The Trump Dump!

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1681

Post by Brive1987 » Sun Nov 11, 2018 4:01 pm

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Re Joan. My origininal (quoted) point is as clear now as it was then. A multiculti Joan is pushing civic nationalism into history. This person (and surrounding events) become abstract symbols with a fluid pomo non-reality. I get it that you think this is wonderful.

I don’t.
Do you think that someone cosplaying as a historical figure means that people are going to believe that this how the historical figure looked like?

Or is the problem simply that of the cultural appropriation someone not "ethnic French" cosplaying as Jean D'Arc? If so, is Milla Yovovich similarly problematic since she played Jean and is of Ukrainian ancestry? Would a French girl of Italian ancestry be OK cosplaying as Joan, or too multi-culti fluid po-mo? What about a French girl of Finnish ancestry? Or of Turkish ancestry? Or of Russian ancestry? When does one draw the line, according to your position? And why?
You are extending a specific politicised incident into broader decontextualised areas. The motive and desired symbolism is more important than the tactic. And the incident is more important as part of a wider pattern than in and of itself. It is a data point.

CFB would accuse you of “whataboutism” if he wasn’t so wedded to his team colours.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1682

Post by Brive1987 » Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:15 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 10:42 am
There was no admission from the WH. There was Kellyanne swapping banter on a subject she clearly knows nothing about.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1683

Post by Kirbmarc » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:08 am

Brive1987 wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Re Joan. My origininal (quoted) point is as clear now as it was then. A multiculti Joan is pushing civic nationalism into history. This person (and surrounding events) become abstract symbols with a fluid pomo non-reality. I get it that you think this is wonderful.

I don’t.
Do you think that someone cosplaying as a historical figure means that people are going to believe that this how the historical figure looked like?

Or is the problem simply that of the cultural appropriation someone not "ethnic French" cosplaying as Jean D'Arc? If so, is Milla Yovovich similarly problematic since she played Jean and is of Ukrainian ancestry? Would a French girl of Italian ancestry be OK cosplaying as Joan, or too multi-culti fluid po-mo? What about a French girl of Finnish ancestry? Or of Turkish ancestry? Or of Russian ancestry? When does one draw the line, according to your position? And why?
You are extending a specific politicised incident into broader decontextualised areas. The motive and desired symbolism is more important than the tactic. And the incident is more important as part of a wider pattern than in and of itself. It is a data point.

CFB would accuse you of “whataboutism” if he wasn’t so wedded to his team colours.
This is just a way to avoid answering the questions I have asked.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1684

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:09 am

Brive1987 wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Re Joan. My origininal (quoted) point is as clear now as it was then. A multiculti Joan is pushing civic nationalism into history. This person (and surrounding events) become abstract symbols with a fluid pomo non-reality. I get it that you think this is wonderful.

I don’t.
Do you think that someone cosplaying as a historical figure means that people are going to believe that this how the historical figure looked like?

Or is the problem simply that of the cultural appropriation someone not "ethnic French" cosplaying as Jean D'Arc? If so, is Milla Yovovich similarly problematic since she played Jean and is of Ukrainian ancestry? Would a French girl of Italian ancestry be OK cosplaying as Joan, or too multi-culti fluid po-mo? What about a French girl of Finnish ancestry? Or of Turkish ancestry? Or of Russian ancestry? When does one draw the line, according to your position? And why?
You are extending a specific politicised incident into broader decontextualised areas. The motive and desired symbolism is more important than the tactic. And the incident is more important as part of a wider pattern than in and of itself. It is a data point.

CFB would accuse you of “whataboutism” if he wasn’t so wedded to his team colours.
Not at all. It's really a simple position-if assimilation is the goal, what is the issue with a non-white playing a French part?

I could see the issue if it were supposed to be an accurate portrayal in a movie or video game. Indeed if you look back at my tweets you'll see that I defended "Kingdom Come" for not including minority characters, because doing so would have detracted from the accuracy.

But this was a festival celebrating Frenchness, and it seems to me that declaring yourself French enough to symbolically portray Flamin' Joan would be a win for assimilation. No idea why it would be bad, but I'm curious for your take.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1685

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:54 am

free thoughtpolice wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 2:24 pm
https://www.scribendi.com/advice/how_to ... ss.en.html
Protip: Unnecessary use of obscure jargon and prolix language doesn't make you look smart. It makes you look like someone trying to convince others that you are really smart and profound.
see: pretentious windbag
I believe he is (rightly) concerned that if he used simple words and their meaning was laid bare, he might not look so good. By obfusticating their meaning in prolix, PoMo jargon, he both clouds the meaning and gives himself some plausible deniability.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1686

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:19 am

"If their meaning were laid bare." Never write before coffee or breakfast.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1687

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:42 am

Was or were. In the Hornbeckian sense, the idea transmitted onto paper that may be more concisely described as a word may only be a social construct, but in the view of Wittgenstein, Derrida, and minimalist author Dadhabhoy, the literal device, or word if you want to use a less nuanced definition needs to be mentally simulated as an independent being, and therefore has the right to see itself as either singular or plural.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1688

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:48 am

From what I recall dear old Jean turned out to be pretty black in the end.

