? Well...


InstantExpert (tm) - a wholly pwned subsidiary of the Dunning-Kruger (c) company.
I can attest to the fact that Svans knowledge of law is right up there with her in-depth knowledge of human population genetics. She recently had someone on her comment section talking about their time as a paramedic, who gave an example of a medical emergency they had to deal with connected to high altitude mountaineering (I think). It involved a group of people and one of them, who was African American, started showing symptoms of pain, shortness of breath etc. The paramedic said that the standard procedure for this situation includes checking to see if the person has the gene for sickle cell anemia, and because it is relatively much more common amongst those of recent African descent, this test is not a priority for those who are caucasian or east asian.
Svan said this is an example of racism and thus implied that it shouldnt be done. I've seen Laden also make such stupid links. Would they really prefer that someone dies rather than a medical procedure that may save a life but goes against their paper thin mantra of "there is no such thing as biological race"?
To say that biological races exist says nothing about inherent abilities or worth of different people and the variability is such that even if there was a group difference (say we determined that Belgians were inherently less intelligent than Thais) we shouldn't discriminate because there will still be a significant fraction of Beligians who are more intelligent than the average Thai.

Steersman
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Re: who

#7191

Post by Steersman »

sacha wrote:Andrew and Dilurk,

Why such similar profile images?

it makes the dialogue a tad confusing (yes, I know I'm blond). Most people barely glance at the image, in order to know who posted the comment, Nectar's changes, but it's always brightly coloured flora and fauna.

Just an observation.
Dilurk made reference earlier to tilting at windmills – Don Quixote; Andrew made reference quite a bit earlier to some connections with Islamic culture – the Arabian knight or cavalryman. Some similarities, some differences ...

ButterCup

Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7192

Post by ButterCup »

Just an FYI, @SurlyAmy @DJGrothe @SallyStrange @justinvacula are tweeting about Amy's address being posted here:
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=73&start=6800#p8183

Amy pulled DJ in because apparently, he controls this sort of thing.

Anyway, even if it is publicly available, this just gives Amy more victim cred with her followers, and will allow her to sell more stuff at Dragon Con. So it is legal to post, but will help the drama more...not that she was going to let it end anytime soon. This is a cash cow for her.


Just my $.02

Michael K Gray
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7193

Post by Michael K Gray »

ButterCup wrote:...This is a cash cow for her.
She could well be in need of a few spare readies when she rightly gets sued for copyright infringement, and using registered trademark to make profit.

Michael K Gray
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7194

Post by Michael K Gray »

A surly crafty craft lesson.
"Get Surly! Hand made Surly-Ramics for male supremacists, and MRA drunk on their own privilege"
[youtube]gOAzuPwStZM[/youtube]

Steersman
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7195

Post by Steersman »

sacha wrote:
decius wrote:
Dilurk wrote:
Steersman is a quick learner. I think he'll be salvageable. I'm hoping anyway.

Steersman. Don't you fucking let me down you cunt.
I respectfully disagree with your impression.

A learner would be willing to read what competent people have contributed over the past year or so, especially when specifically pointed to the relevant threads/posts. He flatly refused to do so and chose to drown us with unsupported criticism and baseless magniloquent verbiage instead.

Not to put myself on a pedestal, but I jumped in here with some sharp criticism of my own (some of which I later withdrew with apologies), but only after following closely the discourse for as long as it lasted, or catching up with what I had missed. Lacking the time to do that, I think the way of the learner is to ask questions, rather than making ignorant assumptions and strawmanning everyone for the sake of feeling morally superior at the sound of one's own voice.

Steersmam has just now gratuitously godwinned Commander Tuvok - someone widely respected for his rational approach to issues - beyond recognition, rather than engage him in meaningful dialogue. That gave me the final confirmation of my impressions, which overlap MKG's perceptive conclusions.

Steersman is a pompous windbag and a cunt.
You can't say I did not warn you, Steersman.

No, I wouldn’t say that.

But I don’t think decius’ criticisms are particularly valid. For one thing, I don’t think I “gratuitously godwinned Commander Tuvok” is at all credible as I spared no expense in creating the entirely justified and warranted analogy – so to speak.

As for cunt? I kind of like Sally Strange’s interpretation: “juicy, funky, flexible, and creative”.

And pompous? I figure if MKG can champion the related word, pedantic, then I figure it can’t be all that much of an odious label to wear.