That said - I'll leave it to the anglophiles here to defend here to defend her honour - and that of Marianne in general.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1689

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:15 pm

Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Re Joan. My origininal (quoted) point is as clear now as it was then. A multiculti Joan is pushing civic nationalism into history. This person (and surrounding events) become abstract symbols with a fluid pomo non-reality. I get it that you think this is wonderful.

I don’t.
Do you think that someone cosplaying as a historical figure means that people are going to believe that this how the historical figure looked like?

Or is the problem simply that of the cultural appropriation someone not "ethnic French" cosplaying as Jean D'Arc? If so, is Milla Yovovich similarly problematic since she played Jean and is of Ukrainian ancestry? Would a French girl of Italian ancestry be OK cosplaying as Joan, or too multi-culti fluid po-mo? What about a French girl of Finnish ancestry? Or of Turkish ancestry? Or of Russian ancestry? When does one draw the line, according to your position? And why?
You are extending a specific politicised incident into broader decontextualised areas. The motive and desired symbolism is more important than the tactic. And the incident is more important as part of a wider pattern than in and of itself. It is a data point.

CFB would accuse you of “whataboutism” if he wasn’t so wedded to his team colours.
This is just a way to avoid answering the questions I have asked.
In the same way you ignored the movie posters. Did you find anything odd about them? Did they represent movies that would ever be made? If not why not? What is it that makes them ridiculous? Please stop the avoidance.

For such a fluid pomo approach as we had for Joan, do you find it outrageously prescriptive that the girl had to be a practicing catholic? Why is it that the organisers banned muslims from integration? Is this a racist act? Is it something you should be focusing on as a problem? Does it suggest there are lines the organisers are not prepared to cross? What do you think defines these lines? Why do you think they were so visibly and overtly liberal when they actually so discriminatory? What odds would you place on a virtue-flare?

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1690

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:19 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Re Joan. My origininal (quoted) point is as clear now as it was then. A multiculti Joan is pushing civic nationalism into history. This person (and surrounding events) become abstract symbols with a fluid pomo non-reality. I get it that you think this is wonderful.

I don’t.
Do you think that someone cosplaying as a historical figure means that people are going to believe that this how the historical figure looked like?

Or is the problem simply that of the cultural appropriation someone not "ethnic French" cosplaying as Jean D'Arc? If so, is Milla Yovovich similarly problematic since she played Jean and is of Ukrainian ancestry? Would a French girl of Italian ancestry be OK cosplaying as Joan, or too multi-culti fluid po-mo? What about a French girl of Finnish ancestry? Or of Turkish ancestry? Or of Russian ancestry? When does one draw the line, according to your position? And why?
You are extending a specific politicised incident into broader decontextualised areas. The motive and desired symbolism is more important than the tactic. And the incident is more important as part of a wider pattern than in and of itself. It is a data point.

CFB would accuse you of “whataboutism” if he wasn’t so wedded to his team colours.
Not at all. It's really a simple position-if assimilation is the goal, what is the issue with a non-white playing a French part?

I could see the issue if it were supposed to be an accurate portrayal in a movie or video game. Indeed if you look back at my tweets you'll see that I defended "Kingdom Come" for not including minority characters, because doing so would have detracted from the accuracy.

But this was a festival celebrating Frenchness, and it seems to me that declaring yourself French enough to symbolically portray Flamin' Joan would be a win for assimilation. No idea why it would be bad, but I'm curious for your take.
See my note to Kirb. This wasn’t about celebrating universal Macron style abstract frenchness. Joan was a position open only to a religous-ethnic subset of France. Less than 5% of RCs would meet the prescriptive hurdle.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1691

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:20 pm

Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 10:42 am
There was no admission from the WH. There was Kellyanne swapping banter on a subject she clearly knows nothing about.
Ahhh. There has now been a statement.


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1692

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:26 pm

Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Brive1987 wrote:
Kirbmarc wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: Re Joan. My origininal (quoted) point is as clear now as it was then. A multiculti Joan is pushing civic nationalism into history. This person (and surrounding events) become abstract symbols with a fluid pomo non-reality. I get it that you think this is wonderful.

I don’t.
Do you think that someone cosplaying as a historical figure means that people are going to believe that this how the historical figure looked like?

Or is the problem simply that of the cultural appropriation someone not "ethnic French" cosplaying as Jean D'Arc? If so, is Milla Yovovich similarly problematic since she played Jean and is of Ukrainian ancestry? Would a French girl of Italian ancestry be OK cosplaying as Joan, or too multi-culti fluid po-mo? What about a French girl of Finnish ancestry? Or of Turkish ancestry? Or of Russian ancestry? When does one draw the line, according to your position? And why?
You are extending a specific politicised incident into broader decontextualised areas. The motive and desired symbolism is more important than the tactic. And the incident is more important as part of a wider pattern than in and of itself. It is a data point.

CFB would accuse you of “whataboutism” if he wasn’t so wedded to his team colours.
Not at all. It's really a simple position-if assimilation is the goal, what is the issue with a non-white playing a French part?

I could see the issue if it were supposed to be an accurate portrayal in a movie or video game. Indeed if you look back at my tweets you'll see that I defended "Kingdom Come" for not including minority characters, because doing so would have detracted from the accuracy.

But this was a festival celebrating Frenchness, and it seems to me that declaring yourself French enough to symbolically portray Flamin' Joan would be a win for assimilation. No idea why it would be bad, but I'm curious for your take.
See my note to Kirb. This wasn’t about celebrating universal Macron style abstract frenchness. Joan was a position open only to a religous-ethnic subset of France. Less than 5% of RCs would meet the prescriptive hurdle.
I saw your note to Kirb. I wouldn't object to those posters. I failed to understand the brouhaha around what's her name playing a trans or Ralph Finnes plating Michael Jackson. They're actors portraying a role, as long as they do it well, I have no objection.

And again, this was a celebration of Frenchie things, not meant to be a historical portrayal. I would like you to address that.

Is it because SJW might go frothing mad at those posters, we should have the same inconsiderate reaction when the opposite happens and a POC portrays a white person? I try not to be reactive, but instead consider real-world harm. I really think that simply reacting to "the enemy" is a bad and ultimately futile approach.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1693

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:46 pm

So even if we found a white, Roman Catholic to play Joan of Arc, wouldn't she have to be quite mad and hear God's dulcet voice as well? Also, she'd have to be a virgin. In France. Good luck with that.

I'm really okay with a rougher representation, especially considering.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1694

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:49 pm

Horatio Nelson wrote: Treat every Frenchman as if he was the devil himself.
It would go against my anglophone identify to do otherwise.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1695

Post by Brive1987 » Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:41 pm

The point about the posters was that they reflect a projection which would never occur. Even in a movie context. And there are probably good reasons why not. It would be ridiculous watching Spacey play Obama in an unironic fashion. Or Owen Wilson play King Shaka. It would also be remarkable if a recreation of the 10 bn landing at Gallipoli comprised a solid diversity quota. If done, it would be subordinating the historical event into a pomo metaphor. Much as fact-tion movies mine history for cheap thrills.

The issue for me isn’t ‘OMG muh skin colour’. Rather, so much of these character’s point of difference was keyed into a cultural and ethnic context that yes, have visual race-based markers. Feel free to dismiss this as a smoke screen for my KKK alter ego. At least I’m being honest in trying to explain something different to this simple prejudice. As I said, I’d be just as cranky having Joe Smith elected as a Meiji emperor in a Japanese cultural festival. Not that that would ever happen.

The interesting thing with this case study is the way it defines the camps. You and Kirb see this as a non historical metaphor showcasing abstract civic values. Fine. You are civic nationalists. It figures. I see it as a reaffirmation of a historical event which helps defines the common heritage which makes France a non-globalised (unique) country. We need to agree to disagree without turning this into a libtards vs the nazis bloodsport.

More interesting with Joan is the apparently OK religious bias. I guess if it’s invisible it doesn’t count. Clearly even this event had cultural lines in the sand they weren’t prepared to cross. :lol: :lol:

Which kinda puts their whole virtue pantomime shtick into question.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1696

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Mon Nov 12, 2018 3:38 pm

Again, was it supposed to be a historical recreation or a celebration?
Rather, so much of these character’s point of difference was keyed into a cultural and ethnic context that yes, have visual race-based markers.
Why? We're not going to duplicate Joan anyway, but rather the ideals (admittedly questionable) that embodied her spirit. If this helps people of different racial and cultural backgrounds assimilate and be more French, how is that a bad thing? Leaving aside the relative merits of being French in the first place...

I certainly understand why race plays an important part in the regressive left. It is the bedrock of their ideology, cannot be questioned, and falls apart under scrutiny. What I fail to understand is why anybody else would care much about race at all.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1697

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:02 pm


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1698

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:48 pm

Is he really any worse than say, Ronald Regan in his second term?

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1699

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Nov 12, 2018 6:14 pm

MarcusAu wrote:
Is he really any worse than say, Ronald Regan in his second term?
From my recollection, yes. The questions about Reagan was about him getting old and dotty, and understandably whether he could substantially recover from his shooting. He fell asleep in meetings later in his term and certainly depended on the people around him. He definitely had some degree of neurological damage.
The difference is (pardon the analogy) that Reagan was like a happy drunk that got a bit goofy then went to bed and Trump is the nasty drunk that gets wound up and surly.
The other difference, and a big one is that Reagan had picked out competent people around him and had the humility to realize they were right even if they didn't suit what he wanted to believe.
I think one of the points made in the article is that maybe there should be fitness tests for our leaders but how can they be designed. A dilemma.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1700

Post by MarcusAu » Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:47 pm

Perhaps Woodrow Wilson would be a better comparison.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1701

Post by free thoughtpolice » Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:20 pm

I think Trump is an outlier to both Wilson and Reagan because he appears to be pretty much fucked up right from the beginning and his flaws are magnified by his pathological personality.
At any rate, there seems to be a trend to consider older candidates than before. They should get screened for competency in the primaries and every few years after they are elected. If you are going to do it for pilots why not for VIP politicians?