Windbag? One could say that that is exactly what the bagpipes are – some rather stirring sounds from that instrument – Amazing Grace, for example. But probably an acquired taste.

Sticks and stones. Or eye of the beholder ....

AndrewV69
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Re: who

#7196

Post by AndrewV69 »

Steersman wrote: Dilurk made reference earlier to tilting at windmills – Don Quixote; Andrew made reference quite a bit earlier to some connections with Islamic culture – the Arabian knight or cavalryman. Some similarities, some differences ...
Correct on the avatar. Unlike you I have not been banned, and I just noticed I have been granted a total of 21 reputation points. You get points if people think your post is useful. I have tried to explain, but some are not sure what to make of me:

http://forums.islamicawakening.com/f18/ ... 6752[quote]
Abdullah69 you are one strange guy, you quote the Quran left and right to make your point and say in sha Allah and all, but you consider yourself an atheist? You know Islam is the truth don't you? It sort of looks like you are forcing yourself to be a disbeliever when you really aren't.[/quote]

(I have also been quoting the bible also)

You know someting also? These people may be religious, but overall they put the baboons to shame just in basic courtesy.

Michael K Gray
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7197

Post by Michael K Gray »


franc
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7198

Post by franc »

ButterCup wrote:Anyway, even if it is publicly available, this just gives Amy more victim cred with her followers, and will allow her to sell more stuff at Dragon Con. So it is legal to post, but will help the drama more...not that she was going to let it end anytime soon. This is a cash cow for her.
She can milk a new product range out of it -

http://i.imgur.com/PHGCs.jpg

JackRayner
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7199

Post by JackRayner »

Notung wrote:Having just defended MRAs (sort of):
justinvacula wrote:...I am working on a guest post for AVoiceForMen...
Er... is that a good idea?
I guess that, associating myself with lots of "unpopular" groups, I should be used to this, but I just can't get over the knee-jerk reaction that people have about men's rights groups. (New here, but I've lurked quite a bit before. Thought I'd join the conversation. I'm sure some of you may have already interacted with me on twitter; https://twitter.com/JackTheRayner I'm not exactly new to the conversation.)

I'd figure that folk here, especially, are well aware of the vilification campaigns that are launched against dissenting thinkers, since a lot of the people in disagreement with FTB/Skepchick dogma are automatically labeled woman haters or gender traitors. (And sadly, they've also begun using MRA as an insult, as if seeking justice for men is this vile thing. Have you bought into it? It would seem so. I'd really challenge y'all to *think* through that...) I still hear many calling what has been going down for well over a year now a "radfem" problem, as if it's only some fringe section of feminism that behaves this way. To that, I'll just say that I'll wait for the rest of you to catch up. (And to trust me when I say that what's been happening isn't anything new, and definitely not exclusive to skepticism/atheism.)

For now, I call for a bit more critical thinking on the subject. I mean, is P. Zachary and crew people that you would trust as authorities on MRA's? As written in a previous post, John the Other is someone that sets PZ right the fuck off. And why is that? Because PZ can't beat his arguments. That's it. PZ rejoiced at the Southern Poverty Law Center's labeling of MRA's as "hate groups" because he felt it excused him from ever having to address any of JtO's arguments. (Which is very convenient for someone hell-bent on always being "right".) I won't even get into the SPLC's credibility, but feel free to read the reasons they cite for sticking the "hate group" label on MRA's, and other assorted men's groups, if you really want to know. It's funny stuff...

masakari2012
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7200

Post by masakari2012 »

[youtube]gOAzuPwStZM[/youtube]

Michael K Gray
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7201

Post by Michael K Gray »

JackRayner wrote:...using MRA as an insult, as if seeking justice for men is this vile thing. Have you bought into it? It would seem so.
Well, you can count me out of that generalisation.
Whilst am not a Men's Rights Activist, I support any and all action aimed at legally and responsibly attaining human rights for men, and women. (And animals, and their father's fathers')

masakari2012
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7202

Post by masakari2012 »

Doh! Michael K Gray beat me to that video. I didn't see it at first, until the page refreshed. :oops:

DownThunder
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7203

Post by DownThunder »

re: Justin writing on a voice for men.