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1702

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:31 am

That could have gone south quickly


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1703

Post by MarcusAu » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:58 am

I'm no lawyer - but I think that throwing a glass of wine in someones face could be classed as assault.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1704

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:45 am

MarcusAu wrote: I'm no lawyer - but I think that throwing a glass of wine in someones face could be classed as assault.
Depends on whether his feelings got hurt.

https://www.whiteplainslawyers.org/assa ... -new-york/
What Are The Different Levels Of Assault In New York?

Our Westchester criminal defense lawyers have extensive experience in defending all levels of assault cases. There are several different levels of assault. The most common type of assault charge that our White Plains criminal defense attorneys have seen throughout New York State is assault in the 3rd degree, and that is the definition that I just provided, where you have intentwionally caused an injury to another person.

There are more serious versions of assault, and they increase in terms of the conduct that the actor engages in, as well as the actual physical condition of the person assaulted. This means that if an individual assaults another person with a weapon, whether it’s a bat or some other type of weapon, that person has now committed assault in the 2nd degree, and that is a felony offense. Assault in the 3rd degree is a misdemeanor offense.

There are a number of different ways one can commit assault in the 2nd degree. You can cause serious physical injury, which is defined as permanent disfigurement or loss of function of a body part. It is a less common offense, but it is a much more serious offense that is taken extremely seriously by all the District Attorney’s offices throughout the state, especially in Westchester.

From assault in the 2nd degree, it moves up to assault in the 1st degree. Assault in the 1st degree occurs when somebody causes serious injury to another person, and they do so by the means of a deadly weapon or a dangerous instrument. The weapon could be a gun, a bat, a knife, or some other instrument along those lines. This is the most typical assault in the 1st degree type of charge that you will face.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1705

Post by MarcusAu » Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:10 am

He may well have been in a New York state of mind - but the incident took place in Virginia.

I doubt much more will come of it - but in any case it's probably not wise on Tucker's part to admit to possibly illegal actions on the part of his son.

And if that sounds pedantic and unfair - just image what would happen if lawyers got involved.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1706

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:44 am

Hmmmm. Charlottesville No less.

My bad, I had NY embedded in my mind for some reason. :think:

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1707

Post by MarcusAu » Tue Nov 13, 2018 3:28 am

I thought it was North Carolina when I did my 2 min google lawyering...

Why so complicated America?

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1708

Post by d4m10n » Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:31 am

http://virginiacriminallawyers.vatraffi ... sault.html
Virginia Code §18.2-57 codifies the offense of simple assault and battery as a class 1 misdemeanor; however, this code section relies upon what is called the common law to define the elements of the offense. Common law is judge made law which has been around for centuries which we inherited in this country from our original ties with England. The common law definition of an assault and battery is an intentional harmful or offensive contact. To get even more specific, an assault under common law is separate from a battery. An assault is the apprehension of a harmful or offensive contact. Thus, even if you did not actually make contact with the individual, if you intended to make contact, you could be found guilty of assault. A battery is the actual harmful or offensive contact.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1709

Post by free thoughtpolice » Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:42 am

So it turns out that Australia, which has a reputation of being a nation of primitive knuckledragging descendants of convicts and other ne'er do wells has elected a toxic masculine chauvinist pig. And I don't mean chauvinistic in the good way as in an ultra patriotic, militaristic, nationalist fossil.
I mean chauvinistic in the modern parlance, as in the crude sexist savage type that promotes rape culture.
It turns out that this brigand known as ScoMo has made crude remarks about the highly talented sweetheart Pamela Anderson, who as I have mentioned before went to high school just down the road from me and has served me breakfast with a big smile on occasion ;) , just because she is on a mission to rescue highly regarded journalist and not at all Russian stooge Julian Assange from his unfair seclusion in the Ecuadorian embassy in London.
https://independentaustralia.net/life/l ... ture,12083
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Morrison was reacting to an appeal by former Baywatch star Ms Anderson on behalf of Julian Assange. Anderson sent a message to the Prime Minister, urging him to consider bringing Assange home to Australia and treating him with fairness and respect once he got here.
Morrison responds to Anderson’s approach with an unsavoury “nudge, nudge, wink, wink” reference to her career as a television sex symbol. In Morrison’s opinion, Anderson needs a “sorting out” that could be provided by his specially appointed male mates, whom, he implies, are well qualified to perform this service.

There can be little doubt as to what such a service entails. It isn’t political. It isn’t ideological. It isn’t sage advice as to where Ms Anderson might more usefully focus her social and political concerns.

The “sorting out” Morrison implies Anderson needs to set her straight, is sexual.

The Australian Prime Minister, when approached by a woman on a political issue, responds by recommending that the woman receive a sexual “sorting out” by several men of his acquaintance.

Or, to put it more crudely, Morrison responds to a woman’s political and humanitarian concerns by implying that she needs a good fuck by a few of his mates.