The only "good idea" for Justin in the eyes of ftb or scepchicks feminists would be a complete and all-consuming display of contrition from Justin, after which he will still be eternally damned, but a useful example for their purposes.

Justin would make a great addition. I dont see why anyone, especially on this forum, would be interested in pandering to others prejudices.

Steersman
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Re: who

#7204

Post by Steersman »

AndrewV69 wrote:
Steersman wrote: Dilurk made reference earlier to tilting at windmills – Don Quixote; Andrew made reference quite a bit earlier to some connections with Islamic culture – the Arabian knight or cavalryman. Some similarities, some differences ...
Correct on the avatar. Unlike you I have not been banned, and I just noticed I have been granted a total of 21 reputation points. You get points if people think your post is useful. I have tried to explain, but some are not sure what to make of me:

http://forums.islamicawakening.com/f18/ ... 6752[quote]
Abdullah69 you are one strange guy, you quote the Quran left and right to make your point and say in sha Allah and all, but you consider yourself an atheist? You know Islam is the truth don't you? It sort of looks like you are forcing yourself to be a disbeliever when you really aren't.
(I have also been quoting the bible also)

You know someting also? These people may be religious, but overall they put the baboons to shame just in basic courtesy.[/quote]

I’ll readily concede that point, although, not to detract from it, “basic courtesy” tends to be the last thing that the Pharyngulites could be “accused” of.

However, I’m kind of curious about your involvement over at Islamic Awakening. The one thread there you had linked to earlier and that I had taken a brief look at didn’t seem to be much related to any political or religious issues and only, apparently, to various protocols with the “brothers”.

In passing though, I was rather surprised, quite astounded actually, at some reference – if I remember correctly, to a video about some Muslim fellow in England being in a quandary whether it was shirk to be stopping at stop signs. Many of them still stuck in the Dark Ages, I think; a consequence of the religion.

AndrewV69
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7205

Post by AndrewV69 »

JackRayner wrote:For now, I call for a bit more critical thinking on the subject. I mean, is P. Zachary and crew people that you would trust as authorities on MRA's? As written in a previous post, John the Other is someone that sets PZ right the fuck off. And why is that? Because PZ can't beat his arguments. That's it. PZ rejoiced at the Southern Poverty Law Center's labeling of MRA's as "hate groups" because he felt it excused him from ever having to address any of JtO's arguments. (Which is very convenient for someone hell-bent on always being "right".) I won't even get into the SPLC's credibility, but feel free to read the reasons they cite for sticking the "hate group" label on MRA's, and other assorted men's groups, if you really want to know. It's funny stuff...
Bah!

I got butt hurt when I got into an argument over a year ago about the SPLC with White Nationalist.. Long story short, I lost the argument, and I am still but hurt over it. My journey started when I went to their site and download their financial records. Go on, I dare ya. Go look.

They are a "virtue industy" with 100K salaries for the select, oh and off shore bank accounts in a couple of tax havens. But go on go digging, you will find them acusing a black woman professor of spreading hate among other things.

Did I mention that this was at least a year before they said MRAs are a hate group?

CommanderTuvok
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7206

Post by CommanderTuvok »

The increasingly insane and known liar/sockpuppet SallyStrange:
Sure, her address may be easy to find, but posting it at the Slymepit, which is basically a site that was invented for the purpose of harassing people, especially feminists?
O Rly, Sally? Fucking liar. The ERV threads/The Slymepit arose specifically as a response to the bullying and harassment of members of the A/S communities by certain members of FfTB and their sycophantic followers (including YOU, SallyWeirdo). Saying the Slymepit was a site invented for the purpose of harrassing people is the same as saying FTB was invented so people could be threatened with violence via email, and that people could have homophobic slurs thrown at them.

I personally think Vacula made a mistake posting Amy's address here, even if it is already public. However, Lousy Canuck's charge stems largely from the fact that Vacula correctly called out his underlying homophobia, and has stood up to Surly Amy with her attempts to silence valid criticism of her via issuing DMCAs. I must say I'm shocked by the number of people who supported her decision to use DMCAs. These people are not skeptics. These people are not freethinkers.

Finally, I saw an email having a go at DJ for saying the supporters of Amy are acting "paternalistic" towards her. I completely agree with DJ. The Baboons are acting as though Surly Amy is a wee little girl lost, who can't face criticism like a man. They are treating Amy like a "girl", rather than a "woman". Hypocritical shitstains.

AndrewV69
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Re: who

#7207

Post by AndrewV69 »

Steersman wrote: In passing though, I was rather surprised, quite astounded actually, at some reference – if I remember correctly, to a video about some Muslim fellow in England being in a quandary whether it was shirk to be stopping at stop signs. Many of them still stuck in the Dark Ages, I think; a consequence of the religion.
Many/most are pretty devout. And I am certainly not promoting Aethism over there at all as it turns out, quite the opposite:

http://forums.islamicawakening.com/f23/ ... post647016
Re: Help me with Qunut
Quote Originally Posted by Abu Shamah View Post
Al-Salamu 'Alaykum

I'm doing my first khutbah as the brother who is supposed to do it is not availible. I really want to do Qunut after ruku but I'm not sure what to say.

Could someone give me something that I could say, and that would be relatively easy to memorise in 1 or 2 hours.

Jazakallah Khayr
If I understand correctly (and I may not have) this may help (you should note the source though) :

Invocations for Qunut in the Witr prayer


"اللَّهُمَّ اهْدِنِي فِيمَنْ هَدَيْتَ، وَعَافِنِي فِيمَنْ عَافَيْتَ، وَتَوَلَّنِي فِيمَنْ تَوَلَّيْتَ، وَبَارِكْ لِي فِيمَا أَعطَيْتَ، وَقِنِي شَرَّ مَا قَضَيْتَ، فَإِنَّكَ تَقْضِي وَلَا يُقْضَى عَلَيْكَ، إِنَّهُ لَا يَذِلُّ مَنْ وَالَيْتَ، [وَلَا يَعِزُّ مَنْ عَادَيْتَ]، تَبَارَكْتَ رَبَّنَا وَتَعَالَيْتَ".
116. Allaahum-mahdinee feeman hadayta, wa 'aafinee feeman 'aafayta, wa tawallanee feeman tawallayta, wa baarik lee feemaa 'a'atayta, wa qinee sharra maa qadhayta, fa'innaka taqdhee wa laa yuqdhaa 'alayka, 'innahu laa yathillu man waalayta, [wa laa ya 'izzu man 'aadayta] , tabaarakta Rabbanaa wa ta'aalayta.
O Allah , guide me with those whom You have guided , and strengthen me with those whom You have given strength. Take me to Your care with those whom You have taken to Your care. Bless me in what You have given me. Protect me from the evil You have ordained. Surely, You command and are not commanded, and none whom You have committed to Your care shall be humiliated [and none whom You have taken as an enemy shall taste glory] . You are Blessed , Our Lord , and Exalted.
Reference:
Abu Dawud, Ibn Majah, An-Nasa'i, At-Tirmithi, Ahmad, Ad-Darimi, Al-Hakim, and Al-Bayhaqi. See also Al-Albani, Sahih At-Tirmithi 1/144, Sahih Ibn Majah 1/194, and 'Irwa'ul-GhaW. 2/ 172.
"اللَّهُمَّ إِنِّي أَعُوذُ بِرِضَاكَ مَنْ سَخَطِكَ، وَبِمُعَافَاتِكَ مِنْ عُقُوبَتِكَ، وأَعُوذُ بِكَ مِنْكَ، لَا أُحْصِي ثَنَاءً عَلَيْكَ، أَنْتَ كَمَا أَثْنَيْتَ عَلَى نَفْسِكَ".
117: Allaahumma 'innee 'a'oothu biridhaaka rain sakhatika, wa bimu'aafaatika min 'uqoobatika, wa 'a'oothu bika minka, laa 'uhsee thanaa'an 'alayka, 'Anta kamaa 'athnayta 'alaa nafsika.
O Allah , I seek refuge with Your Pleasure from Your anger . I seek refuge in Your forgiveness from Your punishment . I seek refuge in You from You . I cannot count Your praises , You are as You have praised Yourself.
Reference:
Abu Dawud, Ibn Majah, An-Nasa'i, At-Tirmithi, Ahmad. See Al-Albani, Sahih At-Tirmithi 3/180, Sahih Ibn Majah 1/194, and 'Irwa'ul-Ghalil. 2/ 175.
"اللَّهُمَّ إِيَّاكَ نَعْبُدُ، وَلَكَ نُصَلِّي وَنَسْجُدُ، وَإِلَيْكَ نَسْعَى وَنَحْفِدُ، نَرْجُو رَحْمَتَكَ، وَنَخْشَى عَذَابَكَ، إِنَّ عَذَابَكَ بِالْكَافِرِينَ مُلْحَقٌ. اللَّهُمَّ إِنَّا نَسْتَعِينُكَ، وَنَسْتَغْفِرُكَ، وَنُثْنِي عَلَيْكَ الْخَيْرَ، وَلَا نَكْفُرُكَ، وَنُؤْمِنُ بِكَ وَنَخْضَعُ لَكَ، وَنَخْلَعُ مَنْ يَكْفُرُكَ".
118: Allaahumma 'iyyaaka na'budu, wa laka nusallee wa nasjudu, wa 'ilayka nas'aa wa nahfidu, narjoo rahmataka, wa nakhshaa 'athaabaka, 'inna 'athaabaka bilkaafireena mulhaq. Allaahumma 'innaa nasta'eenuka, wa nastaghfiruka, wa nuthnee 'alaykal-khayr, wa laa nakfuruka, wa nu'minu bika, wa nakhdha'u laka, wa nakhla'u man yakfuruka.
O Allah, You alone do we worship and to You we pray and bow down prostrate. To You we hasten to worship and to serve. Our hope is for Your mercy and we fear Your punishment. Surely, Your punishment of the disbelievers is at hand. O Allah, we seek Your help and Your forgiveness, and we praise You beneficently. We do not deny You and we believe in You. We surrender to You and renounce whoever disbelieves in You.
Reference:
Al-Bayhaqi graded its chain authentic in As-Sunan Al-Kubra. Al-Albani said in 'Irwa'ul-GhaliL 2/170 that its chain is authentic as a statement of 'Umar.