Which is gang rape.
Have some dignity Land Down Under and try to get with the 21st century.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1710

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:12 pm


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1711

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:17 pm

Brive1987 wrote: That could have gone south quickly

Avenatti has a different take. Not that I'm fond of opportunists, and he has that feel-

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1712

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:40 pm



A real master of politics.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1713

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:12 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote: So it turns out that Australia, which has a reputation of being a nation of primitive knuckledragging descendants of convicts and other ne'er do wells has elected a toxic masculine chauvinist pig. And I don't mean chauvinistic in the good way as in an ultra patriotic, militaristic, nationalist fossil.
I mean chauvinistic in the modern parlance, as in the crude sexist savage type that promotes rape culture.
It turns out that this brigand known as ScoMo has made crude remarks about the highly talented sweetheart Pamela Anderson, who as I have mentioned before went to high school just down the road from me and has served me breakfast with a big smile on occasion ;) , just because she is on a mission to rescue highly regarded journalist and not at all Russian stooge Julian Assange from his unfair seclusion in the Ecuadorian embassy in London.
https://independentaustralia.net/life/l ... ture,12083
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Morrison was reacting to an appeal by former Baywatch star Ms Anderson on behalf of Julian Assange. Anderson sent a message to the Prime Minister, urging him to consider bringing Assange home to Australia and treating him with fairness and respect once he got here.
Morrison responds to Anderson’s approach with an unsavoury “nudge, nudge, wink, wink” reference to her career as a television sex symbol. In Morrison’s opinion, Anderson needs a “sorting out” that could be provided by his specially appointed male mates, whom, he implies, are well qualified to perform this service.

There can be little doubt as to what such a service entails. It isn’t political. It isn’t ideological. It isn’t sage advice as to where Ms Anderson might more usefully focus her social and political concerns.

The “sorting out” Morrison implies Anderson needs to set her straight, is sexual.

The Australian Prime Minister, when approached by a woman on a political issue, responds by recommending that the woman receive a sexual “sorting out” by several men of his acquaintance.

Or, to put it more crudely, Morrison responds to a woman’s political and humanitarian concerns by implying that she needs a good fuck by a few of his mates.

Which is gang rape.
Have some dignity Land Down Under and try to get with the 21st century.
ScMo didn’t get elected by the people - he’s in as the result of a party room coup. He will also be out early next year when real elections have to be held.

He was my direct boss for a number of years, I can vouch he is a shit, but only because of his obsessive focus on personal progression, albeit via the hard work of himself and anyone else he can co-opt.

He’s was also in his early twenties when Bay Watch was peaking with Pambo. He has got her ‘number’.

Typical SJW beat up.


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1714

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:12 pm



Should be good.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1715

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:16 pm

Oh. He is also seeking to forge a link with ‘real Australia’ to differentiate himself from ex PM Turnbull. The man who literally achieved nothing other than nearly fucking up the same sex ‘marriage’ plebiscite - which he actually supported. ScoMo has his eyes on the PM-ship two terms down the track.

The tweet was part of his ‘no bullshit’ pitch.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1716

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:52 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote: Again, was it supposed to be a historical recreation or a celebration?
Rather, so much of these character’s point of difference was keyed into a cultural and ethnic context that yes, have visual race-based markers.
Why? We're not going to duplicate Joan anyway, but rather the ideals (admittedly questionable) that embodied her spirit. If this helps people of different racial and cultural backgrounds assimilate and be more French, how is that a bad thing? Leaving aside the relative merits of being French in the first place...

I certainly understand why race plays an important part in the regressive left. It is the bedrock of their ideology, cannot be questioned, and falls apart under scrutiny. What I fail to understand is why anybody else would care much about race at all.
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote: Again, was it supposed to be a historical recreation or a celebration?
Rather, so much of these character’s point of difference was keyed into a cultural and ethnic context that yes, have visual race-based markers.
Why? We're not going to duplicate Joan anyway, but rather the ideals (admittedly questionable) that embodied her spirit. If this helps people of different racial and cultural backgrounds assimilate and be more French, how is that a bad thing? Leaving aside the relative merits of being French in the first place...

I certainly understand why race plays an important part in the regressive left. It is the bedrock of their ideology, cannot be questioned, and falls apart under scrutiny. What I fail to understand is why anybody else would care much about race at all.
Historical recreation or a celebration? I think both, the former embedded in the latter. It like when Light Horse troopers in WW1 attire lead the Anzac Marches.

The issue is not at heart racial - it’s a broader issue. Further the Joan thing is a data point. If this was it, it would be a awkward blip.

But there is a concerted effort in the West to dismantle the ethnic/cultural uniqueness of traditional institutions in favour of homogenised ‘universal civic values’. Once you initiate economically inspired mass, culturally uncontrolled, immigration you don’t really have a choice.

So contemporary multi-culti norms become “typical Roman families” (BBC),
Joan of Arc is whatever you want her to be (so long as she is catholic)
World War One becomes a fight for 21C SJ “universal values” (Macron)
Sydney Uni looses its shit when given money for a “Western Civilisation” course
The War Memorial literally rewrites history to make past experience ‘inclusive’
Our own right-party :lol: proudly prints literature declaring Australia is “not bound by common culture” ..
Demonstrated by my inability to read an increasing number of CBD signs as we Balkanise and consider limited sharia
Our schools are dropping European languages in favour of courses funded by China
Traditional organised school Saturday sports are also declining as young Asian kids have coaching to attend over rugby
Freedom of speech is literally policed away in favour of new cultural blocks who didn’t get the civic national memo
An army of leftie SJWs are attacking everything they can which define society - from gender norms, marriage, religion ...
We will go republic soon on PC principle, not because there is a functionally better alternative
A million laws are enacted to stop anyone pointing out the naked emperor via a publicly expressed POV
Critics are branded racist, identitarian or Nazi

Now I get it. Kirb, and possibly yourself, want a largely homogenised society. For reasons. And I also get that American civic nationalism is way different from Euro based forms.

But I don’t want this economic-social experiment to play out in current form. And for all their manifest failings, neither do the alt-lite.

So yeah. If we don’t point out data points, even at the risk of being accused of overreacting, the trees will be replaced by the forrest.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1717

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:30 pm

While I am generally a stickler for historical realism, if it is applied indiscriminately it becomes a talking point for those who do want to dismantle the West. So while I did defend "Kingdom Come," i realize the broader context of the Joan of Arc thing was French national unity-which the ethnic Joan supported. To me, getting the race wrong is simply in the same category as getting historical weapons, armor or other details incorrect.

Whether we support a homogenous society or not is largely irrelevant. Millions of immigrants are already in the West, and only the most dictatorial and draconian measures would dislodge them. Even if immigration were completely halted, you still have a diverse group of people with different ideologies and goals. The only thing you can do is to assimilate them. Ostracism and othering will simply encourage them to cling to the ideology and form of where ever they came from. If there's a harmless way to encourage them to feel a part of the greater whole, why not? Seems to be encouraging patriotism. It also serves as a defence when people engage in genuine historical revisionism. It is a matter of both inclusion and picking your battles.If you fail to include these people in your society, they will be perennial troublemakers and remain ghettoized. Including them defuses conflict, encourages them to adopt the ideals of their new homeland. Seems like a win to me.

Defending the West is easily as important to me as it is to you. I see it as a battle of values, you seem to see it more in terms of custom and ethnicity. And it is troubling to me when it is stated or implied that people from other cultures and backgrounds are assumed to have some intrinsic characteristics that make western values incompatible to their personality.

As to your charge of homogenization, I think that is an over-simplification. I will say that I don't give a shit about somebody's ethnic background or race. I care about their ethics and values. And while you often say America is an anomaly, I see no reason why it should be. I see the values working, imperfectly and haltingly at times, but ultimately if reason prevails, we will have a highly functional society.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1718

Post by free thoughtpolice » Tue Nov 13, 2018 3:02 pm

Brive wrote:
He’s was also in his early twenties when Bay Watch was peaking with Pambo. He has got her ‘number’.

Typical SJW beat up.
Serves her right. She's one of those PETA dingbats and all around skank. When she worked as a waitress here she lobbied hard for tips so she could move and get a career. After she got famous she managed to slag off our lovely community to the rest of the world as a shithole filled with loathsome hicks that liked to kill fish and beautiful big eyed animals and them eat them.
Good for ScoMo. I'd vote for him if I could.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1719

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:15 pm


Tick-Tock, motherfuckers.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1720

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:39 pm

Funny, I agree with Glenn Beck. Strange world.



While some abuse the asylum status, for others it is life, or death.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1721

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:47 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:15 pm

Tick-Tock, motherfuckers.
He will need to improve his quantity and quality.

So far we have:
+ Papadopoulos who got 14 days for false statements to FBI
+ Manafort for pre Trump Ukrainian work and dicking his personal finances
+ Gates (who worked for Manafort) for similar peripheral offences
+ Flynn for false statements to FBI

That looks like a typical Washington staffer’s CV.

Slim pickings for a fishing expedition that began in May 2017 and which promised to land Trump for collusion to steal an election. It would be nice to connect at least one kipper with the neo-Soviets.

:mrgreen:

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1722

Post by Brive1987 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:25 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote: Brive wrote:
He’s was also in his early twenties when Bay Watch was peaking with Pambo. He has got her ‘number’.

Typical SJW beat up.
Serves her right. She's one of those PETA dingbats and all around skank. When she worked as a waitress here she lobbied hard for tips so she could move and get a career. After she got famous she managed to slag off our lovely community to the rest of the world as a shithole filled with loathsome hicks that liked to kill fish and beautiful big eyed animals and them eat them.
Good for ScoMo. I'd vote for him if I could.
You may want to factor in that it’s 10:1 odds on that Scotty has ever fired a weapon.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1723

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:36 am

Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:15 pm

Tick-Tock, motherfuckers.
He will need to improve his quantity and quality.

So far we have:
+ Papadopoulos who got 14 days for false statements to FBI
+ Manafort for pre Trump Ukrainian work and dicking his personal finances
+ Gates (who worked for Manafort) for similar peripheral offences
+ Flynn for false statements to FBI

That looks like a typical Washington staffer’s CV.

Slim pickings for a fishing expedition that began in May 2017 and which promised to land Trump for collusion to steal an election. It would be nice to connect at least one kipper with the neo-Soviets.

:mrgreen:
So, you're willing to bet nothing will come of this? No Trump kids indicted, no obstruction?