Notung
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7208

Post by Notung »

Jack: My comment here gives my views on the subject.

I also criticised AVoiceforMen before - I'm not too familiar with the site but I have seen (what I deem) outright misogyny there before.

Steersman
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7209

Post by Steersman »

CommanderTuvok wrote:The increasingly insane and known liar/sockpuppet SallyStrange:
Sure, her address may be easy to find, but posting it at the Slymepit, which is basically a site that was invented for the purpose of harassing people, especially feminists?
O Rly, Sally? Fucking liar. The ERV threads/The Slymepit arose specifically as a response to the bullying and harassment of members of the A/S communities by certain members of FfTB and their sycophantic followers (including YOU, SallyWeirdo). Saying the Slymepit was a site invented for the purpose of harrassing people is the same as saying FTB was invented so people could be threatened with violence via email, and that people could have homophobic slurs thrown at them.

I personally think Vacula made a mistake posting Amy's address here, even if it is already public. However, Lousy Canuck's charge stems largely from the fact that Vacula correctly called out his underlying homophobia, and has stood up to Surly Amy with her attempts to silence valid criticism of her via issuing DMCAs. I must say I'm shocked by the number of people who supported her decision to use DMCAs. These people are not skeptics. These people are not freethinkers.

Finally, I saw an email having a go at DJ for saying the supporters of Amy are acting "paternalistic" towards her. I completely agree with DJ. The Baboons are acting as though Surly Amy is a wee little girl lost, who can't face criticism like a man. They are treating Amy like a "girl", rather than a "woman". Hypocritical shitstains.
I’ll agree that Amy is giving some indication of being or playing at some sort of delicate flower – and using that to claim the rights of some privilege. One is tempted to give some consideration to the “kick in the cunt” meme .... figuratively speaking of course, and from an entirely “ironic” perspective ....

Likewise with Vacula’s posting of Amy’s address, although the DMCA issue is a bit of a can of worms.

But “Lousy Canuck’s homophobia”? That looks like a real stretch with diddly squat in the way of supporting evidence.

AndrewV69
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Re: Periodic Table of Swearing

#7210

Post by AndrewV69 »

Notung wrote:Jack: My comment here gives my views on the subject.

I also criticised AVoiceforMen before - I'm not too familiar with the site but I have seen (what I deem) outright misogyny there before.
*shrug*

Too bad you read that one. I am not going to apologise or explain it away though.

I am going to leave it up to you. After all I never bother with Jezebell and Feministing any more myself, much less manboobz. Though I suspect I may have read more at those sites than you did at AVFM.

Locked