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1724

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:39 am


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1725

Post by Brive1987 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 1:38 pm

I personally would support a “war on vandalism”. No one should damage other people’s kit.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1726

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 1:45 pm

A powerful conservative voice on populism.
https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article ... ssion=true

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1727

Post by Kirbmarc » Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:15 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote: A powerful conservative voice on populism.
https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article ... ssion=true
I agree with Frum on Bannon, but Frum is a terrible advocate for liberal democracy. He was the one who coined the dumb term "axis of evil" for George W. Bush, and pushed for the Iraq War. He and his other neocon friends were the ones responsible for the failures of the US in the foreign policy. In the article, he advocates as his own the struggle for liberal democracy against "islamism" yet he was one of the biggest sponsors of Saudi Arabia as a "regional partner" of the US strategy in the Middle East, when the KSA is the biggest source of reactionary/conservative anti-democratic and illiberal islam.

I'm not surprised that Frum wasn't able to turn the audience to his side and even lost against Bannon. He can't propose any solution to the problems that Bannon highlights because he's not defending just liberal democracy (which is worth defending) but the status quo of American conservatism (which is in shambles) AND the "imperial mission" of the US (which is in a deep crisis). He can't acknowledge that neo-conservatism, its lies, its support for corporate bailouts and its hawkish foreign policy is part of what paved the road to Trump, by seeding distrust for civil institutions, by sacrificing American money and soldiers in unwinnable wars that only made a minority of cronies richer, by trampling over worker's rights and welfare systems to facilitate corporate interests.

Frum's side, the neocons, should just retire from politics and let other, less compromised people deal with the populist mess.
Integral to the liberal project, again in the broad sense of the word liberal, is confidence in the power of reason. Words and arguments can overbear ignorance and prejudice. Over the long term, words and arguments can even overcome oppression and violence. That’s why liberals in the broad sense are so uniquely horrified by official lying: How can reason prevail unless words connect to reality? How can we argue against people who will spread fictions, if serviceable to them, without a qualm?
Dude, you supported a president who lied shamelessly about Iraq having WMDs and ties to Al-Qaeda, who had a foreign policy completely un-tethered to reality, and who created a financial bubble with widespread easy credit. This is why right-wing people have flocked to the populists. They suck, but at least they acknowledge that the "spreading of democracy" through wars and invasion didn't work, and that economic globalization is not without its downsides. Your side is still dreaming of more interventions and more bailouts. Time to move on.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1728

Post by Brive1987 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:39 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: That could have gone south quickly

htt..ps://twitter.com/greggutfeld/status/1061761982569832449?s=21
Avenatti has a different take. Not that I'm fond of opportunists, and he has that feel-
https...://mobile.twitter.com/MichaelAvenatti/status/1061774967451213824

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1729

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 4:36 pm

Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Brive1987 wrote: That could have gone south quickly

htt..ps://twitter.com/greggutfeld/status/1061761982569832449?s=21
Avenatti has a different take. Not that I'm fond of opportunists, and he has that feel-
https...://mobile.twitter.com/MichaelAvenatti/status/1061774967451213824
Again, I don't doubt that Avenatti isn't a scumbag opportunist. But Tucker Carlson has certain problems with twisting the truth to fit his narrative as well. And TMZ wouldn't be my first choice for news reporting. I believe I will withhold judgement, though I hope this clears Avenatti from the spotlight.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1730

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 4:46 pm

Kirbmarc wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote: A powerful conservative voice on populism.
https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article ... ssion=true
I agree with Frum on Bannon, but Frum is a terrible advocate for liberal democracy. He was the one who coined the dumb term "axis of evil" for George W. Bush, and pushed for the Iraq War. He and his other neocon friends were the ones responsible for the failures of the US in the foreign policy. In the article, he advocates as his own the struggle for liberal democracy against "islamism" yet he was one of the biggest sponsors of Saudi Arabia as a "regional partner" of the US strategy in the Middle East, when the KSA is the biggest source of reactionary/conservative anti-democratic and illiberal islam.

I'm not surprised that Frum wasn't able to turn the audience to his side and even lost against Bannon. He can't propose any solution to the problems that Bannon highlights because he's not defending just liberal democracy (which is worth defending) but the status quo of American conservatism (which is in shambles) AND the "imperial mission" of the US (which is in a deep crisis). He can't acknowledge that neo-conservatism, its lies, its support for corporate bailouts and its hawkish foreign policy is part of what paved the road to Trump, by seeding distrust for civil institutions, by sacrificing American money and soldiers in unwinnable wars that only made a minority of cronies richer, by trampling over worker's rights and welfare systems to facilitate corporate interests.

Frum's side, the neocons, should just retire from politics and let other, less compromised people deal with the populist mess.
Integral to the liberal project, again in the broad sense of the word liberal, is confidence in the power of reason. Words and arguments can overbear ignorance and prejudice. Over the long term, words and arguments can even overcome oppression and violence. That’s why liberals in the broad sense are so uniquely horrified by official lying: How can reason prevail unless words connect to reality? How can we argue against people who will spread fictions, if serviceable to them, without a qualm?
Dude, you supported a president who lied shamelessly about Iraq having WMDs and ties to Al-Qaeda, who had a foreign policy completely un-tethered to reality, and who created a financial bubble with widespread easy credit. This is why right-wing people have flocked to the populists. They suck, but at least they acknowledge that the "spreading of democracy" through wars and invasion didn't work, and that economic globalization is not without its downsides. Your side is still dreaming of more interventions and more bailouts. Time to move on.
I agree, but some of his arguments against populism were entirely correct. And the permutations of the Republican party are amazing to behold. Despite being a Democrat, I fear for the Republicans. Many long-time Republicans are concerned that the party hasn't just gone astray, and the brand tarnished, but that the divisions will destroy the party itself, especially if the Commander-in-Cheeto gets his comeuppance.

And there would go the loyal opposition. Both parties are facing what might be irreconcilable internal divisions, who knows what will arise in the strife.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1731

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 4:59 pm


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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1732

Post by Brive1987 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:27 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:36 am
Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:15 pm

Tick-Tock, motherfuckers.
He will need to improve his quantity and quality.

So far we have:
+ Papadopoulos who got 14 days for false statements to FBI
+ Manafort for pre Trump Ukrainian work and dicking his personal finances
+ Gates (who worked for Manafort) for similar peripheral offences
+ Flynn for false statements to FBI

That looks like a typical Washington staffer’s CV.

Slim pickings for a fishing expedition that began in May 2017 and which promised to land Trump for collusion to steal an election. It would be nice to connect at least one kipper with the neo-Soviets.

:mrgreen:
So, you're willing to bet nothing will come of this? No Trump kids indicted, no obstruction?
I’m sure they could be pinged for something. It might even happen. The dude just has to pick up his game.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1733

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:44 pm



Humor as a coping mechanism. But yes, Trump really did say it. In addition to a bunch of other allegations. At this point, nobody is certain if he's crazy or a theatrical liar.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/p/trump ... vp-BBPIhj6

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1734

Post by CaptainFluffyBunny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:57 pm

Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:36 am
Brive1987 wrote:
CaptainFluffyBunny wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:15 pm

Tick-Tock, motherfuckers.
He will need to improve his quantity and quality.

So far we have:
+ Papadopoulos who got 14 days for false statements to FBI
+ Manafort for pre Trump Ukrainian work and dicking his personal finances
+ Gates (who worked for Manafort) for similar peripheral offences
+ Flynn for false statements to FBI

That looks like a typical Washington staffer’s CV.

Slim pickings for a fishing expedition that began in May 2017 and which promised to land Trump for collusion to steal an election. It would be nice to connect at least one kipper with the neo-Soviets.

:mrgreen:
So, you're willing to bet nothing will come of this? No Trump kids indicted, no obstruction?
I’m sure they could be pinged for something. It might even happen. The dude just has to pick up his game.
That's not how it works. This is a slow, grinding process. It is not unusual for it to go on for years. What we have seen is a very tight Mueller ship, with nary a leak in sight. But McConnell blocking protections for the probe is proof some people are scared shitless.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1735

Post by free thoughtpolice » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:14 pm

That's not how it works. This is a slow, grinding process. It is not unusual for it to go on for years. What we have seen is a very tight Mueller ship, with nary a leak in sight. But McConnell blocking protections for the probe is proof some people are scared shitless.
Also my view of the process. Also which side is most responsible for dragging out the process? For instance , how long has Mueller been trying to get Trump to testify? If you don't think that that the Trump team has been pulling out all the stops to avoid a pathological liar, the Donald, to get any questions at all. That is probably what was behind the stunt where they yanked Acosta's press pass. Change the subject. Diversion.

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1736

Post by free thoughtpolice » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:24 pm

Apparently the caravan has disappeared since the election and there is little coverage of the military on the Mexican border. We can only hope that the authorities have learned their lessons from other, similar incidents:

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1737

Post by free thoughtpolice » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:49 pm

He's Back! You didn't think you would get rid of Trumpy Bear that easily did you?

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1738

Post by Mr. X, Indeed » Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:01 pm

free thoughtpolice wrote: Apparently the caravan has disappeared since the election and there is little coverage of the military on the Mexican border. We can only hope that the authorities have learned their lessons from other, similar incidents:
That deliriously insane Sam Peckinpah movie based on a novelty song about CB radio lingo. It was always fun to come across it at 3 AM when we were high and bored. I hear the army is hunkered down and ready.

https://www.duffelblog.com/2018/11/troo ... t-caravan/

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1739

Post by free thoughtpolice » Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:13 pm

"Breaker Breaker. We're still 200 km south of Ciudad Mexico and have already crushed several thousand Mara Salvatrucha beneath our Convoy."
If only Peckinpah were still with us it would be a masterpiece above even the Godfather series! :clap:

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Re: The Trump Dump!

#1740

Post by Kirbmarc » Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:55 pm

CaptainFluffyBunny wrote: At this point, nobody is certain if he's crazy or a theatrical liar.
Those are not mutually exclusive statues.

Most of all, though, Trump is a shit-stirring troll. He floods the news with idiocy, whether deliberately or not, and people discuss the idiocy while the important stuff gets less focus.

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